Ex-Premie.Org |
Forum III Archive # 36 | |
From: Jan 21, 1999 |
To: Feb 2, 1999 |
Page: 2 Of: 5 |
Paul -:- Important News Flash -:- Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 13:46:56 (EST) __JW -:- Important News Flash -:- Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 13:53:13 (EST) ____Mike -:- Let's hope so... -:- Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 14:11:13 (EST) ____Mike -:- Uh oh! He DID keep them -:- Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 14:29:49 (EST) ____Katie -:- Phase II? (nt) -:- Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 15:54:45 (EST) ______JW -:- Okay, I Get It! -:- Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 17:09:50 (EST) ____Paul -:- Important News Flash -:- Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 16:51:49 (EST) __John -:- Thanks for the latest laugh! -:- Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 14:16:20 (EST) __Happy and living in Paris -:- Important News Flash -:- Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 15:03:43 (EST) __Jim -:- The fine print -:- Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 15:07:56 (EST) ____Mike -:- BWAH HA HA HA HA HA HA ..... -:- Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 15:27:47 (EST) ____M -:- belated seasons greetings! -:- Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 15:29:58 (EST) ______Selene -:- belated seasons greetings! -:- Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 15:35:31 (EST) ______Jim -:- Link time, Brian? -:- Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 15:36:40 (EST) ________Roger Drek -:- GMJ greeting added to Drek -:- Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 13:13:04 (EST) ______Robyn -:- belated seasons greetings! -:- Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 22:06:21 (EST) ________Rick -:- belated seasons greetings! -:- Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 22:41:04 (EST) __________Robyn -:- belated seasons greetings! -:- Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 07:57:21 (EST) ____________Rick -:- belated seasons greetings! -:- Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 11:30:50 (EST) ______TD -:- belated seasons greetings! -:- Sun, Jan 31, 1999 at 04:15:46 (EST) __Gail -:- Is this News Flash true? -:- Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 07:42:07 (EST) ____Paul -:- Is this News Flash true? -:- Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 11:08:11 (EST) ______Gail -:- Thanks--This News Flash is -:- Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 15:31:24 (EST) ________ham -:- Thanks--This News Flash is -:- Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 18:40:58 (EST) Ophelia -:- In Kissimmee (1979) Pt. 1 -:- Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 12:36:11 (EST) __Ophelia -:- In Kissimmee (1979) Pt. 2 -:- Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 12:41:27 (EST) ____Selene -:- In Kissimmee (1979) Pt. 2 -:- Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 13:42:00 (EST) ______reditor -:- when did M move to malibu? -:- Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 14:55:29 (EST) ________Mike -:- when did M move to malibu? -:- Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 16:27:25 (EST) __________reditor -:- u must mean 84? -:- Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 16:29:46 (EST) ____________Mike -:- u must mean 84? -:- Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 16:32:53 (EST) ______________Mike -:- BTW, Red -:- Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 16:39:24 (EST) ________________Gail -:- No Remodelling - Demolition -:- Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 00:08:21 (EST) __________________Runamok -:- fire stopped by3 trees/marolyn -:- Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 00:29:02 (EST) ____________________Runamok -:- fire stopped short -:- Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 02:17:15 (EST) ____________________Runamok -:- something stopped 2 short -:- Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 02:43:59 (EST) ______________________Gail -:- Malibu Fire - 1978 or 79? -:- Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 07:36:00 (EST) ________________________JW -:- Malibu Fire - 1978 or 79? -:- Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 14:29:23 (EST) ______________________barney -:- Amherst Guru Puja was 74 -:- Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 12:52:03 (EST) ________________________Gail -:- Naw! It's just that you're -:- Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 15:38:30 (EST) ________________________Runamok -:- Amherst Guru Puja was 74 -:- Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 18:36:24 (EST) ______________Selene -:- u must mean 84? -:- Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 17:53:12 (EST) ________________Mike -:- u must mean 84? -:- Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 18:14:44 (EST) ________________JW -:- He had Both Houses -:- Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 14:31:33 (EST) ____________barney -:- 74 might be right -:- Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 04:32:56 (EST) ______________JW -:- 74 might be right -:- Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 14:02:46 (EST) ________________barney -:- earthquakes (ot) -:- Sun, Jan 31, 1999 at 16:37:24 (EST) ______________Blanco -:- 74 might be right -:- Sat, Jan 30, 1999 at 10:53:05 (EST) ________________Selene -:- 74 might be right -:- Sat, Jan 30, 1999 at 15:56:37 (EST) ________________barney -:- earthquakes (ot) -:- Sun, Jan 31, 1999 at 16:24:10 (EST) __________eb -:- when did M move to malibu? -:- Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 17:08:23 (EST) ____________JW -:- when did M move to malibu? -:- Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 17:13:28 (EST) ____________Mike -:- hmmmmm.... -:- Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 17:28:04 (EST) ______________Selene -:- hmmmmm.... -:- Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 17:59:14 (EST) ________________x -:- hmmmmm.... -:- Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 18:59:45 (EST) __________________Mike -:- hmmmmm.... -:- Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 19:10:43 (EST) ____________________eb -:- To Mike and x -:- Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 20:47:19 (EST) __________________Katie -:- to x -:- Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 22:41:00 (EST) __________Gail -:- when did M move to malibu? -:- Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 19:55:08 (EST) ____________Gail -:- When did M move to Malibu? -:- Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 20:04:13 (EST) ______________Selene -:- When did M move to Malibu? -:- Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 20:12:56 (EST) ________________barney -:- Miami & my little friend -:- Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 05:13:14 (EST) __________________Not that it matters -:- Anniversary Event was 1996 -nt -:- Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 07:38:51 (EST) __________________JW -:- Some Dates -:- Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 14:40:48 (EST) ____________Selene -:- when did M move to malibu? -:- Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 20:05:38 (EST) Brian -:- Behind the Green Door Revised -:- Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 19:25:43 (EST) __bill -:- mobBILE phone joke -:- Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 07:49:32 (EST) __Katie -:- Behind the premie door... -:- Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 15:35:13 (EST) ____Selene -:- Behind the premie door... -:- Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 15:38:22 (EST) ____Mike -:- Behind the premie door... -:- Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 16:20:29 (EST) ______Jethro -:- Behind the premie door... -:- Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 02:30:28 (EST) Runamok -:- PremiePosts on Ex-Premie Forum -:- Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 15:34:52 (EST) __Jean-Michel -:- Why do you care? -:- Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 16:47:58 (EST) ____Jerry -:- Why do you care? -:- Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 19:52:42 (EST) __Helen -:- PremiePosts on Ex-Premie Forum -:- Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 17:24:00 (EST) ____Anne -:- too good to be true -:- Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 18:00:10 (EST) ______Mike -:- Dumbing down -:- Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 18:16:47 (EST) ____x -:- PremiePosts on Ex-Premie Forum -:- Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 18:49:42 (EST) ______Runamok -:- PremiePosts on Ex-Premie Forum -:- Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 19:37:42 (EST) ______Helen -:- PremiePosts on Ex-Premie Forum -:- Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 20:34:03 (EST) ______VP -:- PremiePosts on Ex-Premie Forum -:- Sat, Jan 30, 1999 at 00:56:19 (EST) __Blanco -:- PremiePosts on Ex-Premie Forum -:- Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 23:48:58 (EST) ____Runamok -:- existential bakhti -:- Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 00:32:58 (EST) ______Blanco -:- existential bakhti -:- Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 18:43:33 (EST) ______Mike -:- extra-straps on a bikini? -:- Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 18:53:10 (EST) ________Runamok -:- extra sauce on your spaghetti? -:- Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 00:25:52 (EST) __________Mike -:- I couldn't help myself -:- Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 09:43:01 (EST) ________Blanco -:- extra-straps on a bikini? -:- Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 09:31:59 (EST) __________Runamok -:- stop it Mike -:- Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 12:05:13 (EST) ____________Mike -:- Narada -:- Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 15:12:12 (EST) ______________Gail -:- Hey, Nimmy, where are you? -:- Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 15:51:39 (EST) ________________Runamok -:- hey Mike where is Nimmy -:- Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 18:32:12 (EST) ____________Blanco -:- stop it Mike -:- Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 18:46:24 (EST) ______________Runamok -:- stop it Blanco -:- Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 20:19:55 (EST) ________________Blanco -:- ...regain?? -:- Sat, Jan 30, 1999 at 10:15:48 (EST) __________________Runamok -:- ...rogaine?? -:- Sat, Jan 30, 1999 at 13:17:13 (EST) Katie -:- good cop/bad cop: to OP -:- Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 14:19:37 (EST) __Mike -:- good cop/bad cop: to Katie -:- Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 14:43:03 (EST) ____Orlando -:- editing: to Mike -:- Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 15:07:38 (EST) ______Mike -:- Nice try, op -:- Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 15:17:08 (EST) ________Mike -:- By the way, OP -:- Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 15:20:34 (EST) ______John -:- editing: to Mike -:- Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 15:33:53 (EST) ________Mike -:- No, it doesn't -:- Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 16:01:20 (EST) ____peter -:- plain as the nose on your face -:- Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 23:25:00 (EST) ______Mike -:- Good one, Peter -:- Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 09:30:53 (EST) __Jim -:- Your slip is showing, op -:- Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 18:43:38 (EST) ____Jim -:- Thanks a little more, op -:- Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 20:39:16 (EST) ____G's mom -:- My favorite Jim post ever... -:- Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 21:14:06 (EST) __g's mom -:- Good post Katie (nt) -:- Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 21:19:05 (EST) __VP -:- good cop/bad cop: to OP -:- Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 21:23:57 (EST) ____op -:- good cop/bad cop: to OP -:- Sat, Jan 30, 1999 at 03:55:22 (EST) ______bill -:- guru DNA? -:- Sat, Jan 30, 1999 at 09:00:10 (EST) ______Katie -:- reply to op II -:- Sat, Jan 30, 1999 at 12:39:32 (EST) ________Katie -:- and one more thing -:- Sat, Jan 30, 1999 at 13:40:14 (EST) __________Robyn -:- and one more thing -:- Sat, Jan 30, 1999 at 15:39:39 (EST) ____________Selene -:- and one more thing -:- Sat, Jan 30, 1999 at 16:00:15 (EST) ______________Robyn -:- and one more thing -:- Sat, Jan 30, 1999 at 19:13:14 (EST) ________________Selene -:- and one more thing -:- Sun, Jan 31, 1999 at 15:58:14 (EST) ________gerry -:- reply to op II -:- Sat, Jan 30, 1999 at 16:19:41 (EST) __________Katie -:- reply to op II -:- Sat, Jan 30, 1999 at 16:32:46 (EST) ____________gerry -:- reply to op II -:- Sat, Jan 30, 1999 at 16:47:55 (EST) ________Rick -:- reply to op II -:- Sat, Jan 30, 1999 at 16:53:19 (EST) ______Jim -:- Where's MY answer? -:- Sat, Jan 30, 1999 at 14:44:56 (EST) ________Selene the irreverent -:- Where's MY answer? -:- Sat, Jan 30, 1999 at 15:15:43 (EST) ______VP -:- I disagree, OP -:- Sat, Jan 30, 1999 at 16:41:06 (EST) shp -:- attitudes -:- Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 12:11:19 (EST) __Rick -:- attitudes -:- Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 14:24:54 (EST) ____shp -:- attitudes -:- Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 16:55:47 (EST) ____gerry -:- attitudes -:- Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 19:42:23 (EST) ______x -:- lower case i *trip* -:- Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 19:56:33 (EST) ________SHP -:- lower case i *trip* -:- Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 21:18:13 (EST) __________x -:- Touche -:- Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 23:04:36 (EST) ____________Helen -:- Bwa ha ha ! (nt) -:- Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 23:16:55 (EST) ____________SHP -:- stretccccch that X! -:- Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 18:58:28 (EST) ______________bill -:- three ways to go. -:- Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 17:21:13 (EST) ________________SHP -:- three ways to go + infinity -:- Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 17:26:34 (EST) __________________bill -:- three ways to go + infinity -:- Sat, Jan 30, 1999 at 00:42:39 (EST) ____________________SHP -:- three ways to go + infinity -:- Sat, Jan 30, 1999 at 09:06:56 (EST) ______________________bill -:- three ways to go -:- Sat, Jan 30, 1999 at 15:45:50 (EST) __John -:- attitudes -:- Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 14:32:20 (EST) ____Mike -:- 12-step program for Jim.... -:- Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 14:56:13 (EST) ____shp -:- attitudes -:- Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 16:59:06 (EST) __Brian -:- lattitudes -:- Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 14:48:23 (EST) ____shp -:- lattitudes -:- Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 17:06:30 (EST) ______Mike -:- I'm a bit confused... -:- Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 17:45:51 (EST) ________Helen -:- I'm a bit confused... -:- Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 17:49:45 (EST) __Helen -:- attitudes -:- Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 14:54:29 (EST) __ham -:- attitudes -:- Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 15:06:37 (EST) ____shp -:- attitudes -:- Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 17:08:37 (EST) __Runamok -:- Oh, really? -:- Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 15:22:31 (EST) ____shp -:- reply -:- Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 21:09:53 (EST) ______Jim -:- reply -:- Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 21:18:06 (EST) ________SHP -:- reply -:- Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 19:20:46 (EST) __________Jim -:- autism -:- Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 22:02:04 (EST) ____________SHP -:- jim, you have 'ought-ism' -:- Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 15:46:04 (EST) ______________Mike -:- Hey, snakes are cool, too :-) -:- Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 15:57:41 (EST) ________________SHP -:- Hey, snakes are cool, too :-) -:- Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 16:07:04 (EST) ______________Jim -:- get your kids -:- Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 19:57:46 (EST) ________________SHP -:- get your own kids -:- Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 20:52:26 (EST) __________________Jim -:- See? -:- Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 22:32:33 (EST) ____________________SHP -:- going for it -:- Sat, Jan 30, 1999 at 11:40:32 (EST) ______________________Katie -:- going for it -:- Sat, Jan 30, 1999 at 13:20:16 (EST) ________________________SHP -:- going for it -:- Sat, Jan 30, 1999 at 13:32:00 (EST) ______________________Jim -:- honestly?? -:- Sat, Jan 30, 1999 at 15:56:19 (EST) ________________SHP -:- you're not MY alpha.... -:- Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 21:15:32 (EST) ______Helen -:- reply -:- Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 23:39:21 (EST) ________SHP -:- reply -:- Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 19:25:52 (EST) __________Helen -:- reply to you -:- Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 21:59:17 (EST) ____________Helen -:- reply to you II -:- Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 00:35:15 (EST) ____________SHP -:- reply to you -:- Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 16:03:51 (EST) ______________Helen -:- Navel gazing -:- Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 20:05:20 (EST) ________________SHP -:- time for a drink -:- Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 20:59:05 (EST) __________________Helen -:- Let's get sloppy drunk, shp -:- Sat, Jan 30, 1999 at 18:04:26 (EST) ____________________SHP -:- Yesh, lesh have a few drinksh -:- Sat, Jan 30, 1999 at 21:39:50 (EST) ______Runamok -:- assumptions -:- Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 23:44:44 (EST) __bill -:- latitudes -:- Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 19:33:46 (EST) ____bill -:- latitudes -:- Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 19:44:43 (EST) ____Jim -:- Remembrances -- the video -:- Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 20:04:34 (EST) ______Runamok -:- Remembrances -the book -:- Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 20:37:33 (EST) ______Mike -:- Well said, Jim! -:- Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 09:41:09 (EST) __Gail -:- attitudes -:- Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 22:53:41 (EST) ____SHP -:- attitudes -:- Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 17:21:25 (EST) ______x -:- ZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz -:- Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 18:49:56 (EST) ________SHP -:- if you are so bored.... -:- Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 21:04:25 (EST) |
Date: Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 13:46:56 (EST)
From: Paul Email: None To: Everyone Subject: Important News Flash Message: Just received this in mail. 'Dear Kansas City area premies and aspirants: For those of you who saw the recent satellite feed of Maharaji know of His announcement that He has now fulfilled His committment to His Master to spread Knowledke around the world, and that now He is going to do what He wants to do.' The letter goes on to say that one of the things M is doing now is making more video tapes and that for $276 per month the community can have a subscription. To quote further: 'Of course, these funds go to support video showings in poorer communities around the world and not just to cover the cost of the videos.' Well, what can we say. M has accomlished his mission and still maintains his concern for poor premies around the world. What a guy! Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 13:53:13 (EST)
From: JW Email: None To: Paul Subject: Important News Flash Message: For those of you who saw the recent satellite feed of Maharaji know of His announcement that He has now fulfilled His committment to His Master to spread Knowledke around the world, and that now He is going to do what He wants to do.' Paul, what do you think this means? Does this mean he is done with the 'spread this knowledge' trip, even the facade of it, and he's now going to spend his time watching TV and taking vacations? This sounds like the line of somebody who is losing a war and 'declares victory' and just splits. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 14:11:13 (EST)
From: Mike Email: None To: JW Subject: Let's hope so... Message: JW: 'This sounds like the line of somebody who is losing a war and 'declares victory' and just splits.' Let's hope so..... ;-) On a lighter note: So he must have ESTABLISHED peace on this planet, just like he PROMISED, eh? Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 14:29:49 (EST)
From: Mike Email: None To: JW Subject: Uh oh! He DID keep them Message: JW: I just 'realized' that I wasn't 'realizing'..... that must mean I'm realized, now. I just realized that he HAS kept his promises: - LIBERATION: Yes, he successfully liberated me from my cash and youth. - GOD CONSCIOUSNESS: Yes, I am now 'conscious' of the fact that there is no god! - ESTABLISHED PEACE: Yes, we have definitely 'established' that there is little or NO peace on this planet, most of the time. - TAKE AWAY ALL CARES AND FEARS: Yes, AGAIN, he has removed all caring from his loyal minions and they are no longer afraid because their brains no longer function well enough to warn them of real danger. - LOOK WHO'LL BE FEEDING ALL THE PEOPLE: Yes, even this one! Remember, the song said, 'LOOK,' it didn't say that HE was going to do it! OH MY GOD.... JW, he DID keep all of his promises! Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 15:54:45 (EST)
From: Katie Email: None To: JW Subject: Phase II? (nt) Message: nt Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 17:09:50 (EST)
From: JW Email: None To: Katie Subject: Okay, I Get It! Message: Phase I was kind of a mess, let's face it. Losing 90% of your followers, after 25 years, being considered nothing more, if thought of at all, as a has-been cult leader from the 70s, and being a Jenny Craig drop-out, kind of made 'phase I' less than a ringing success. But that's because it was Shri Maharaji's plan. It was all his damn fault! Maharaji couldn't help the lord of the universe, trip. He HAD to do it. He was just following directions from Shri Mahararj Ji. But NOW, with 'phase II,' Maharaji is free, now that he has done a satellite video hook-up seen by at least .000000005% of the world's population, 'phase I' is over and something so dynamic is about to take place. Yessir, it's just right around the corner, not much further, coming right down the pike, and it's so incredible. Hold on to your hats! Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 16:51:49 (EST)
From: Paul Email: None To: JW Subject: Important News Flash Message: Maybe he means that after all these years of selfless sacrafice and service to the premies and the world ,he needs to have some time to pursue some of his own interests and that he's now amassed enough $$$ that he doesn't need to pander to the premies (kind of like the ring of that). Besides, if he can get 100-200 communities to send him a few hundred bucks for videos that cost a few dollars, the $20-30,000 a month will keep him in cognac. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 14:16:20 (EST)
From: John Email: None To: Paul Subject: Thanks for the latest laugh! Message: You mean up until that satellite feed he did not think he had fulfilled his dad's mission? and now he does? What, does he actually think the whole world has now heard his message? Who is he kidding? Don't answer, i know, I know, The premies! $276/ month. Jeez, that seems high for a few videos, but I'm sure no one will be complaining or questioning. How many communities do you think there are that would subscribe? Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 15:03:43 (EST)
From: Happy and living in Paris Email: None To: all Subject: Important News Flash Message: Does this mean he is retiring ? Is he going to spend his days getting up in the morning, going into the studio, and tape a video here and there ? I read on the French Forum that he had 'patented' some inventions and 'sculptures'... So after the morning video taping, he'll have lunch -- eating or drinking it ??? -- and mosey on down to his workshop (is there on at the Palace ?) and invent some gadget and sculpt away some incredible master(haha)piece ? What about his fervent followers, how are THEY going to feel having their favorite drug (seeing him) taken away from them ? Will they rebel ? Will they riot ? Will they wake up ? His Work is done, is it ? Does it mean he has spread Knowledge now that he has beamed down his videotaped image via satellite or rather that he has reached his financial goals, having accumulated enough dough ? Has he decided he had plucked his premies long enough ? Naw, I don't believe he could have. Gee... there will be sobbing in the cottages, as we say in French, if it's the case and he calls it 'quit' ! Anyway, this kind of news sure makes it worth tuning in, folks ! Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 15:07:56 (EST)
