Ex-Premie.Org |
Forum III Archive # 49 | |
From: May 27, 1999 |
To: Jun 4, 1999 |
Page: 4 Of: 5 |
Date: Sat, May 29, 1999 at 10:30:53 (EDT)
From: Red Bird Email: None To: Cat Subject: International Law Message: Hello Cat, I want to remind you that we pay attention to posts on this forum. We are far from mediocre and realize it would be an excercise in futility to go after M and his legions of lawyers. I concede: The President of Elan Vital - Attorney Linda Gross specialty unknown. Board Member of most companies M profits from: Robert A Jacobs world renowned tax attorney Registered Agent: Attorney Alvaro Pascotto, specialties in Aviation and Entertainment International Organizer: Virgilio J Ciullo - specialty unknown. So stop worrying. You are legion. RB Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, May 29, 1999 at 11:25:10 (EDT)
From: Catweasel Email: M.I.G21? To: Red Bird Subject: International Law Message: Dear Mr Red Bird,The point is I'm not worried.Its the legal minds you dont know about that find your site and its many claims most interesting.I suppose what you say here is a bit like Parliamentry privilege,and as such you have a degree of latitude.Personally I subscribe to the theory of'Whats the difference between a dead snake in the middle ofthe road and a dead lawyer in the middle of the road?'......Skid marks in front of the Snake!!!Enjoy Jim!! Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, May 29, 1999 at 11:31:08 (EDT)
From: Gail Email: freedom@gtn.net To: Catweasel Subject: International Law Message: Speaking of international, why not send me a letter. I'd love to hear from you. BTW, I promise not to reveal anything you say. Just ask op. I never told what she said either. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, May 29, 1999 at 12:29:58 (EDT)
From: Catweasel Email: None To: Gail Subject: International Time Travel Message: I will, in a round about way. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, May 29, 1999 at 11:57:09 (EDT)
From: Red Bird Email: None To: Catweasel Subject: International Law Message: Hello Cat, Yes, I'm quite certain you're right about the rest of the legal team. I've heard that joke before. Over here the scenario for the skidmarks was the Jersey Turnbike;-> Enjoy the day, RB Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, May 29, 1999 at 09:27:21 (EDT)
From: spartakus Email: voodo To: catweasel Subject: your end is near Message: SHIT HEAD YOU ARE GOING TO EXPERIENCE FUNNY THINGS .... YOU CAN LAUGH AS MUCH AS YOU WANT BUT YOU WONT BE ABLE TO CLEAR THIS MESSAGE FROM YOUR MIND THE SPELL THAT I CAST ON YOU WILL TAKE EFFECT AS SOON AS YOU READ THIS REMEMBER SUPPORING THE MERCHANT OF RAINBOWS IS A CRIME AGAINST GOD !!!!! Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, May 29, 1999 at 11:49:30 (EDT)
From: Catweasel Email: Ahhh a dingo took my baby!!! To: spartakus Subject: your end is near Message: Are you near my bum,better move your bringing on a strong movement! Ahhh ...Now thats better.......OH SPARKY ..I'M SO SORRY!!! P.S Dont try and teach a Koori brother how to point the bone.Or you'll end up a crocodile sandwich[And make that snappy!!!!] Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Tues, Jun 01, 1999 at 20:27:44 (EDT)
From: AJW Email: None To: Catweasel & Sparakus Subject: The end is near Message: I sense I am in the presence of great prophets. Yeah for these are the times of which it was written, when the lion lies down next to the lamb and a little boy pees on them. I think there's a statue in Brussels somewhere. Anth the awed. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Wed, Jun 02, 1999 at 08:22:18 (EDT)
From: Catweasel Email: None To: AJW Subject: The end is near Message: You sensed 50% right.Me? I'm just a weasel.And I love it! Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, May 29, 1999 at 09:26:45 (EDT)
From: Nigel Email: nigel@redcrow.demon.co.uk To: Everyone Subject: Cultivating a devotee Message: The idea that Knowledge is an experience rather than a concept or set of beliefs is both a concept and a belief in its own right. And a second fundamental idea is that of Maharaji the giver and of the experience being his unique gift. Once it was necessary, or at least encouraged, to believe that Maharaji was Lord in Human Form. Not so today. But it is as true now as in the early years that in order to be ready to 'receive' Knowledge the aspirant must come to accept both the 'giver' and 'experience' concepts unquestioningly. This is a wise move. Otherwise, Knowledge simply wouldn't work. Even the premies will tell you as much (consciously or otherwise), and they are right. Jonathan Cainer is an interesting example. In his Elk.org 'Lives' entry he tells about a friend showing him the meditation techniques in a tent at a pop festival. He insists, however, that he didn't really experience anything until later after formally receiving Knowledge. He offers this as proof of Maharaji's special status. I would say it illustrates something else entirely. This is not to say people don't experience anything when meditating, nor even when listening to satsang. But what are they experiencing? They may be deeply relaxed and absorbed. They may experience profound sensory adjustments as their perceptual systems disengage from external stimuli. They may find the experience to be pleasant and meaningful. But it takes the combined effects of the two beliefs (that their experience is 'Knowledge' and that Knowledge comes from Maharaji) in order to make the leap of faith into premiedom. Adopting these two beliefs early on has the crucial mindwarping effect: a sense of gratitude and the formation of a strong emotional bond with the giver. (It is a one-way bond, of course.) And the experience of feeling something for Prem Rawat, embarrassing as it is to recall, can be a powerful experience in its own right - the missing X factor in Jonathan Cainer's spiritual progress - and is the devotional glue that keeps the Tub of Lard's show on the road and 24-carat plumbing in his bathroom. That devotional feeling can take a long time coming but once it kicks in you can rely on classical conditioning to do the rest. It is funny when you contrast the way many (most? / all?) of us felt when hearing and seeing Prem Rawat speak for the first time. I almost had the screaming abdabs. (TD in her excellent journey's entry talks about this too.) Where every fibre of your being is screaming 'get me out of this sodding madhouse!' Fortunately there were premies at hand to reassure me. Maharaji, they told me, is like a mirror. If Maharaji sounds confused, muddled and incoherent, that merely reflects where you are at. Jeez - I believed them! They also told me that Maharaji's satsang is like applying a leather to a very muddy window. When you first start wiping the dirt just looks worse, but eventually the glass becomes clear and the clear light of heaven shines through etc Which is, I suppose, one way of looking at it. The other way is to think of Pavlov's dogs. It doesn't matter how harsh the bell sounds once the aspirant starts salivating for Knowledge. They will quickly come to associate the message - no matter how offensive to their better judgement - with whatever mellow, twinkly sensations they experience in satsang. In addition to these good feelings in the present combined with the growing faith in Maharaji and the anticipation of a supreme experience to follow, there are other peripheral rewards. These include the sense of community and common purpose, or even the naughty pleasure of letting one's gaze dwell on the face a particularly attractive blissed-out sister (or brother - depending on your gender or preference) as they share satsang. You soon come to enjoy both hearing the message and appreciating the messenger. (The messenger, of course, was always Maharaji - even when he was speaking through whichever brother or sister was in the satsang chair.) Bog-standard psychology, really. The mellow twinkliness has nothing to do with Maharaji, of course. Hypnotic subjects will report similar experiences - as will the devotees of many modern gurus. There was a fascinating TV program recently featuring the followers of Ashokohara (the Japanese nerve-gas-in-the-subway cult). Their leader was in prison for mass murder, yet the devotees were still loyal. They still owed the guy their undying love and gratitude for what he had shown them inside. But I would be very surprised if exactly the same conditioning factors were not also present in the Ashokohara movement as in the DLM/EV trip, or that the thing inside they had been 'given' wasn't pretty much the same as Maharaji's 'gift'. But what would happen if you tried to unravel the whole satsang package and tried to isolate whatever it takes to elicit 'that experience'? Find out which, if any, factors are necessary. Does there even need to be a 'giver', for example? Back in 1986, Maharaji announced to his UK initiators that he was going to write a book. (I've been meaning to raise this on the forum for ages, but keep forgetting about it. Perhaps Mr Ex or Jean Michel remember something about this.) I heard it from a brand new initiator just back from his initiator initiation ceremony with the Lard himself. He was quite excited about the book thing. (What on earth would Maharaji have put in it? His poetry? Transcripts of his satsangs? Would he be able to write a grammatical sentence? What would he call it - 'My Life as a Superior Power in Person: Part II - The Wilderness Years..?' I guess we'll never know...) But it made me think about the various components that make up the satsang/program/festival experience. If the experience lay merely in understanding Maharaji's words, then why go to the trouble of organising events of any kind? He could freely distribute his written teachings in books and pamphlets, or even via the net. Far smaller cost and potentially far greater readership. I remember seeing deaf premies at festivals. It was never suggested that not being able to hear Maharaji's words would in any way diminish their experience. Similarly blind premies: being able to focus upon the Divine Form was apparently also unnecessary. Being in the Master's physical presence from time to time used to be considered an unmissable component of one's devotions, but what with the ongoing shift towards mail-order watch-at-home videos and satellite feeds even the 'darshan factor' seems to be going down the golden pan. So it seems each of the satsang components is unnecessary apart from the message itself. But then, weren't/aren't we always told that the experience of satsang doesn't lie in the words? (Just as well, really, since the most of the words have changed beyond recognition: from 'eternal liberation' to 'no afterlife' in less than ten years, for example.) No, satsang was the experience behind the words, whatever that means; it is simply an experience of the heart. Yet, strangely, none of the meditation techniques involve focussing on the heart, do they? Which appears to eliminate everything except devotion. A premie's addiction comes not from the techniques nor the message, but from from a carefully cultivated, idiotic love for a funny little vainglorious man with messianic delusions whose feet they would grovel before and kiss with no self-respect whatsoever. Whose garden they will weed and whose houses and aeroplanes they will build or refurbish without payment. Whose onscenely luxurious lifestyle they will finance with donations they can barely afford. And yet who consider themselves supremely blessed to be given such priceless opportunities for self-abasement. I'm so fucking glad to be out of it. That's all I wanted to say really... Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, May 29, 1999 at 09:41:52 (EDT)
From: Helen Email: None To: Nigel Subject: Cultivating a devotee Message: Great post Nigel. Said so well. I do think devotion is the main point, no matter how it's packaged today. Service=devotion, satsang= singing his praises, meditation=connecting with the giver, ie Maharaji. All advertised to result in a feeling of bliss until you get up close to M and realize what a slimeball of a human being he is! Then you re-evaluate the package, where did that bliss come from? Maybe he isn't the giver, maybe it was just conditioning. As the telletubbies would say: Uh-oh. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, May 29, 1999 at 10:07:15 (EDT)
From: Helen Email: None To: Nigel Subject: Cultivating a devotee Message: When you think about it, this 'guru as mirror' thing was really destructive. We were conditioned not to trust our instincts, that survival oriented part of us that said 'run, run like the wind, fool!' We were conditioned to believe there was no such thing as objective reality. This really damaged our ability to judge, discriminate, everything became one big blob of mush in our thought-deprived brains! We became ethically deficient, which really robbed us of our human-ness if you think about it. Now I know, in black and white terms, that M is a slimeball because objective reality tells me so. He lives an obscene lifestyle through fleecing people, and he is the leader of a cult that is destructive to people. I can say that now without any doubt. But I remember when I hemmed and hawed when people asked about his lifestyle, and would parrot all the stuff about how he's not attached to any of it, and he just plays with all that stuff etc. I guess since we thought he was divine, that this was plausible to our muddled brains, but now I think 'my God, he's so transparent! It's so obvious! Only a brainwashed person would believe this rot!' It's so obvious to anyone outside of the cult how much of a sleezeball he is. Which also reminds me of the fact that he has got to be very contemptuous of his premies that they fall for his shit!!!!! Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, May 29, 1999 at 21:11:43 (EDT)
From: TD Email: None To: Helen Subject: Cultivating a devotee Message: When you think about it, this 'guru as mirror' thing was really destructive. We were conditioned not to trust our instincts, that survival oriented part of us that said 'run, run like the wind, fool!' We were conditioned to believe there was no such thing as objective reality. This really damaged our ability to judge, discriminate, everything became one big blob of mush in our thought-deprived brains! We became ethically deficient, which really robbed us of our human-ness if you think about it. Brilliantly put Helen! As both you and Nigel have said, that decisive moment in time where due to either a lapse in judgement/free-will or say a convincing argument by an influential premie we trusted, we abandoned our own initial gut-instinct beliefs and thoughts about Maharaji and thus crossed the border into full-on total acceptance cult-land. We could no longer trust or rely on our thoughts, as they were seens as 'doubts' and in premiedom, doubts are seen as 'thieves of the heart' as the Big M so succinctly likes to describe them as. And by getting ourselves into this kind of pathetic state, that's when we start to do and believe things that we normally would never have done, and certainly wouldn't do now. I mean look at something like 'darshan'. If I had been told before I became a premie that premies kissed M's tootsies I would have run a mile (and M and premies would never talk about this at an introductory event!). As an ex-premie and with my own thoughts and viewpoints back on board, I'm equally repulsed by the fact that I kissed his tootsies, but as a premie and with a cult-mind, I felt it was an honour and yet another gift to do so. Y'know, I see us doing things like darshan, not to mention all the other things that premies end up doing because of Maharaji (abandoning careers/neglecting family and children/propogating premie bullshit/fulfilling M's pedantic extravagant requests) as similar to say the Chinese during the Cultural Revolution doing things as absurd as pulling out all the flowers and grass because Mao Tse-tung told them to do so and justified it by saying that they were a symbol of the bourgeoisie and ruling class's lifestyle and ideas. Actually recently I've read a bit more on Chairman Mao (one of my many hobbies, along with making sand-filled alarm clock souvenirs and dressing up in medieval gear and jousting with friends) and it's quite spooky, but there are so many parallels with Mao's style of manipulation and somebody like Maharaji's. Did you know that they referred to Mao Tse-Tung's Thought as a demon-exposing mirror as well? That by his sheer status, he had the power to reflect back the evils of the Chinese person who doubted him (used in some horrific torture scenarios). Not to mention the intelligentsia and free-thought seen as a problem, Mao elevating himself through propoganda and brutal oppression to being seen as a divine figure (OK, Maharaji might not have used physical violence, but he used the mind-fucking kind which IMHO is pretty bleeding bad!), not to mention things like the Mao badges, the kind of wacky reasoning and quotes in the Little Red Book and all the songs sung. Here's a sample of one of the Red Guard's songs which does have a resonance with devotional songs like Arti: Piercingly staring at the clouds and the sky Our longing hearts burning with anxiety When Chairman Mao enters Tiananmen Square Even mountains and rivers rejoice. To have seen the Great Teacher Chairman Mao, is the fulfillment of our brightest wish. Ah! . . . How many nights did we dream of you, ah Burning tears of happiness keep running down . . . Longed for day by day Hoped for year by year, ah Today we're at your side. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, May 29, 1999 at 22:05:04 (EDT)
From: Helen Email: None To: TD Subject: Mao and Maharaji Message: That is chilling indeed, TD!!! The two do seem to parallel one another VERY well. Thanks for that post. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, May 29, 1999 at 10:16:13 (EDT)
From: Gail Email: None To: Nigel Subject: Cultivating a devotee Message: Thank you. Your post is a keeper! Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sun, May 30, 1999 at 01:48:25 (EDT)
From: Fred Email: None To: Redbird & all Subject: Flying Carpet Syndrome Message: What worried and confused me was the haphazardness of it all. Some premies seem to land on their feet managing to do enough 'service' to keep their minds from going crazy while the majority of premies, lost to the world, are clinging on for dear life to the lotus feet on the magic carpet flying to nowhere - except maybe the bank. Fred Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, May 29, 1999 at 11:52:45 (EDT)
From: Sid Nigh Email: None To: Nigel Subject: Cultivating a devotee Message: No Nigel, its actually an expierience.But if you dont have it,well ,how would you know?Frustrating eh Nigel? Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, May 29, 1999 at 12:29:51 (EDT)
From: nigel Email: None To: catweasel in drag Subject: So speaks a CULTivated mind Message: No Nigel, its actually an expierience.But if you dont have it,well ,how would you know?Frustrating eh Nigel? Did you read my post, or simply not understand it? Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, May 29, 1999 at 12:35:41 (EDT)
From: Marianne Email: None To: nigel Subject: So speaks a CULTivated mind Message: Oh you Brits have such a dry wit! How you doing, Nigel? Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, May 29, 1999 at 14:01:03 (EDT)
From: nigel Email: nigel@redcrow.demon.co.uk To: Marianne Subject: So speaks a CULTivated mind Message: Things are just fine and dandy this side of the ocean, ma'am. Nice to see you around the forum again, Marianne. You take care now (as I believe is the common parlance in the colonies). Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, May 29, 1999 at 21:02:07 (EDT)
From: Sid Nigh Email: None To: nigel Subject: So speaks a CULTivated mind Message: It was just anoverload of postulating nonsense.You completely miss it. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, May 29, 1999 at 21:33:17 (EDT)
From: nigel Email: nigel@redcrow.demon.co.uk To: Sid Nigh Subject: Well spotted, sir... Message: Cripes, we posers don't stand a chance with hawkeyes like you about... Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, May 29, 1999 at 14:49:56 (EDT)
From: Jim Email: None To: Sid Nigh Subject: Excellent! (Nigel, not Sid) Message: No Nigel, its actually an expierience.But if you dont have it,well ,how would you know?Frustrating eh Nigel? Sid, You know, don't you, that the english language won't really let you do what you're doing? That is, trying to make the word 'experience' serve as an anti-thought shield. It doesn't work, that is, outside the canopy of the cult circus tent. That's just one reason why no premie can rationally discuss Maharaji. Really well put, by the way, Nigel. Thanks. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, May 29, 1999 at 16:28:35 (EDT)
From: cp Email: None To: Nigel Subject: Cultivating a devotee Message: Nigel me too . I think all that ! The fact that no techniques relate to the heart is near the core of it. My logic and experience shows that therefore the techniques drain the subtle capacities of the heart in time, leaving it with a capacity for limited simulted devotion. But alas, I wander into the vague world of intutive science. ( so dont quote me on that one) Liked your post cp Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sun, May 30, 1999 at 01:04:59 (EDT)
From: Liz Email: None To: Nigel Subject: Thanks Nigel Message: Hi Nigel, Who are the instructors in the U.K. these days? Regards, Liz Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sun, May 30, 1999 at 17:29:50 (EDT)
From: Robyn Email: sundogs@hotmail.com To: Nigel Subject: Cultivating a devotee Message: Dear Nigel, Just wanted you to know I read this and found it very good. I don't have time to read the whole thread unfourtunately but I did want to tell you I appreciated the thought and time it took to write and I found it a good read. I do just want to say that somehow I missed or never heard the message that the meditaion really came from/through M. I am eternally grateful for not paying attention or forgetting it though. Love, Robyn Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Tues, Jun 01, 1999 at 21:19:15 (EDT)