From: Jim Email: None To: Paul Subject: The fine print Message: 'Dear Kansas City area premies and aspirants: For those of you who saw the recent satellite feed of Maharaji know of His announcement that He has now fulfilled His committment to His Master to spread Knowledke around the world, and that now He is going to do what He wants to do.' (emphasis mine) This is a trick, I think. Maharaji promised to bring 'Knowledge' to the world, not 'Knowledke'. Who does he think he's trying to fool? But, beyond that, DID Maharaji announce that he'd now fulfilled his 'committment to his Master'? I forget. Was that part of the satellite address? Because, if he DID say that then I've got to hand it to him, he's right. He has completely fulfilled his mission and we, my bitter friends, are toast. See, when I first started doubting Maharaji I had no idea that one day he'd be able to address pretty well everyone at the same time via this technology. I guess you could say I lacked imagination as well as faith. Now, though, he's done it and I'm feeling obliged to take back all I've said against him. He pulled it off when no one was looking. He did the unimaginable (by me, anyway) and we're all left with egg substitute on our face. shp, I apologize for calling you stupid. You had the fortitude to keep the channel open when I let mine cave right in. I'm sorry. op, why didn't I really try to communicate with you? You extended your hand, your human decency and your warmth and I slapped it all away. I'm sorry beyond words. In fact, wasn't that where you wanted to take me all along? Back home, beyond words, where I could be safe and worry free? Guide me, op, for I feel weak and depressed. Mind you, every day IS a new day and every breath.... well, even now I can feel that breath taking me to that magic spot. I can feel that love and with it -- surprise? Oh no, it's so familiar! -- that gratitude! op, get me some front row seats for something or other. I'll dress nice and won't blubber too much. Please, op, accept my apologies. CD, your clever linguistic judo kept you dry when the rest of us just wallowed in the mud. And all along there were the cues but who could see them? The secret of pi, the meaning of infinity, the chalice and the lost ark. Hey, the power of positive thinking! The gracious, subtle wisdom of Napoleon Hill and, perhaps, Og Mandingo, the 'Greatest Salesmean in the World'! (Can't remember if he's one of your guys but he damned well should be.) You offered us these and more, CD. Plus a few 'classic' riffs and a pint or two. CD, I LOVE you. I love what you stand for. I love the fact that you could take a brain-dead accident victim and get along with them evey bit as well as you could me. THAT says it all. I'm learning, buddy. And yes, I love my Les Paul (although it is kinda heavy. I'm looking for an old start with a decent whammy system and some Seymour Duncans, at least for the neck pickup. What do you think?) Bruce, you are a warrior for truth. The sheer guts you've had wading in here again and again, spelling out the honest facts as clearly as you know them. Who was I fooling? Bruce, you always impressed. If I can afford it, I'd like to bring my girlfriend to Amaroo. Not to lolligag (or 'walkabout' as you guys say. Pretty good, eh?) But to serve. I think Laurie needs to experience selfless service for once. I want to put her to work on Maharaji's farm, if you know what I mean. For myself, Bruce, I was wondering if you could maybe swing something a little 'administrative' if you know what I mean. (Know what I mean?) I mean there's mutual respect there, isn't there? You know, between two noble, worthy opponents such as ourselves? Well, if not, I'll come humbly. Just let me know and I'll pack accordingly. Okay, that's it. Time to practice! Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 15:27:47 (EST)
From: Mike Email: None To: Jim Subject: BWAH HA HA HA HA HA HA ..... Message: Jim: BWAH HA HA HA HA ad nauseum! ...... NO NO I can't stop.... BWAAAHHHHHH HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA BWAAAHHHHHH HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA BWAAAHHHHHH HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA BWAAAHHHHHH HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA BWAAAHHHHHH HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA BWAAAHHHHHH HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 15:29:58 (EST)
From: M Email: None To: Jim and all Subject: belated seasons greetings! Message: with love from within Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 15:35:31 (EST)
From: Selene Email: None To: M Subject: belated seasons greetings! Message: Right back at ya ole buddy. Sooo happy to hear of your retirement. congratulations. And let me be the first to send you a gold plated Mr. Hanky!! Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 15:36:40 (EST)
From: Jim Email: None To: M Subject: Link time, Brian? Message: Thank you Maharaji for giving the finger to my mind. You look so strong and clear in that picture. My heart is overflowing. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 13:13:04 (EST)
From: Roger Drek Email: None To: Jim Subject: GMJ greeting added to Drek Message: Being the fascist plagarist that I am, I've taken the liberty to steal said greeting from Maharaji and have added it to the House of Drek Gallery click here for Roger's House of Drek Gallery for way off topic stuff Including the Chronicles of the Red Nighty Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 22:06:21 (EST)
From: Robyn Email: sundogs@hotmail.com To: BM Subject: belated seasons greetings! Message: Dear BM, Respectfully, #@$( you too. I was surprised that as your aging face was revealed through the wonders of computer graphic I found I had to keep turning away, you have gotten much older. I think you look older than your age which I believe is your mid or late 30's. What a sad case you are even with all your cash. I did like the finger though, good touch. Ever yours in EX-premiedom, Robyn Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 22:41:04 (EST)
From: Rick Email: None To: Robyn Subject: belated seasons greetings! Message: Dear Robyn, BM is 41 years old. Exactly how old do you think he looks. JSCA, Rick Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 07:57:21 (EST)
From: Robyn Email: sundogs@hotmail.com To: Rick Subject: belated seasons greetings! Message: Dear Rick, I think he looks 52, you know ancient! Hahahaha! My god he was just a kid when I last took a close look. Do you think he looks good or what! Love, Q-Tip Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 11:30:50 (EST)
From: Rick Email: None To: Robyn Subject: belated seasons greetings! Message: Dear Robyn (Q-Tip), No, you're right. He looks haggard. Old and tired. But he's had a lot to do. Peace, Rick Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sun, Jan 31, 1999 at 04:15:46 (EST)
From: TD Email: None To: M Subject: belated seasons greetings! Message: Is this the fifth technique? Very clever! Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 07:42:07 (EST)
From: Gail Email: None To: Paul Subject: Is this News Flash true? Message: Maybe they haven't gotten around to telling the Canadians the good news yet. Yuk Yuk :>) Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 11:08:11 (EST)
From: Paul Email: None To: Gail Subject: Is this News Flash true? Message: Gail: I'm not sure if the local premie contact took it upon himself to interpret what M was saying in the broadcast or if it's the party line. Hard to believe that that this premie would do anything in public that wasn't officially blessed. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 15:31:24 (EST)
From: Gail Email: None To: Paul Subject: Thanks--This News Flash is Message: very good news indeed. I guess it means that MJ is getting tired of this trip. He wants to do his own thing. I thought the position of LORD, with all of its lifetime responsibilities, was a lifelong commitment. Oh well, even the Lord gets tired of helping lost souls out of the muck of maya with his bulldozer. Even he gets tired of spreading this K around like peanut butter. I guess MJ has lost his capacity for compassion and unconditional love. Having an ego the size of a small planet will do that to you. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 18:40:58 (EST)
From: ham Email: None To: Gail Subject: Thanks--This News Flash is Message: just his way of showing us he's having a mid-life career crisis, he could go his whole life not having really lived, gotta grab it while there's still some time left. Imagine having lived you're whole life as a lying fake who was a dismal failure in terms of his initial career aims in the family firm, 'peace in out time', ah well guess everyone has to grow up sometime, or in his case shrink down. Downsizing indeed. Can you imagine being the counsellor having to help him come to terms with his loss, especially the loss of lifestyle. Hope you've got plenty stashed away in that swiss bank account. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 12:36:11 (EST)
From: Ophelia Email: None To: Everyone Subject: In Kissimmee (1979) Pt. 1 Message: Ophelia wasn't planning to attend Hans Jayanti in Kissimmee; not after the previous year when her husband left her to join the Ashram. His moment of clarity brought her the pain and suffering of a woman betrayed and left for another lover. But this was worse. Ophelia's rage surfaced only long enough for her to recognize it and suppress it quickly with guilt. She could not allow herself to feel angry toward the Guru--twice she had spoken with initiators who urged her to understand that her feelings were invalid and kept her from the true experience of peace and bliss. One week prior to the festival, Big John sat down beside the softly weeping Ophelia during Satsang. He took her hand in his and guided it to rest in his lap atop his bulging woody. She lifted her red eyes to behold his blue eyes upon her. Big John leaned over and whispered, 'Come with me to Florida.' He shifted his weight and stuck his hand in his pocket. Ophelia gasped, fearing the worst. But Big John pulled out a small picture of the Guru and said, 'Ophelia, he wants you to come.' A few days later, Ophelia met up with Big John at a gas station and became convinced from the chance encounter that, by His grace, the Guru was calling her to Kissimmee. She accepted a ride in Big John's old VW bus, unaware that seven other devotees were also planning to make the 3,000-mile trip in 3 days. Big John's motivation for asking Ophelia along became apparent after the first rest stop: no one else had any money. The tight quarters, along with the standard vegetarian diet, soon created an intolerable breathing environment. Ophelia studied the others, wishing she could surrender and experience the bliss they were evidently experiencing (since none seemed to notice the stench). Two of the female passengers were ashramites and spent almost the entire trip sitting in a lotus position with their eyes closed. Nothing so unusual in that except that one of them was not wearing panties and no one but Ophelia seemed to notice. (Secretly Ophelia nicknamed the panty-less sister, 'Beaver.') Repeatedly, one of the brothers strummed a guitar and sang all the songs he knew until someone would ask him to play Arti. Everyone except Ophelia would join in eagerly. Ophelia looked out the window and wondered why she was here in this van on this planet with these crazy people. Whenever she started crying, the others mistook her tears for joy. One morning, Ophelia awoke to find Big John's arm around her shoulders, his hand groping her breast as he steered with his other hand. 'I have a special gift for you, sweetie,' he purred. 'And I have something for you, too.' Ophelia elbowed Big John in the rib hard and pulled her shawl closer around her. Fortunately, the sun was rising over the Atlantic Ocean, and soon they'd be out of this damn van. After arriving at the festival site, Ophelia experienced mild panic as memories of the previous year rushed through her mindless mind. All around her devotees were smiling peacefully, busily engaged in various forms of service. Ophelia felt like a fish out of water, a sore thumb, a bad cliche. She gave the brother at the front gate her last $100 and, carefully avoiding Big John, wandered off to see if the Grace had brought her to this cow pasture for a purpose. Deep down, she wanted the Guru to be real. She wanted the Knowledge to manifest in her life. If only her husband hadn't left her for that fat, greasy... Ophelia stopped herself short of finishing her blasphemous thoughts. 'So Hung,' she repeated in her head as she attempted to attach the syllables to her breathing. 'So Hung.' What a stupid mantra, Ophelia thought to herself. I doubt whether the Guru is 'So...' Stopping herself again before completing her thought, Ophelia decided to focus on something external since she was apparently going to lose the current battle with her mind. Service: Ophelia decided to help out in the kitchen. Unfortunately, her husband was there in charge of the yogurt. 'So Timothy,' Ophelia began, 'How is life in the ashram? How's Miami?' Immediately the vibe became weird; Ophelia was afraid of his response. 'Listen, Ophie, I have something to tell you.' Timothy stared at the ground, unable to meet Ophelia eye to eye. 'I've, we've... er, I'm leaving the ashram. One of the sisters and I fell in love, and one thing led to another, and now she's pregnant...' His voice trailed off. Timothy glanced at Ophelia out of the corner of his eye. Ophelia dropped the crate of yogurt on the ground, turned, and walked away. She came to her senses when a friend called to her as she meandered through the field where Satsang would start very soon. Ophelia sat stunned through several hours of blithering nonsense, registering nothing. When the Guru arrived on stage, his devotees went crazy. Ophelia remained seated in a catatonic state. It wasn't until the Guru left the stage that Ophelia let out her blood-curling scream. A whole year's worth of anguish escaped her lips, and she could no longer hold it in. Devotees nearby mistook her outburst for some sort of spiritual experience brought on by the Darshan of the Lord. When it became apparent that she was not going to stop screaming after a number of minutes, Ophelia was escorted by security to the tent where the social workers and psychologists were on duty to assist with freaked out devotees. A doctor administered a shot of valium, and Ophelia fell asleep quickly. The devotees assisting smiled knowingly as they arose and departed for the evening. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 12:41:27 (EST)
From: Ophelia Email: None To: Everyone Subject: In Kissimmee (1979) Pt. 2 Message: Day 2: Ophelia awoke with a dry mouth and a strong urge for a drink. Although she hadn't used alcohol, tobacco, or drugs for a couple of years, the desire she felt was strangely reminiscent of the days before the Guru when she would hang out down at the beach everyday and find guys who would help her get high. After receiving Knowledge, Ophelia took for granted that she would never, ever drink or use drugs again. After all, she was told that the Knowledge was the source of the satisfaction she was searching for in drugs. And if she would only practice it correctly, she'd never need anything else again. The day shift in the mental ward tent was over in the corner having Satsang to prepare for their Service. Ophelia had no trouble sneaking out of the tent. She traveled directly to the front gate and saw a devotee smoking a cigarette. She bummed one from him, and a light, and walked off slowly down the path toward the shuttles to the city of Kissimmee. A brother approached her and reproached her for smoking on sacred land where the Lord was likely to show up at any time. Ophelia was crushed. Her spirit, held hostage by the Guru, was easily tamed into submission. Freedom was not hers; not yet. First, she would learn to recognize evil and burn in hell before rising as a Phoenix and reclaiming her soul. Ophelia hopped on the shuttle which stopped at various hotels. She got off in front of a 7-11 and realized that she had no more money. At first, she considered whether this was a 'sign.' Perhaps the Guru's Grace caused her to be broke and hungry. Her programmed mind said, 'Go back to the sacred land. Eat the yogurt.' Her natural mind told her programmed mind to 'eat shit.' Ophelia stuffed a bottle of cheap wine and a muffin in her jeans and left the store. Fortunately there were so many other devotees in the process of getting busted for the same offense, Ophelia was able to walk away and drink her wine in a hotel parking lot. After she got a fairly decent buzz on, Ophelia decided she really needed coffee instead of wine at 7:00 in the morning. She walked around the side of the hotel restaurant and noticed it was filled with devotees. She assumed these must be the brothers and sisters who knew better than to camp in the cow pasture, eat Divine Groceries yogurt, and use port-o-potties for 7 days. While gazing in the window, Ophelia noticed a young girl, seated alone, who appeared to be talking to herself. The perfect breakfast companion. Ophelia approached the young girl and asked if she might join her. The girl was actually in her 30's, but wore her hair long and kept braiding and unbraiding a strand of it. She introduced herself as Lil, and invited Ophelia to sit with her. Lil easily fell into a monologue, and Ophelia listened with a mind as clear as an Etch-A-Sketch which had just been shaken upside down. She ate her stolen muffin and Lil bought her a coffee and the morning seemed promising. As it turned out, Lil was a devotee from Miami. Her boyfriend was also a devotee, but his cocaine habit caused Lil to worry because his behavior became wild and extraordinary when he was strung out. Once, Lil told Ophelia, he threw her across a room and broke her nose. A few times he butt fucked her and really hurt her. (Ophelia noticed that conversations around them died down as Lil told her tale). Lil explained that she had learned some spiritual lessons from the abuse she suffered. For instance, she learned how to find pleasure within pain. She recognized that it's all the same and that 'through changing her perceptions of what was happening,' she was able to rise above anything negative in her life. Ophelia was hypnotized by Lil's story, mesmerized by her style and her confidence. She only wished that she could have Lil's clarity and understanding. Then again, she wondered if perhaps Lil might have taken a few too many acid trips. Lil's boyfriend showed up, smiled quickly at Ophelia, and told Lil it was time to go. Although they never met again, Ophelia often thought of Lil fondly--never considering that rather than achieving sainthood, Lil was probably suffering from Dissociative Disorder. Ophelia decided to hop on the shuttle and give the Guru one more chance to cure her misery. But first, she used the restroom in the hotel. It turned out to be the highlight of her day. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 13:42:00 (EST)
From: Selene Email: None To: Ophelia Subject: In Kissimmee (1979) Pt. 2 Message: NOTE: I loved that! thanks.. and here's an attempt to tie it to the Red Nighty. ============================================================ You know you are having fun at a festival when... The best thing that could happen is a civilized bathroom with only one other person in the other stall. But what was that noise? Ophelia thought it was someone crying. They ended up outside their stalls at the same time. The woman had definitely been crying. She also had no problems pulling out a vial of coke and doing a line right in front of Ophelia! Lena looked over 'Well I figure if someone smells like cheap wine at 8 a.m., they don't have a lot of room to judge' She smiled at Ophelia and offered her a line. They started talking immediately. As they left the hotel they both expressed a desire to stay away from the cow patch a little longer. They went back to the lot and finished the wine. Lena laughed til tears ran down her eyes as Ophelia recounted her breakfast conversation with Lil. She felt so close to this person she had just met. Lena asked Ophelia if she had heard the rumours that Maharaji was going to be spending more and more time in Malibu, and that Miami was not the hot spot it had been. Ophelia told her a story about the last days of DECA... Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 14:55:29 (EST)
From: reditor Email: None To: Selene Subject: when did M move to malibu? Message: does anyone know this...also, when was end of DECA project? thanks for help on this. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 16:27:25 (EST)
From: Mike Email: None To: reditor Subject: when did M move to malibu? Message: Red (again with the red...): I believe it was in 74. I went to a party at his place not long after he moved in, so I think that is the right year (maybe 75). Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 16:29:46 (EST)
From: reditor Email: None To: Mike Subject: u must mean 84? Message: don't u? Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 16:32:53 (EST)
From: Mike Email: None To: reditor Subject: u must mean 84? Message: red: NO, he's lived in Trancas Canyon for a long time. I think the house has been completely renovated since I saw it, originally. Actually, I think he had been eyeing the place since a year or two earlier, because Scott and I chased him up Pac Coast hiway in that direction when he lived on Sunset Blvd, in the Palisades. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 16:39:24 (EST)
From: Mike Email: None To: Red Subject: BTW, Red Message: Red: In fact, I took a picture of M removing the tennis net because we couldn't walk around it. I 'think' it was his birthday, but I can't remember the exact event. Anyway, like I said, it was 74/75..... Just can't quite remember which. After looking at the recent floor plans of the place, though, I can say that alot of renovation/rebuilding was done ont he place. BTW, IT was really nice already, I don't know why he remodeled it. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 00:08:21 (EST)
From: Gail Email: None To: Mike Subject: No Remodelling - Demolition Message: He demoed that place because he claimed it leaked. Meanwhile, do you guys remember the fire in Malibu. The trees around his house got their leaves singed off. He spray painted them green. Remember Marolyn saying that there was no way that a fire could destroy that house. It was a house full of love. Even the fire had to stop in the face of that love. I wonder what she said as the house was torn down. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 00:29:02 (EST)
From: Runamok Email: None To: Gail Subject: fire stopped by3 trees/marolyn Message: I remember Marolyn gushing forth frothy satsang about '3 strong trees' that saved her ass apparently, I think likening them two strong devotees. That was at Amherst- so it was pretty early- the 'holy' family gang was there. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 02:17:15 (EST)
From: Runamok Email: None To: Runamok Subject: fire stopped short Message: was at Amherst, was that 73? when Marolyn gave that talk. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 02:43:59 (EST)
From: Runamok Email: None To: Runamok Subject: something stopped 2 short Message: and it was my post. marilyn gave that little speech at amherst- was that 73? The family was there like i said. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 07:36:00 (EST)
From: Gail Email: None To: Runamok Subject: Malibu Fire - 1978 or 79? Message: I am probably wrong, but I it was more like 1978 or 79. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 14:29:23 (EST)
From: JW Email: None To: Gail Subject: Malibu Fire - 1978 or 79? Message: That's right Gail. I think the Malibu fire was 1978. The Amherst program was in July, 1974. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 12:52:03 (EST)
From: barney Email: None To: Runamok Subject: Amherst Guru Puja was 74 Message: Geez, it's all slipping away. I used to remember every program, when and where I saw BM and a few post above I stated that the Miami 25th Anniv. program was '95 when it WAS '96. I can tell that the Viagra is accelerating the onset on Alzheimers. Pretty soon I'll have to go live with Uncle Ronnie. Wonder if the DLM/EV Historian could help us? Also if BM was married then Holy Family was not there. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 15:38:30 (EST)