From: Gail Email: None To: Robyn Subject: The Simplicity of Empty Minds Message: MJ's glorifies the simplicity of the people in Nepal, Mauritius, India, and Africa. He doesn't tell them how great they are when he's there, but he tells us. The message to PWKs is 'be more simple and come empty.' Decades ago, I told Elliot Brye that it was difficult to think and function properly while trying to remember technique #3 (holy name). She said that K made her smarter (I wonder if she still thinks that. I haven't seen her in years). It was strange--that exercise to constantly erase yourself--but I kept at it. 'Let Maharaji paint your picture. dah dah dah ... beautiful dah dah dah ... experience infinity dah dah dah ... that beauty dah dah dah ... MJ's world dah dah dah See through the master's eyes. dah dah dah Maybe you aren't ready for ABC. dah dah dah You don't know what this life is for!' SIZE=6 COLOR=PURPLE Sure I do, MJ--buying Vision products on my MasterCard, Visa, and AmEx cards. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Tues, Jun 01, 1999 at 09:05:16 (EDT)
From: RT Email: omm To: Nigel Subject: I prefer Yogurt Culture Message: N, excellant post! Am sending to EV and Visions and others. RT Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, May 28, 1999 at 23:08:01 (EDT)
From: fabfeb Email: fabfeb@airmail.net To: Everyone Subject: children of premies Message: My daughter's father is a premie and I am very concerned about her welfare. We have been divorced for a year and he took her to her first program recently during a weekend of visitation. She is only six years old and has a strong relationship with each parent. I would like to know if anyone can tell me the effects of exposure to this cult on children. I am desperate for information, so that I can better proceed in the struggle to protect my child from involvement. Any non-premie or ex-premie parents, please respond! Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, May 28, 1999 at 23:11:50 (EDT)
From: fabfeb Email: fabfeb@airmail.net To: Everyone Subject: children of premies (addendum) Message: Please respond by e-mail. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, May 28, 1999 at 23:24:59 (EDT)
From: Gail Email: None To: fabfeb Subject: children of premies Message: No one is immune to the effects of brainwashing. Your daughter would probably be suceptible to the group high. Many young children get swept up by their parents. I met a young boy about 8 or 9 who had been given K. The boy's mother was totally addicted to following MJ around the world (a real gopi for sure). MJ claims he makes people wait until they are 18, but he makes exceptions. The child was doing service with the rest of us at about 23:30. This is hardly a normal life for such a young person. Ask your husband not to expose your daughter to this belief system. I would suggest that you get an injunction to protect her, if he doesnt wish to comply. The adult children of premies, whom I know, view MJ as a cult leader. They are embarrassed by their parents' involvement. Luckily, by 1982, MJ decided it would be better to ban children from all cult activities, so they were not exposed to much. As of about six years ago, in Amaroo, he started brainwashing children again (get 'em while they're young). Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, May 29, 1999 at 00:00:26 (EDT)
From: cp Email: None To: mom Subject: children of premies Message: If you hve to agree on the type of schooling she goes to and what religion if any she is raised in as part of a visitation arrangement, then it follows that religious or cult events constitute religious instruction. The court must see this thing as a cult I hope. It seems that you should be able to block him from allowing her to watch videos at home too. I know relatives who think they are somehow planting a seed of devotion if they put a video on while the nephew is visiting. They say the young ones LIKE it. Thats their justification. They also like to eat at KFC. There may be studies you can cite that illustrate the effects of cult exposure on children in order to support your arguement. If you check the archives there was quite a few references in the last few months. One of the others on the forum may have a grip on all that. Good Luck Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, May 29, 1999 at 04:12:51 (EDT)
From: Catweasel Email: Naughty Girl To: Gail Subject: children of premies Message: Dont tell exaggerated porky Pies Gail,it will come back to haunt you no matter what your motivation. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, May 29, 1999 at 01:44:31 (EDT)
From: Red Bird Email: None To: fabfeb Subject: children of premies Message: Hello fabfeb, Is your daughter's father current on his child support payments? If he is then he probably gets to choose where he can take her on weekends. Be cautious and don't hesitate to go back to court if it appears the cult is affecting the child in a negative manner. RR Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, May 29, 1999 at 04:07:34 (EDT)
From: Catweasel Email: No emotive Nonsense To: fabfeb Subject: childrenof PeoplewithKnowledge Message: It is not a cult.Children under the age of 8 years are generally not admitted to events,either local video events or major events with a speaker .This is contrary to what you may read here.There is a responsible organization with normal protocols you would find if you attend any similar event aimed at Adult attendees.This will bring howls of derision from those self styled experts who post here .It is nethertheless fact. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, May 29, 1999 at 07:00:18 (EDT)
From: nigel Email: nigel@redcrow.demon.co.uk To: Catweasel Subject: Maharaji's eloquent spokesman. Message: Over and over you accuse the ex-premies of lying. But when challenged you can't identify a single lie, can you? When asked to clarify anything at all - such as your claim that Maharaji has admitted many mistakes - your only recourse is to call the challenger a 'moron' or 'boring'. And you've nothing to say but he same thing over and over again: 'You guys is just losers .You coulda quit any time. Get a life ,low IQ's da lot of you. You'r times coming soon... watch out... im wasting my cat time talking to you guys .It isnt a cult. You're website is a cult.I know the truth.I don't go to videos. I don't believe the rubbish .I don't give money I just meditate when I want to and the experience is reel. You guys is just losers .You coulda quit any time. Get a life ,low IQ's da lot of you. You'r times coming soon... watch out... im wasting my cat time talking to you guys .It isnt a cult. You're website is a cult.I know the truth.I don't go to videos. I don't believe the rubbish .I don't give money I just meditate when I want to and the experience is reel. You guys is just losers .You coulda quit any time. Get a life ,low IQ's da lot of you. You'r times coming soon... watch out... im wasting my cat time talking to you guys .It isnt a cult. You're website is a cult.I know the truth.I don't go to videos. I don't believe the rubbish .I don't give money I just meditate when I want to and the experience is reel. You guys is just losers .You coulda quit any time. Get a life ,low IQ's da lot of you. You'r times coming soon... watch out... im wasting my cat time talking to you guys .It isnt a cult. You're website is a cult.I know the truth.I don't go to videos. I don't believe the rubbish .I don't give money I just meditate when I want to and the experience is reel. You guys is just losers .You coulda quit any time. Get a life ,low IQ's da lot of you. You'r times coming soon... watch out... im wasting my cat time talking to you guys .It isnt a cult. You're website is a cult.I know the truth.I don't go to videos. I don't believe the rubbish .I don't give money I just meditate when I want to and the experience is reel....' Maybe you are not the only glue-sniffing premie shit-stirrer to grace these pages, Cat, but you are the most ridiculous. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, May 29, 1999 at 08:23:12 (EDT)
From: Catweasel Email: None To: nigel Subject: no,just me stating the facts. Message: Fact is fact.Nothing more to be said. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, May 29, 1999 at 11:21:52 (EDT)
From: nigel Email: nigel@redcrow.demon.co.uk To: Catweasel Subject: And the fact that you are... Message: ...still a sad toe-kisser is your problem, not mine. But couldn't you practise your devotions elsewhere, please? Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, May 29, 1999 at 11:54:24 (EDT)
From: Catweasel Email: None To: nigel Subject: Blame Jim Message: No Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, May 29, 1999 at 09:13:20 (EDT)
From: Red Bird Email: None To: Fabfeb Subject: childrenof PeoplewithKnowledge Message: Hi Fabfeb There's your answer fabfeb. Your daughter has to be at least 9. Still if dad skips out on child support it's a lot easier to collect inter-state wise these days. RR Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, May 29, 1999 at 09:23:50 (EDT)
From: Helen Email: None To: Catweasel Subject: childrenof PeoplewithKnowledge Message: Even if 'protocols' are followed, the premie influence is still around this child. This parent is concerned about it, because she no longer thinks that that is a good thing for people. I would be concerned too, I would not want premie adults giving my kid satsang; kids are vulnerable at different phases of their lives and the promises made about M and knowledge are too good to be true. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, May 29, 1999 at 09:35:35 (EDT)
From: Red Bird Email: None To: Helen Subject: childrenof PeoplewithKnowledge Message: Helen, I completely agree with you concerning the influences. However, the law is set up in most states that non-custodial parents have the right to see their children and interact with them as they see fit. The only control a custodial parent would have is if the father/mother was part of the non-profit cult and sliding out of child support payments using non profit status as an excuse for non payment. Hopefully, M or those around him have dealt with the pedophile problem. This is probably the most dangerous situation to a young girl. Other than that, I'm sure the child would be bored and through the 'wisdom' of their eyes see m as a man that sells cups with birds on them. I can't imagine a teenager hanging around. Can you? I think they'd do a 'Wadi Sue' number and exit stage left. RR Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, May 29, 1999 at 09:54:38 (EDT)
From: Helen Email: None To: Red Bird Subject: childrenof PeoplewithKnowledge Message: It depends on how vulnerable the child/teenager is. If they are feeling desperate, they might want the promised high of knowledge and M. It also depends upon how much the child wants to please the premie parent. If the premie parent is the non-custodial parent, the child may want to get more involved with knowledge as a way to connect with that parent. Children of divorce often want to go live with the non-custodial parent when they hit their teens because thay simply want more time with that parent and want to connect. If the child has a good sense of self and trusts his or her own instincts, has goals and has a good head on his/her shoulders about how goals are achieved (ie. through hard work, not magic), and can separate emotion from logical thought, I would say the child will be able to resist the conditioning and see it for what it is. I would urge premie/ex-premie divorced parents not to let the M issue become a battleground (unless the child is in serious danger)! It gives it too much power and after all, the M trip is all about POWER, robbing people's sense of personal power. This is my professional opinion! Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sun, May 30, 1999 at 01:30:47 (EDT)