From: Gail Email: None To: barney Subject: Naw! It's just that you're Message: no longer so concerned with the when and where you saw the cult leader anymore. You have a life. I'm still working on one. This bullshit should start to blur for me any day now. I would suspect that ex-premies don't need Viagra. The years of pent-up sexual energy will probably do the trick until one is 110 at least. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 18:36:24 (EST)
From: Runamok Email: None To: barney Subject: Amherst Guru Puja was 74 Message: Nope they were together and then that period in history was over. I think the big thing was Marolyn giving darshan that 'broke the camel's back'. I also think it might have actually been before 74 but........ it was around then for sure. Maybe there was more than one fire. There are alot of fires in Malibu, or have been. I've seen them reported alot. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 17:53:12 (EST)
From: Selene Email: None To: Mike Subject: u must mean 84? Message: yup I went to that party too. I was confused since he still had the Miami house and all the Mimia lilas going full steam. But it had to be after 75 because I drove there from AZ and I hadn't moved to AZ until 75 Some party huh? All us groveling idiots standing in a huddle seeking a glimpse. No fun at all. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 18:14:44 (EST)
From: Mike Email: None To: Selene Subject: u must mean 84? Message: Selene: Like I mentioned to Red, I think that he had actually eyed the property and purchased it prior to 75 because he was seen driving in that direction on several occasions. When he knew he was being 'tailed,' he would speed up to over 100mph on PCH to lose the 'bongos' (in one particular instance, it was Scott and I....he he he). Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 14:31:33 (EST)
From: JW Email: None To: Selene Subject: He had Both Houses Message: He got the Malibu dream house in 1974, and ALSO a house in Miami Beach in around 1978 or 1979. First there was the Palm Island House and then the house further North in Miami Beach, right on Biscayne Bay. I think he wanted to be near the plane project. But he kept the house in Malibu as well. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 04:32:56 (EST)
From: barney Email: None To: reditor Subject: 74 might be right Message: I recall sending in $100 at that time (right after he got married in May of '74) so they could buy the place in Malibu. Or maybe that was the request to buy adjacent land to protect his privacy. I believe that there were two requests for money in regards to the house. And I remember driving up their to gawk after some program in L.A. in the '70s. The original house was a white 2 or 3 story affair that was relatively modest, especially in contrast to what has completely replaced it now. The current structure is a tan stucco affair with loads of huge windows looking out to the ocean. The structure was built to withstand a Richter Scale 9 earthquake. Remember that a log scale is logarithmic which means a 9 is really, really strong. I mean have there ever been any 9's? Actually, there have been only 4 earthquakes of 9.0 or greater between 2150 B.C. - 1994 A.D. YEAR MO DA LAT LONG Mag 1687 10 20 CS -13.200 -76.500 9.00 1812 03 26 DS 10.000 -67.000 9.60 1827 11 16 BS 1.900 -75.600 9.70 1868 08 13 DE -18.300 -70.600 9.50 (none of above in California and by my estimations are all in South America around Colombia and Bolivia) Wait a minute. The above data doesn't include the 9.2 Alaska quake. The San Francisco quake of 1906 was 8.25 There have been 11 quakes in California between 1735 and 1974 with magnitude above 7.0. We should dispatch someone from L.A. out there to take some pictures. A number of good shots from PCH 1 with a telephoto would be really good as well as a few from the road directly above it. Some pictures of the Trancas Market would be good, too, as it is/was a staging area for premies to be picked up and shuttled up for service. Maybe Jim could pose as an eager premie. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 14:02:46 (EST)
From: JW Email: None To: barney Subject: 74 might be right Message: Interesting Barney, yes I recall there was a second fundraising to buy land around 'the residence' after 'the residence' had been purchased some time before that. I think that was about 1977 but the house was purchased in about 1974. Isn't it bizarre how we talk about Maharji's house as 'the residence' and his motorhome as 'the motorhome?' Were you around or in on any of the fundraising for the new 'residence?' Regarding earthquakes, the Loma Prieta earthquake in Northern California in 1989 was a 7.1 so I guess that's the 12th California earthquake over 7.0 since 1735. Who was around to measure an earthquake in 1735 in California? Father Serra? Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sun, Jan 31, 1999 at 16:37:24 (EST)
From: barney Email: None To: JW Subject: earthquakes (ot) Message: I was around for the fundraising, but other than throwing $100 into I didn't have much of a part. Do you remember Harry W. from Chicago? Apparently, he struck it rich by inventing some video camera thingy and he owns a house directly above The Residence. Yes, we sure gave up our own identities and needs when we proudly referred to Maharaji's property as The. I image that you got shook by the Loma Prieta earthquake? I've only been in two quakes, both in the 5s. Yes, the U.S. Geological survey has earthquake data back to 2035 B.C. I guess that they look at the amount of shift. One technique they use for dating is the examination of tiny crystals on the rock and how many are remaining versus an expected number if the rock was brand new. I'm a little fuzzy on this, but knew a geologist who was working on discovering a fault. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, Jan 30, 1999 at 10:53:05 (EST)
From: Blanco Email: None To: barney Subject: 74 might be right Message: March 26 1812, Latitude 10 Longitude 67 Magnitude 9.60 Was it really that strong???? The story goes that Bolívar was recruiting soldiers to fight out the Sapnish Colonialism. When the earthquake hit the country the Spaniards said that it was a curse from God for trying to get away from the Holy Spanish Kings... The people started hiding from Bolívar until He, at a street meeting said to the crowd: ...if Nature opposes we'll also fight to subdue it and make it obey us.... He freed five Latinamerican Nations (Colombia, Ecuador, Peru, Bolivia and Venezuela) Sorry I just couldn´t help it.... Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, Jan 30, 1999 at 15:56:37 (EST)
From: Selene Email: None To: Blanco Subject: 74 might be right Message: No need to apologize Blanco. I thought that was very interesting. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sun, Jan 31, 1999 at 16:24:10 (EST)
From: barney Email: None To: Blanco Subject: earthquakes (ot) Message: Yes, that was interesting, Blanco. According the the U.S. Geological survey they estimate that that earthquake was 9.6. The worst I've ever felt was a 5.6 and it was strange. Again, 9.6 is HUGE and must have put the fear of God into them. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 17:08:23 (EST)
From: eb Email: None To: Mike Subject: when did M move to malibu? Message: Hi Mike, Was that the party on the tennis courts when he talked about how Knowledge is not like training dolphins? Or was that one later on in the 70's? I thought he had the mansion since at least January '74. eb Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 17:13:28 (EST)
From: JW Email: None To: eb Subject: when did M move to malibu? Message: Yes, eb, I think you're right. Maharaji and Marolyn got married in May, 1974 and he was living in Malibu at least by then. The DECA project ended by 1982, probably sometime in 1981 the plane was finished. I remember seeing the plane (the 707) at the airport in Kansas City in November, 1981. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 17:28:04 (EST)
From: Mike Email: None To: eb Subject: hmmmmm.... Message: eb: I don't remember the content of any real satsang. He hung around alot and didn't really talk to anyone. I DO remember that later in the evening (after sundown) we watched a movie of M. Imagine that.... there he was, in the house, present and accounted for..... and here we are watching a 'movie' of him giving satsang!!!!! Drip.... After the movie he comes on a PA system and gives us his blessings and tells us to drive carefully..... Drip.... The only redeaming value I found was that when we left, the fog had rolled in and covered the entire area. It was really a beautiful site seeing all of those hills peeking above the fog line while we were on top. It was a full moon, too (if I remember correctly). Really pretty. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 17:59:14 (EST)
From: Selene Email: None To: Mike Subject: hmmmmm.... Message: It MAY very well have been a b'day party. Memory returns, we came to AZ in Sept of 74. RE: the blueprints, he didn't just remodel he built an ENTIRE new house next to the old one. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 18:59:45 (EST)
From: x Email: None To: Selene Subject: hmmmmm.... Message: I went to a birthday party at gmj's Malibu mansion once too. I estimate I was about ten years old so that would make it around '77. I remember that the big buzz was that gmj got a helicopter for his birthday, and then sure enough, after awhile a helicopter came swooping by, causing much elation amongst the premies. The main thing that I remember was parking down at the trancas market and then hiking what seemed like several miles up to gmj's hilltop mansion, followed by waiting around for literally hours and hours for greaseball to show. As I remember it I was always waiting around for that jerk when I was premie. I guess its a powewr trip he likes to play, but who does he think he is? The Rolling Stones or something? I mean come on! The worst part was being completely mortified as I was herded along with the hundreds of burnt out devotees, past the confused, wealthy, suburbanites who were all out on their front lawns watching as us freaky hippie types walked by. I just remember wishing SO HARD that I was one of the spectators rather than the unfortunate soul that I felt I was. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 19:10:43 (EST)
From: Mike Email: None To: x Subject: hmmmmm.... Message: x: I think your visit may have been a couple of years after mine. I DO remember that this was the first time that we were asked to NOT bhole shri or pranam. He didn't want to upset the neighbors (that's exactly what we were told, at the time). If he were the lord, why would he care???? Drip.... Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 20:47:19 (EST)
From: eb Email: None To: Mike and x Subject: To Mike and x Message: The dolphin satsang I referred to earlier happened on the tennis court during this gathering that x described. I remember waiting for what seemed hours in a line in the fog in the parking lot of the market down the hill. (How many prepositions was that? It made me dizzy writing it). Childcare was happening in the ashram or premie house up the hill a bit. I did spend some time there during the day so I didn't have to wait as long as x did. Besides the dolphin satsang, I remember a couple of LA premies eating Kentucky Fried Chicken. I flashed and thought it must be some weird lila just for me. (My memory is bad, but that I remember). Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 22:41:00 (EST)
From: Katie Email: None To: x Subject: to x Message: The worst part was being completely mortified as I was herded along with the hundreds of burnt out devotees, past the confused, wealthy, suburbanites who were all out on their front lawns watching as us freaky hippie types walked by. I just remember wishing SO HARD that I was one of the spectators rather than the unfortunate soul that I felt I was. Hi x - I wanted to tell you that I can relate to this SO much. And the stupidest part is that I was always in these situations out of my own free will (because I thought I had to be there), rather than being dragged along by someone else. I'm glad neither of us is in that situation anymore. Sheesh! Take care, Katie Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 19:55:08 (EST)
From: Gail Email: None To: Mike Subject: when did M move to malibu? Message: He moved back to the west late in 82 or very early 83 I believe. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 20:04:13 (EST)
From: Gail Email: None To: Gail Subject: When did M move to Malibu? Message: It seems to me that he had his Malibu home before he married Marolyn in 1974. He kept this place open and rented a house on an island off Biscayne Blvd Causeway (or that vacinity) by 1978 or 79. Remember the rush. The people who had moved to Malibu to be close to MJ had to pack up and move east. Then, he moved back to Malibu. The same old cleaning staff never left. They just kept the house ready for when he came back. His entourage of gopis moved back too. Soon they'll have to move to Africa for Phase III (MJ's deposition). Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 20:12:56 (EST)
From: Selene Email: None To: Gail Subject: When did M move to Malibu? Message: I think you are on there GAil. He won't have much choice but a third world country. The 90's are not a good breeding ground for this type of thing. What will the premies do here? Talk about withdrawals! 30 years on the same drug. never dealing with the real issues. Of course they can all move to Africa. They don't care about material stuff after all, right? yeah, right. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 05:13:14 (EST)
From: barney Email: None To: Selene Subject: Miami & my little friend Message: We can't forget Phillip Michael Thomas of Miami Vice TV show being at the Miami Beach programs. when was the Mariel (sp) boatlift? Somewhere I've got some great pictures of me and some friends in the mid '80s in Miami Beach at the beach with some great graffiti as backing. My favorite was Ronald Wilson Reagan = 6 + 6 + 6. The last time I was in Miami Beach in July of 1995 for the 25th Anniversary the whole scene was very Cuban and the tourists seemed to be mostly from South America. Reason Maharaji might have left Miami for Malibu: the airplane project was kaput too many cubans and Al Pacino and his little friend Didn't Miami Beach deteriorate to the point of being really ugly at some point? When I was there in 1995 Miami was coming back and looking good even though some of the old hotels we all knew and loved were still abandoned. One thing they did (in the 80s?) was rebuild the sand on the beaches by pumping sand in from slightly offshore. Apparently, they need to do it again, but that supply is gone and it is going to be more expensive. The beaches were really disappearing in the late 70's and early 80's. In 1995 the beaches were decent and they had machines that cleaned them. There was a nice meandering boardwalk near Wolfies that ran up and down the beach for 1/4 to a 1/2 mile along the edge of the beache near the hotels. There were tall grasses planted near the boardwalks. I did notice drug dealing at the bathrooms at the street ends near the beaches. And at night the beaches were a little scary with a fair number of homeless characters living on the boardwalks. 1995, the South Beach area was really hip and cool. Designer Gianni Versace's place in South Beach was really cool with a telescope. When did Versace move to South Beach? I saw a movie called Illtown (1996) with Lili Taylor and Michael Rapaport as nice, hip heroin dealers with a heart operating in South Beach. Interesting small role was Tony Danza playing the gay Mr. Big Money Man Behind the Drugs. It was a bad movie, I couldn't recommend it other than the scenery. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 07:38:51 (EST)
From: Not that it matters Email: None To: barney Subject: Anniversary Event was 1996 -nt Message: nt Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 14:40:48 (EST)
From: JW Email: None To: barney Subject: Some Dates Message: The Mariel boatlift was in 1980, the same year there were race riots in Miami. It was also a time when Miami was awash in cocaine. South Beach most definitely improved to the point that it is now very trendy and very gay. I don't know when Versace moved there, but it most definitely became jet set, a la 'The Birdcage.' They were broadening the beaches in the late 70s and into the 80s. After th days of Arthur Godfrey in the 50s, Miami Beach began deteriorating. By the 70s Miami Beach was still rather run down, filled with working class jews from the Northeast living in small hotels, but, fortunately, historic preservation laws prevented developers from tearing down those great art deco buildings in the Southern part of the city. That's the area that has become so trendy these days. By the way, South Americans were always the main tourists in the Summer months, even back in the 70s. Canadians, Americans and the Brits, and other 'snow birds' were the big tourists in the Winter months. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 20:05:38 (EST)
From: Selene Email: None To: Gail Subject: when did M move to malibu? Message: Mike and i are definitely right about the party. My speculaton is that he maintained a Maimi palace as well, til those 80's years you mention. He had probably shot his wad in Miami and found that the Malibu population was more tolerant, more vlunerable to a guru and way more rich!! Good move. Who says you can't think when you are drunk? All it takes is a pack of slaves and financial advisors. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 19:25:43 (EST)
From: Brian Email: brian@ex-premie.org To: Everyone Subject: Behind the Green Door Revised Message: This post originally referred people to a site online here that contained URL's to the pages on www.premie.org that were password protected. Within a few hours of it's appearing here, the URL's were changed along with the password. Personally, I'm amazed that Mili and Harlan work so quickly, but that's life. Rather than subject people to broken links, I've deleted the page and revised this post. Also on the deleted page was a form allowing you to receive the information from the password application form. That was also changed so that it no longer began: Hey wake up! Somebody wants to see more pictures of The Lord! but now sports these words at the top: Congratulations, you have been added to the list of internet users that are on this server. You could be charged by The F.B.I. with a felony. I'm wondering just how many internet users are supposedly illegally accessing cgi scripts on their server. But since the tone could be taken as threatening to users who submitted the revised form on the deleted page, I removed it rather than worry people that they just made Harlan and Mili's list of offenders by clicking on the submit button. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 07:49:32 (EST)
From: bill Email: None To: Brian Subject: mobBILE phone joke Message: On that site the have a link to maharaji's mobile phone number- you hit it and it says -you got to be kidding- Of course the master of life is not available to take your call. You are the student slave. Peon. Idiot. the lord of the universe doesnt take calls from YOU. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 15:35:13 (EST)
From: Katie Email: None To: Brian Subject: Behind the premie door... Message: Congratulations, you have been added to the list of internet users that are on this server. You could be charged by The F.B.I. with a felony. I didn't 'access their server' so I didn't get this message, but I think it's pretty funny. Lighten up, premies! Anything's possible, but do you REALLY think people could be charged with a felony for 'illegally' looking at pictures of Maharaji and the words to Arti? If so, we're all hiring Jim as our defense lawyer :) Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 15:38:22 (EST)
From: Selene Email: None To: Katie Subject: Behind the premie door... Message: Confusing premies - nothing new. I see www.premie.org announcing they are the Officious er I mean Official Site. Then I am told enjoyyourselfinprivate.org is the 'sancioned' site. Which is it? Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 16:20:29 (EST)
From: Mike Email: None To: Katie Subject: Behind the premie door... Message: Katie: I wonder if they know which particular 'public law' applies to this situation. I'll bet NOT! he he he :-) BTW, did you notice that M's finger is on backwards in our holiday greetings picture? Boy, for a 'god' he sure does mess up when he's getting ready for work, doesn't he? Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 02:30:28 (EST)
From: Jethro Email: None To: Mike Subject: Behind the premie door... Message: 'BTW, did you notice that M's finger is on backwards in our holiday greetings picture? ' That's because it's the first time he's seen it in years, you see it's been stuck up his....(woops a power failure) Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 15:34:52 (EST)
From: Runamok Email: None To: Everyone Subject: PremiePosts on Ex-Premie Forum Message: These premies are so anxious to post here. What gives? Just between you and me (exes only), talking to premies is a bore, otherwise I might still be one. Maybe some ex could start a for forum just for premies so they wouldn't have to feel so negative... You say, it already exists Are you premies convinced that you can do the world good trying to change us? Do you like that bash your head against the wall experience? Are you just to chicken to leave M so you get a contact high from us? Is it fair to say that this is a forum for ex-premies and others may participate as guests? That might help bring some perspective to the situation. I think arguing with premies is a bore and a half. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 16:47:58 (EST)
From: Jean-Michel Email: None To: Runamok Subject: Why do you care? Message: So why do you care arguing with them? I don't. They're not even honest towards themselves, then what do you expect from them in a discussion? Prove it? You already know. Prove it for them? They won't accept it, otherwise they'll fall from their heaven.... and become exes. Nobody ever proved me I was wrong following the Lard. I had to accept it for myself. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 19:52:42 (EST)
From: Jerry Email: None To: Jean-Michel Subject: Why do you care? Message: JM, I think this forum is a much needed rebuttal to M's claims to perfection. Before I came across it, I never heard anybody saying so much as boo to Maharaji. It's just the shove premies sitting on the fence need to get on the right track. As for premies who show up here to argue, well, if they think they're going to reconvert any exes, they're dreaming. I think they're just here to keep swaying premies on the fence and maybe win them over. Personally, I think their lame arguments only help those premies to jump off the fence that much quicker. When I arrived at the forum, there was a slugout going on between CD and Jim (actually, it was a pretty good ass whuppin' CD was getting), and I know it only helped me to jump off of my fence. So thanks, CD, you've been a big help. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 17:24:00 (EST)
From: Helen Email: None To: Runamok Subject: PremiePosts on Ex-Premie Forum Message: Hey Run. I really do wonder what premies get out of it. I do think maybe it's kind of fascinating for them to read here because it's a foot in the premie world and a foot in the real world, but that it also is very confronting and so I wonder what is in it for them? My friends used to confront me all the time about Maharaji (my non-premie friends) I just swallowed it, denied it, thought 'poor them, they can't understand out of their ignorance'. I kept up those friendships & they kept up with me, I observed them and learned a lot from them for when it was time to let go of the guru... Remember, there is a high degree of delusion in being a premie. God knows how embarrasing it is to look back and think of the stupid recklessness of it all and what my friends and family must have thought of me--but I was really deluded from objective reality in Guru Maharaji's 'shelter'. Remember 'Guru Maharaji's shelter'? Shelter from the big bad world that we premies were too fragile and sensitive to deal with. GM did us such a disservice--better to have taught us some survival skills for the world, IMO Helen Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 18:00:10 (EST)
From: Anne Email: None To: Everyone Subject: too good to be true Message: 'if I could only have the HOPE that something like that (knowledge) existed - even just the hope would be enough', post from Merete Kierulff on enjoyinglife - Denmark, Living with Knowledge. OK, which one one of you creative souls wrote and submitted this one to enjoyinglife.? I am sincerely HOPING that this piece of work has been submitted by one of you from this site. It is a classic, hitting on all the points, yet there is a underlying message written between the lines. How did it get by the editors? Please tell me that it cannot be true that this is a sincere post. What kind of a life is it were just hope is enough? When I received k. there was suppose to be An EXPERIENCE now just the HOPE of k. existing is enough? Is this so that premies can now truely ignore what they are experiencing and live on hope? Anne Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 18:16:47 (EST)
From: Mike Email: None To: Anne Subject: Dumbing down Message: Anne: IMHO, if this is considered acceptable, then it's another stage in the 'dumbing down' of expectations concerning K. From my point of view, this dumbing down went something like this: - K is the experience of LIBERATION or GOD CONSCIOUSNESS! - K is THE PEACE - THAT place! - K is really peaceful - K is a relaaxation technique - K just 'feels good' - K is only a hope! (last stage, not confirmed yet.... he he he) Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 18:49:42 (EST)
From: x Email: None To: Helen Subject: PremiePosts on Ex-Premie Forum Message: Hi Helen, My opinion, is that the main reason why certain premies enjoy lurking here is, they have fun reading the discussions of things like 'which devotional song was the grossest of all?' Notice they always chime in with their two cents? I bet they also like reading the observationss and axccounts, like the one that sticks out in my mind, where an ex- premie said that he was driving somewhere once with three other devotees, when he noticed that they had passed the offramp they needed, but, rather than point it out, he felt shamed into appearing oblivious like the other three, due to the fear of appearing 'in his mind', by noticing his surroundings rather than meditating, or being blissed out, or whatever, he felt that the others were doing. Now that is an interesting introspection,that story is a lot more *real* and has a lot more emotional honesty and soul searching in it than any of the pablum served up at enjoyinglife.com, that's for sure. Even CD and OP would probably have to concede that. I mean inspirational stories can be nice, but they get boring after a while. People want to be entertained, even premies. Where else can anyone, premies included hear these personal,riveting accounts of the fascinating mindframes and situations that one found him/herself in as a premie? Nowhere in the premie world proper, that's for sure. Where no one is really allowed to even ACKNOWLEDGE the strange trips of the 70's, let alone talk freely, openly and honestly about them. Obviously the premies here like the freedom and honesty that they find here, which is so clearly lacking in their stunted and repressed little cult. Sincerely x Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 19:37:42 (EST)
From: Runamok Email: None To: x and all Subject: PremiePosts on Ex-Premie Forum Message: I just wonder if it should be posted that premies are guests of the ex-premies or something to that effect. Some of those people act like this thing exist to serve them and I don't think it does (altho Katie or Brian can clarify). For myself, among other things, I want to document and record the misdeeds of Shri Goomaraj so that people will know about what he is. It's easy for that to turn into an argument when premies are present.. but that's not how it starts for me. I think premiedom gets really dumb for them and that's why they're here. Now if they could admit that much. By the way, I not talking about the lurkers, altho a lot of the same analysis will apply. Really funny post, Mike. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 20:34:03 (EST)
From: Helen Email: None To: x Subject: PremiePosts on Ex-Premie Forum Message: I agree, x..it certainly was a, er, um ...colorful time and it is fun and interesting and weird to read about it. Helen Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, Jan 30, 1999 at 00:56:19 (EST)
From: VP Email: None To: x Subject: PremiePosts on Ex-Premie Forum Message: I'm with you, x. This is a premie soap opera and we are the characters. The thing about gerry with the tampon in an ashram will be the talk in the cult for a while, I suspect-SNICKER. Talk about enjoyinglife, gerry. VP ;) Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 23:48:58 (EST)
From: Blanco Email: None To: Runamok Subject: PremiePosts on Ex-Premie Forum Message: (exes only), I have been reading here for quite a while but i still don't fully understand what's the basic difference between a premie and an ex. i think that basically we are all peas in the same curry sauce. Perhaps it just might be that some are nice and tender and others bruised, overboiled or even demolished. And then it is just natural for tender peas to firmly believe that their curry sauce will just simmer along with their dreams...then exes are just a pain in the art, you know?, a loud and insistent testimony that you have to hang the thief when he is young...for though we slepe or wake, or rome, or ryde, Ay fleeth the tyme; it nil no man abyde. The more I read here the more I realise the oppressive consecuences of M's self-respect-belittling views which have caused innumerable sufferings to everyone who dared believe in him. The impenetrable wall behind where he sits is plausibly broken on this web page every day.... I think this is reason enough to ignite my interest to listen to premies (potential ex-premies) and to read through the experience of exes. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 00:32:58 (EST)
From: Runamok Email: None To: Blanco and all Subject: existential bakhti Message: I love(d) Miragey enough to denounce him when it became clear he's a fake. It's arguably some existential form of bakhti yoga. If M could feel me, he would know there's real love in denouncing him. There's respect for his victims. There's a chance for HIS soul (ok not a big chance). If you love a fake that you know is a fake, it's not love. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 18:43:33 (EST)
From: Blanco Email: None To: Runamok Subject: existential bakhti Message: That is wonderful…and as you mention Bahkti Yoga I just remembered the Holy Bhagavad Gita, the great Hindi book about Devotional Love to the Living Master, (does it sound familiar???) which, strangely enough for some, is not a strange freaky trip from the 70’s but a well known Religious Belief followed freely, openly and honestly by Millions in India and elsewhere in the world, and please don’t forget that Human Rights are inclusive Free Religious Beliefs. According to the Gita the Love for the Living Lord will bring you conciousness of bliss (in other words: it will make you happy). That’s a pretty good offer isn’t it?? Does it sound like a bargain??. Just follow the Perfect Master and be Happy. But…there is always a but….(does it sound familiar???) Where is the Living Lord so that I can devote my love to Him and be Happy??? (I think this is a reasonable question for somebody with common sense): Let us break this thing down for the sake of understanding: “my love” is the target, it is real, it does exist, simple people have lots of it “to be happy” is the bait…and there exists nobody who does not want to be happy. But…but…where is the Living Lord??, the subject of the love who will make me happy??? Lucky you…lucky you when it became clear Miragey is a fake. Not everybody is able to give-up the bait of Happiness, furthermore love is stubborn and blind… just remember you cannot Love and be Clever…. That is why I agree with you…respect for self-esteem…respect for human existence…respect for hearts who love….respect for freedom of the soul…respect for children….respect for wifes and husbands…for sons & Daughters…for old age…for Men and Women who love and fight to be Happy… respect for Humanity…respect for the poor for the rich….for the student…for the worker…for trust…respect for ourselves Respect…yes…, because love is not the fake…hapiness not the fake…fake is him who fills his skyrocket by ram-raiding you of your soul away Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 18:53:10 (EST)
From: Mike Email: None To: Runamok Subject: extra-straps on a bikini? Message: Run: I vote NO! Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 00:25:52 (EST)
From: Runamok Email: None To: Mike Subject: extra sauce on your spaghetti? Message: Gee Mike, just when I was getting so opened up and everything you come and ruin it with your cynical intellectualism! Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 09:43:01 (EST)
From: Mike Email: None To: Runamok Subject: I couldn't help myself Message: Run: Sorry about being so cynical and so intellectual in my post above, but I couldn't help it.... he he he. You see, after looking at M's holiday greeting picture to us, I noticed that his finger was on 'backwards.' THEN, miraculously, it changed into a thumb!!!! I was in such a state of ecstasy, that I just HAD to poke fun..... he he he. My definition of ecstacy = laughing so hard that tears come to my eyes....... :-) Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 09:31:59 (EST)
From: Blanco Email: None To: Mike Subject: extra-straps on a bikini? Message: No for extra-straps on a Bikini??? People say I take life too seriously but this one sank in slowly and when it did hit the target it really made me burst into laughter…you know? i had a healthy , happy, open laugh… long time didn’t laugh like this well and why on earth should somebody who posts here need extra-straps on his bikini, the least straps the better the Bikini i guess, except for offensively kinbiks of course Don’t have mercy on my english please, I’ll accept whatever constructive critics even if venemous, precisely ...I’m here to understand what happened to you and the bhakti-bend (to understand what you are denouncing) so I kindof defeat myself if i am not able to make others understand aswell what really...really...really, sincerely and deep inside happened to me.... Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 12:05:13 (EST)
From: Runamok Email: None To: Blanco Subject: stop it Mike Message: Mike's just not ready for my insights, Blanco. And I, progressive free-thinker that I am, was too lazy to post them anyway. But I can remember evolving from a 'devotee' point of view toward BM to a 'fuck you' point of view without feeling a big change in my attitude. The big change was realising the guy was full of it, not that my love was so different overnight. The whole Rama/Hanuman thing was supposed to be about hanuman and rama were soooo close. So what it boiled down to was that we could bring peace on earth and since it came from our love then it would be M who had done it. Such were the meat and potatoes of premie intellectualism. It became more and more obvious to me, that even if that were the case, our energy would be tied up supporting the fatguru, greedy pit of desire that he is, rather than establishing peace even for ourselves. What was the name of the fat slug of a villain in Star Wars? Jabba Hut? Something like that. The Ramayama also included intrigue with the Rama's brother and featured a bad guy who had endearing developmental traits (i.e. had some kind of reasoning). So we can place ourselves in a bizarre anti-M bakhti if that's really our thing. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 15:12:12 (EST)
From: Mike Email: None To: Runamok Subject: Narada Message: Run: If I remember correctly, Narada (the guy that wrote the bhakti sutras) HATED GOD! It was kinda like St. Paul. He was always bad mouthing god and took every opportunity to display his total hatred for he 'divine being.' Anyway, I don't remember the storyline well enough to tell you what it was that changed his mind, but the fact that he obsessed over god all of the time, apparently made it very easy for god to turn him around..... a 100 percent devotee in no-time-flat. My point???? You better watch out, cause if you keep obsessing over god (negatively, that is), you might be closer than you think...... he he he. :-) Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 15:51:39 (EST)
From: Gail Email: freedom@gtn.net To: Nimrod Subject: Hey, Nimmy, where are you? Message: Just wanted to say hi. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 18:32:12 (EST)
From: Runamok Email: None To: Gail Subject: hey Mike where is Nimmy Message: I've never heard of new threads either Gail. Oh ok... we do miss Nimmy, i do anyway. Mike, I'm always just one drink away. I told you that. The way I understood the Ramayama, it did account for the bad guy and the good guys switching places type stuff. The Ramayama has taken Indian lore far into the orient (like Bali, Malaysia). That weird music from Bali is tied up with the Ramayama. (See Rawatt, you can actually get useable info on our forum.) Sometimes I think of it more like M's off the path, but more often it's a perspective not worth the time of day. Well Mikey, sounds cool with the atheist devotee stuff. Maybe you can do a show and tell when you're ready. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 18:46:24 (EST)
From: Blanco Email: None To: Runamok Subject: stop it Mike Message: So the close relation between Hanuman and Rama is the source of your Devotional Point of View . If I remember well Hanuman is a sort of Rambo, he is sent to Ceylon to rescue SITA, he helps Rama across the Sea without any vessel, he is a valiant soldier with Superhero Powers, he never answers back, he nevers questions orders, he is always ready for Ram’s orders, He sits silently for hours looking between his eyes ( no eyeball squizzing though…), he eats only when he is hungry, he drinks only when he is thirsty, he sleeps only when he is tired, all woman are his sisters (they may marry others), he has no money of his own (He gives it all up to Rama), he is even able to become invisible and spy on Rama’s enemies (hey..RAMBO can’t do that…) and most important of all, he is ready to have his throat cut on behalf of Rama because he knows…he is certain without any doubt whatsoever (reasonable or unreasonable) that Rama is the Supreme Source of all Creation, of Peace on Heaven or Earth, the all Powerful Lord of the Universe. I think that the only possibility for Hanuman to become real is that Rama also becomes real…these “premie intellectuals” as you call them, led us to believe that such a Rama had been reborn and we, foolishly and unluckily became the fall guys, the dupes, the suckers who bought this fantabulousness whereby we in fact were giving-up our very life to support a fatguru (rather than a satguru), a greedy pit of desire (rather than an endless fountain of Love), a Star War Fat Slug like Villain (namely a Ravana rather than a Blue Rama). So no wonder Run a Mock , no wonder we neither got peace for ourselves nor brought peace to the world…and as if it still was not enough to our disgusted concience (we really want peace) (FY…FY…and FY…) the fakeking forced fancy hanuman into life, just that such a forced hanuman doesn’t last for long so the fakeking drops the old, used or faulty ones and picks up the new, we are just dead soldiers and Gita’s battle must be won so just recruit new ones to die again and again…. Run a Mock, there is nothing Bizarre about our saying this, this is mostly a free world where free people live, wherever we are we are entitled to this freedom, M is not pretending anything, the fact that he is not even worried about humans is serious and real, he is a Master…a Master of Deceit….a very Successful Master of Deceit who carpets his stairs with the loot of your bhakti, your devotional love, your humanity Nobody cares you know?, it is nobody’s problem you see?, that is why he continues to manage this neverending story…I don’t have to Post here or anywhere but I was just like Mike, I could not resist it.. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 20:19:55 (EST)
From: Runamok Email: None To: Blanco Subject: stop it Blanco Message: because I'm going to regain my faith by reading your posts, because you really understand.. You got it! Isn't it a shame, to have the beautiful mythology of the past perverted and warped into a propaganda ploy for a fat boy to stay fat? I think M is best seen in the light of the western evangelists, not the mythology of the east. He's after the bucks.. that's really about it. Glad to have you around Blanco.. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, Jan 30, 1999 at 10:15:48 (EST)
From: Blanco Email: None To: Runamok Subject: ...regain?? Message: ...regain??? come on Run a Mock....don’t tell me now that you threw the baby out with the bathwater just because of M. And if you did, just get up now and pick-up the pieces one by one, you are the legitimate owner of yourself. M’s message, whether in the mythology of the past or the MacDonaldization of the present, contains a sort of Computer Virus which is tiggered-on when you touch the Esc key...its main effect is to give you the illusion that if you Escape you will die alive on the way...No Run a Mock...No, stand up, you have a brain to think, a heart to feel, and a life to live, there is a place for you in this world even if he or anyone else says there is not...to Escape like you did you need to have guts, now, to put back the broken pieces you have to shed blood, sweat and tears, then just drop the sourness, the bitterness and look aagain at yourself proudly in the eyes, engage your gears on and Go Ahead Sir!!!. Just one question Run a Mock: who are these Western Evangelists??? Please correct me if i am wrong but the evangelists included in the new testament were all born in Palestine (The East). Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, Jan 30, 1999 at 13:17:13 (EST)
From: Runamok Email: None To: Blanco Subject: ...rogaine?? Message: I'm may be running amok, Blanco, but running a mock makes me sound like I'm lying and stuff... I only do that as a joke, not for real. Anyway, I haven't lost my hair much, unlike some people (it's going Prem!) so there's prob no need for Rogaine- baldness treatment. Oh, you said regain as in my faith! Yeah, you're right, I have a lot of faith still, but its possibly spiritual implications make me hesitant to admit. I'm just your average existential ex-premie hanging tough in the agnostic waters. Who wants to believe in God after M? It's a traumatic thing. I was thinking of tele-evangelists and there money grubbing ways. I was actually thinking of the Bakers with that women with her grotesque makeup and hair- Tammy Faye Baker. Or maybe Jimmy Swaggart. What you say is well said.. I have not lost faith but I have gained a lot of fight since M leaves us in a desert and says 'Walk' more often than not. Nice to hear your well thought out musings about M.. 'mcdonaldizations of the present', Indeed! Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 14:19:37 (EST)
From: Katie Email: None To: Everyone Subject: good cop/bad cop: to OP Message: dear OP - this post went inactive (that's the problem with long threads) but I felt that I had to respond to it. op wrote: Please forgive me, Katie, if I read you wrong here. But VERY often the varying tactics taken by the two of you seem to be a careful play. I don't think Katie is any softer on premies than Jim, she's just more subtle. A welcome table laid out, 'here, have some cookies and milk and relax - no one is going to hurt you here. You're welcome to believe whatever you want, for as long as you want (under the breath: even if it's absolute nonsense).' versus Jim: 'What the f**k are you saying? You're a number one asshole if you believe that! blah blah blah' When the movie comes out, I'm sure that aspect will be played up... You are misreading me here, op, and I think you're misreading Jim, too. We genuinely disagree on a lot of things: especially our different approaches on the forum. I know the 'good cop/bad cop' scenario is a set-up, but Jim's and my different ways of interacting with other people on the forum are not. It is not a careful play. What you are seeing in the thread-long arguments that Jim and I have every couple of months or so is a real interaction - we don't set it up beforehand, or e-mail each other inbetween posts or whatever (we've been accused of this before, by premies.) I know that some people really dislike my posts - usually premies - and they hate them because of what you described as my 'here, have some cookies and milk' approach. Another premie once called me 'sickeningly maternal and politically correct'. Both these description seem to imply that I am trying to manipulate people by being friendly. This is not true, however unbelievable that may seem. I do my best to be myself here, and I am honestly trying to understand what's going on in people's heads. Regarding this statement - 'no one is going to hurt you here. You're welcome to believe whatever you want, for as long as you want (under the breath: even if it's absolute nonsense).' I know I've never said no one will hurt you here because it just isn't true. If premies post here, they're going to get negative responses. I really try to avoid getting into long arguments with premies here. I do answer premies when I feel that they are sincerely trying to communicate and understand what's going on here, OR if they make broad generalizations about the ex-premies who post on this site (for example: the Get A Life type post). I also try to answer factual questions (like 'where's the premie site?'), and will comment on off-topic posts. As far as me saying that people can believe what they want to believe: I am not here to argue anyone out of believing in Maharaji. I make it a rule to try not to argue with people's experiences, such as your and Bruce's experiences with Maharaji himself. I do feel that it's OK to share my OWN experiences. I have never EVER told someone that what they believe is absolute nonsense, but I HAVE tried to state my own beliefs clearly in response to theirs. I don't know why it's so hard for people to understand that the ex-premies who post on this forum are individuals (and this is not addressed solely to you, op). We're constantly being accused of being in a cult (with Jim as our leader). And when we do differ among ourselves, people say that we're trying to manipulate them (and I do consider the 'good cop/bad cop' analogy to be an accusation of manipulative tactics.) There is no 'party line' here, and the ex-premies, as a group, think, feel, and believe a number of different things about Maharaji, premies, and everything else you can imagine. I wish people could understand this. So, long answer to short post. Hope you take it in the spirit in which I wrote it. Respectfully, Katie Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 14:43:03 (EST)
From: Mike Email: None To: Katie Subject: good cop/bad cop: to Katie Message: Katie: Your last paragraph brought up some really good points concerning individual expression on this forum (IMHO). But, I'm afraid that it's hard (if not impossible), for those that are brainwashed into a cult party line and it's approved expressions, to understand REAL individuality. They will ALWAYS look for collusion because that is the environment that THEY are immersed in. They will see conspiracies (like when two ex's happen to agree on a subject) because their own environment is conspiratorial (ELK's editing policies being a good example of this). Individual expression REQUIRES 'individuals' that can express their views and thoughts in their own way (e.g. absolutely NO party line) without editing or pressure from a hierarchy. Additionally, individual expression requires 'individuals' that can HEAR IT. This is why the premies see us that way.... They, with some exceptions, are looking thru their own 'colored glasses' that were given to them by the Big M and are told to properly maintain them by the hamster's elite hierarchy. Nice try to get your point across to op, though! But, her mind is made up and that's the way it is! Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 15:07:38 (EST)
From: Orlando Email: None To: Mike Subject: editing: to Mike Message: Your last paragraph brought up some really good points concerning individual expression on this forum (IMHO). But, I'm afraid that it's hard (if not impossible), for those ex-premies that are brainwashed into an anti-cult party line and it's approved expressions, to understand REAL individuality. They will ALWAYS look for collusion because that is the environment that THEY are immersed in. They will see conspiracies (like when two premies happen to agree on a subject) because their own environment is conspiratorial (ex-premie.org being a good exemple). Individual expression REQUIRES 'individuals' that can express their views and thoughts in their own way (e.g. absolutely NO party line) without editing or pressure from a hierarchy. Additionally, individual expression requires 'individuals' that can HEAR IT. This is why the ex-premies see us that way.... They, with some exceptions, are looking thru their own 'colored glasses' that were given to them by their own negativity and are told to properly maintain them by this site's elite hierarchy. Nice try to get your point across though! But, their minds are made up and that's the way it is! Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 15:17:08 (EST)