From: Fred Email: None To: Red Bird Subject: Wadi Sue Message: Dear Redbird, Wadi Sue didn't exit stage left other than when she sang 'Get up and Dance' to her ol' dad. She has recently put together a video advertising the glories of Visions International with lots of 'oohs' & 'arrs' from premies. A very mediocre sales-pitch video that reminded me of Amway. Fred Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sun, May 30, 1999 at 08:42:02 (EDT)
From: Gail Email: None To: Fred Subject: Wadi Sue works for Visions Message: According to Chris Price, Premlata and Daya work at visions. They help to edit the videos. Chris said this to me when I complained that the videos from the last few years might be using subliminal or hypnotic techniques. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sun, May 30, 1999 at 20:01:27 (EDT)
From: Gerry Email: None To: Gail Subject: Ah, Gail, my favourite hobby Message: horse! I think there is a strong possibility they are using high tech subliminal and hypnotic material in their videos, but I can't say for sure. It's just a guess. It would be interesting to have some videos examined by experts. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, May 29, 1999 at 08:01:23 (EDT)
From: I think you have made Email: None To: fabfeb Subject: a mistake with your e-mail Message: address, F. I have tried to write you three times to no avail. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, May 28, 1999 at 21:56:46 (EDT)
From: Jim Email: None To: Everyone Subject: Why I love being an ex Message: The best thing is the humour: Dear Maharaji We thank you for the beautiful gift that it has been to be able to participate in the preparations for Mar del Plata Our opportunity to contribute to this wonderful event was to make the stage curtains. And we are very, very thankful for this chance to renew this feeling of being closer to you. We need to see you and fill our hearts with love. Hasmad, Lilia, Rogerio, Marilei, Carlos Conceição, Fernando Bermudez, Neuza, Marli, Waldir, Cida, Margaret e Pepa (from ELK, 'Expressions') Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, May 28, 1999 at 22:38:02 (EDT)
From: Marianne Email: None To: Jim Subject: Filled with sadness Message: Jim: I had a completely different reaction to the post from the premies. I have never read or posted on any of the premie sites. I left years and years ago and have no desire to read satsang or to banter with premies. If others choose to do so, it's a free world, mostly. Reading this post reminded me of the feeling of unrequited love I felt for GMJ when I lived in the ashram or as an active community premie. I put everything into DLM and Maharaj Ji. What I got in return came from premie friends, not from M. M. did not know and did not care what little contributions (like curtains) I made to his endeavor. These people do have something valuable to give, but sadly do not realize that the recipient could care less. Where's those monthly donations from your checking account, by the way, curtain makers? Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, May 29, 1999 at 20:21:47 (EDT)
From: Jim Email: None To: Marianne Subject: Tragicomic? Message: Marianne, I hear you loud and clear. You have to admit, though, that this cult, like all of them, is as funny as it's weird as it's scary as it's sad. They're all like that, I think. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, May 29, 1999 at 21:57:46 (EDT)
From: Marianne Email: None To: Jim Subject: Pathetic Message: Yes, tragicomic and also pathetic. The idea that people are still doing service to this guy when he's such a charlatan is very disturbing. It's all take, take, take. If only they knew the history.... He doesn't care about the curtains. He just wants good ol' US $$$$$$. It reminds me of when I came into some money after my father died. I had left the ashram but was a very devoted community premie. Somehow, Arthur Brigham, who was then in LA, got word that I had come into some money. It wasn't a vast amount, but it was my college money, probably the most important thing my parents ever wanted to give me. He called me up and wanted me to donate it to M. I told him I wanted to think about it for a couple of days. 'Why?????' he asked incredulously. Then I asked if I could bring the money to M if I decided to give it. 'Why would you want to do that?' Arthur demanded. Of course, I wrongly figured that M might be interested in meeting me briefly, if only to say THANK YOU to a premie who was giving up a sizable chunk of money for her Lord's desires. Well, Arthur told me that would never be possible, and who was I anyway to want to impose myself on M. Reason, no MIND, prevailed, and I kept the cash. And it helped pay to educate me to become a lawyer who can taunt M on the internet!! The story had a happy ending. I wish the folks in Argentina could have such a happy ending. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sun, May 30, 1999 at 00:06:42 (EDT)
From: Red Bird Email: None To: Marianne Subject: Pathetic Message: Hi Marianne, I for one am grateful your Irish Sensibility kicked in and you kept the money;-) Rawat and his minions had a talent for sniffing out inheritances and trust funds. Initiator Rosie L. forked some of hers over. Wonder if the 'Instructorship' was a reward? M also collected paper weights back then too. Odd the things that come back to us. Luv ya, RB Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sun, May 30, 1999 at 01:38:17 (EDT)
From: Fred Email: None To: Red Bird Subject: Rosie L Message: Is Rosie L from the U.K. Is she still an Instructor? I knew quite a few people who gave their inheritanced to m. One gets to help back stage and the other who gave a house or two wonders around the U.K. on drugs looking very lost by all accounts. Fred Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Tues, Jun 01, 1999 at 21:50:34 (EDT)
From: Gail Email: None To: Red Bird Subject: Winston Churchill's Ashtray Message: Someone sent it to MJ. He said that he keeps it in his safe. I guess it's too valuable to butt his cigarettes in. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Mon, May 31, 1999 at 01:34:34 (EDT)
From: spartakus Email: na To: Marianne Subject: money Message: during a program in rome, 1982 or1983. I hade the 'honor' to do service, in the money room .in the palaccio de la sport rome. in the end of the program, we hade to transport the total amount,( between 1 to 1 and ahalf milion us $) that was taken in maney differnt currencys. the money was given to abunch of german premies, staying in afancy resort, on the hills ssrrounding rome by the way, the monney was packed into empty shoe boxes, stuffed in huge tote bag, as far as i know the money was never deposited . this story have much more juicy details not for cyber space!!!! Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, May 29, 1999 at 23:57:16 (EDT)
From: Mary M Email: None To: Jim Subject: Why I love being an ex Message: Eeesshhh, This is right up there with Premlata's custom Barbie Doll Outfits 'divine service'. Mare Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, May 28, 1999 at 21:28:39 (EDT)
From: Marianne Email: None To: Everyone Subject: Our favorite scandals Message: I see from reports below that premies are getting together to watch videos and then logging on to this site sometimes. I figured that this topic would get someone's attention. Tell me your favorite DLM (Divine Light Mission for those of you who only know Maharaji's organization as Elan Vital) scandal. While this incident has been discussed many times here, I'm going to repeat it for the neophytes. Please add your own. In the summer of 1973, all the premies were abuzz with preparations for Millenium '73 (yes, way back in 1973 we were talking about the Millenium). It was the celebration of Hans Jayanti in November that was held at the Houston Astrodome. By the way, the Astrodome was supposed to take off with all of us in it, according to premie lore at the time. I am sorry to say I believed it. Maharaji's family, especially his brother Bal Bhgwan Ji put out information like that. But, I digress.... Guru Maharaj Ji was touring the country to strike up publicity for the event and the premies were busy selling off family heirlooms (which we now deeply regret, as did our parents who usually did not know til the loss of the important item was discovered) in order to pay for this magnificent event. I lived in Kalamazoo, Michigan at the time. The premies managed to convince the Mayor of Detroit to give Maharaj Ji the key to the city. I went to see Maharaj Ji receive the key, along with about 30 other premies. It was a public event. There were 3 people sitting right in the front row with a huge box of flowers that they were holding. No one knew them, but they told all the premies who were sitting around them that they wanted to give the flowers to Maharaj Ji. 'How nice,' we all said. Maharaj Ji came into the room to receive the key. As he walked up to the Mayor, the flower guy jumped up and smacked Maharaj Ji right in the face with a pie. Pie guy and pals ran out in the confusion that followed. My friends who were the WPC (the misnamed World Peace Corps --- in other words, security) were horrified because they allowed M. to get pied. They thought lightning was going to strike them or something. A few days later, Mahatma Fakiranand and a premie from the Detroit ashram found the pie guy --- a journalist for an underground Detroit paper, of whom the Detroit police were none too fond. Fakiranand got him to meet with the 2 of them on the pretext that he, Fakiranand was going to give up the meditation techniques because he had had a falling out with M. They told pie guy, 'Here's the light,' and smashed his head with a hammer. Pie guy was seriously injured, but did not die. Fakiranand was secreted out of Detroit and the US by premies. The Detroit police did not look too hard for anyone to arrest because they did not like pie guy or his radical hippie newspaper which exposed police corruption. And I wondered, 'What did hitting someone in the head with a hammer have to do with inner peace?' Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, May 28, 1999 at 21:35:20 (EDT)
From: Jim Email: None To: Marianne Subject: Maharaji directed traffic Message: Marianne, As I mentioned before here, Mike Donner, former president of DLM and Maharaji's one-time close friend, told me last summer that Maharaji personally directed him to take Fakiranand from Detroit to Chicago and to make arrangements to fly him out of the country rather than face the music. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, May 28, 1999 at 21:39:22 (EDT)
From: Marianne Email: None To: Jim Subject: Important fact Message: Jim: Thanks for adding that critical piece of information. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, May 29, 1999 at 06:34:00 (EDT)
From: nigel Email: nigel@redcrow.demon.co.uk To: Marianne Subject: And less we forget... Message: The pie-man, Pat Haley (or Halley) had his skull broken. He never fully recovered and died a year or two later. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sun, May 30, 1999 at 02:36:32 (EDT)
From: Roger E. Drek Email: None To: nigel Subject: Pat Halley is alive, I think Message: My informants tell me that Pat Halley is still alive. This link indicates that Pat Halley contributed to the book, Voices from the Underground: V1-Insider Histories of the Vietnam Era Underground Press published in 1993. My understanding is that as a result of Fakiranand's battery Mr. Halley has a metal plate in his head. Lot's of Peace, Love, and Understanding! From the Table of Contents is the following: Looking for Utopia Page 37 by Patrick Halley In August of 1973, Guru Maharaj Ji, the 15-year old 'perfect master, arrived in Detroit to inaugurate his 'Divine Light Mission'--a religious cult started in India--and to receive the key to the city. The local press hailed him as a messenger of peace and brotherhood. His disciples hailed him as the new 'God.' Only Detroit's Fifth Estate concluded that he was a hustler and a fraud. In this appendix to Bob Hippler's history of the Fifth Estate, Patrick Halley tells, for the first time, how he infiltrated the 'Divine Light Mission' and pied the perfect master from 15 feet, and about the steel plate he wears in his head as a reminder. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sun, May 30, 1999 at 10:07:35 (EDT)
From: Nim Email: None To: Roger E. Drek Subject: Think again Drek, ole pal Message: My informants tell me that Pat Halley died three or four years ago of natural causes. And I believe my informants are better than yours. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sun, May 30, 1999 at 13:00:52 (EDT)
From: Gail Email: None To: Nim Subject: Are you ever going to speak Message: to me again? I'd be willing to give you my first born in exchange for a conversation (just kidding, I wouldn't do that to you). Is it another woman? Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sun, May 30, 1999 at 14:48:45 (EDT)
From: Roger E. Drek Email: None To: Nim Subject: Think again Drek, ole pal Message: Ok, that might be true. I merely showed that he might have been alive circa 1993 and did not die a year or two after the attack. I've seen several versions about Pat Halley and I'm just interested in presenting the facts as best as I can. One problem with the web is that there is too much unsubtantiated information flying around. Maybe your informants are better than mine? Where did you hear that, Nim? Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sun, May 30, 1999 at 17:47:12 (EDT)
From: Nim Email: None To: Roger E. Drek Subject: Think again Drek, ole pal Message: Actually I have to make a small correction. Pat Halley died circa 1994-95, not of natural causes as I mentioned before, but in a car accident. This was told to me by Ann Johnston sometime during 1996. Oh, and Ann made a point of emphasizing that the car accident was not related in anyway to his 'divinely' incurred head injury. Alright so she didn't use the word 'divinely'...I'm just throwing it in...but you can bet that's what she thinks. Even more interesting, ANN was the house mother at the Detroit ashram to where MJ returned immediately after being 'pied' by Pat Halley. Now have I got a story for you ... but first a shower, dinner and I'll get back to you. Later Rog. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sun, May 30, 1999 at 18:46:57 (EDT)
From: Marianne Email: None To: Nim Subject: Think again Drek, ole pal Message: Nim: Then Ann knew me, at least vaguely, and I knew her. What ashram did she live in in Detroit? Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sun, May 30, 1999 at 21:34:29 (EDT)
From: Fred Email: None To: Nim Subject: Think again Drek, ole pal Message: Hurry up Nim, Old Boy, Shower, Dine, we wait with baited breath to hear your scandalous tale. Best Regards, Fred Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sun, May 30, 1999 at 22:07:37 (EDT)
From: Roger E. Drek Email: None To: Fred Subject: Nim, we wait with baited breat Message: Nim, Well, that pretty much clears up the Pat Halley story. Sounds good to me. Ok, I need a good story. Something to look forward to. Thanks! Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sun, May 30, 1999 at 23:22:18 (EDT)
From: Nim Email: None To: Roger E. Drek Subject: Wait no more guys! Message: Alright. As told to me by Ann Johnston. That day when MJ was pied by Pat Halley, there was a press conference scheduled at the ashram following the reception where he was going to receive his civic award or key to the city. Ann had been busy preparing these hand made signs that said 'press' on them to be placed on the back of the chairs for the media people and one 'special' sign for MJ's chair that of course said 'Guru Maharaj Ji ' on it. Now the people in the ashram who had been waiting for MJ to return from the reception had heard about him being pied, even before he returned home. According to Ann, Fakiranand upon hearing the news 'cowered in a corner of the room like a little boy...and began trembling.' Then MJ returned. According to Ann he was totally enraged. He stormed into the ashram and upon noticing the signs Ann had made for the chairs saying 'press', he proceeded to rip them all off, and shouted out 'No more Media!' MJ then noticed Fakiranand cowering in the corner of the room, and according to Ann, he spoke the following words to him: 'I don't want you to hurt this man' End of story. You guys of course know the rest. But the thing I want to share with you is this. When Ann told me this story(in 1996) I had this 'gut' feeling that there was something wrong with it. That she wasn't telling the truth, and moreover she may be hiding some dark, long held secret. I couldn't figure it out. What was wrong with Ann's goddamn story?! And then one day when I was driving in the car, it came to me. Here's Mj returning after being pied. The little 15 year old pisher is in a rage, so much so that he storms into the Ashram, rips off signs, shouts out 'no more media'...and then calmly, in English, says to Fakiranand 'I don't want you to hurt this man.' Two things. In the early days I have great difficulty remembering MJ speak to the mahatmas in English. He seemed to always speak to them in Hindi. Secondly, for those of you who speak a second language, and have the kind of grip on it that MJ had with his English then...it is extremely difficult to slip into your second language when you're that angry, but not that fluent. I just have a hard time believing Ann's story. Somehow I envisage M in that moment, shouting out something in Hindi, blaming the whole pie incident on his mahatmas who failed to protect him or something like that...and thereby setting Fakiranand off. To this day, and especially after hearing Ann's defence of Mj, I believe that he not only directed traffic after the fact, but that in his irresponsible little pisher ways, he incited Fakiranand to commit the crime. And thats the story guys. I hope I didn't disappoint. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sun, May 30, 1999 at 23:45:38 (EDT)
From: Fred Email: None To: Nim Subject: Great Story! Message: Great story! Anne Johnson - What is this lady's problem - do you know? Any ideas? Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Mon, May 31, 1999 at 02:23:24 (EDT)
From: Roger E. Drek Email: None To: Nim Subject: Great! ***Best*** Message: Wow! Gotta really wonder what it would have been like to have been at the ashram when Maharaji arrived. If only we could tap the akachic (sp) record and get that on video tape. Yes, Maharaji's english was pretty bad at the time and your guess at slipping into Hindi is quite viable. Lot's of forgiveness in Maharaji's world. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, May 29, 1999 at 06:28:17 (EDT)
From: Jean-Michel Email: None To: Marianne Subject: Favorite? Message: Mine, and obviously quite some others is the story of that Indian person who's been run over by one of the hired Indian buses taking premies from Delhi (Punjabi Bagh) to Prem Nagar. That happened in October/November 1972. None of the buses stopped, and the accident was totally ignored! Except for those sitting in the bus. They still remember, believe me. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Mon, May 31, 1999 at 00:09:34 (EDT)
From: Liz Email: None To: Mary Subject: Honeymoon dillie scandal Message: Any luck with the honeymooner archives? Don't mean to rush you but I'm excited. Liz Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Mon, May 31, 1999 at 11:01:00 (EDT)
From: Mary M Email: None To: Liz Subject: Honeymoon dillie scandal Message: Hey Liz, No luck on the honeymoon archive search... yet. I'm up to my neck in a fresh COMMEX & AMNEX door that opened. This Entity Relationship Diagram would need a rain forest of paper to set forth and explain. Luv, Mary Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, May 28, 1999 at 21:23:53 (EDT)
From: selene Email: None To: Ms. K Subject: HST and Leary. OT? not so fast Message: Ms. K for you do I face my fears : I hope this helps you and Biff or Bill or whoever. ==================== From Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas A SAVAGE JOURNEY TO THE HEART OF THE AMERICAN DREAM Copyright 1971 bt Hunter S Thompson - p. 178: ...That was the fatal flaw in Tim Leary's trip. He crashed around America selling 'conciousness expansion' without giving a thought to the grim meat-hook realities that were lying in wait for all the people who took him seriously. After West Point and the Priesthood, LSD must have seemed entirely logical to him ....but there is not much satisfaction in knowing that he blew it very badly for himself, because he took too many others down with him. Not that they didn't deserve it: No doubt they all Got What Was Coming To Them. All those pathetically eager acid freaks who thought they could buy Peace and Understanding for three bucks a hit. But their loss and failure is ours, too. What Leary took down with him was the central illusion of a whole life-style that he helped to create... a generation of permanent cripples, failed seekers, who never understood the essential old-mystic fallacy of the Acid Culture: the desperate assumption that somebody - or at least some force - is tending that Light at the end of the tunnel =====end quote==== sorry bolding is mine italics his, couldn't resist If you need more lets email, don't wantto push my luck. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, May 28, 1999 at 21:44:48 (EDT)
From: Marianne Email: None To: selene Subject: Not OT to me Message: Hey Selene! Great quote. HST has always had a way of putting things in perspective, hasn't he? Didn't he ever riff on GMJ during the early '70's, both their salad days? Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, May 28, 1999 at 21:55:52 (EDT)