From: Mike Email: None To: Orlando Subject: Nice try, op Message: OP: What.... you can't come up with an ORIGINAL response? You had to nick mine? So much for YOUR individuality! Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 15:20:34 (EST)
From: Mike Email: None To: OP Subject: By the way, OP Message: OP: Why do you think that YOUR... ahem.... expressions aren't EDITED here, hmmmmmm?????? Now tell me, can you say the same about ALL the 'expressions' on ELK aren't? NOW, tell me who has a 'party line!' Simple as that.... Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 15:33:53 (EST)
From: John Email: None To: Orlando Subject: editing: to Mike Message: If you really do believe what you wrote in this post, then I think you are beyond hope. I think you've followed your breath one too many times. Hey everyone, help me out? Is it just me or is does this post of Orlando's make any sense at all? I left M years ago. For years I could have returned but chose not to. So, 15 years after I left, I find this forum. Most of what people were saying about M and K made sense to me. Does that mean I was brainwashed by this forum? And what do you call the environment of the nightly videos that are shown in the premie kingdom? Does that environment encourage any expression other than to sit still with your tongue stuck up your throat? Can you make a negative comment during one of the videos or after wards? C'mon Orlando, do you really think M encourages free expression? Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 16:01:20 (EST)
From: Mike Email: None To: John Subject: No, it doesn't Message: John: You're right, the post doesn't make any sense at all in the premie context. If you haven't done so already, please read MY post above it. You will note that orlando-the-individual-master-expresser plagerized my words and twisted them in a sorry attempt to turn the tables on us ex's..... pretty pathetic, if I do say so myself! Hey, they say imitation is the sincerest form of compliment.... Welllllllll, OK. In that case, THANKS FOR THE COMPLIMENT, orlando! Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 23:25:00 (EST)
From: peter Email: None To: Mike Subject: plain as the nose on your face Message: They will see conspiracies (like when two ex's happen to agree on a subject) because their own environment is conspiratorial. The old 'takes one to know one' principle. You were so close, Mike, I can't believe you missed it. I mean, I've definitely seen op and Passing thru play 'good cop/bad cop'. How much you want to bet that both have the same ISP address? On the same account billed to EV? For 'educational activities', you know. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 09:30:53 (EST)
From: Mike Email: None To: peter Subject: Good one, Peter Message: Peter: I got it..... I was trying to say it in a nice way... he he he :-) Hey, how come you no post more often, eh? Don't tell me that it's because Katie hogs the 'puter! :-) Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 18:43:38 (EST)
From: Jim Email: None To: Katie Subject: Your slip is showing, op Message: Please forgive me, Katie, if I read you wrong here. But VERY often the varying tactics taken by the two of you seem to be a careful play. I don't think Katie is any softer on premies than Jim, she's just more subtle. A welcome table laid out, 'here, have some cookies and milk and relax - no one is going to hurt you here. You're welcome to believe whatever you want, for as long as you want (under the breath: even if it's absolute nonsense).'versus Jim: 'What the f**k are you saying? You're a number one asshole if you believe that! blah blah blah' When the movie comes out, I'm sure that aspect will be played up... Here's what I think, op. Your comments prove what I've expected all along: that even you don't take yourself seriously. Not for a moment. Indeed, you're so aware of how idiotic you sound that anyone who claims to accept your expressions at face value is immediately suspect. See, Katie has never sneered or muttered what you attribute to her ('absolute nonsense') under her breath. In fact, as you've seen here a number of times, I myself find it incredulous that she can accept your cult thinking to the extent that she does. You've seen me try to shake her tree on that score. Indeed, you've seen her even begin to sneer at ME a bit if I persist. Whatever Katie thinks in her heart of hearts, she has NEVER once let on that her expressions to you are patronizing or insincere. Thus you have no reason to accuse her of this duplicity save and except your own knowledge that no sane person, as intelligent as Katie and as aware of the issues as she obviously is, could possibly accomodate you as she does. You yourself know it doesn't make sense and you just can't figure it out. In a way, op, you and I agree. We both have a hard time accepting Katie's claim that she thinks you guys are sincere. And that, my friend, says it all. You're projecting your own common sense as am I. We're both aware that what you and the other premies say here is largely bullshit. I think it's absolutely marvellous that you've taken this step. See, in another way, I've been as frustrated with you as I have with Katie at times. You, too, op have tried to peddle your cookies here. I mean here we are, angry, vindictive blasphemers, manmots with a worldwide platform to spread our viscious lies about your wonderful Lord, able to quite possibly really sabotage his peace train. Yet you are more than willing to come here and befriend us, share recipes (didn't you actually do that with Katie or someone else once?) and just chat a little. THAT, to me, has always seemed a little sly. Know what I mean? I mean it's like Chris. He, too, wants to smile and chuckle with us Enemies of his Lord, talk about stupid guitar trivia, shit like that. Is HE sincere? Hm, op, what do you think? Anyway, you now strike me exactly like a person with a guilt conscience, unable to come to terms with accpetance you yourself know you don't deserve. This post by you is about as rich a confession I'd ever expect from you. Thanks. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 20:39:16 (EST)
From: Jim Email: None To: Jim Subject: Thanks a little more, op Message: You know, I'm interested in seeing how Katie and op play this out. Something like this?: op: Katie, I read your post and I want you to know I'm really sorry if I offended you. I'm sorry, I've just been really frazzled at work recently and maybe, I don't know, maybe it was that X-Flies episode I saw the other night. (By the way, did you see the movie? If so, did you like it? A lot of my friends did but, frankly, I found the whole thing rather dumb. Now, 'Shakespeare in Love', THAT's a movie! Have you and Peter seen it yet? I thought 'The Red Violin' was the film of the year but this movie is light, sexy and breathtaking all at the same time. You just HAVE to see it!) I guess I've been a little frazzled by Jim recently and, you know, I'd LOVE to feel welcome on the forum, but you can't exactly say I get much respect there, you know? Anyway, I started thinking and I wondered how is it he can think I'm so deceitful and you, who seem to get along well enough with him -- most of the time -- are so nice to me? Maybe it wan't the X-Flies, maybe it was that episode of Law & Order, you know, the one where... well, I can't remember exactly how it went but you know the old routine, 'good cop, bad cop'? I just wondered, if that's what was going on here? Katie: Well, op, you read what I said on the page. I am certqainly not in cahoots with Jim. As I've told him so many times I seriously disapprove of how he cajoles, needles and upsets you premies. After all, we were premies too once. OP: But Katie, don't you see? That's what I mean? It really sound sto me like you think we're all STILL suffereing from some disease you've been cured of, you know? Katie: Oh, op, I DO see that. Adn if that's what I said I definitely don't mean it! What I mean is that I was there too and I am now firmly committed to pass no judgements for peopel who are still with Maharaji? op: 'Still', Katie? 'Still'? Why do you say that? Don't you see that in your own deepest thoughts you, too, think it's just a matter of time... Katie: No, oP, please don't do that to yourself! I'm saying nothing of the sort. Personally, I coudln't care less if you followed Marshall Applewhite AND Ron Hubbard if it made you feel better. Op: What's that supposed to mean? Katie: I'm just saying, it's your life. I don't care what you do so long as.. oP: You don't care..? Katie: No, not that I don't care. That's not what I meant either! God, you sound like Jim right now! I'm only saying whatever makes you happy, you know? I'm not here to try to persuade you of anything. OP: You mean you don't care? You don't care if I'm following some freak vestigal seventies joke like an albatross around my neck? You don't care about that? Katie: op, I never said that! I'm just saying.. op: I hear what you're saying. You're saying.. Katie: Look, unlike Jim, I honestly believe that you believe Maharaji's sincere. I honestly think that. oP: Well, I hear you say that often enough. But... well, to tell you the truth, ... I know this is gonna sound kind of funny and everything but, well, can I ask you 'why?' Why do you think I believe it? Don't you ever wonder about how I really process all that negative information you guys keep spreading? I mean, sure, some of it's kind of silly. Like that Nigerian Maharaji thing. What a joke that was! But it can't ALL be wrong. Don't you think I don't realize that? Katie: Well, I'm not saying that, I'm jsut saying that if you tell me you believe something, who am I to say otherwise? OP: You think I'm stupid, don't you? Admit it, you think I've got to be the stupidest person in the world to keep following this obvious fraud. Katie: No, I never said that.. op: I KNOW you never SAID it. But I'm asking you if you THINK it. Katie: No, of course not. I completely respect your choice to say you believe whatever you want to say you believe. Op: You WHAT?? Katie: Oh, forget it! This is what I get for trying to be nice? For trying to respect you, this is what I get? Sheesh! Look, op, I've got to run. Please, chill out and, if it makes you feel any better, ignore Jim. Hell, if it makes you feel better, ignore ME (although I don't know why you'd want to do THAT. I am kind of nice, after all.) But ignore anyone you wnat if it makes you feel better. I'm sorry we imsudnerstand each other.. op: You think I'm stupid, don't you? Katie: No, op, I DON'T think your're stupid. But I DO have to go. Bye. Gotta go. Bye. Okay..... gotta go. OP, I've got to go now. We can talk about this later. Maybe after I've seen that Law & Order episode, if you think of the name. Bye. op: Bye. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 21:14:06 (EST)
From: G's mom Email: None To: Jim Subject: My favorite Jim post ever... Message: Bravo! Well said! Insighful! My favorite parts are: And that, my friend, says it all. You're projecting your own common sense as am I. We're both aware that what you and the other premies say here is largely bullshit. I mean here we are, angry, vindictive blasphemers, manmots with a worldwide platform to spread our viscious lies about your wonderful Lord, able to quite possibly really sabotage his peace train. Yet you are more than willing to come here and befriend us, share recipes (didn't you actually do that with Katie or someone else once?) and just chat a little. THAT, to me, has always seemed a little sly. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 21:19:05 (EST)
From: g's mom Email: None To: Katie Subject: Good post Katie (nt) Message: nt Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 21:23:57 (EST)
From: VP Email: None To: Katie Subject: good cop/bad cop: to OP Message: Katie, As you know, I haven't been here in a couple of weeks. I haven't even read this whole thread. Just wanted to add that I find this terribly ironic. Someone in a cult suspects you of manipulation, yet they cannot see how they themselves are being manipulated. (By Maharaji) No offense, op. I have nothing against you. I just know you are being paranoid here. I know Katie. VP Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, Jan 30, 1999 at 03:55:22 (EST)
From: op Email: None To: Katie, VP, etc. Subject: good cop/bad cop: to OP Message: But VERY often the varying tactics taken by the two of you seem to be a careful play. I don't think Katie is any softer on premies than Jim, she's just more subtle. A welcome table laid out, 'here, have some cookies and milk and relax - no one is going to hurt you here. You're welcome to believe whatever you want, for as long as you want (under the breath: even if it's absolute nonsense).' versus Jim: 'What the f**k are you saying? You're a number one asshole if you believe that! blah blah blah' I appear to be a very poor communicator these days. I certainly didn't say that there is a script, or that you spend email time synchronizing your lines and formulating a plan of action. I said 'seem' - and meant it. I was simply pointing out the difference between the two approaches. And I stand by that. Katie, you may claim to respect others' beliefs, and that you are not out to change them. I'm sorry, but your position as 'webmaster's assistant' belies this. If you are a lowly typist in a company that manufactures assault weapons whose primary customers are 3rd world terrorists, it's a day job and I don't think you will be held responsible for company policy. But if you are on the board of directors, and you don't actively work to change the policy - or quit - then you can't sit quietly in the corner when the investigation starts and say 'it had nothing to do with me'. No matter how many times you said 'I don't think it's a good idea to supply terrorists' during the board meetings. This is a very crude and admittedly exaggerated analogy. But there are those on this site who feel like they're waging a war. I can already see the answers to this, but I'm going to post it anyway. So, to continue: Katie, as a person you may be incredibly giving, loving, nurturing. Sometimes you seem too good to be true. I'm sure your online persona is probably much sweeter than your real self. But I can't believe that you continue to support all the activities of this site if you actually believe that there ARE people who are content and fulfilled by practicing Knowledge and listening to Maharaji. There is a purpose to this site - it is to expose M and K as fraud and bogus. Add to that, to create distrust in anyone who might be interested in him, whether that person has received K or not. On a slightly different note: Every human being has filters through which to look at the world. These filters prevent us ALL from seeing things as they really are. On this site there are as many individual interpretations to any given situation as there are posters. If you can read through them carefully, you'll see that the 'ex' slant is as obviously programmed as the 'premie' one. I'm trying to get away from programming. I've had enough of filters and masks. In my own life, I happen to find that practicing the techniques that M taught me, so long ago, still works to center me, to clear the atmostphere and give me a clear perspective on where I'm going and where I want to be. And I happen to find listening to him refresing, often showing me things from an angle that hadn't occurred to me. So, isn't THAT programming? No. There's a big difference between programming and communication. I happen to feel that M communicates his message. He says some things that I don't agree with, and I can leave those to one side. Just like I can do that with any real friend. It was one of my big lessons in growing up, and that happened as part of my life WITH Knoweldge. I've spent enough time on this post - I think it's time for bed. take care, all you wandering spirits and sundry bits of dna. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, Jan 30, 1999 at 09:00:10 (EST)
From: bill Email: None To: op Subject: guru DNA? Message: Of course OP, part of what you hear is that he is the 'master of life' and as such you dont look to see if you have any learning to do in that area. Is this a DNA creation and prem rawat has (after 30 years of trying different ideas,) hit upon the random selection that will help his organisation survive-ie, 'it feels good so do it' approach ? Is there a self concious intelligence that is a bit miffed that prem rawat would claim to be the ultimate ruler/lord of the universe/lord that came with all 68 powers? Is there just a 'oneness' that all the indian guru's and buddhist types can help us all get to if they are doling out the right techniques and corresponding words? When you go 'inside' are you bumping into a 'oneness' that is not self concious and it is the 'master' or various 'masters' who are already dead that populate that realm and in fact push the dials and hit the control switches because the 'oneness' is basically inert and like a blob of potential that the out of the body guys have it over because THEY are self concious? Answer me please. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, Jan 30, 1999 at 12:39:32 (EST)
From: Katie Email: None To: op Subject: reply to op II Message: dear op - I want to respond to several of the things that you said: You wrote: I certainly didn't say that there is a script, or that you spend email time synchronizing your lines and formulating a plan of action. I said 'seem' - and meant it. I was simply pointing out the difference between the two approaches. And I stand by that. Well, I'm certainly glad you didn't mean that it was actually carefully 'orchestrated'. You're right that there is a difference between Jim's and my approaches, not to mention our feelings about the whole subject of Maharaji and premies. However, the 'good cop/bad cop' analogy that you made implied that this difference was manipulative. Katie, you may claim to respect others' beliefs, and that you are not out to change them. I'm sorry, but your position as 'webmaster's assistant' belies this. If you are a lowly typist in a company that manufactures assault weapons whose primary customers are 3rd world terrorists, it's a day job and I don't think you will be held responsible for company policy. But if you are on the board of directors, and you don't actively work to change the policy - or quit - then you can't sit quietly in the corner when the investigation starts and say 'it had nothing to do with me'. No matter how many times you said 'I don't think it's a good idea to supply terrorists' during the board meetings. This is a very crude and admittedly exaggerated analogy. But there are those on this site who feel like they're waging a war. I can already see the answers to this, but I'm going to post it anyway. op, I think this WAS a crude analogy. I know there are people who post here who see this as a war (both premies AND ex-premies), but I do NOT. I'm sorry that you see my work with Brian in this way. This is a site for ex-premies. It was never intended to be a site for premies. There are a lot of unhappy people out there, who for some reason or another haven't found the peace and satisfaction that you say you've found in Maharaji's knowledge. I was one of these people, and so were a lot of friends of mine, and so were a lot of other people who post here. My purpose in working on the site is to help people who were in the same situation that I was. I DID get help from other ex-premies when I decided to stop practicing knowledge, but a lot of people didn't. To put it bluntly, there are a lot worse things in the world than Maharaji. The premies I know who say that they are happy practicing knowledge are usually good people. In my individual relationships with them, I don't try and convert them, and they don't try and convert me. Same thing with my friends who are Christians, atheists, or whatever. I believe that in order to establish some kind of relationship with someone, there has to be mutual acceptance first. You obviously cannot accept the fact that I feel this way as an EX-premie, thus it seems as if you find it hard to accept the fact that I accept your experiences with Maharaji. So, to continue: Katie, as a person you may be incredibly giving, loving, nurturing. Sometimes you seem too good to be true. I'm sure your online persona is probably much sweeter than your real self. Gee thanks, op :)! I really try not to come across as too 'sweet' in my posts, but I guess I do. I'm NOT incredibly giving, loving, and nuturing - I'm a human being. Most people that know me think I'm a fairly nice person, but some do not. I also know that some of the people who post on this site don't like me either. But I can't believe that you continue to support all the activities of this site if you actually believe that there ARE people who are content and fulfilled by practicing Knowledge and listening to Maharaji. I am not sure what you mean by 'all' the activities of this site. But as far as working on the site and believing that there are people who are content and fufilled by practicing knowledge, I don't see the conflict. I don't agree with everything on the site, the same way you say (below) that you don't agree with everything Maharaji says. But you still continue to do service at his programs and so forth - what's the difference between that and me working on the site? There is a purpose to this site - it is to expose M and K as fraud and bogus. Add to that, to create distrust in anyone who might be interested in him, whether that person has received K or not. That's your interpretation. I see the purpose of this site as being to tell the other side of the story - that following Maharaji and/or practicing knowledge does not necessarily bring peace and happiness. Before this site was established, there was plenty of pro-Maharaji information around, but it was very hard for people who were UNhappy with knowledge to get any support anywhere. I see this as the purpose of the site. I also think aspirants should have a chance to know what other people who haven't been happy with either Maharaji or knowledge have experienced before they make that commitment. On a slightly different note: Every human being has filters through which to look at the world. These filters prevent us ALL from seeing things as they really are. On this site there are as many individual interpretations to any given situation as there are posters. If you can read through them carefully, you'll see that the 'ex' slant is as obviously programmed as the 'premie' one. I'm trying to get away from programming. I've had enough of filters and masks. I didn't talk about programming in my original post - I don't feel as strongly about that as some of the other people here do. But it makes me angry that you think you can say that all the exes are programmed, despite their 'individual interpretations'. Especially given your next statement about Maharaji: He says some things that I don't agree with, and I can leave those to one side. Just like I can do that with any real friend. It was one of my big lessons in growing up, and that happened as part of my life WITH Knoweldge. If you can do this with Maharaji, who is supposed to be a teacher, why is it so hard to believe that I, and the other EX-premies, can also do the same thing with each other's statements, and with the things that premies say on here? It almost seems as if you're implying that I (we) don't have the capability to do that because I don't practice knowledge. Look, you can cast aspersions on my motivations for being here as much as you like. But (and I've said this a million times) the reason I started working on the site is because a premie friend of mine killed himself. Then I met other people who were confused, self-hating, and unhappy because they hadn't been able to find the peace and happiness they were supposed to find following Maharaji. A lot of these people, me included, thought that this was OUR fault, and that we were failures as human beings. Even those of us who learned to live with this failure still had scars from the past. Sharing our experiences, confusion, negative feelings and all has been very healing for a lot of us here. I wouldn't work here if I didn't believe that the site was a tool for positive growth and change. Respectfully, Katie Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, Jan 30, 1999 at 13:40:14 (EST)