From: selene Email: None To: Marianne Subject: Not OT to me Message: actually spent some tme in Aspen during those days. Dont' remember him 'riffing' on M but he was drunk a lot and said a LOT. And it made sense to me. Now is that scary? course i was drunk too. so there ya go Thanks Marianne Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Mon, May 31, 1999 at 03:20:05 (EDT)
From: x-0-x Email: no To: selene Subject: Not OT to me Message: He was not into M, he did give, (bring in person to the prison on a visit), to his daughter who was in prison a book about a Guru Maharaj Ji, not necessarily the, 'M, (here)', I was their, she asked me if I believed in a, Guru Maharaj Ji or words to that effect, to make a long story short I said, no. It was a most profound moment! I think T.L. has contributed very much in the big picture, to moving We The People ahead. Much more than most. I am a 1st./new/x, here, just happened to scan, see this by chance, do not mean to be a ------ I am not sure what I mean. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Mon, May 31, 1999 at 13:45:44 (EDT)
From: selene Email: None To: x-0-x Subject: Not OT to me Message: well I can't reassure you since I don't know whata a ---- is :) just kidding, you are not being that. whatever it is Welcome. Is the the you meant Hunter or Leary, the one who gave the book, etc. I am assuming Leary. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Tues, Jun 01, 1999 at 04:11:22 (EDT)
From: x-0-x Email: no thank you To: selene Subject: Not OT to me Message: Timothy Leary gave that book to his daughter in prison, who less then a year later, was reported to have committed suicide in her jail cell. Tim, kept an open mind, most of the time, right up to the night he died. He did not say anything in regard to my answer to his daughters question, and he could have since we were about shoulder to shoulder, looking through the glass and talking to his daughter on the other side in Prison. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sun, May 30, 1999 at 02:01:26 (EDT)
From: Fred Email: None To: Marianne Subject: Susie Bai Message: Hi Marianne, Does anyone know what happened to Susie Bai? Fred Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sun, May 30, 1999 at 17:07:38 (EDT)
From: Marianne Email: None To: Fred Subject: Susie Bai Message: Hi Fred. Susie Bai --- the first western Mahatma. I liked her. It was the only nod to women having authority in the whole thing. I have no idea. Maybe others do. You are new. When were you involved and where, if you want to tell. Welcome to the Forum, and thanks for your contributions! Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sun, May 30, 1999 at 21:32:15 (EDT)
From: Katie Email: None To: Fred Subject: Susie Bai Message: Hi Fred - I enquired about Susie Bai on here once, and someone said that she was happily living in LA & not involved with M anymore. By the way, I always really liked Susie Bai, and was glad to hear that she was doing well. She lived in the DC ashram before and after I received knowledge (late Fall '72) and she was very kind to me. Take care, Katie Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, May 29, 1999 at 00:54:24 (EDT)
From: Katie Email: mishkat@gateway.net To: selene Subject: Not OT to me either Message: Thanks very much, Selene. I don't think it's OT at all - it pretty much sums up the whole reason I got into Maharaji in the first place. Especially: the essential old-mystic fallacy of the Acid Culture: the desperate assumption that somebody - or at least some force - is tending that light at the end of the tunnel. What can I say except 'sheesh'! Love, Katie P.S. BTW, it's Biff (a.k.a. bftb). Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, May 29, 1999 at 01:13:58 (EDT)
From: Selene Email: None To: Katie Subject: Not OT to me either Message: Thankyou Katie. I read that book in the early 80's Had this sweet 24 year old male 'friend', we were helping me thru divorce wars - oh well another story for later; but he LOVED HST. And he gave me every book and they were such a welcome, intelligent but insane welcome, from the premie not happenings. And yet so tied into it all. ( I still think mild psycho active drugs in the right setting would be nice but I can't find that. ) selene - moved to the west to find Jim Morrison found a computing carreer - ///// oh well Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, May 29, 1999 at 01:47:08 (EDT)
From: cp Email: None To: Selene Subject: Not OT to me either Message: This quote comes very close to NDE. Are you saying that you do or dont believe that these experiences are for real? It seems that the light at the end of the tunnel is a common experience for alot of people who have NDE. And they come from all walks of life and none are into cults or even meditaion. Some are bonafide atheists but do acknowledge that there is a presence in the light or the light has a consciousness to it. Thats what M has tried to monopolize on, bu putting his label on it. And one of his main crimes in my opinoin. Anybody experience this tunnel and light while close to death? cp Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, May 29, 1999 at 08:46:06 (EDT)
From: Helen Email: None To: cp Subject: NDEs Message: A lot of scientists believe that NDEs are brain activity, the brain comforting the self, so to speak, at the time of death. But it does seem like a lot of folks have these experiences, and a lot of folks leave their bodies and look down at what's going on and are able to report verbatim what was said at the scene of their accident, in the hospital, etc. I sort of had a NDE when I almost hemorraged to death, I sure had some kind of experience. I woke up sobbing and holding the nurses' hand and saying 'I love the lord so much' . It wasn't as is I had a beautific look on my face, I was freaked and crying. Of course it could have been a trauma reaction since my vitals went way down, and I my brain was probably freaked. SO it wasn't a real NDE probably was just a trauma reaction. Bobby had an NDE I think. ANyone else? I think the HST quote does really sum up where we were at in the 70s--we believed with childlike simplicity that someone was tending that light and that someone would be at the end of that light tunnel when we died. Hell, I didn't just believe this, I KNEW it to be true, and centered my whole life around it. I still hope that there is a creator who watches over us, I do hope that. My conception of God has changed though as I became more rational after leaving M. It's pretty funny that drugs and God were a total package back then. God = constantly being high. This was a lie that our whole generation got caught up in but it was probably inevitible. I know there are a lot of premies who put in a lot of time mediating and probably never took a drug in their lives, who weren't in it for instant gratification, but I sure was. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, May 29, 1999 at 14:12:28 (EDT)
From: Bobby Email: None To: Helen Subject: NDEs Message: Yeah I had an NDE back in 1969 followed by intense visionary experiences. I have stories about it on my site. Here's a a couple of links - a shorter version and a more extended autobiographical version. My Near-Death and Spiritual Visions A Spiritual Emergence Journey I've got a lot of updating to do on my story. The events of the past several years, including my recent bout with cancer that brought me pretty close to death, have had strong influences on my life story. My NDE and Visions are groundwork for a very personal spirituality. I continue to get a great deal of meaning and purpose out of the perceptual shifts I've experienced. I've also read a considerable amount of HST. I've enjoyed quite a bit of the reading and tend to agree with some of his politics but not his cosmology. Well, actually that bit about the being at the end of the tunnel is really appropos. It's real for me. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, May 29, 1999 at 17:02:52 (EDT)
From: cp Email: None To: Bobby Subject: NDEs Message: Bobby It is real for me too. My life is not the same after the experience. Twice. And it had nothing to do with M. There is no way I would ever label it as my brain making me feel good. Looking forward to the update cp Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, May 29, 1999 at 19:20:57 (EDT)
From: Selene Email: None To: responses to this quote Subject: NDEs yes all I agreee Message: That is it really. HST and what he was saying And NDE's don't have a lot to do with each other perhaps. I have had 2 almost deaths one from a drug overdose and one during a miscarriage that went REAL bad - I was alone, etc. During both I had the light / rushing tunnel thing. I don't feel qualified to define those experiences. I did see and feel the same things maybe twice in all the time Idid whatever technique it is now. HST was talking about something else, I think tho I don't know that for sure either. I think he just meant a generation of people were created who thought they could buy enlightenment, or get an expressway to it, or both. And that attitude was disasterous. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sun, May 30, 1999 at 22:10:18 (EDT)
From: Katie Email: mishkat@gateway.net To: Selene Subject: I agree with Selene Message: Hi Selene - you wrote: I think he just meant a generation of people were created who thought they could buy enlightenment, or get an expressway to it, or both. And that attitude was disastrous. I agree completely. The most destructive part for me is that I both believed that 'someone' was tending the light at the end of the tunnel, and that I KNEW who that person was. I still believe in the light at the end of the tunnel, but I'm not making any more assumptions about it until I get there. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sun, May 30, 1999 at 02:09:14 (EDT)
From: Liz Email: None To: Katie Subject: Not OT to me either Message: I agree. Turn on... Tune in... Drop out... relax and float downstream.. this is not dying... WAKE UP AND SMELL THE DAISIES! Liz Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, May 28, 1999 at 18:13:55 (EDT)
From: Are you Co-dependant Email: None To: Everyone Subject: on Maharaji-Take the Test Message: WHAT IS CODEPENDENCY? Author Unknown My good feelings about who I am stem from being liked by you. My good feelings about who I am stem from receiving approval from you. Your struggles affect MY serenity. MY mental attention focuses on solving YOUR problems or relieving YOUR pain. My mental attention is focused on PLEASING YOU. My mental attention is focused on PROTECTING YOU. My own hobbies and interests are put aside. My time is spent sharing YOUR interests and hobbies. YOUR clothing and personal appearance is dictated by my desires as I feel that YOU ARE A REFLECTION OF ME. YOUR behavior is dictated by my desires as I feel that YOU ARE A REFLECTION OF ME. I AM NOT AWARE OF HOW I FEEL. I am aware of how YOU feel. I am not aware of what I want. I ask what YOU want. IF I AM NOT AWARE I ASSUME. The dreams that I have for MY future are linked to YOU. My fear of rejection determines what I say or do. My fear of YOUR anger determines what I say or do. I use GIVING as a way of feeling safe in our relationship. My social circle diminishes as I involve myself with YOU. I put MY values aside in order to connect with YOU. I value YOUR opinion and way of doing things MORE THAN MY OWN. The quality of my life is in relation to the quality of yours. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, May 28, 1999 at 17:40:37 (EDT)
From: Rob's.. Email: None To: Everyone Subject: ..in the House. Message: How is everyone tonight? I see you've had another bonehead premie insulting you. Current and Future? Didn't last too long in the ring. Can't stay long, going out boogie-ing in a few. Any pressing issues happening? Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, May 28, 1999 at 17:58:21 (EDT)
From: Rob Email: None To: nobody Subject: 6 o'clock and all's well, Message: so I'm off out with the lads for a nippie sweetie and maybe a lap dance or three. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, May 28, 1999 at 18:21:52 (EDT)
From: Gail Email: None To: Rob Subject: Come on, Rob! This is video Message: night. You're blowing it! Oh, well, as MJ once said, 'If you can't experience K, you might as well climb a mountain and take your six-pack with you (or six bottles of congnac depending upon preference). Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, May 28, 1999 at 18:52:39 (EDT)
From: Mike Email: None To: Gail Subject: Come on, Rob! This is video Message: Gail: 'If you can't experience K, you might as well climb a mountain and take your six-pack with you' I just KNEW I was doing it right!!!!!! Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, May 28, 1999 at 21:18:48 (EDT)
From: Mary M Email: None To: Gail Subject: Come on, Rob! Message: Hi All, I think Rob is shadow dancing. Not much intrigue there. This Irish Lass likes the facts, albeit, I'll give some benefit of doubt... not too much. Fool me once, fock you. Fool me twice fock me. So careful lassies! Love, Mary m Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, May 28, 1999 at 21:33:37 (EDT)
From: Marianne Email: None To: Mary M Subject: Come on, Mary! (OT) Message: Now do you fock yourself 2x there you sassy Irish lassie? How you doing there, Mary girl? My hearing is almost over. There's only 1 day left. The prosecutors got caught hiding evidence from me that they were supposed to disclose months ago, so I think they're about to get a paddling from the federal judge. God, I'm exhausted. But I do say g'night to S. Bernadette each and every night! Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, May 28, 1999 at 21:52:27 (EDT)
From: Mary M Email: None To: Marianne Subject: Come on, Mary! (OT) Message: ;-) Why lass, I can fock me self anytime I want to! Glad you trial is almost over. Where to they paddle the judges? My Bridgette and you're Bernadette will have to get together. Luv to you, Mary focking Magdalene Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, May 28, 1999 at 21:57:31 (EDT)
From: Marianne Email: None To: Mary M Subject: PENANCE!!!! WAY OT Message: Well, now you've taken that sainted Mary Magdelene's name in vain. I'd say that calls for you to make several ghee balls and sing three arti's in your birthday suit outside wherever they're showing videos tonight of the Lord of the Universe. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, May 28, 1999 at 22:41:46 (EDT)
From: Mary M Email: None To: Marianne Subject: PENANCE!!!! WAY OT Message: Oh, Oh... I'm out of cotton balls and clarified butter. (Now a true act of rebellion would have been to use a 59 cent candle from Walmart;-) Arti.... sure I can sing RT'S (Dire Straits - MTV)! I like Father John's penance much more. 27 years since my last confession and he only gave me 1 Hail Mary! Boy did I get off easy. Luv Ya, Mary the Magdelene at least for this evening! Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, May 28, 1999 at 19:05:43 (EDT)
From: Robyn Email: sundogs@hotmail.com To: Rob Subject: 6 o'clock and all's well, Message: Dear Rob, Well am I glad I read your 2nd post before I replied or I may have sounded like I was interested in a lap dance!! :) I have been really wanting to go out dancing lately but there isn't much choice in countrybumpkinville and I hate the smoke at bars. It seems belly dancing doesn't cut it in replacing rock and roll! :) Have fun, be safe. Love, Robyn Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, May 28, 1999 at 19:41:56 (EDT)
From: Ron Email: None To: Rob Subject: 6 o'clock and all's well, Message: Wow, a loner who goes out with the lads, you are something, a very great person. We await with abated breath for your next message of ... of 'why can't we just get along', or is it? 'let the debate begin!' Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, May 28, 1999 at 19:56:25 (EDT)
From: gerry Email: None To: Ron Subject: 6 o'clock and all's well, Message: Wow, a loner who goes out with the lads, you are something, a very great person. We await with abated breath for your next message of ... of 'why can't we just get along', or is it? 'let the debate begin!' My feelings exactly, Ron. Here we have another poser trying to confuse fence sitters such as Liz, back into the fold. If I read her post right, she's now ''practising Knowlege, writing a check to EV and reassessing her viewpoint re BM'' because of this asshole. Another arrogant cult shithead if you ask me. And fuck off to all you ladies gushing over this jerk. Look what he's done to Liz. I don't give a flying fuck if his ''feeling'' get hurt because he ''such a nice guy,'' he pisses me off. In fact, he's sleazier and certainly more dangerous than Catfuckweasel, because of his thin veneer of well mannered so-called reasonableness. He's a cult member. He wants other people to be down in the hole he's in. He makes me puke. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, May 28, 1999 at 20:47:53 (EDT)
From: Marianne Email: MarianneDB@aol.com To: Liz Subject: LIZ -- IS THIS TRUE? Message: Liz: I've been out of the loop recently because of my court hearing. What's going on with you? How are you doing? Gerry says you're back in the fold. Tell me what you're thinking. You can email me if you want. If you want to post, go ahead. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sun, May 30, 1999 at 02:33:12 (EDT)
From: Fence-sitter Email: None To: Marianne Subject: Fence-sitting Message: I have e-mailed you. It's half past midnight. I should go to bed. Liz Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, May 28, 1999 at 20:54:39 (EDT)
From: cp Email: None To: gerry Subject: 6 o'clock and all's well, Message: but its just the scottish accent. Kind of like Sean Connery Didnt he say he has a mother in law? To me that equates to hes married. Here in New York do lads go a'lapdancing when the mother inlaw/wife is in the sidelines? I must get out this weekend and check it out. Do you think Liz is so naive as to get swayed by his polite manners and level thinking? Enough to go back to writing out checks again? Wasnt she kidding? Gerry, you can be just as polite as he is. Be aware that we have not seen him in a nasty mood. He is bieng gentlemanly just as you would in a new environement We cant hold that against him. We should try to focus on the diologe . No amount of smooth talk can erase years of exploitation as far as most of us are concerned Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, May 28, 1999 at 21:25:42 (EDT)
From: Gerry Email: None To: cp Subject: 6 o'clock and all's well, Message: Hi cp, geez, I hope you are right about Liz, but if you read that thread (near the bottom) it sure sounds like she is serious. Maybe not, though. It won't be the first time I've been wrong... Talk is what got us in the cult in the first place, and yes, I do think smooth talking could sway someone who is on the fence back into the cult precisely because the years and years of cult programming and brainwashing. I don't like his messing with people's minds when they are vulnerable, like Liz appears to be. I don't really care about dialog with this guy. He's as slick as the cover of ''And It is Divine.'' You know what I'd do if one of these smooth bastards started making inroads into peoples minds like this sleaze bag is trying to do? That's right, I'd cut him off at the knees. This forum is NOT a democracy and we really don't have to allow insidious programming to harm already damaged and vulnerable people who come here to break the bondage of BM's shitty little cult. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, May 28, 1999 at 21:57:07 (EDT)
From: Mary M Email: None To: Gerry Subject: Do'na worry bout th Rrrobert Message: Alo Gerry, Now doncha be worrien about the lasses. We've enough Irish on this site that know how to deal wi a man tha wears a kilt from time to time;-) Aye, the puddin was bland. We'll be gatherin our pots and pans for all out assault should anythin happen to our Lizzie. Luv, Mary Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sun, May 30, 1999 at 02:37:38 (EDT)
From: Lizzie Email: None To: Mary M Subject: Do'na worry bout th Rrrobert Message: Thankee Mary. Lizzie Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, May 28, 1999 at 20:56:20 (EDT)
From: Nim Email: None To: gerry Subject: Excellently stated, gerry!(nt) Message: nt Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, May 28, 1999 at 20:57:39 (EDT)
From: Ron Email: None To: gerry Subject: 6 o'clock and all's well, Message: I wonder if he has any opinion on Maharaji, if ask you my opinion his so-called premie status is just a mask. He can avoid discussing M which will avoid discussing his one-with-universe or some other personal half baked theory. He hopes his cheeky comments about M and premies will gain respect here and he can take us on a magical mystery tour of his beloved philosophy. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, May 28, 1999 at 22:48:16 (EDT)
From: Robyn Email: sundogs@hotmail.com To: gerry Subject: Liz, Gerry, Ron Message: Dear Gerry & Ron, God, I have to stop reading here. It is to hard not reading it all. At first I thought Rob was a premie, then an ex now you say he is confusing Liz. Dear Liz, Please don't get sucked back in. That would be so sad. I know I bitch about the fighting ect here but shit, M is a fraud. You can do K without him if you get something out of it, you can do it 5 or 10 min a day, you are in charge. You are your OWN woman. This really makes me sad. You deserve more that the superfical existance and check writing that is part of the cult. Love, Robyn Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, May 29, 1999 at 00:58:52 (EDT)
From: Ron Email: None To: Robyn Subject: Robyn Message: I could go out on a limb and build my tree of opinions but, I'll let who Bob is shake out on its own, an it will, if he continues to post. Being an ex-premie is not all roses even with support, but we can take back our lives. If one has lost faith and can't take back his life, would he be undeserving of the tittle ex-premie? Yes/no or huh? Makes no sense, black and white, premie and ex-premie, also a lot of grey. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, May 29, 1999 at 01:24:26 (EDT)
From: Robyn Email: sundogs@hotmail.com To: Ron Subject: Robyn Message: Dear Ron, Hi, I see so many new names here tonight, it is great but confusion for me also. I loved that phrase, 'I could go out on a limb and build my tree of opinions'. I just thought it was plainly stated someplace and I missed it, yes most things in life are grey. I have been an ex for 20 years and there is NO fear of my getting back into it but I do still do the meditation, the techniques I want to do when and how I want to do them so I guess that is a little grey right there, eh? From posts I've read here there are lots who have lost faith but can not take their lives back or it takes them years to get through that process. I don't think I've seen you post before, are you in that grey area yourself or a die hard ex? Either way welcome and enjoy. Love, Robyn Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sun, May 30, 1999 at 02:44:04 (EDT)
From: Liz Email: None To: Robyn Subject: Liz, Gerry, Ron Message: Thanks for your concern, I still 'think' I need to go to see the videos to be able to practice. In truth I know this isn't true but it is reality for me at the present. I wish I could fill my life with exciting things so I wouldn't have the time or inclination to go. Liz Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sun, May 30, 1999 at 12:49:06 (EDT)
From: Gail Email: freedom@gtn.net To: Liz Subject: Liz, keep in touch--why not Message: I still 'think' I need to go to see the videos to be able to practice. In truth I know this isn't true but it is reality for me at the present. I wish I could fill my life with exciting things so I wouldn't have the time or inclination to go. There is nothing wrong with staying active. See if there is something there for you. Just stay crispy, that's all. Really listen to what he says. Personally, I think I needed to go to the videos two or three times a week to reinforce the programming. I associated feeling bliss, high, and mindless with MJ and his words. I always have gotten rushes and 'blissed out (cringe)' at the school auditoriums where I teach. When the kids have done a good job, and everyone is focused, it is really high. I jabbed this girl who was sitting beside me and asked her if she was getting rushes from the show. She looked at me like I was crazy and then admitted she was. It's a human phenomenon called the collective high. By associating this natural high with MJ we have learned to turn on that bliss by a thought of MJ, a video, a song, travelling to see him, kissing his feet, dancing with him, etc. Good grief. We have taken a natural experience and learned to manipulate it; it's a good thing we learned that. You've got to get something for your money. I don't know how you found this site, but it can help to discern fact from fiction. There is no need to quit cold turkey (you got involved by sticking one toe in at first) or even quit at all; there is a need for making an informed choice. I lost your e-mail. Feel free to contact me. Luv, Gail Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sun, May 30, 1999 at 17:25:46 (EDT)
From: Robyn Email: sundogs@hotmail.com To: Liz Subject: Liz, Gerry, Ron Message: Dear Liz, Well if it is excitement you want you could take on my life. Plumbing is not only NOT working but exploding all over the place. Pretty exciting I guess but I think I'd rather be peacful and not catotonic which is I'm sure what would happen if I went to a video of M! Shit, uh pun not intended but it is where my thoughts are today, I still meditate but NEVER thought it was M 'giving' me the experience! I was so fortunate to never get that message, don't know if no one mentioned it around me or I missed it or just spaced it out, either is very possible! :) I hope you can get to where you don't feel the need to go to the damn things anymore dear. There are lots who meditate just fine with out any connection to M at all. It is true and it can be for you also. Love, Robyn Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, May 29, 1999 at 05:18:59 (EDT)
From: Catweasel Email: Elementary my dear Watson To: gerry Subject: 6 o'clock Gerry's in hell!!!! Message: Good cop, Bad cop huh Gerry?God your slick.Dont know how we stay in front of you EINSTEIN.But we do!Perhaps because your the only one competing. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, May 29, 1999 at 09:20:41 (EDT)
From: AHA! Email: None To: Catweasel Subject: cat in hell Message: It is NOT a mind game weas, YOU are responsible for alerting the Queensland community about herr rawat. Your involvement here has paid off for your lord in spades. You should be proud of your self oh great devotee. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, May 29, 1999 at 11:08:16 (EDT)
From: Gail Email: None To: AHA! Subject: I'm not sure, but I think Message: Catweasel is an American. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, May 29, 1999 at 12:56:23 (EDT)
From: maybe but resides Email: None To: Gail Subject: here abouts Message: (message deleted by Katie) Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, May 29, 1999 at 13:57:34 (EDT)
From: Errrfff Email: None To: maybe but resides Subject: here abouts Message: I'm getting catsicus. Anyone know a homeopathic cure? E Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, May 29, 1999 at 14:54:24 (EDT)
From: restrain Email: None To: Errrfff Subject: thy mouse click(nt) Message: xyz Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sun, May 30, 1999 at 05:41:08 (EDT)
From: Curious Email: None To: maybe but resides Subject: here abouts Message: I'm a bit uneasy about this. I presume that's the address of CW's server. Does it stop there, or can you go even further, and how do you do it? Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sun, May 30, 1999 at 08:05:18 (EDT)
From: cp Email: None To: Curious Subject: here abouts Message: Uneasy is putting it mildly. I'm shocked to see this . Whats the explanation?? Pain in the neck that he (catfeeble) is, I thought that it was a pact that everyone was protected from that information going out. Barney! did you do that? Whats it say in the manual? Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Mon, May 31, 1999 at 10:29:14 (EDT)
From: Curious Email: None To: cp Subject: here abouts Message: I'm pretty sure I know the dastardly culprit, but am not sure of the ethicalness of telling, but the first letter of his first name rhymes with C. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sun, May 30, 1999 at 10:06:18 (EDT)
From: Catweasel Email: None To: Curious Subject: here abouts Message: I wouldnt expect any better.What Hypocrisy!Now you Know what your dealing with.That's why I have arranged a very wide loop.One rule for you 'specials' and one for everyone else?SOUNDS LIKE WHAT YOU CLAIM HAS BEEN YOUR LOT! Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sun, May 30, 1999 at 13:12:54 (EDT)
From: EV Security Email: None To: Catweasel Subject: here abouts Message: Mr Catweasel, I believe we must meet before you are allowed to attend another event. We will attempt to contact you after Maharaji has accepted an invitation from AU. thankyou Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sun, May 30, 1999 at 22:57:08 (EDT)
From: Catweasel Email: None To: EV Security Subject: Piss Off Fool Message: Like you worry me? Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sun, May 30, 1999 at 23:07:47 (EDT)
From: EVS Email: None To: Catweasel Subject: Piss Off Fool Message: i bet a few muscles tightned up and yer grabed air for a moment. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Mon, May 31, 1999 at 03:33:29 (EDT)
From: Catweasel Email: None To: EVS Subject: Piss Off Fool Message: Hardly Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sun, May 30, 1999 at 13:09:47 (EDT)
From: Gail Email: None To: Curious Subject: Don't worry about a thing! Message: Once I phone Brian to find out where Orlando was posting from. (S)he was particularily vicious with me, and I wanted to know the whereabouts of this poster. Brian said that just as I was protected, Orlando was protected. Your secrets are safe. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sun, May 30, 1999 at 19:49:36 (EDT)
From: cp Email: None To: Curious Subject: Curious! Message: Is this bieng looked into? Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sun, May 30, 1999 at 22:04:48 (EDT)
From: Katie Email: mishkat@gateway.net To: Curious Subject: ID information and reassurance Message: I deleted the info given for Catweasel. Whoever posted it should be warned: do it again, and I'll ask Barney to block you. I'd like to reassure everyone who posts here that we encrypt all information given by your server. I cannot give specific details on this, but PLEASE do not worry about being identified by posting here. I have checked the premie forum (run by CD) and the Internet Provider encryption there is simple letter/number substitution, so I suspect that that's where 'whoever' got Catweasel's IP (once you have the IP number, there's a program which will tell you the address of the IP). By the way, it really makes me angry that someone would post personal information about a forum user on the forum. I'm sorry that this happened, Catweasel. Take care all - Katie Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sun, May 30, 1999 at 22:40:48 (EDT)
From: Mary M Email: None To: Katie Subject: ID information and reassurance Message: Hey Katie, For the record, I was 'Errrfff'. No clue who 'maybe but resides' is. And, heeded the 'restrain' to 'Errrfff' post. My apology to cat also. Mary M Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Mon, May 31, 1999 at 02:49:01 (EDT)
From: barney Email: None To: Katie Subject: ID information and reassurance Message: Indeed, the IP addresses which are sent by your browser to every server you ever visit, including the ex-premie.org server. These addresses can be traced to your Internet Service Provider (ISP) and there might be information as to the city in which your ISP resides. Additionally, there are utilities to FINGER your account and your ISP might have your name and email name in that information. You might want to contact your ISP to remove such personal information. I recently did just that on one of my accounts. For the record, as Katie mentioned, the IP addresses that ex-premie.org receives are encrypted in the remote possibility that someone hacks the site. This is quite remote since we have done everything possible to lock out intruders. Additionally, at ex-premie.org we consider your IP address to be private and will not reveal such information. However, be forewarned that in the event of any criminal activities we will contact the appropriate law enforcement agencies and provide them with that information. Finally and an important warning to anyone posting on CD's Premies and Friends chatroom on Paradise, the IP address that was posted here most likely came from the Premies and Friends chatroom where such information is freely available. So, if you are concerned about not revealing your IP then I strongly suggest that you avoid posting at the Premies and Friends chatroom. Return to Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Mon, May 31, 1999 at 10:26:52 (EDT)
From: Mary M Email: None To: barney Subject: ID information and reassurance Message: Hey Barney, Didn't know that about the premies and friends room. HA HA I went there a few times and their virtual world shuts down. Maybe I ought to go to programs and their il-logical world would shut down;-) So if anybody wants to have fun in the premie chat room you should borrow my ip. Love, Mare Return to Index -:- Top of Index |