From: Katie Email: None To: all Subject: and one more thing Message: I just wanted to add one thing here. The reason that I really try to respect and accept other people's experiences and beliefs is because I have been so unaccepting of them in the past, and later found out that things weren't as black and white as I thought. When I was a premie, I believed M and K were the only way, and I laid a lot of trips on people based on this (I'm sorry for anyone who encountered me in this mode). Even if I didn't actually say anything, I thought that people who didn't have Knowledge were 'unenlightened'. I was also brought up with the 12-Step/AA philosophy - it was like a religion in my family, and I also believed that was the ONLY way for people to cure addictions. I used to preach this to people as well. Part of MY growing-up process has been to learn that I don't know what's best for anyone else - I can only know what's best for myself. I'm still learning, and working on, this. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, Jan 30, 1999 at 15:39:39 (EST)
From: Robyn Email: sundogs@hotmail.com To: Katie Subject: and one more thing Message: Dear Katie and Op, Katie those were 2 great posts. I am defintely one of those people that think you are pretty damn wonderful. :) Intelligent, open, caring...etc. I read one of op's posts or a quote from one of her posts in someone elses reply to her. It was about a pregnant mother being turned down for K until her baby was a year. Crapola I say to that. If K is so great and everyone should have it to bring peace to the world then it is a mean and manipulative BM that would keep it from a pregnant woman. She would benifit greatly by having K right? She would be a better mother and person with the gift, right? Then why deny her? Manipulation plane and simple. I am not going to get more into this because it made me really angry when I first read it. I got K without any of that bull shit, I wanted it and got it in the Bronx, NYC. No one questioned me about my readiness. I also think this site is a very important piece to the puzzle of BM's cult. It gives voice to a to long hushed group of us who see this whole thing as a cult and as the years tred on it seems more and more empty of any real substance. Love, Robyn Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, Jan 30, 1999 at 16:00:15 (EST)
From: Selene Email: None To: Robyn Subject: and one more thing Message: Hey Robyn, was it one of those ancient buildings with at least 5 floors? The upper level reserved to the BM? I received K in NYC in 1972 but I thought it was Manhattan but I could be wrong, the people who drove me from PA were driving like maniacs. And i had my 2 month old son with me. Wild times. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, Jan 30, 1999 at 19:13:14 (EST)
From: Robyn Email: sundogs@hotmail.com To: Selene Subject: and one more thing Message: Dear Selene, Geez dear, I thought you knew me better than that! :) Do you really think I remember anything about the house where I recieved K except the precise room, high cielings and kind of small. Brooklyn is seperated houses and neigborhoods, at least what I remember of it and the Upper East Side of Manhattan at least, where my grandmother lived was more high rise apartments but I don't know for sure. Don't get me going, I have been on a slow road to humiliation trying to figure out time zones and now here is another topic that sends my mind into that kind of premie brainlessness. Love, Robyn Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sun, Jan 31, 1999 at 15:58:14 (EST)
From: Selene Email: None To: Robyn Subject: and one more thing Message: I am pretty sure it was manhattan but that's a big city, there may have been several ashrams or premie houses or whatever. Don't feel bad, I am having short term memories problems big time these days. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, Jan 30, 1999 at 16:19:41 (EST)
From: gerry Email: None To: Katie Subject: reply to op II Message: Wow Katie, you go, girl! I also know that some of the people who post on this site don't like me either. Really? How do you know that? Don't count me in on this, sweetie, even if I am Jim's devoted devotee (or something like that--courtesy-Mel Boring) :) PLUS I think Katie's BIG TIME cute! Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, Jan 30, 1999 at 16:32:46 (EST)
From: Katie Email: None To: gerry Subject: reply to op II Message: I wasn't talking about you OR Jim, Gerry. Mostly certain premies and anonymous posters. This has been another part of growing up for me - fortunately I started learning it before I ever got onto the forum. Thanks for the compliment, BTW! I would return it, but I'd have to see a picture first :) I know I can say with confidence that I'd think Sparky and Bocephus were cute - will that do for now? Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, Jan 30, 1999 at 16:47:55 (EST)
From: gerry Email: None To: Katie Subject: reply to op II Message: Hi Katie, Didn't mean to imply Jim was in that group, although I can see how my post might give you that impression. I was hoping Santa would bring me a digital camera for Xmas, but he, like the gooroo, was a big disappointment. Get this-Bocephus (11 years old, fat, lazy) came ripping into the house, tore around the living room and disappeared into the bedroom. I got up and walked around the house looking for a coyote or dog or something and when I came back in, my computer had been reset! Cat paws on the computer desk! Sparky was still in his ''nest'' in the LR, some much for the usual suspects. Is there a reset button on the keyboard? Otherwise, I'm spooked! PS Sparky makes his way underneath the sheets most nights now. Poor boy, he really is bald and gets cold. It's to the point that I don't even notice him there much now. He gets right between Patty and me with his head on the pillow. What a guy! Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, Jan 30, 1999 at 16:53:19 (EST)
From: Rick Email: None To: Katie Subject: reply to op II Message: Then I met other people who were confused, self-hating, and unhappy because they hadn't been able to find the peace and happiness they were supposed to find following Maharaji. A lot of these people, me included, thought that this was OUR fault, and that we were failures as human beings. Even those of us who learned to live with this failure still had scars from the past. Hi Katie, One of the important reasons that people thought it was their fault is because maharaji taught that. I think op makes a few good points, although unintentionally. First, that maharaji represents himself to be something he isn't. Second, he offers something he can't deliver. Third, his organization is a cult. And fourth, that his cult programs people's minds. The very reason people leaving him might need support, or people considering him might need an alternative point of view, is that he's a fraud. If op is right about these points, how could your participation in this site be anything but hostile? Rick Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, Jan 30, 1999 at 14:44:56 (EST)
From: Jim Email: None To: op Subject: Where's MY answer? Message: Well thanks for answering MY post to you on this, op. What do I look like? Gefilte fish or something? You know, I'm the other 'aggrieved' party in this. I wrote you a lengthy and considered reply. Where's MY answer? By the way, op, you ARE being silly here. Your assumption that the only reason the ex's seem to share some common sentiments is that they're somehow 'programmed' is absurd. I mean if this were a real life conversation we'd quickly clear up the meaning of 'programmed' and you'd have no choice but to back off on that claim. But its' not. It's the net and sometimes these digressions can get SO tiresome. Like, I'm thinking 'ah shit! Do we REALLY have to go through THAT loop now?' And then to factor in the haphazard way you continue your part of a conversation, a little here, a little there -- it makes it right near impossible to talk with you! But anyway, where's MY answer to MY reply to your original accusation? Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, Jan 30, 1999 at 15:15:43 (EST)
From: Selene the irreverent Email: None To: Jim Subject: Where's MY answer? Message: What do I look like? Gefilte fish or something? God I certainly hope not!! They had that awful shit at my husband's mom's funeral - he never drinks but was understandable upset so he had bought a pint of Absolut and drank a lot (for him) of it - of course I finished it. Anyway he kept making sarcastic remarks about the gefilte fish. I had never seen him like that before or since. They all politely ignored it but it was actually really funny. Awful stuff!! white and slimy. I just know you are not like that. As for OP, my standard line: if they don't like it why the hell do they post here? My idea of a not at all fun thing to do would be to post to the premies with my opinions. OF course they wouldn't respond anyway since they would never get through, but if they did they would be just like all the rest of us. Worse I suspect but alas we will never know since it's all censored. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, Jan 30, 1999 at 16:41:06 (EST)
From: VP Email: None To: op Subject: I disagree, OP Message: I'm sure your online persona is probably much sweeter than your real self.-op Ever been to Katie's house for a visit? Just curious. I have been and can tell you that your statement above is dead wrong. 'Too good to be true' is a negative assumption. Good things can be true. Katie is a good person. I can't believe that you continue to support all the activities of this site if you actually believe that there ARE people who are content and fulfilled by practicing Knowledge and listening to Maharaji.-op After many conversations with Katie, I can tell you that she doesn't support everything that happens on this forum/site. This forum is composed of many individuals who write whatever they want. She isn't responsible for their actions and neither is Brian. They are not out to control people, unlike some people I could name. I know Katie can speak for herself, but I feel strongly enough about this to put it in bold. I know that what Katie DOES support is the idea that people who are disillusioned with Maharaji can come here and get support. That doesn't mean she is in favor of premie or Maharaji bashing. Her role as assistant web-master is to help people. I believe that she isn't out to convert anyone who is happy, even if others here are. Katie can believe Maharaji is a phoney without shoving that down anyones throat. Do you shove Maharaji down everyone's throat? From your post above, I doubt that you do. Can you conceed that you may be wrong about Katie and her motives? If you want to express disagreement with this site or it's objectives, you have that right. But to accuse Katie of being manipulative is wrong. Even if the ONLY objectives in the site are what you state (which they aren't-there are more) no one has to come here and read. No one has to think about Maharaji. Anyone has the right to believe whatever they want about him. Some people read here and it doesn't change a thing for them (you, CD, Jack, and Bruce- for example) Frankly, I don't know why you folks would subject yourself to coming here if you are truly happy with what Maharaji has given you. Why hurt yourself like that? (It's your business, but it makes no sense to me) But there are others who are disillusioned and need some support FOR WHAT THEY ALREADY KNOW INSIDE (usually.) They can come here and get support if they need it. Now, if this site shows people that Maharaji is a fraud, that is ok with me. If you are happy with him, that is ok with me, too. It's your life--it's your choice. Just don't drag Katie through the mud, please. Her hands are clean. Peace, VP Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 12:11:19 (EST)
From: shp Email: None To: Everyone especially jim Subject: attitudes Message: yo all, i was just checking some back posts and sometimes they slip into the archives before i have had a chance to reply to someone. i could've let this go, but i think it's important to point out something that is just so obviously counterproductive to communication between any people regarding any subject. the quote below was from jim to me, shp. the context is not important. the prevading attitude which emanates from jim is here for your review: 'I think you're just one confused little puppy. I tried to pick you up and you whimpered, bit and peed on me. I think this is pathetic and if you have any question about how the big world outside of the page participants here might think of it, get your kids on line.' jim is obviously revealing his very serious ego/arrongance problem in the above quote, casting himself as the bigger, intelligent human and me as the much smaller, immature, ill-mannered and incontinent baby animal. and he accuses maharaji of setting himself above others? no wonder jim has such a bad reaction to maharaji putting himself above others BECAUSE HE DOES THE SAME THING. this is EXACTLY the problem, AND THIS IS WHAT I HAVE BEEN SAYING, THAT JIM IS SO FULL OF WHAT HE ACCUSES MAHARAJI OF (in terms of powertripping on people, scaled down, of course to jim's lifestyle, etc) THAT HE RENDERS HIMSELF USELESS TO THE CAUSE OF CLARITY BECAUSE OF HIS OWN LIMITATIONS. IF maharaji is who you all says he is (or isn't), and IF you say he has deluded many and YOU are all free of the delusion, WHY does jim BLAME and verbally ABUSE people he himself believes are deluded? when dealing with people who are delusional, it is necessary to be gentle and patient, yes firm at times, but never accusatory or violent...that's is, if you are trying to help. if you just want to punch out someone and blame them for having been or still being deluded, then you must be jim. if you think there are other ways up the mountain, then you must be everybody else, or jim with a changed attitude. i really do hope that you consider my words, jim. it would be such a waste of so much brilliance and ability just because of your dysfunctional attitude if you go on like you have. if you in your heart believe that you are trying to save a person from drowning, you put the rope as close to their hands as possible, right? you don't dangle it and do fancy lasso tricks and dare the person to jump for it. i perceive other lines than the obvious one that separates premies from ex-premies. i see a line that separates the ones on both sides who are willing and able to have reasonable and civil discourse about a very complex matter that requires patientce and good will, from those who just rip and tear. the fundamental question is really the only one that matters to me. i have heard outrageous accusations made here, and i have heard the heartfelt stories of people here who keep me coming back to hear more, even though it is not complimentary of maharaji. i don't come here to defend him, but when i speak up for a point or for common sense or just for my opinion, i have been constantly accused (by jim mostly) of being an apologist and a whole string of nasty names implying that i am nothing more than a puppet of maharaji. this is simply not true. from here on, i will refrain from being sucked into bad language, insults, or any counterproductive attitudes that i am so tempted to use with certain folks. and i am still listening. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 14:24:54 (EST)
From: Rick Email: None To: shp Subject: attitudes Message: You're an asshole. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 16:55:47 (EST)
From: shp Email: None To: Rick Subject: attitudes Message: whether i am an asshole or not is beside the point. you fail to address the issue that's the game you play asshole covers everything you can't or won't deal with. my kids already know that doesn't play anymore. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 19:42:23 (EST)
From: gerry Email: None To: Rick Subject: attitudes Message: I think shp is really Keith with a new ISP and a spell checker. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 19:56:33 (EST)
From: x Email: None To: gerry Subject: lower case i *trip* Message: He's certainly into the same lower case i *trip* that Keith was. What's that all about, anyway? Some kind of sub-concious, low self esteem thing? Or are they just too lazy to hit the shift button? Hmmmm, makes ya wonder! Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 21:18:13 (EST)
From: SHP Email: None To: x Subject: lower case i *trip* Message: Hey x, or is it X? There is your own hypocrisy staring you right in the face, you little x you! I could just type faster, that's why I stopped using upper case, so I could post faster. Now you have even attacked that for lack of anything else. So why do you use a small x? Is it about size? Esteem? Something you'd rather not discuss? C'mon, give us all a break from the STUPIDITY, X (x)! Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 23:04:36 (EST)
From: x Email: None To: SHP Subject: Touche Message: SHP, I 've got to give credit where credit is due, you got me on that one! Nevertheless(is that one word?) I think your post above looks better with the capital I's. Additionally, I wouldn't exactly say that that's the best I can come up with to 'attack' you, although attack dosn't seem like quite the right word to me. SHP, I was just having a little fun with you because I feel you are taking this whole Jim thing way to seriously. Also, you accuse people here with being impatient towards you which I disagree with. You've kind of gone back and forth here for a long time now, and you also always say that you're studying this stuff, sorting things out, etc. but then you spend all of your time arguing about whether Jim is a decent human being or a worthless asshole, rather than facing the serious, blatant issues surrounding Maharaji's inconsistencies and shortcomings. You really should probably sift through the archives a little, or read some books like The Guru Papers,etc. if you really want information and help sorting things out. Arguing irrelevancies with Jim and the others over debate styles and semantics won't get you anywhere! Like Mike says, this isn't a mellow dude contest. Or an exercise in how to behave oneself properly. This is a forum, an exchange of ideas and personalities, an ongoing discussion of Maharaji's cult. Nothing more, nothing less. As for me? I don't know why I use the lower case x as my tag, it probably IS from low self esteem, or maybe it stems from my microphallus condition:) your friend(really), x Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 23:16:55 (EST)
From: Helen Email: None To: x Subject: Bwa ha ha ! (nt) Message: hhioijd.d.d Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 18:58:28 (EST)
From: SHP Email: None To: x Subject: stretccccch that X! Message: ok I got the ground rules down good now. kinda feels like an old roller rink I used to go to when I was a kid. We are all out here rolling around trying to have a good time and sometimes we bump into each other. some are going faster and some are going slower and some are just trucking along, but we are all on the same track. and this wierd music is playing.....! 8>) Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 17:21:13 (EST)
From: bill Email: None To: SHP Subject: three ways to go. Message: hello shipster, have you come to that fork in the road yet where you decide either; there is an origional intelligence that is self concious, or there is no origional intelligence and we exist on the leading edge of a wild dna experiment, or there is this 'oneness' that has qualities but is not self concious and some that die attain higher states unless they plunge into the samadhi and merge and become one. and as part of this third view, you can resonate or vibe or chant or breathe your way into that 'oneness' while you are in a body and realize your own divinity. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 17:26:34 (EST)
From: SHP Email: None To: bill Subject: three ways to go + infinity Message: I have looked through all the windows you described and have looked through many more. I have walked away from all the windows and been outside where it's all hanging out and there's no way to hold one perspective because I'm everywhere and in all scenarios at the same time on different levels. I hold no personal viewpoint of the cosmos and my place in it at this time. I'm just here. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, Jan 30, 1999 at 00:42:39 (EST)
From: bill Email: None To: SHP Subject: three ways to go + infinity Message: You say you have looked through many more. Could you name a couple? Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, Jan 30, 1999 at 09:06:56 (EST)
From: SHP Email: None To: bill Subject: three ways to go + infinity Message: imagi-scenarios: 1) Everything we are and know is contained in a droplet of water hanging on the edge a leaf in a much larger universe. 2) Earth has been seeded with humans by various races besides the earth evolved monkey men (see wingmakers.com), and they are coming back. 3) Some humans evolved from monkeys and some evolved from dolphins. The dolphin people want peace and environmental health and the monkey people create chaos and war. 4) As for God, I believe that past 'religious figures' somehow embodied the Word and spread the knowledge of the inner experience of fulfillment to other human beings. Catchy, eh? I still believe that story. As for the authenticity of teachers in the latter 20th century, this is the discussion under way. 5) It's comforting to not have to choose the one I have to travel with the rest of my life. I can observe my life and the universe around me and change my viewpoint as I get older and hopefully wiser. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, Jan 30, 1999 at 15:45:50 (EST)
From: bill Email: None To: SHP Subject: three ways to go Message: Hello Shipper, Well, 1,2,and three are off topic actually, which is fine of course. What does 'embodied the word' mean? When you say 'It's comforting to not have to choose one', you overlook the fact that you actually have. The reason I say have YOU chosen yet is that you may have aquired your choice in a package deal with other ideas. Since you have listened to maharaji for so many years, can you identify what you understand about the god you are trying to get clear about? Your answer to the 'embodied the word' will show you and me what is the foundation of your beliefs or understandings. It will be a good place to discuss. I'm exploring like you. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 14:32:20 (EST)
From: John Email: None To: shp Subject: attitudes Message: Hey,shp, my sympathies, sincerely I mean that. I mean,hell, I think Jim's arguing style sucks, and I told him that, or something like that, soon after I started coming to this forum. But so what? I mean, we're all different. Don't read his posts if you find him impossible to communicate with. Personally, I think Jim is hysterically funny sometimes, that makes up for his assaholic nature. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 14:56:13 (EST)
From: Mike Email: None To: John Subject: 12-step program for Jim.... Message: John: In order to help poor Jim remove the curse of assaholism (GOD I LOVED THAT!), I formulated 12-steps for his pleasure: 1. We admitted we were powerless over ASSAHOLISM - that our lives had become unmanageable. 2. Came to believe that Dawkins is greater than ourselves could restore us to sanity. 3. Made a decision to turn our will and our lives over to the care of logical thought, as we understand it. 4. Made a searching and fearless moral inventory of ourselves. 5. Admitted to the EX FORUM and ourselves the exact nature of our wrongs. 6. Were entirely ready to have logical thought remove all these defects of character. 7. Humbly asked our own brains to remove our shortcomings. 8. Made a list of all persons we had harmed, and became willing to make amends to them all. 9. Made direct amends to such people wherever possible, except when to do so would injure them or others OR THEY ARE PREMIES! 10. Continued to take personal inventory and when we were wrong promptly admitted it. 11. Sought, through reading everything available, to improve our conscious contact with logic as we understand it, reading only for knowledge of our own minds and the power to carry that out. 12. Having had synaptic awakening as the result of these steps, we tried to carry this message to ASSAHOLICS everywhere! Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 16:59:06 (EST)
From: shp Email: None To: John Subject: attitudes Message: john, i am free to ignore or deal with jim i have chosen for now to address his problem in the open forum where he has trashed many others besides myself crudeness is not 'style' and anger is not 'passion' he just needs to tuck his ego in and get along like the rest of us mortals. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 14:48:23 (EST)
From: Brian Email: brian@ex-premie.org To: shp Subject: lattitudes Message: JIM IS SO FULL OF WHAT HE ACCUSES MAHARAJI OF (in terms of powertripping on people, scaled down, of course to jim's lifestyle, etc)... Exactly what power do you perceive Jim having over you? Or anyone else on the forum? The power to insult? We all have that. ...THAT HE RENDERS HIMSELF USELESS TO THE CAUSE OF CLARITY BECAUSE OF HIS OWN LIMITATIONS. You many be right. What's yer point? Katie doesn't suffer from that. Are you going to harp on her niceness to the same extent as you are fixated on Jim's apparent meanness to you? Robyn posts nice words too. Why is that lost on you? when dealing with people who are delusional, it is necessary to be gentle and patient, yes firm at times, but never accusatory or violent... that's is, if you are trying to help. This is a forum where people help themselves. There is support, but it's not as much fun to harp about. You've been treated both gently and patiently by some here. You haven't been treated violently. I don't agree that you should never be accused of anything. You want the truth, or you just want to be placated and babied? People here have posted to you in the belief that you are not so delusional that you can't understand your accountability for the verbal and mental games that YOU play with the subject of discussion - Maharaji. IF maharaji is who you all says he is (or isn't), and IF you say he has deluded many... Pretty big IFs in your mind and in your posts. Don't expect that to go unchallenged here. You can try to shift responsibility for your CAUSE OF CLARITY in life to others (like Jim), or learn to assume it for yourself. I called you on your Alpha post, and you avoided responsibility for your Beta behavior, and shifted it to me for having accused you of it. Can Jim be a prick? Yes he can. Can you move beyond that? Or are you just too happily contented with having Jim serve as the reason why Maharaji isn't a fraud in your eyes, and for why you aren't a fool for not being willing to face it? Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 17:06:30 (EST)
From: shp Email: None To: Brian Subject: lattitudes Message: the business with jim is just that and the business with maharaji is just that...no intermixing or hiding behind one or the other. i am fine over here, bri, just fine. i just gave jim what-for for a change....instead of the other way around. i can handle it. can i get beyond it? i imagine so, since the reason i have been around is a bit greater than this petty ante stuff. yeah, those if's are biggies and that's the crux of the matter. but challenges are not what i need, space to think and feel this out are what i need, and the support of well-meaning folks. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 17:45:51 (EST)
From: Mike Email: None To: shp Subject: I'm a bit confused... Message: shp: You said, 'yeah, those if's are biggies and that's the crux of the matter. but challenges are not what i need, space to think and feel this out are what i need, and the support of well-meaning folks.' shp, you've been talking AROUND those big if's for awhile. Everytime we (as a group) broach those big if's, you don't really discuss or digest them (IMHO). I'm a bit confused concerning exactly what it is that you are looking for here. 'Space to think and feel' isn't what we need from a written communications forum.... CHALLENGING/discussing belief systems is what we need. If I 'need space,' I stop posting and reading for awhile. Now, if you take exception with the particular technique a participant uses to 'challenge' your beliefs, then SAY SOMETHING. If they don't catch the hint, then direct your commentary to someone else. But, don't ask for a challenge-less discussion about M, because I think you would be asking for the impossible (especially if you take-on the pro-M persona). shp, we could discuss the weaknesses in each and every personality here, from now to eternity and it wouldn't accomplish a thing! I have faults and some people may not like my style. If someone asked me to cool the verbal-abuse, I would do a little introspection and see if I could 'fix it,' if I was so inclined. But that's ME! That's how 'I' work! Just because I work that way doesn't mean that ANYONE else has to work that way. But, if YOU like the way I work then talk to me. If you like the way Katie works, talk to her. If you like the way Rick works, talk to him. Whatever..... But let's get off the personality bashing train, now. If a particular personality grates on YOU, then don't talk to them.... simple as that! You ain't gonna change Jim, unless he wants to be changed! That's assuming that he really NEEDS to be changed.... a HUGE assumption! He 'may' grate on some people, but he's an incredibly clear thinker and a prolific contributor to this forum. This isn't a mellow-personality contest, it's a forum for the discussion of a destructive cult and its belief systems, right? Why not 'get on with it' and challenge your belief systems. shp, if your beliefs are TRUE, they can take a challenge, can't they? If they aren't, they will fall apart like the house of cards that they are. It's one or the other! But, to make this work, you MUST challenge them HONESTLY and COMPLETELY, IMHO. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 17:49:45 (EST)
From: Helen Email: None To: Mike Subject: I'm a bit confused... Message: Amen, brother Mike. Can I get a witness? Allehluia, brother Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 14:54:29 (EST)
From: Helen Email: None To: shp Subject: attitudes Message: I agree with you shp that if someone is delusional, they should not be beat up on. I think that people deny their delusions until they are ready to face them. I agree that Jim's style lacks kindness a lot of the time, and can be counterproductive in getting people to see their delusions. But Jim is Jim and his style has certainly contributed a lot here, because he's trying to get at the truth. I certainly don't get my knickers in a twist over him because I recognize that his style is his style. He and I have gone at it a few times and that's part of life as far as I'm concerned. You are free to defend yourself, argue, hell, you can tie up thousands of threads going on about Jim's dysfunctional personality if you want . But like Jim said before, this isn't about Jim, it's about a Guru and his followers and ex-followers. That's the purpose of the website. As Katie said, Jim is one person on this forum and I really can't agree with you that he is some kind of alpha figure here. I just don't buy that. Hope you are doing well. Helen Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 15:06:37 (EST)
From: ham Email: None To: shp Subject: attitudes Message: For someone on a spiritual route shp, you do rattle on, what's wrong with a little silence, quiet reflection & absorbtion? Could save you a lot of aggravation & grief. Give you a little breathing space and enable you to choose more carefully where to intersect here. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 17:08:37 (EST)
From: shp Email: None To: ham Subject: attitudes Message: how true. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 15:22:31 (EST)
From: Runamok Email: None To: shp Subject: Oh, really? Message: Shippy, you flame on as much as anybody. You sure don't seem to want to take responsiblity for yourself here. You've cursed me several times and others numerous times. If I consider who is the worst behaved person on the forum, you come to mind. Going after Jim just makes him more of what you wish he weren't. Whether there is a kind of leadership here or not, Jim, as much or more than anybody, had had a role in establishing an internet presence for exes. You're so into being here- some people established this presence without and did you that service. I have no direct say as to your participation here, BUT, I wish the Premies and M-sympathizers who WANT to hang out here would show us some respect as far as this our 'temple' not yours (NOT literally). With you, you think you're doing us a favor when you preach, and then when we shut you up, you whine like you're being persecuted. No one sucked you into anything. You did it. Take responsibility for yourself. You're always saying you're an adult. Walk the walk. We may challenge you. You don't have to answer. You won't get thrown off for your point of view. Cut the whine, dude. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 21:09:53 (EST)
From: shp Email: None To: Runamok Subject: reply Message: the deal with jim isn't really personal, but it is exasperating. like if you had a yellow background and orange letters, ya know? that would make it hard to understand what is being said. that's waht jim's trip does, makes it harder to understand and believe. you assumed alot in your post like you think you know why i do what i do, etc. and you are wrong. and the only whine i hear around here is how much maharaji allegedly hurt many of you and how rich he is, and what his faucets are made out of, and how he said this then and that now. maybe when you are done licking your wounds, you just may collectively be able to get up the momentum to actually have some effect on folks like me once you can keep your personalities in check and tell your stories without malice towards your listeners. (this is not for all exers, but you know who you are.) i am still listening, despite the bull. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 21:18:06 (EST)
From: Jim Email: None To: shp Subject: reply Message: shp, You are so funny! the deal with jim isn't really personal, but it is exasperating. like if you had a yellow background and orange letters, ya know? that would make it hard to understand what is being said. that's waht jim's trip does, makes it harder to understand and believe. Understand and believe what? and the only whine i hear around here is how much maharaji allegedly hurt many of you and how rich he is, and what his faucets are made out of, and how he said this then and that now. maybe when you are done licking your wounds, you just may collectively be able to get up the momentum to actually have some effect on folks like me once you can keep your personalities in check and tell your stories without malice towards your listeners. What do you mean by 'keep your personalities in check'? (this is not for all exers, but you know who you are.) i am still listening, despite the bull. Do you think people care? I just find you funny. You don't ahve the ability to think clearly and I, callous bastard that I am, find a few laughs in that. Maybe, if you were my friend or something (unimagineable) I'd feel sorry for you, try to help you a bit. But you're not. You're just a middle-aged idiot who's life is so bound up in dumb thinking you might as well not have a brain. And yeah, I laugh. Maybe I AM fucked up after all. Mind you, other people, like JM, simply ignore you. Which is worse? Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 19:20:46 (EST)
From: SHP Email: None To: Jim Subject: reply Message: Jim, You caught me in a good mood. Right now I wish you well, hope your girlfriend is healthy and horny (for your sake) and that all the circumstances in your life are in favor of your highest good. I wish you that because I wish everybody that, everywhere, regardless of their political, religious or philosophical beliefs. I believe that you know damn well the answers to all the above questions you asked me in the above quote, and you are baiting me into 'argument-world', which is your most comfortable environment of verbal communication, whereas others like myself prefer a more peaceful and cordial method of interchange. I believe there is a more fuel efficient way to communicate than the (imho) wasteful energy burns that you seem to like. I want to sincerely thank you, however, for the energy that you have expended personally toward me in your efforts, no matter how crude or polished, to express something to me that you feel is so important to share. None of what you have said to me is lost or forgotten. You have made a great effort to communicate with me in your own way, and I just want you to know that I appreciate it, even if I don't like your style or agree with everything you said. I have your 'signature' of who you are and how you feel about this matter and why, in no uncertain terms. This is me. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 22:02:04 (EST)
From: Jim Email: None To: SHP Subject: autism Message: I believe that you know damn well the answers to all the above questions you asked me in the above quote, and you are baiting me into 'argument-world', which is your most comfortable environment of verbal communication, whereas others like myself prefer a more peaceful and cordial method of interchange. I believe there is a more fuel efficient way to communicate than the (imho) wasteful energy burns that you seem to like. Shp, You're a worm. I ask you some simple questions and again you don't have the guts to follow up with your own words. You talk about my 'trip' which 'makes it harder to understand and believe'. I ask you what you mean and you call that 'baiting'. THAT, shp, is pretty damnded stupid. You know, it's hilarious to hear you juxtapose 'argument' with 'peaceful and cordial' communication. As if one precludes the other. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 15:46:04 (EST)
From: SHP Email: None To: Jim Subject: jim, you have 'ought-ism' Message: Jim, I'd rather be a worm than a snake. When a worm is wounded, it bleeds, rolls over and heals. When a snake is wounded, it hisses, strikes and bites. So if I am a worm, that is not so bad. Worms do alot to areate the soil and create optimum conditions to make things grow. You even pick on the least of creatures to spew your bile, what ignorance. You have that empire kind of 17th-19th century thing going, as opposed to a native culture that would consider the worm a pretty cool critter. Helps catch fish, too. Makes the ultimate sacrifice to put a nice big salmon on the buffalo skin to feed the family. I didn't exactly expect you to drop your bag on the next post and go 'shucks, SHP, yer right, I was baiting you and have been using that technique to tango with anybody I want to screw with for a really long time.' But hey, you, have a fan club, you're cool, the polls came in, you must have read them. So you don't have to cop to anything because so many people have bought your trip and accept your abusiveness as an acceptable 'style'. I still say you were baiting me, but since you have classified me as a worm I guess it's appropriate, eh? Why did you communicate with me in the first place? Why did you continue? Do you sincerely give a shit about effectively conveying your thoughts in order to expose someone you consider a fraud who you believe has misled thousands, or did I just unknowingly wander onto your personal premie-for-skeetshooting range? I may be slow or thick or hesitating in your eyes, but I am not here to satisfy your timeframe. There are stories of abused people who don't snap out of it for years, even though they are functioning adults in every other way. Shock and denial are not necessarily voluntary responses, and take different amounts of time to wear off for each individual. I accept the fact that this may be my condition right now, if your hypothesis about maharaji is correct. That's alot for me to see at once for the first time. I just want you to know that your meanness didn't contribute to this happening...if anything, it delayed it. I like and respect some of your attributes, but for me, your nasty side made it harder to focus on what I came here for in the first place, which was to find out what is going on from this site's point of view. So now I have been transmigrated from a human to a puppy to a worm by you. Geez, lawyers in Canada have to know alot more than the lawyers down here...I don't know one U.S. lawyer who knows how to interspecies-transmigrate souls. Or is this a gift? If you take the letters in your name J-I-M and look at it with the M in front, it looks like M-JI. Coincidence? Send that one to Roger's believe it or not. And I meant that thing about hoping your girlfriend wants you. Maybe you'll be more civil around here and still get your point across. (No disrespect intended to your lady.) Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 15:57:41 (EST)
From: Mike Email: None To: SHP Subject: Hey, snakes are cool, too :-) Message: shp: You shouldna pick on snakes like that. They relieve the planet of an overabundance of disease-ridden rodents and such.... assuming they're native, of course... :-o Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 16:07:04 (EST)
From: SHP Email: None To: Mike Subject: Hey, snakes are cool, too :-) Message: Yeah, man, all God's creatures have a purpose. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 19:57:46 (EST)
From: Jim Email: None To: SHP Subject: get your kids Message: shp, Do you have the courage to bring your kids here or not? Go on. I dare you to show them the posts you call 'abusive'. Tell them how hard it is for Daddy when he's asked questions he doesn't want to deal with. Explain to them how different that is from when THEY get asked questions they don't want to answer. I think it'd be fun to see how impressed they were with their father's presentation here. Come on, shp, you've got nothing to be ashamed of, right? Go for it! Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 20:52:26 (EST)
From: SHP Email: None To: Jim Subject: get your own kids Message: You are a complete idiot. You really are. You don't get one thing and it spoils what you do know. When and if my kids are ever in a situation even remotely relatable To this one, I hope I have more patience Than you to help them through it. And as for your post and the stink on it... Smells like bait to me, Jimbo. Lots of bloody smells on your post, Like the bottom of a chum bucket You are. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 22:32:33 (EST)
From: Jim Email: None To: SHP Subject: See? Message: Shp, Why don't you just get lost? No one here really wants to talk with you (except for me, I think. But that's MY problem, not yours.) You're afraid of being 'baited' or otherwise lured into thinking or discussing Maharaji responsibly. Remember when I first called you another Keith? Know why I said it? Because, just like you're doing now, Keith retreated into his own shell of ignorance to the point no one could talk with him. Not in any meaningful way, at least. I saw that coming with you and now, shp, it's a full case you've got happening. You're not liked here, shp. AND you're not doing yourself or anyone any good. Do you enjoy being the brunt of so many jokes? How'd you feel hearing Helen tell you that, much as she's tried to be patient with you, you just ended up trying all her patience? Do you think you're serving some purpose here? Anyway, Keith got himself kicked off by impersonating others and posting so many posts Brian determined it was a harrassment campaign and that alone. I'm not sure that you'll slide quite that far out of control but maybe it'd be a good thing if you did and got this over with once and for all. So, shp, if it's any assistance, may I suggest that you 'live a little'? DON'T hold your 'personality in check'. DO just do what feels best in your heart. Fight the demons that are challenging you. Go for it. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, Jan 30, 1999 at 11:40:32 (EST)
From: SHP Email: None To: Jim Subject: going for it Message: Jim, 1) I would never play some of the games you say Keith has played. I wouldn't post under a false name or knowingly clog or harrass this site. 2) As for jokes, I don't steer my life by a popularity contest and who is making fun of me at any given time. We all enjoy being liked and respected, but not to the point of an empty existence based on peer pressure. 3) I have been guest here and have not always acted like one, since I saw everyone else letting it fly, so did I. So I will act more like a guest from now on. Respect to my hosts here, thank you for allowing me to be here... 3) After everything that has gone down between us, for you to say to me: 'So, shp, if it's any assistance, may I suggest that you 'live a little'? DON'T hold your 'personality in check'. DO just do what feels best in your heart. Fight the demons that are challenging you. Go for it.' Now that triggered something. It's early and I am going to get a cuppa coffee and sit back down and open up a little more. Your post revealed to me a sincere caring for what happens to me, whether you admit it or not. And underneath all your tough exterior, I caught a glimmer of your own heart. That promotes some trust. It's nice to know that you aren't just anti-something, but also pro-something too. I was not in his ashrams. I wasn't privvy to much of what some of you were. I didn't do much backstage, residence, or personal service to him or his family. I have just been a 'civilian' premie out in the world, raising a family and working jobs and trying to have a happy life....not necessarily in the company of very many other premies day-to-day or community-wide. So alot of what I have heard here has been new or newly acknowledged information and has taken time to assimilate. My first seven years with knowedge were in Miami (78-85), and for the last 14 years I have been in a relatively quiet area. I did not think this was going to be 'easy going' as time went by, and I did not come here just to windowshop, so here comes some of the letting go, since you cared enough to ask: It always struck me weird that Maharaji either said or allowed to be said of him that 'Guru is greater than God because guru shows you God'...that pushes a BIG red button in the Judeo-Christian cosmology, and I ignored it. Still bothers me to this day. Don't ask why I never followed up on it...I just look back and see myself completely wowed by someone who had come to save the world. As for being the 'Lord of the Universe' with all the trimmings, I again was wowed in the mid-70's by someone coming from 'the east to the west'...'as a little child'...to 'spread the Knowledge of God' just like the Judeo-Christian (Isaiah + new Testament if you look at it a certain way) and other prophecies foretold. His alteration of his presentation I never looked at as covering up the past, just as a change of presentation. (Christian prophecies 'I will come like a thief in the night' and 'his name will not be heard in the streets' bolstered my support of his newer low key approach.) The opulence with which he surrounds himself I have justified as befitting for him as the personage he claims to be. The alleged ripping off of the Amtext idea from an individual premie by one of Maharaji's ashram housefathers and running him out of the business is detestable to me. And why Maharaji never answered that guy's (RD's?) letters is a mystery to me. Is it possible that Maharaji never sees some of his mail...that he has some super-gung-ho premies surrounding him who keep stuff from him? But even if that's true, he's supposed to be omniscient. I have had more than my share of shitty business dealing being perpetrated on me in corporate America, so this is a particular sore spot. The abrupt closing of the ashrams which put many lives into turmoil I have rationalized as his right and authority to do, with the teaching hidden in the ozone and all the displaced ashram premies responsible to figure it out. After all, they were his ashrams and were peopled by folks who had sworn obedience to him, so whatever goes down is cool, right? But then when I heard about displaced families and babies, etc., something about it did not feel right to me. The suicides I cannot attribute directly to him, but in some circumstances the instructors on deck most certainly weren't emotionally equipped to handle some of the people and situations. And Maharaji's not reaching out to those who called to him in their agony - ashram premies - I don't know what to say. But what comes to mind is that 70's satsang where he talked about a good father not letting his child crawl into a fire....something doesn't add up from where I sit, bigtime. So why haven't I chucked it all, you may ask? Hell if I know. Something still rings true in the Knowledge when I practice, for one thing. For another, teachers of his alleged calibre are known for blowing minds, being unpredictable and doing things that have allegedly deeper ramifications than this physical plane reveals. Or maybe that is more 'new age spiritual crap' as you would call it. Or maybe not. I am in a quandary, and not ashamed or embarrassed to admit it. I have cut Maharaji alot of slack regarding his spoken words and what they mean. As I remember, he set me up for that in his Albert Hall (?) satsang where he said something like 'when you go to a master, don't just take the words, but also soak up the love, soak up the caring, etc...' In other words, he told me not to take him literally. Now as I sit here and type, it doesn't feel good to look back and observe that alot of this went down in my life without a peep out of me. I am not merely the rationalizing creature that you and others here have witnessed in the past months...I am a strong, loving person with no problem speaking my piece, and having respect and patience to communicate even with those I disagreed with. Anyone who ever knew me would attest to that. If anything has come from our exchanges, it is getting the feedback that I am coming off like someone who who has allowed himself to be gagged to speak my true thoughts about this whole matter. That has been definitely giving me many hours of self-reflection to deal with, with no commercial interruptions, just in-my-face real life stuff 24/7, that touches on every aspect of my life. But I asked for it. And I want to live in the truth whatever it takes. Also, there are more lives involved here than just my own. It is a delicate situation, also with children involved. Much love and care are required for me to work this all out without hurting anyone. With just your simple change of attitude, expressing as you did in the last sentence of you above post, you have changed the chemistry between us, at least from my point of view. And that will make it easier to deal. I know this site isn't about 'me', and I never wanted to monopolize threads or incite ill feeling with anyone. I did think that I could benefit from listening and taking part here, and getting personal was just a way to accomplish this, not my raison d'etre. I also realize how absurb some of my answers must have sounded to the ears of those who have gave it all up long ago. Perhaps we will exchange some more. So I wish you a good day. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, Jan 30, 1999 at 13:20:16 (EST)
From: Katie Email: None To: SHP Subject: going for it Message: Hi shp - I liked your previous post very much, and I appreciate your honest sharing of your thoughts and feelings. Just a few comments (no answers) - You wrote: Something still rings true in the Knowledge when I practice, for one thing. I think a lot of people here have had this experience, although I did not. What I've come to believe since I've been on this site is that the knowledge meditation is very powerful for some people, less for others. In other words, it's not the ONLY way. There are several ex-premies on this site who still practice the meditation and find it valuable. These people have been able to dissociate the knowledge meditation from Maharaji, who, as you probably are aware, is not the only person who teaches it. You also wrote: For another, teachers of his alleged calibre are known for blowing minds, being unpredictable and doing things that have allegedly deeper ramifications than this physical plane reveals. Or maybe that is more 'new age spiritual crap' as you would call it. Or maybe not. I am in a quandary, and not ashamed or embarrassed to admit it. I agree that the 'lila' question is very hard to deal with, especially if one is familiar with the stories of other teachers doing the same thing. I was going through the archives last night and getting posts about the DECA project. What really struck me was the amount of abuse that people were willing to put up with from Maharaji - and I'm talking about people who post on this site, who I respect highly. So you aren't alone here. I don't have any easy answers to this one. For what it's worth, I try and accept the unavoidable difficult experiences (for example, illness) in my life as something I have to live with, and maybe learn from. However, if a person imposes something intolerable on me, I get out of there. I think people should treat each other with respect and kindness, even if they ARE teachers. I left Maharaji because I could no longer tolerate the way that following him was making me feel about myself. I wasn't an ashram premie, didn't work at DECA, didn't know about almost all the revelations that have been made on this site. I went around and around in my head about leaving for a long time - back and forth, back and forth - thinking about things Maharaji and other premies had said and not trusting my own thoughts or feelings. Finally, it was the strength of my own feelings (or intuition or thought - I honestly cannot say) that made me leave. As the premies say, it was my HEART. I just had to be free, even if it meant I was going to go to hell. I'm not saying that you're in the same situation - just sharing my experience as you shared yours. Take care, Katie Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, Jan 30, 1999 at 13:32:00 (EST)
From: SHP Email: None To: Katie Subject: going for it Message: Thanks for taking the time. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, Jan 30, 1999 at 15:56:19 (EST)
From: Jim Email: None To: SHP Subject: honestly?? Message: Your post revealed to me a sincere caring for what happens to me, whether you admit it or not. And underneath all your tough exterior, I caught a glimmer of your own heart. That promotes some trust. It's nice to know that you aren't just anti-something, but also pro-something too. Shp, I'd be lying if I said I was feeling anything but generous when I wrote that BUT, if you're going to read such noble sentiments into my comments, what the hell, I'll take it. (Thank god for the subconscious, eh?) . If anything has come from our exchanges, it is getting the feedback that I am coming off like someone who who has allowed himself to be gagged to speak my true thoughts about this whole matter. Don't forget, all of us -- or at least most of us -- feel that we did this to some extent. After all, we were trained to disassociate from all our thoughts, 'true' or not. I'd say that you've come off more like someone who still holds, by your own admission (i.e. lila), a nest of cult dogma in your head but who has some wiggle room around it to think a bit. I think it was Mike who said something pretty true the other day. Unless a cult member can entertain even the POSSIBILITY that they've been had, they'll be impervious to all reason about the cult. What's been so frustrating about you is that you're easily in the category of cult members who CAN entertain such a possibility. I've got this metaphor in my head. Imagine the cult dogma's like an iceberg lodged in some arctic bay. If the iceberg's securely in place, it just sits there, protected by its sheer size. It fills the whole bay and very little water sweeps by. Certainly not enough to threaten it in any way. But what if the iceberg gets dislodged a bit? It drifts to the mouth of the bay and suddenly, perhaps for the first time in decades, it's exposed to currents, some of which are warm and constant. Soon enough, these currents start wearing down the outer edge of the iceberg. The iceberg begins shrinking if ever so slowly. So long as the current's effect is greater than whatever forces might increase the berg, sooner or later that thing's going to really show its shrinking stature. Now what if the iceberg shrinks just enough to really escape its arctic bay? What if it actually gets carried into the current and finds itself, say a month later, far south of all arctic waters, still being buffetted by warmer, moving currents? At that point it's going to really lose mass, it's gonna start shrinking like a motherfucker. I figure that some premies are like people with icebergs safely ensconced in their protected arctic bays. The waters are stagnant and cold. By that I mean that they keep them that way. They DON'T approach any of the facts or arguments that could possibly threaten their berg of cult thinking, the 'warm currents', if you will. Will they ever change? Probably not. The sad fact is that it's a lot easier to get into a cult than to leave one. History's riddled with people who died with crazy indoctrination firmly in place. Other premies are like people with icebergs that have moved out to the mouth or edge of their protective bays. They feel the warm waters of reason brush slowly against their icebergs but any accretion, if it exists, is almost undetectable. Sure, if one did some major time/lapse photography one might indeed see some shrinkage over the years (Knolwedge Lite, anyone?). But nothing fast enough to be marked in a single conversation, that's for sure. Then there are premies whose icebergs have simply broken free. They're still extant but now they're drifting unprotected in all the reason and truth the world has to offer outside the cult's protected waters. These icebergs are being 'assaulted' '24/7' by the warm waters and their future as icebergs begins to look at least a little iffy. Indeed, on a good day, you can almost see the erosion take place hour by hour. That's all. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 21:15:32 (EST)
From: SHP Email: None To: Jim Subject: you're not MY alpha.... Message: and you can find somebody else to order around and jump your hoops for you. The more I think about and read your outrageous ego trip, the less respect and willingness I have to listen to anything from you, valid or not. Like I said, get your own kids and don't even try to tell me what to do with my life, not even metaphorically or whatever. You have a very few speeds: attack bait cajole/humor(?) mental/books/philosophize And you are supposedly free of the evil influence of maharaji. So why aren't you more realxed and calm about your life? You are such an uptight sphincter. In the name of righteous indignation, you smuggle in your own neuroses behind this website's banner. I recognize that in you, and you can deny it all you want. As for the others you can push around, they will just have to fend for themselves until they get smarter and tell you to f*ck off. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 23:39:21 (EST)
From: Helen Email: None To: shp Subject: reply Message: Shp, It's not my job to get 'my personality in check' so that you can have a better experience here. In fact, I REALLY resent that whole 'get your personality in check' concept. People's personalities are THEM, they can't separate their personalities from themselves, that is more Guru speak as far as I'm concerned. I am not into TRANSCENDING my personality and all that crap. It's not our job to make this a cushy ride for you--you really do demand a lot of attention here and you complain about this site constantly. It really does get annoying. It's just not our responsibility to meet your needs, I wish you'd deal with that or move on. Helen Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 19:25:52 (EST)
From: SHP Email: None To: Helen Subject: reply Message: To simplify: I mean to be civil, not to become a zombie. God, we all have to be sooo careful about our wordings because of semantics. And I have noticed lots of folks besides myself have had to go back and clarify a word or two to clear up a post. So don't get so jumpy...if you think you know me from previous posts that were positive experiences, why do you think I would all of a sudden become somebody else? Don't assume the negative about me please. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 21:59:17 (EST)
From: Helen Email: None To: SHP Subject: reply to you Message: My reaction (in post above) is the culmination of following your posts on here for the past three months, and in particular your latest crusade against Jim. I have tried to keep my feelings of annoyance at you at bay but you know what: YOU'RE ANNOYING!! That's probably the meanest thing you'll see come out of my 'mouth' on the forum, there's a lot more I could say but I won't because I try to practice self-control. So there you have it I am not that interested in going on and on and on with you anymore shp. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 00:35:15 (EST)
From: Helen Email: None To: shp Subject: reply to you II Message: Dear shp, Of course I would have a lot more respect for you shp, if you said something substantive once in a while. But so often you talk in circles, tell us how spiritual you are and how evolved you are, how unevolved we are, how you are trying to look deep within your soul, and are going through such heavy changes etc etc ad nauseum. I don't think you mean to, but you come off as quite egocentric, as if you have all the answers already and have nothing to learn from anyone. There, whatever self-control I had is lost, and I've told you exactly what I think of you. I kept waiting for you to show some signs of movement, change, etc, but you seem to have recharged your premie battery during a brief sabbatical from the forum and now you are even more frustrating than ever. ARRGHHH Still holding out hope that you are going to get your feet on the ground (and please don't write me a poem about how grounded you are) Helen Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 16:03:51 (EST)
From: SHP Email: None To: Helen Subject: reply to you Message: Helen, I am not on a 'crusade' against anyone. I was speaking up for myself in the face of someone who is admittedly and dramatically rude, who others say is rude, and everybody just lets him do his trip and they all live with it, because of his great contributions to the cause, or something like that. I don't buy that. Do I have to? No. That's all. As for the essence of why I am here, my perspective is shifting and changing and I am just trying to take it all in..as I mentioned to Jim in a recent post, sometimes abused folks are in shock and/or denial for a long time even though it's all spelled out.....and that if you all are correct, this may be my present state, hypothetically for now. But meanness, Jim's or anyone's else's, is not a contributing factor to my awakening if I am to have one. And I am not asking anybody to be 'nice' or 'sweet' either....just civil and straight, that's all I ask. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 20:05:20 (EST)
From: Helen Email: None To: SHP Subject: Navel gazing Message: Again, this is the ex-premie website. This is not the 'help shp with his eternal shifting and changing process, embrace shp with all of his infernal navel-gazing' website. . As per Jim--people 'allow' or 'disallow' as they please. Here I am engaging with you again--about the forum, once again. Pick a different topic please. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 20:59:05 (EST)
From: SHP Email: None To: Helen Subject: time for a drink Message: I don't drink much, don't keep it in the house, except every now and then I get a bottle of wine or a six-pack, maybe once every month or two. But tonight or sometime over the weekend, I think I am going to have some drinks, just to relax some. Alcohol does have its positive attributes. Some of your feedback and others implies that I am all about myself, etc. That's really not a conscious act. I definitely don't feel superior to anyone here based on m-belief or ex-m. I hope that you and your family and your dogs are all very happy tonight. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, Jan 30, 1999 at 18:04:26 (EST)
From: Helen Email: None To: SHP Subject: Let's get sloppy drunk, shp Message: I don't think you're consciously self-involved, I think that continual naval gazing makes all people that way. The sun does not rise and set on whether you stay with or leave Maharaji. And isn't that idea a little liberating in a way? I mean, in the scheme of things it really isn't that important. So why not just give the whole thing a rest and just focus on what's important to you and leave the guru thing behind. Who needs it? Look what it's doing to you, pal. Just ONE opinion here. Go out and have a few drinks and take a break, it's all ridiculous anyway, IMO (all this Maharaji stuff--what a waste of time he is) I'm having a few glasses of wine myself on this beautiful Saturday night. Take care, sorry if I was too grumpy. Me own husband said I was being a bit of a bitch today so I apologize if I was too grumpy Helen Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, Jan 30, 1999 at 21:39:50 (EST)
From: SHP Email: None To: Helen Subject: Yesh, lesh have a few drinksh Message: Ish ok, Helen. Can I call you 'Hel' for short? Been married long enough to catch onto the ebbs and flows So ta shpeak. Here's to ya. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 23:44:44 (EST)
From: Runamok Email: None To: shp Subject: assumptions Message: And you assume a lot in all of your posts that what you do is very important and that we ought to be interested in why you do what you do. You also like to excuse your own shortcomings in writing posts by saying you were in a hurry, you were sleepy. Don't forget to assure us that your motivations are totally sincere in being here.. oh I'm sure that's true and by the way, how much would you be selling your own personal snake oil for, if it were for sale, but REALLY Shippy, I know you're not selling anything. You're too sincere! You are so sincere but all the ex-premies who find fault with you are insincere, including the webmaster, even tho You have important reasons for being here. I mean the webmaster is really just some weird channel of Goomirage's grace anyway. It's not like any of the people who you disagree with are actually doing any service for you, themselves, without the aid or energy of your FATCAT guru. And don't forget, Runamok, what you say would be quite good if any of it were true (examples of untruths not mentioned). Shippy, please don't do me any favors by hanging around, ok? Do yourself a favor, decide where you wanna be and quit whining. You're a fucking whiner and your new age garbage just keeps you from hearing yourself. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 19:33:46 (EST)
From: bill Email: None To: shp Subject: latitudes Message: Hello Shipster, Jim has helped me a great deal. He pried apart logics that had me stumped and vulnerable. I would read a post by CD and it would seem flawless and Jim would take it apart stem to stern and damned if I could point out where Jim was wrong. He tiptoed around me and I don't know why. I'm not sure how i would have done on the fireing line. Katie has given you her advice. When Rick speaks to Jim, that is like one warrior talking to another. I myself would never post a sentence against him in any way. When the forum was young, he was it's real strength. Why dont you just post after one of my posts and we will talk. But not this one! And John said something I have to agree with. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 19:44:43 (EST)
From: bill Email: None To: bill Subject: latitudes Message: What I agree with John about is that Jim can be very funny sometimes. It comes in waves. You missed a good era for him about a month ago of so. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 20:04:34 (EST)
From: Jim Email: None To: bill Subject: Remembrances -- the video Message: Let's be honest. It's true that when this thing started I was kind of prominent. After all, hardly anyone was even around back then. There was me, Scott Perry (not Talkington), Katie Unlimited (the other Katie), Rick (the other Rick, too). We were posting on alt.support.ex-cult and Scott emailed me about starting a page. Typical me, I said I was all for it but didn't know shit about how, so he did all the work. Got a little money (not much) from David and I and that was about it. Things started happening. After less than a year, I think, Scott decided to give up the page. I think one problem was that his Course in Miracles involvement made it difficult for him to host such a necessarily critical venue. Not to mention his Quaker membership. That couldn't have helped. But, perhaps more than anything, Scott had to really apply himself at work. So David Stirling took over the page and you can still see his handiwork via the Cult watch link. About a year later, things were starting to really pick up. David had a new baby and felt he just wasn't up to hosting the page any further and handed it to Brian. Brian enlisted Katie's assistance and there we are. If this was a party I was indeed one of the first guys here. I helped serve drinks, mingled a bit. That kind of thing. I guess I was one of the first people to really slag m under my own name and all that. Why'd I do that? I just felt I wasn't going to tiptoe around m, the biggest coward of us all. I'd already been too much of a weenie in the cult. It was time for a change. Plus, I believed (and still do) that these days are different than the rabid, fanatical period of Fakiranand's hammer throw and the 'I'd-slit-his-throat' attitude exhibited by that security guy in LOTU. AND, I had a lot of fun blasting premies and chasing down EV honcho's and stuff. That WAS fun, I admit. Yes, I'd have to say that, at one point, I was kind of prominent here. But now? Give me a break! There are so many people just saying their piece, so many diferent ways. We've all got different experiences, personalities and perspectives AND the interest or skills in expressing them. What a joke to think I'm a leader in any way. I won't even begin to list the people who are just so spot on, thorough, interesting, funny or imaginative here who I'm happy to just count myself among as a peer somehow. This 'Jim-leader' thing is only a very senseless meme that makes no sense but carries on from one evasive dolt to the next. But what can you do? It's kind of fun. I wish I had this rep when I was younger, single and just rying to get laid all the time. But really, you know, as I know, that this is compelte bullshit. Now I'm even embarrassed a bit about commenting on it. I mean it's THAT stupid. So, if you'll all turn to page 35 of the 'Manmot Song Book' ... Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 20:37:33 (EST)
From: Runamok Email: None To: Jim Subject: Remembrances -the book Message: So it does seem to me that if Ship is so convinced of the value of the forum, he owes you something- respect at least. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Thurs, Jan 28, 1999 at 09:41:09 (EST)
From: Mike Email: None To: Jim Subject: Well said, Jim! Message: Jim: AND, thanks for being here when I arrived! I really mean that! :-) Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Wed, Jan 27, 1999 at 22:53:41 (EST)
From: Gail Email: None To: shp Subject: attitudes Message: Jim is honest and direct. Perhaps he is antagonistic to cajole current premies into thinking about MJ's (Hindu) belief system that we all accepted without question at one time or another. Jim posts a lot and seems to be fanatical at times; no wonder. His ashram friend committed suicide after being with the Lard for a few months; Jim was unable to help this guy. This is a hard thing to get over. The more a person believes in MJ and K, the more obsessed and dedicated (s)he becomes. MORE DEDICATION EQUALS MORE PAIN AND FURY WHEN THE TRUTH IS EXPOSED. Jim ignored his common sense and lived in the ashram for ten years. At the end of the rainbow, all he had was a bunch of unfulfilled promises and empty pockets. Why shouldn't he be angry? You would be furious if you could see how MJ has deluded you for 21 years. Do you really feel great on a day-to-day basis? What has MJ and K really given you? What about your doubts? What about your anger? Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 17:21:25 (EST)
From: SHP Email: None To: Gail Subject: attitudes Message: Gail: In response to your questions: >Do you really feel great on a day-to-day basis? No, but in the midst of any given headache-filled day, I can scope to a beautiful awareness, consciousness of my life on a deeper level which never seems to 'go down'. And my awareness of that ability is to maharaji's and knowledge's credit, regardless of anything else he has allegedly said or done. I need to come to terms with this seeming paradox, I know. But frankly, I haven't practiced much since posting here for some reason, even though I know it feels good. >What has MJ and K really given you? See above answer. Also, I have absolutely believed for about the last 25 years that he is the LPM, LOTU, etc. That gave us all a charge, as long as it was believed, you know. I wasn't just looking for a meditation teacher either...I was looking for the ONE. That's a long time to hold a thought/belief as fact, ya know? >What about your doubts? I don't call them doubts. I call the situation 'taking another look' at Maharaji, based on new information (to me) and a realization of some past events that I am now consciously aware I never felt right about. >What about your anger? I honestly don't feel angry. I am in 'search' mode. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 18:49:56 (EST)
From: x Email: None To: SHP Subject: ZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz Message: Your story has grown tiresome. Will the last devotee in the building please turn off the lights on your way out? Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, Jan 29, 1999 at 21:04:25 (EST)
From: SHP Email: None To: x Subject: if you are so bored.... Message: why don't you just IGNORE ME? And that goes for ALL of you who are bored with me, just shut the hell up and let the ones (if any) who can and will still communicate with me do so. Thank you very much. I notice that you still use the small 'x'....tsk tsk. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |