Forum V: Archive
Compiled: Wed, Jul 19, 2000 at 22:07:26 (GMT)
From: Jul 07, 2000 To: Jul 17, 2000 Page: 2 Of: 5


Pauline Premie -:- Well, That Shows You..... -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 00:32:17 (GMT)
__ Ex Forever -:- Maybe Maharaji himself doesn't know he's in ... -:- Thurs, Jul 13, 2000 at 07:28:24 (GMT)
__ chr -:- Well, That Shows You..... -:- Thurs, Jul 13, 2000 at 06:01:41 (GMT)
__ Donny Devotee -:- Well, That Shows You..... -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 13:18:24 (GMT)
__ __ Pauline Premie -:- Well, That Shows You..... -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 21:17:23 (GMT)
__ __ __ SB -:- Pauline: Here is a TRUE story that applies to that -:- Thurs, Jul 13, 2000 at 02:46:39 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ VP -:- Pauline: Here is a TRUE story that applies to that -:- Thurs, Jul 13, 2000 at 03:38:33 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ SB -:- Imagine: Elan Vital says I followed for 25 years -:- Thurs, Jul 13, 2000 at 07:07:34 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ Jim -:- SB, I forgot -:- Thurs, Jul 13, 2000 at 16:08:16 (GMT)
__ Tonette -:- If this is a premie - -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 03:58:07 (GMT)
__ __ Pauline Premie -:- If this is a premie - -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 21:12:01 (GMT)
__ __ VP -:- If this is a premie - -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 19:36:05 (GMT)
__ __ __ Joe -:- You exes think everything is a joke. -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 21:21:55 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ VP -:- I'll be sorry then? -:- Thurs, Jul 13, 2000 at 01:51:18 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Pauline Premie -:- That above post was by ME... -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 21:25:51 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Donny Devotee -:- I knew it! -:- Thurs, Jul 13, 2000 at 00:08:36 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ Joe -:- I Beg Your Pardon.... -:- Thurs, Jul 13, 2000 at 16:13:56 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ SB -:- Well, you are wrong-lol-I tell you that -:- Thurs, Jul 13, 2000 at 08:34:10 (GMT)
__ __ Ruphus -:- If this is a premie - -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 07:09:10 (GMT)
__ __ __ Tonette -:- Maybe you should go -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 07:47:15 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Ruphus -:- Maybe you should go -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 08:18:02 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ hamzen -:- You mean, like all premies, you're po-faced (nt) -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 21:25:25 (GMT)
__ SB -:- Thank You Pauline, I'm crying...... -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 01:55:41 (GMT)
__ Simon Satsang -:- Well, That Shows You..... -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 01:09:20 (GMT)
__ Ruphus -:- Well, That Shows us Foum thinks -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 00:42:36 (GMT)
__ __ Nigel -:- Well, That Shows us Foum thinks -:- Thurs, Jul 13, 2000 at 02:36:08 (GMT)
__ __ Ben Lurking -:- Well, That Shows us Foum thinks -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 02:05:38 (GMT)
__ __ Pauline Premie -:- Well, That Shows us Foum thinks -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 01:04:27 (GMT)
__ __ __ Ruphus -:- Well, That Shows us Foum thinks -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 01:16:52 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Jim -:- Ever try to joke with a cult member? -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 01:24:59 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Ruphus -:- Ever try to joke with a cult member? -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 01:36:10 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ SB: Who rufus, WHO??? -:- tell me please rufus......hackers? -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 03:48:41 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ Jim -:- Ever try to joke with a cult member? -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 01:43:51 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ Ruphus -:- Ever try to joke with a cult member? -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 01:59:48 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Simon Satsang -:- Ever try to joke with a cult member? -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 11:59:05 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Ruphus -:- Ever try to joke with a cult member? -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 12:15:17 (GMT)

Coach -:- Sodium Silicate!? -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 00:04:40 (GMT)
__ VP -:- At least they are honest -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 19:55:03 (GMT)
__ __ Salam -:- At least they are honest -:- Sat, Jul 15, 2000 at 02:34:07 (GMT)
__ Salam -:- Sodium Silicate and computer networks too. -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 17:23:18 (GMT)
__ Sir Dave -:- It's oh so cheap and tacky -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 12:02:34 (GMT)
__ Selene -:- Sodium Silicate!? hA!! Looks like an illegal -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 05:52:34 (GMT)
__ Tonette -:- Like they say - -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 04:09:54 (GMT)
__ __ Jim -:- Let me be the first to say 'That's not racist!' -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 04:49:35 (GMT)
__ Elaine -:- Sodium Silicate!? -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 00:17:19 (GMT)
__ __ It's probably Satpal's -:- mob(nt) -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 00:35:47 (GMT)
__ __ __ cq -:- It IS a follower of Satpal (aka Bal Bhagwan Ji) -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 17:45:48 (GMT)

Rated-X -:- Deluding People -:- Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 16:10:30 (GMT)

Jethro -:- A phone call with Ron Geaves -:- Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 10:49:02 (GMT)
__ Marianne -:- Many thanks, Jethro -:- Sat, Jul 15, 2000 at 00:05:13 (GMT)
__ Susan -:- This goes into my reasons not to deal with them -:- Thurs, Jul 13, 2000 at 14:57:39 (GMT)
__ __ Jethro -:- They are all narcistic -:- Thurs, Jul 13, 2000 at 17:56:17 (GMT)
__ Joe -:- A Comment on the Side -:- Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 21:14:53 (GMT)
__ __ VP -:- It's like the old game 'telephone' -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 02:42:19 (GMT)
__ __ __ Ruphus -:- It's like the old game 'telephone' -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 07:05:40 (GMT)
__ VP -:- A phone call with Ron Geaves -:- Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 13:03:33 (GMT)
__ __ Jethro -:- A phone call with Ron Geaves -:- Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 13:11:03 (GMT)
__ __ __ Sir Dave -:- The most revealing thing -:- Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 23:58:03 (GMT)
__ __ __ AJW -:- Pariahs -:- Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 14:08:49 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ VP -:- Pariahs -:- Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 14:37:55 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Jethro -:- Pariahs -:- Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 14:35:37 (GMT)
__ Sir Dave -:- A phone call with Ron Geaves -:- Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 11:50:12 (GMT)
__ AJW -:- Rons very, very, very bad memory. -:- Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 11:10:41 (GMT)
__ __ Jethro -:- Oh I forgot to mention..... -:- Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 13:03:53 (GMT)
__ __ __ AJW -:- Oh I forgot to mention..... -:- Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 13:59:39 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Jethro -:- Oh I forgot to mention..... -:- Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 14:30:07 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Ruphus -:- Did you forget to mention..... -:- Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 23:08:52 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ AJW -:- For the record Ruphus -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 08:13:19 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ Ruphus -:- For the record Ruphus -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 08:30:12 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ AJW -:- Why don't you... -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 09:57:42 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Ruphus -:- Why I don't -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 10:21:21 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Jethro -:- Guilt by ommission -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 10:41:27 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Ruphus -:- Guilt by ommission -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 11:06:32 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ VP -:- Wrong again, Ruphus -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 20:23:38 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ AJW -:- What would you have done Rufus? -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 10:38:47 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Ruphus -:- What I would have done ? -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 11:15:39 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Jethro -:- Typical premie non-answer -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 14:11:47 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Ruphus -:- End of discussion. (nt) -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 12:34:44 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ AJW -:- Quite pathetic Ruphus. -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 13:28:19 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Susan -:- Rufus is Bjorn Again I think (nt) -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 15:41:45 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Jethro -:- Rufus is a real sicko -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 18:36:20 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Monmot -:- I Was Just Going To Suggest That Also -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 16:06:00 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ Joe -:- Did you forget to mention..... -:- Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 23:47:49 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ Ruphus -:- Did you forget to mention..... -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 00:23:49 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Joe -:- You are an idiot...... -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 00:40:34 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Ruphus -:- From one idiot to another..... -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 00:49:43 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Joe -:- You are even more of an idiot than I thought.... -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 21:06:57 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ Jethro -:- Did you forget to mention..... -:- Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 23:59:42 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Ruphus -:- Did you forget to mention..... -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 00:26:05 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Jethro -:- What are you talking about?nt -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 00:29:52 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Ruphus -:- What I am talking about -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 00:55:12 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Jethro -:- He did call me! nt -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 01:20:58 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ Jethro -:- So what is it that you care about 'Ruphus'?nt -:- Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 23:29:22 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Jim -:- You're lucky, Jethro -:- Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 16:05:03 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ Jethro -:- You're lucky, Jethro -:- Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 16:31:24 (GMT)

Premie on-looker -:- A few comments -:- Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 00:51:16 (GMT)
__ Salam -:- A few comments -:- Sat, Jul 15, 2000 at 18:10:51 (GMT)
__ An avid fan -:- Right on, Premiji! -:- Fri, Jul 14, 2000 at 04:51:08 (GMT)
__ Way -:- To Premie on-looker -:- Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 16:01:08 (GMT)
__ AJW -:- A few comments -:- Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 10:47:30 (GMT)
__ Mili -:- A few comments -:- Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 09:52:30 (GMT)
__ __ jajajaja SB jajajaja -:- That was a spanish laugh: hahahaha: english (nt) -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 01:59:18 (GMT)
__ __ Ben Lurking -:- A few comments -:- Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 23:13:00 (GMT)
__ __ Jim -:- That's a good one, Mili. You're hilarious -:- Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 15:51:56 (GMT)
__ __ VP -:- A few comments -:- Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 12:54:52 (GMT)
__ TD -:- A few comments -:- Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 05:38:26 (GMT)
__ P-man -:- A few comments -:- Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 04:36:06 (GMT)
__ __ Jim -:- P-man's concise travel cult test kit -:- Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 04:57:02 (GMT)
__ Joe -:- A few comments -:- Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 03:57:53 (GMT)
__ __ Daneane -:- 'Fear of contradiction' -:- Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 05:10:10 (GMT)
__ Jerry -:- A few comments -:- Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 02:12:58 (GMT)
__ Jim -:- Great! Like I need logic lessons from cultniks! -:- Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 01:55:49 (GMT)
__ Helen -:- you have no 'relationship' with maharaji -:- Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 01:41:31 (GMT)
__ __ PeterPaul -:- edited -:- Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 07:23:31 (GMT)
__ __ __ Jerry -:- This moron should go -:- Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 15:02:54 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Katie -:- This moron should go -:- Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 17:14:39 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Jerry -:- Well, shucks, Katie -:- Thurs, Jul 13, 2000 at 00:48:20 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Jim -:- Yes (but then I'm an easy vote to tap) -:- Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 16:09:46 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Jerry -:- Yes (but then I'm an easy vote to tap) -:- Thurs, Jul 13, 2000 at 00:44:56 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ JohnT -:- Yes... I agree -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 11:55:03 (GMT)
__ __ chr -:- you have no 'relationship' with maharaji -:- Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 06:30:36 (GMT)
__ __ __ Helen -:- you have no 'relationship' with maharaji -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 00:05:30 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Daneane -:- Yes,if it wasn't fer me,there would b no suckitude -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 02:28:17 (GMT)
__ Sir Dave -:- It's almost like telepathy, man -:- Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 01:26:13 (GMT)

PeterPaul -:- BE QUIET, BE STILL, BE REAL, OH MY -:- Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 00:21:21 (GMT)
__ G -:- BE QUIET -:- Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 03:49:36 (GMT)
__ Jerry -:- BE QUIET, BE STILL, BE REAL, OH MY -:- Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 02:37:31 (GMT)
__ __ VP -:- Jerry, I am laughing so hard--ot -:- Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 03:39:27 (GMT)
__ __ __ Jerry -:- Jerry, I am laughing so hard--ot -:- Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 14:48:42 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Robyn -:- Jerry, I am laughing so hard--ot -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 22:27:07 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Jerry -:- Jerry, I am laughing so hard--ot -:- Thurs, Jul 13, 2000 at 01:32:18 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ Robyn -:- Jerry, I am laughing so hard--ot -:- Thurs, Jul 13, 2000 at 18:14:09 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ cq -:- Yo Robyn, ... if nothing else, at least you can -:- Thurs, Jul 13, 2000 at 20:06:53 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Veep -:- Jerry, I am a fan -:- Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 18:22:59 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Jerry -:- Jerry, I am a fan -:- Thurs, Jul 13, 2000 at 01:35:11 (GMT)
__ Sir Dave -:- Why not worship the blood? -:- Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 01:01:39 (GMT)
__ __ Robyn -:- Why not worship the blood? -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 22:29:12 (GMT)
__ __ __ G -:- No go, eh? Maybe in France? -:- Thurs, Jul 13, 2000 at 02:07:48 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Robyn -:- No go, eh? Maybe in France? -:- Thurs, Jul 13, 2000 at 18:16:27 (GMT)
__ __ G -:- blood meditation -:- Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 04:03:36 (GMT)
__ __ __ Sir Dave -:- blood meditation -:- Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 12:37:12 (GMT)
__ Daneane -:- Humburg??? -:- Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 00:28:55 (GMT)
__ __ PeterPaul -:- Hamberg??? -:- Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 07:13:25 (GMT)
__ __ __ Daneane -:- Live and let live?? -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 00:07:25 (GMT)

Forum Administrator -:- Links from the Forum -:- Mon, Jul 10, 2000 at 20:35:04 (GMT)
__ Tonette -:- Roger's site-Please children -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 02:38:07 (GMT)
__ Roger eDrek -:- Sounds good to me. Besides... -:- Mon, Jul 10, 2000 at 23:41:52 (GMT)
__ __ Nigel -:- Bad time to do this, Rog -:- Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 10:45:18 (GMT)
__ __ __ Jim -:- I'm with Nigel on this one, Roger -:- Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 15:44:12 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Roger eDrek -:- Forget it! It is what it is. -:- Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 18:40:09 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Jim -:- Can we talk about this? -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 01:19:13 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ Roger eDrek -:- SHOW ME THE MONEY! (NT) -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 03:17:07 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ Jim -:- Shit, Roger, you haven't even seen my presentation -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 04:46:41 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Roger eDrek -:- Let me tell you about my operation -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 16:53:47 (GMT)
__ __ Tonette -:- Porn and unfortunately Roger' Site -:- Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 00:33:08 (GMT)
__ __ __ Roger eDrek -:- Yeah, I'm going to have to get a job now -:- Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 03:13:38 (GMT)
__ __ __ Sir Dave -:- Porn and unfortunately Roger' Site -:- Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 01:41:36 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Roger eDrek -:- Sue me! -:- Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 03:10:02 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Sir Dave -:- You're in big trouble now Roger -:- Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 00:19:32 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Daneane -:- Sue me! -:- Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 16:59:16 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ Roger eDrek -:- She's not my wife, she is my dominatrix (nt) -:- Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 20:41:03 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ chr -:- Sue me! -:- Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 06:40:55 (GMT)


Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 00:32:17 (GMT)
From: Pauline Premie
Email: None
To: Everyone
Subject: Well, That Shows You.....
Message:
By the grace of the Speaker, who is so caring to give his time, free of charge, to speak on behalf of a number of organizations, about that love, that truth, that gift, that love and that experience, I now have a blissful new place to live. So, by the grace of the master who is not and never said he was God, I am now crashing with a blissful married premie couple, Steve and Joan, and their four kids, Darshan, Satganga, and Devotion, who are in their 20s, and their 3-year-old girl, Gratitute. I am not supposed to be using their Internet service, but by the grace of he whom we should not judge by his successful lifestyle, they have jobs and aren't home.

Anyhow, I saw the new Elan Vital FAQs, and I think all you ex-premies must really feel put in your place by how masterful they are. What more explanation could you need than that? I'm just so blissed out that Elan Vital, to which I send $50 every month so they can more actively squealch these awful ex-premie websites, is now stating their support for free speech and speaking out and defending that love, that truth and that gift, from all you miserable, negative people who are so attached to the materialism of this world (so unlike Maharaji), and so negative.

I hope that he FAQs will help you and others have that understanding that all that stuff about Maharaji being God (which he never said he was), arti, feet-kissing, ashrams and all that stuff was just due to those confused Indian and Western premies, who literally forced he who says he is an ordinary person, to wear crowns and have people worship him.

And I know that if it weren't for the ashrams, thousands more people would have died in the drug culture. It's just so obvious how helpful they were in saving people, by the grace of the successful investor, and it's true, several state legislatures even recognized it. They really saw the gift of the ashram as what saved lives. God, you are such ingrates to not be thanking Maharaji for the wonderful thing he did for you, allowing you to live a celibate and drug-free life for all those years, without the complications of family, friendd, career and education. Now of course, there is no 'drug culture' and so the ashrams aren't necessary. Maharaji was just so smart and kind to close them when he did.

You ex-premies should get lives. I was thinking just that the other day, as I spent the afternoon writing poetry to be displayed on Enjoyinglife.com and when I was scrubbing the driveway of the Master's driveway with a toothbrush.

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Date: Thurs, Jul 13, 2000 at 07:28:24 (GMT)
From: Ex Forever
Email: None
To: Pauline Premie
Subject: Maybe Maharaji himself doesn't know he's in ...
Message:
a cult. Let's email him. I think that is IT: He doesn't know what a cult is. I have an idea. I'm going to send him something interesting I have: Few web pages about the Guru Papers. That will wake him up. I hope that he answers himself because I want to know from Maharaji himself what he thinks about The Guru Papers. After all, the importance of all, even that premies say their cult have the right to exist because if Evangelists preachers in TV perform fake miracles, why not Maharaji's Church Elan Vital? Yeah, but the guy at least says he heals in the name of God which is VERY different than Maharaji walking around us mortals, believing himself he is GOD. He is joking, playing around with people's heads and that is not right. That is what makes the Elan Vital Church NO ACCEPTABLE, especially to us, ex-cult members.

Is this a dream Pauline? God has HIS own Church NOW!! Alleluya!

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Date: Thurs, Jul 13, 2000 at 06:01:41 (GMT)
From: chr
Email: None
To: Pauline Premie
Subject: Well, That Shows You.....
Message:
Pauline, we need more of you here. I think you should email what you have written here to Elan Vital. Or even better, to ELK. Trouble is, they'll probably take it seriously.
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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 13:18:24 (GMT)
From: Donny Devotee
Email: None
To: Pauline Premie
Subject: Well, That Shows You.....
Message:
Pauline,

I am so sick of you trying to show how 'humble' you are by doing meaningless service like scrubbing His Most Humble Meditation Teacher's driveway with a toothbrush. Have you ever licked The Speaker's toilet bowl clean? That, my dear, is devotion. So stop coming here to brag about your devotion when everybody knows that you haven't begun to sink nearly low enough in your devotions, you phony baloney, you.

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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 21:17:23 (GMT)
From: Pauline Premie
Email: None
To: Donny Devotee
Subject: Well, That Shows You.....
Message:
Donny,

My dear brother, I can't even imagine the bliss I would feel if given the opportunity for participation by licking out the bowl of Maharaji's toilet, especially if it was a gold toilet. I have been praying for that for many years, but I have not yet been given that divine opportunity for participation by the grace of he who is the most beautiful holder of a pending patent, and is not, and never claimed to be, God.

But I also wanted to point out that I am not worthy to scrub the driveway of Maharaji's residence with a toothbrush, I can only scrub the DRIVEWAY of the DRIVEWAY of Maharaji's residence. Some day, by the grace of the eliminator of all confusing Hindu terms, I will be able to have the opportunity to have participation in the form of scrubbing the actual driveway. That will be blissful.

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Date: Thurs, Jul 13, 2000 at 02:46:39 (GMT)
From: SB
Email: None
To: Pauline Premie
Subject: Pauline: Here is a TRUE story that applies to that
Message:
What is the problem some exes have with Darshan and service, eh?

Here is a true story a premie told me today, as a response to my comments to him about what the bad exes are talking here about Maharaji and Jagdeo and how Elan Vital's statements are getting confusive, and how Maharaji didn't care about the jaw pain or teeth problems that 'person' talked about not long a go here. To the later he replied: Maharaji gives people many more important things than money, and I said: What about compassion? $2500 is like $10 to me, maybe $5. He stopped me. First he told me that Maharaji is not Elan Vital and that probably Maharaji is so busy doing other 'things' that maybe he haven't had time to look at the letters the exes wrote enquiring about Jagdeo. He said that I was in mind and that I needed to meditate more and watch more videos, and that I should avoid coming here to read garbage and lies that it was better to use my time in anything, doing service, but not to come here. Because Maharaji love his premies so, so much, we were never going to understand the 'things' he does. Because look at the experience I had, he said.

This premie went to the residence of Maharaji in Miami, on Alton's Road, to do service; a new pool for the Lord was been built. A group of premies did service most of the day, under the Florida sun, tired, and he said they didn't care because everyone-premies- were hoping to receive Darshan. But of course, that was too obvious and Maharaji sent Michael Donner to tell the premies to stop staring at windows, etc. and Donner added something like, you came to do service not to get darshan. I can't remember the exact word even that I tried to put attention to such a personal story: I wanted to hear it so, so bad...But oh, few minutes later...I am repeating all as he said it, the best I can: I wish I had a tape recorder. Joking.

I sat there and listen. The premie told me that is no way that Maharaji can be a mean person. You can't believe with the sweetness he walked and guided two of his little children. So much love and care, how Maharaji can be the person the exes want to portray? and you know what he did when he came out to show the pool to his children? He walked toward a utility room, a simple place, he said, and asked for a chair and gave us satsang for one hour, and that the whole satsang was about service: According to him, Maharaji said: Service for the for the living Master is the highest experience any human being can have.... his eyes were shinning and I noticed he was drooling too...My premie friend said that when M. said that, he understood why he was there.?? Maharaji also explained to this extra lucky servants, for free, that service is very especial and that if they came just to paint, go get a job as a painter, carpenter? same, etc, but that they were there to serve The Master and that they were the luckiest people in this world. Maharaji asked if anybody had questions and the painter asked: Can we have darshan? Maharaji replied: Aren't you having it? But, he is so, so full of mercy that he told them all to line up and allow all to kiss his feet and that you could stay there down all you wanted because nobody was removing the premies like in a formal darshan line. By the time he finished his story I began to cry for real, knowing that I couldn't say much to such a good honest devotee like he is. He has been my friend for 13 years...how can I tell him straight what I think? I'M NOT READY YET. I said that if he thinks I'm in my mind for having doubts, he should go to Elan Vital's site and read the lies himself AND SEE IF HE UNDERSTAND HOW OFFENDED i feel by M, because now he says he is not god anymore. Twenty five years believing something that is not true!! I have reasons to doubt, I said, and left, still crying.

The ultimate experience all you workers, is working for free for The Living Lord, Maharaji.

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Date: Thurs, Jul 13, 2000 at 03:38:33 (GMT)
From: VP
Email: None
To: SB
Subject: Pauline: Here is a TRUE story that applies to that
Message:
SB,
It is obvious that you are going through a lot right now working through your feelings. Be easy on yourself :)
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Date: Thurs, Jul 13, 2000 at 07:07:34 (GMT)
From: SB
Email: None
To: VP
Subject: Imagine: Elan Vital says I followed for 25 years
Message:
Guru Maharaji for what? It's very upsetting to me; it's very, very unjust of his part!

Who is Maharaji kidding, and the premies say that he is saying he never proclaimed to be God because look at what 'they' did to Jesus... So, for his devotees/premies he is still God when he says he isn't. Or: I can't question Maharaji for anything. We were encouraged en those day to go to the programs. I traveled to many different countries for him now to call me just a hippie. Not so fast Elan Vital/Maharaji. Expect mail from me soon. Aspirant Contact, follow the guidelines!! Hypocrats! It's a cult no matter how they want to present it. You bet I'm angry. Can I say that I forgive him? Absolutely not! It's just your mind the premie told me. How pathetic...Poor guy. He deprives himself of so many things, I know this for a fact, but sends money to Maharaji directly every month! That is an obvoius effect of brainwashing when he as a premie sees Maharaji so, so rich and pompous and egocentric and justifies it all, and forgets about himself. I was not that kind of premie. Now that I look back and 'compare' I didn't fit in. I had different interpretations about my rights, and Elan Vital got raid of me, through Judy Ollman, then, the national coordinator of the aspirant moronic deceiving process, I don't remember her title,: One of the most rudest ignorant people I ever spoke with, and in the same time is sad, because you know how she got to be like that. Cults are full of magic, you know? Sure, premies read this and they think we are in a campaign to 'dirty' Maharaji, as to say that we add the dirt and that it doesn't exist, all because of blind faith, the one he ask people to have for him. HE NEEDS TO WAKE UP!! He needs to let people go home, where they belong, not at his feet!! Now is the time for him to show compassion and to stop manipulating people.

Is his stupid idea that if some people like him is okay to play God behind close doors? Well, we know about the free labor he gets and how he exploits (?) people. If he gets a visit from authorities to enquire about he having slaves, what his excuse will be? This large group of friends dropped by to help do this and that around my mansion. LOL. My Family is Holy. My friends come from other countries because they are generous contributors to my mission to save the World and they like me so much they work for free and I don't even offer them a drink!! El chipo. Where is the straight jacket?

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Date: Thurs, Jul 13, 2000 at 16:08:16 (GMT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: SB
Subject: SB, I forgot
Message:
You wanted my phone number?

(250) 360-1040

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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 03:58:07 (GMT)
From: Tonette
Email: None
To: Pauline Premie
Subject: If this is a premie -
Message:
I rest my case. My GOD, what satire!!!! This is a joke, right? You guys have lost me. Is this a premie that believes Maharaji saved us from drugs? Otherwise we would all be dead? Get a life? This is a joke right? I am too naive and believe too much sometimes what is written here in the forum. This thread can't be for real because if it was written in earnest, then obviously we have the rantings of a schizophrenic. Surely the author does not believe what she said. If Pauline Premie believes what she wrote then she is brainwashed beyond maybe what this site can do for her.
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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 21:12:01 (GMT)
From: Pauline Premie
Email: None
To: Tonette
Subject: If this is a premie -
Message:
Of course I am a premie, I mean a student, and a PWK.

I KNOW that the ashrams saved many people from drug culture because the Elan Vital website (the new FAQs) say so, and they wouldn't lie. To doubt what they are saying at Elan Vital is to be following my mind instead of my heart, and that would make my internal vegetables rot. No way!

You ex-premies think all PWKs are brainwashed. We are not brainwashed, we just refuse to have doubts about Maharaji or knowledge, realize that anything that goes wrong is the fault of others besides Maharaji, that anything that does happen is 'perfect,' and whenever I am unhappy it is my own lack of THAT understanding that Maharaji so lovingly gives me, but I forget. No, I am not brainwashed. How could you even think that?

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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 19:36:05 (GMT)
From: VP
Email: None
To: Tonette
Subject: If this is a premie -
Message:
It's a joke, Tonette :)
VP
formerly most gullible on the forum--snicker
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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 21:21:55 (GMT)
From: Joe
Email: None
To: VP
Subject: You exes think everything is a joke.
Message:
Just wait until you are on your deathbed taking your last breath. I KNOW that it will be Maharaji, the greatest incarnation of the Speaker who graces the world by his presence, whom you will remember, and boy, will you be sorry then.
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Date: Thurs, Jul 13, 2000 at 01:51:18 (GMT)
From: VP
Email: None
To: Joe
Subject: I'll be sorry then?
Message:
I'm not holding my breath
Har har!
Breath...get it?!
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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 21:25:51 (GMT)
From: Pauline Premie
Email: None
To: Joe
Subject: That above post was by ME...
Message:
I can't believe that some ex has used my name.
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Date: Thurs, Jul 13, 2000 at 00:08:36 (GMT)
From: Donny Devotee
Email: None
To: Pauline Premie
Subject: I knew it!
Message:
Joe, eh? Like in JW, Joe? And all the time I thought it was Helen. But sooner or later you phony baloney exes all slip up. I knew it was an ex pretending to be a premie all along. A true premie would never use a toothbrush to scrub The Clear One's driveway's driveway. That's not sinking low enough. True premies use their fingernails to scrape the holy driveway. Nobody scrubs anything. Jeez, are you exes dumb. Boy oh boy!
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Date: Thurs, Jul 13, 2000 at 16:13:56 (GMT)
From: Joe
Email: None
To: Donny Devotee
Subject: I Beg Your Pardon....
Message:
Pauline Premie used MY name on one of her posts and should be blocked for doing that. I have nothing to do with her.
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Date: Thurs, Jul 13, 2000 at 08:34:10 (GMT)
From: SB
Email: None
To: Donny Devotee
Subject: Well, you are wrong-lol-I tell you that
Message:
mahariachi said in a not too lod program that 'he' keeps 'everthing' he owns like brand new. Everything?

What do you think? I think that 'somebody is doing 'some' scrubbing in the residence... and of course is not HIM!!

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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 07:09:10 (GMT)
From: Ruphus
Email: None
To: Tonette
Subject: If this is a premie -
Message:
Maybe you should check your brain cells.
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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 07:47:15 (GMT)
From: Tonette
Email: None
To: Dufus
Subject: Maybe you should go
Message:
give Maharji a blow job. It would subsitute for the experience that you are not having with your MASTER. Besides he commands it of you.
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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 08:18:02 (GMT)
From: Ruphus
Email: None
To: Tonette
Subject: Maybe you should go
Message:
You wrote; 'Maybe you should go give Maharji a blow job . It would subsitute for the experience that you are not having with your MASTER. Besides he commands it of you.'

I did not know it gives an experience to give a blow job. I never tried and I never will.

I did not know a blow job subititues the experience not having with my MASTER? (was that your experience YOU ARE NOT HAVING with your master?)

I did not heard such commandments.

I have a experience with Knowlegde and I am pleased with it.

I have a limiteded sense of tasteless humour

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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 21:25:25 (GMT)
From: hamzen
Email: None
To: Ruphus
Subject: You mean, like all premies, you're po-faced (nt)
Message:
a
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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 01:55:41 (GMT)
From: SB
Email: None
To: Pauline Premie
Subject: Thank You Pauline, I'm crying......
Message:
Thank you so, so much for the reminder that leaving Maharaji was the best thing I ever did in my life, thank you...sniff..
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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 01:09:20 (GMT)
From: Simon Satsang
Email: foaming@themouth.con
To: Pauline Premie
Subject: Well, That Shows You.....
Message:
I am overwhelmed, dear sister by your love and devotion to he who is not God and never was.

As you may know, my medication prevents me from remembering the seventies but I surmise that all of those photos of a person called Maharaji, sitting on a throne wearing a Krishna crown and having songs such as, 'Maharaji you are the Lord, you've shown us by your word' sung to him by Rich of-the-many-words-in-one-song Neal, well I suspect that those photographs and films are all fakes.

Certainly it must be so because the words which they have transcribed onto some of those old films are so ridiculous that even me, in my present insane condition, find them utterly appalling and nonsensical.

The truth that those old films are all fakes is obvious when one sees the pathetic attempts they've made to get the faked image of Maharaji to do a dance whilst wearing a string vest made out of badly embroidered floral patterns.

The faked image of Maharaji looks ridiculous in his floral string vest and they have made him too fat and have not got the computer graphics correct because all he does is wave his arms about in a very stilted fashion which quite frankly, looks absurd and can hardly be construed as a dance!

Well, my dear sister, we know that the real Maharaji is none of those bizarre images from the past but is a wealthy, Western Indian business guru who just happens to have some spare time to impart his knowledge to us lower classes. I went to a knowledge review recently and was surprised that he still gives the same four techniques out that he gave before.

When I asked the instructor why this was, he told me to trust and let go. So I did but unfortunatly my nurse wasn't with me so I had to sit out the rest of the knowlege review in a pair of wet trousers.

I'll see you at the next satellite feed...

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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 00:42:36 (GMT)
From: Ruphus
Email: None
To: Pauline Premie
Subject: Well, That Shows us Foum thinks
Message:
posting under fake and different aliases is OK!
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Date: Thurs, Jul 13, 2000 at 02:36:08 (GMT)
From: Nigel
Email: fitzroy@liverpool.ec.uk
To: Ruphus
Subject: Well, That Shows us Foum thinks
Message:
So now you feel ok about having posted under multiple aliases for months, 'coz you suspect an ex may have done similar..?

Is that the best you can manage for the moment?

Why not not tell us about the INCREDIBLE experience that Maharaji has given you, rather than merely justify your presence here by comparing your own behaviour with exes who, unlike you, actually have a reason for being here?

You look pretty pathetic, Ruph. Nothing to say and a lot to lose.

Where do you belong?

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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 02:05:38 (GMT)
From: Ben Lurking
Email: None
To: Ruphus
Subject: Well, That Shows us Foum thinks
Message:
Not only that but he allows your cult induced spelling - I remember Pauline from the ashram days - she was a looker.
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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 01:04:27 (GMT)
From: Pauline Premie
Email: None
To: Ruphus
Subject: Well, That Shows us Foum thinks
Message:
To tell you the truth, I think there are only two ex-premies. That guy Jim Heller (who is also the anti-christ) and that woman named Katie. (She is kind of nice, and I don't think Heller is capable of that, so I think Katie is another person.) All the rest of the supposed ex-premie posts are also from Jim Heller, posting under a bunch of aliases. It takes premies like you and me, Ruphus, who are connected to THAT love, to point it out.

I see it this way. Elan Vital says that only 10% of the followers of Maharaji lived in the ashrams. And these were the people who were saved from the drug culture. It goes to show you that what probably happened is that the 90% of the premies who DIDN'T live in the ashram, weren't sheltered. So, although it LOOKS like 90% of the people who received knowledge have drifted away from Maharaji, the truth is they DIED in the drug culture. Yes, that's what really happened, I bet.

These ex-premies spread such lies. Only two people, Jim Heller (who is the anti-christ) and Katie really actually left Maharaji, and he hasn't even LOST them, he just needs entertainment. I don't know what happened to Katie -- I think it's because she has to work with dirt or something. That made her confused. But only people who die ever go away from Maharaji, his love and that gift, because it's just so beautiful. Or at least if they do, they, like Elan Vital said, always remember Maharaji fondly and would NEVER criticize him.

Thanks, Rufus. Maybe I will see you at the next Satellite Event!

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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 01:16:52 (GMT)
From: Ruphus
Email: None
To: Pauline Premie
Subject: Well, That Shows us Foum thinks
Message:
Your writing style, words, the use of CAPITAL LETTERS (and brackets) is soooo identical with another PERSON posting here (at the Forum). Sure you are not TWINS? I THINK I heard HER name mentioned. Have FUN!
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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 01:24:59 (GMT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: Ruphus
Subject: Ever try to joke with a cult member?
Message:
This is what happens. Yech!
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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 01:36:10 (GMT)
From: Ruphus
Email: None
To: Jim
Subject: Ever try to joke with a cult member?
Message:
Hi Jim
A friend of mine told he hacked the system. Guess who is Simon Satsang?
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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 03:48:41 (GMT)
From: SB: Who rufus, WHO???
Email: None
To: Ruphus
Subject: tell me please rufus......hackers?
Message:
What is that?
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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 01:43:51 (GMT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: Ruphus
Subject: Ever try to joke with a cult member?
Message:
I give up. Who?
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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 01:59:48 (GMT)
From: Ruphus
Email: None
To: Jim
Subject: Ever try to joke with a cult member?
Message:
Take a guess.

You could try to examine his his style and writing. I am sure you'll pick the right person.

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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 11:59:05 (GMT)
From: Simon Satsang
Email: foaming@themouth.con
To: Ruphus
Subject: Ever try to joke with a cult member?
Message:
I can't imagine who I must be. You see, I gave my mind to Maharaji and he hasn't given it back yet.
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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 12:15:17 (GMT)
From: Ruphus
Email: None
To: Simon Satsang
Subject: Ever try to joke with a cult member?
Message:
If you have no brain, you dont need to know who you are.

Guessing contest: who is the alisas behind 'Simon Satsang'
Grand prices.

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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 00:04:40 (GMT)
From: Coach
Email: None
To: Everyone
Subject: Sodium Silicate!?
Message:
Sodium Silicate
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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 19:55:03 (GMT)
From: VP
Email: None
To: Coach
Subject: At least they are honest
Message:
They put the greeting from their guru right up at the beginning of the website. In this same spirit of honesty, how many premies out there would include 'greetings and blessings from Maharaji' as part of their busisness website? Their personal website?
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Date: Sat, Jul 15, 2000 at 02:34:07 (GMT)
From: Salam
Email: None
To: VP
Subject: At least they are honest
Message:
Maybe if you try to open your eyes for a change, you will see good old mum and mister big mostash. No mention of the great one,
but then who knows, the holly family has plans!!!!!!

Salam

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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 17:23:18 (GMT)
From: Salam
Email: salam_au@iprimus.com.au
To: Coach
Subject: Sodium Silicate and computer networks too.
Message:
is this a coincidence or am i imagining things,

Company : Sunil Systems (P) Ltd
Profile : Exporters of computer networking
Address : 141, Vikas Vihar, Ambala 134 003, India
Phone : +(91)-(171)-540041 Fax : +(91)-(171)-552808
Please send On-line Trade Enquiry or E-mail us at sunilsystems@usa.net

this company has the same address as Aayas, uses the same service provider has the same prefix and phone number and they have a dedicated web site to our ex beloved at

http://www.manavdharam.homepage.com/main

it seems that mr m. is following the foot steps of Bill Gate,

Salam

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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 12:02:34 (GMT)
From: Sir Dave
Email: None
To: Coach
Subject: It's oh so cheap and tacky
Message:
The whole setup is just so second rate. To think these people were worshipped as the Holy Family!
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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 05:52:34 (GMT)
From: Selene
Email: None
To: Coach
Subject: Sodium Silicate!? hA!! Looks like an illegal
Message:
substance to me.

Bored and doing a search on M huh?
Is that the strange stuff you find packed into stuff you buy like wallets and things?
I wonder where the proceeds go. yeah that will keep me up all night puzzled. Love your posts. Thanks.

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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 04:09:54 (GMT)
From: Tonette
Email: None
To: Coach
Subject: Like they say -
Message:
There's a sucker born every minute. We were suckers once so this is obviously marketed to those poor ignorant Indian souls. They have to worship something because there is so little else in their society to free them intellectuallly. Besides they are all poor as shit and love to live like dogs for their MASTER. Part of their upbringing. Gotta be dominated by something because the average human being is unworthy of even his own life!
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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 04:49:35 (GMT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: Tonette
Subject: Let me be the first to say 'That's not racist!'
Message:
Tonette,

I always thought it was blacks who like to live like dogs for their MASTER. Either blacks or negroes, I forget which. Anyway, you sure about this?

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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 00:17:19 (GMT)
From: Elaine
Email: None
To: Coach
Subject: Sodium Silicate!?
Message:
HOW....on earth ....did you come upon this???
This should be some story.
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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 00:35:47 (GMT)
From: It's probably Satpal's
Email: None
To: Elaine
Subject: mob(nt)
Message:
nt
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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 17:45:48 (GMT)
From: cq
Email: None
To: It's probably Satpal's
Subject: It IS a follower of Satpal (aka Bal Bhagwan Ji)
Message:
It IS a follower of Satpal (Bal Bhagwan Ji)

quote from the site:

President Manav Uthan Sewa Samiti (Regd.)
President Rotary Club, Ambala City
President Aggarwal Sabha , Ambala City

Sh. Om Parkash Aggarwal : Our Director and spritual person
in there life. Having 30 Years experience in Business of
Sodium Silicate Manufacturing. Followers of Sh. Satpal Ji
Maharaj

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Date: Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 16:10:30 (GMT)
From: Rated-X
Email: None
To: Everyone
Subject: Deluding People
Message:
One time m said that one of his instructors in India would show only 2 out of the 4 techniques when he revealed knowledge. He was quite angry at this and sent him away, and said 'You have deluded many people, you better ask for forgiveness'. Those techniques don't work much anyway, so getting 2 instead of 4 is not such a big deal.

M on the other hand, passed himself for god all his life, has gathered enormous wealth and shattered many lives in the process. Now that's deluding people.

If a guy takes a yoga class, and the teacher shows him some meditation techniques. Will he shower the teacher with expensive gifts, fall in love with him, kiss his feet, serve and dedicate his life to him? Make that teacher the priority in his life at the expense of his family and friends?

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Date: Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 10:49:02 (GMT)
From: Jethro
Email: None
To: Everyone
Subject: A phone call with Ron Geaves
Message:
The other night I received a call from Ron Geaves. What follows is what took place in that call to the best of my recollection(even though my memory has been challenged at times). The contents of the square brackets [ ] are own comments and were not spoken by Ron or myself.

RG:Hello Eddie[my name before I changed it to Jethro] this is Ron.
JC:Hello Ron, is that Ron Geaves?[I know another Ron who had a similar voice to RG]
RG:I have heard that you have been using my name of the ex-premie forum. I heard from EV that you sent them an email.
JC:Well, yes I did.
RG:If you were in front of me I would punch you on the nose.
JC:Really, well you just might get one back.[Ron, do you remember, when I first came back from Israel and was staying at Carol S's house in Edgware, how you used to punch me on the arm and leg in order to teach me to be a tough devotee and I wouldn't hit you back. Well, know that I have changed]
JC: All I did was repeat the content of our conversation at A..'s wedding.
RG: Why didn't you call me first?
JC: I am in a life-threatening situation at the moment and did not have the time. Didn't Anth phone you about it? I had asked him to?…anyway this subject is not personal it should be aired publicly
RG: No he didn't!!!! I don't want to speak to Anth , he is so full of hatred.
JC: Really, I wouldn't say that…….anyway as I was saying, I just repeated the content of our conversation which was that I had asked you what you thought about the jagdeo business. You said that you were on some EV committee and that you had seen reports from both sides of the Atlantic. When you saw the first report you thought that it was just a ploy by ex-premies, but when you saw the second report, which was totally independent of the first, you were convinced that jagdeo was 'in it up to his neck'. You also said that you could 'take on ' the forum when I said that the premie contributors were doing a crappy job.
RG: I did not say that. What I said was that the only information I had on the subject was from the ex-premie site, and based on that I made my comments, and when I said 'take on' the forum, I did not mean to enter discussions in the forum. [I suppose he meant he would punch everyone on the nose].
JC: Oh dear, well I remember differently………I am willing to write to EV and state publicly what you have said.
RG: No, no don't do anything, just leave my name out of anything you have to say.
RG: I loved the service I was doing and have now have submitted my resignation to the other people in EV.
JC: I don't understand why. Surely, if you are telling the truth, they[EV} know there was no committee investigating jagdeo and they would know I was lying[just another lying hateful ex-premie][it is curious that I have never received an answer to my email]. Anyway your name had been mentioned loads of times onthe ex-premie forum[not by me]. Don't forget you have given satsang all over the world. People remember you. Do a search in the archives.
RG: I think this has just been an ex-premie ploy just to cause distrust between the members of EV. Why did you wait 6 months to post it?
JC: Don't know really, I guess I wasn't thinking about it until the subject came up. I don't spend all my time on that forum. [ after the call, I remembered that I did post a message soon after the phone call, stating the contents of the conversation without mentioning Ron's name, and the post invited(almost begged, Ron to participate in the forum)].
JC:Anyway, again I am willing to publicly say that you remember the conversation differently to me and that I could have been mistaken. Seems like my mouth is always getting me into trouble.
RG: Well you should watch what comes out of it.
JC: Maybe, but this who I am, I always say it as I see it.[Oh yes and my former master always says to 'walk straight and talk straight in this world(children's satsang), you can't have true devotion without honesty, and be prepared to give up your social respectability for the sake of truth(peace bomb)].

[ We then talked about how our own lives had gone……in fact one could even call it satsang]

RG: If you and Anth want to chase Jagdeo ,you can, just don't involve me.[I am sorry that as a human being you are not concerned , especially you were one of the originals who set up prempal's mission in the west, your attempts at ignoring this has the same smell as prempal's refusal to answer any of this].

JC: Don't think that I am immediately going to repeat this on the forum.
RG: Well, I hope not.

JC: Have a good life.
RG: I will !
JC: Bye.
[End of call]

Well everyone I have struggled a little with myself as whether I should post this or not, because of Ron's request and I know this will anger him…….but what can I do…the subject is above protecting anyone's name even if they were regarded as a friend.

Ron, don't bother phoning me again. Anything you want say to me should be said publicly on this forum or any other forum. If you still want to punch me on the nose, you are welcome to try. I suggest you place your arguments here.


Jethro

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Date: Sat, Jul 15, 2000 at 00:05:13 (GMT)
From: Marianne
Email: None
To: Jethro
Subject: Many thanks, Jethro
Message:
Jethro: I've been away from the forum for all of this week and have just read this thread. Thank you so much for posting this information. I've printed out the post and saved it for future reference.

That Ron felt compelled to offer his resignation just emphasizes to me that the cult situation still exists. It sounds as though he gave up information that was not supposed to be divulged and is trying to remedy the problem by lying to you about it now.

I am delighted to hear that EV is spending its time and resources reading the forum, and that we are a source of irritation to them. What is really offensive though, is that they have branded the Jagdeo complaints as an ex-premie scheme, with no basis in reality. This is an insult to Susan, Abi and others victimized by Jagdeo. In fact, complaints have been made to DLM/EV about Jagdeo, and EV has chosen to ignore them. Susan made a post about what happened to her and gave her name. She's in the ex white pages. For EV to say they had no way to identify her and contact her is a total obfuscation of the truth. They're ostriches with their heads in the sand.

Having spent quite a bit of time with Anth this year, the comments that he is 'hate-filled' are a reflection upon those uttering the words, rather than upon Anth himself. He's brilliant, hilarious, insightful and kind. I am honored to call him my friend.

Yeah, knowledge is all about love, peace and happiness, isn't it?
What a crock!

Love, Marianne

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Date: Thurs, Jul 13, 2000 at 14:57:39 (GMT)
From: Susan
Email: None
To: Jethro
Subject: This goes into my reasons not to deal with them
Message:
pile.

So, if I were to talk to them, and someone were to believe me, and that person was to say so, that person would become an EV outcast?

What a charming, healthy organization.

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Date: Thurs, Jul 13, 2000 at 17:56:17 (GMT)
From: Jethro
Email: None
To: Susan
Subject: They are all narcistic
Message:
Hi Susan
It's same old stuff that happened when it was DLM.
People there are full of ambition and rising up the ladder(the top being at the feet).
They are all narcistic, as far as I can see. They emulate their leader which makes it right in their minds(hey I said minds).
Not one of them believes in their own self.

Jagdeo told my ex-wife that he(Jagdeo) is a reincarnation of a past perfect master......maybe they all still believe that garbage, maybe maharaji believes that, maybe..maybe...maybe.

Their silence only encourages speculation which will grow.

Take care Jethro

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Date: Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 21:14:53 (GMT)
From: Joe
Email: None
To: Jethro
Subject: A Comment on the Side
Message:
RG:I have heard that you have been using my name of the ex-premie forum. I heard from EV that you sent them an email.
JC:Well, yes I did.

This whole exchange is fascinating for the reasons others have enumerated. But I find it really interesting, flattering really, by how much avid attention this forum is getting from various premies, and Elan Vital. Don't you all get this feeling that when you post something on the forum, hundreds of premie-honcho eyes are dissecting it, talking about it, talking about it on the telephone, sending emails about it, creating files, etc., etc. I mean, Ron 'heard' about one post, as well as one email to Elan Vital. I don't believe I have ever gotten this much attention in my life. I kind of like it, really.

So, considering the audience reading this: Hello you guys, you premies, you brothers and sisters who are reading this. Let me just say, JAI SATCHITANAND, Bohle Shri, follow your heart, and don't let your vegetables rot. Have a nice day!

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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 02:42:19 (GMT)
From: VP
Email: None
To: Joe
Subject: It's like the old game 'telephone'
Message:
Joe,
I imagine it being a bit like the old children's game 'telephone.' Remember: The first child whispers something to the person on his right, then that child whispers into the next ear, and so on. Imagine the stories the premies at the end of the chain hear(ones who don't actually READ the forum)by the time stories get around to them.
LOL, at your greeting to premies :)
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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 07:05:40 (GMT)
From: Ruphus
Email: None
To: VP
Subject: It's like the old game 'telephone'
Message:
I am pretty sure that Rons version of this story will be pretty different.
And I agree that the story when it has been told by 15 ex-premies and 15 premies, you can hardly recognise the it. Pity Jethro did not record it. May be Rod did. So would I.
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Date: Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 13:03:33 (GMT)
From: VP
Email: None
To: Jethro
Subject: A phone call with Ron Geaves
Message:
This is such a powerful look into the mindset of EV. An ex-premie ploy? That is TOO much! This guy has been in a bubble so long he has major paranoia.

Why does Ron have to quit doing the service he enjoys? Just because he told you something and it ended up here? So what?

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Date: Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 13:11:03 (GMT)
From: Jethro
Email: None
To: VP
Subject: A phone call with Ron Geaves
Message:
'Why does Ron have to quit doing the service he enjoys? Just because he told you something and it ended up here? So what? '

I asked him the same question and he said something about his colleagues not being able to trust him again. Anyway he hasn't resigned, he has offered his resignation.
(He also said that I violated the spirit of the wedding I was I at(my words).)

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Date: Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 23:58:03 (GMT)
From: Sir Dave
Email: None
To: Jethro
Subject: The most revealing thing
Message:
'I asked him the same question and he said something about his colleagues not being able to trust him again'

This is the most revealing thing (to me) which you've written. If the people of Elan Vital feel that they can't trust dear old Ron Geaves, long time devotee from way back when and one of the most constant premies who could always be relied on - well if they don't trust Ron, they really are in a state of blind panic and paranoia!

I would surmise that Ron's been squeezed into a tight corner, on this one. Possibly he's been pressured by Maharaji to keep his mouth shut.

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Date: Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 14:08:49 (GMT)
From: AJW
Email: None
To: Jethro
Subject: Pariahs
Message:
Hi Jeth,

This sounds familiar. A couple of my premie 'friends' won't have anything to do with me anymore. One said she can no longer come round to our house because of what she'd heard about what I'd written on the internet (she hadn't read it herself). One said he can only meet me in private.

Not all my premie friends have reacted the same way. I guess it's times like this when you find out who your real friends are.

Anth the sociable

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Date: Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 14:37:55 (GMT)
From: VP
Email: None
To: AJW
Subject: Pariahs
Message:
Talk about fear!
A friend can only meet you in private? And they are not in a cult? Whatever! This sounds like what Gail when through when she became an ex.
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Date: Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 14:35:37 (GMT)
From: Jethro
Email: None
To: AJW
Subject: Pariahs
Message:
I spoke to a friend who is long term premie about this. This is a long-term premie who has believed that all the troubles for prempal are because of the 'premie mind' which manifest in the organisation around him. Anyway he said it was Ron's karma that this is happening and it serves him right.

This is really old stuff.
Strange because exs are usually cristicised for being stuck in the past.

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Date: Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 11:50:12 (GMT)
From: Sir Dave
Email: sirdavid12@hotmail.com
To: Jethro
Subject: A phone call with Ron Geaves
Message:
Thanks for posting that. It's an insight into how things have become in the cult. Rather sad really. After all this time, it's down to this. Paranoia, denial and covering up. Not much love there is there. Not a good example of any great knowledge or wisdom.

It's how the abused are treated which matters. How they are treated reflects upon the organisation. You can have people extolling the virtues of the master, his supposed knowledge and all of that but if the abused are not looked after then it all amounts to nothing but empty words.

Maharaji can talk the talk as much as he likes but if he hasn't shown any concern for the abused then his words are meaningless.

Ron talks about 'chasing Jagdeo' as if it's become some sort of game. But it's not a game for all the people he abused and I have heard no sympathy for them coming from the mouths of Maharaji and Elan Vital spokespersons.

The more they deny, cover up and sweep it under the carpet, the worse they look.

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Date: Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 11:10:41 (GMT)
From: AJW
Email: None
To: Jethro
Subject: Rons very, very, very bad memory.
Message:
Hi Jeth',

Looks like you beat me to it. I was trying to get Ron's number to give him a call, but my agents in the uk haven't got back to me. Anyway, it looks like he wouldn't talk to me anyway- me being full of so much hate and all.

Anyway Jeth', either Ron has got a very, very, very bad memory, or he's a complete liar. He is denying that he talked to you about these 'committees'. He'd probably also deny (or 'forget') that he had a long conversation on the phone with the ex-head of Unity School about Jagdeo and his child molesting tours.

I can't believe these fucking clowns Jeth'. I used to have respect for Randy, Judy and Ron once. Now they're bullshitting, suffering from memory loss, and lying, all to protect a paedophile.

What's their problem? Why can't they come clean? Their lies and evasions are so transparent the wind blows through them.

Anth the hate filled

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Date: Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 13:03:53 (GMT)
From: Jethro
Email: None
To: AJW
Subject: Oh I forgot to mention.....
Message:
that Ron did say that no complaint had been made so there was nothing officially to investigate.
Would you mind giving a precise answer to this? I find it baffling that anyone should say such a thing and I don't have time for research at the moment.

also you said'
I can't believe these fucking clowns Jeth'. I used to have respect for Randy, Judy and Ron once. Now they're bullshitting, suffering from memory loss, and lying, all to protect a paedophile.'

I reaaly don't think for a minute that Ron or Judy(i don't know Randy) think they are lieing to protect a paedophille, they are trying to protect prempal. What is sad is that their loyalty(ie devotion) is so misplaced that it amounts to the same thing. Pity really.

Take care and watch your nose
Jethro

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Date: Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 13:59:39 (GMT)
From: AJW
Email: None
To: Jethro
Subject: Oh I forgot to mention.....
Message:
Hi Jeth',

If he said, 'No complaint had been made,' he doesn't know about my correspondance with Glen, some of which Sir Dave has put up on his website. He's also ignoring the fact that Randy and Judy were told, and I believe another instructor was also informed by a different victim's relative.

Does he think we're making this all up or something?

Anth the Hate filled complainer.

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Date: Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 14:30:07 (GMT)
From: Jethro
Email: None
To: AJW
Subject: Oh I forgot to mention.....
Message:
Hmmm maybe that isn't official enough for Ron. He did say something about 'there are procedures for this type of thing' and was convinced that if a complaint had been made the procedures would have been followed.

I am not sure how some people live with themselves. I have heard words like 'denial' and 'revisionism' but have never really understood what they meant until now.

But as has been said, the victims here seem to be totally ignored by EV and their speakers......did I say speakerS?


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Date: Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 23:08:52 (GMT)
From: Ruphus
Email: None
To: Jethro
Subject: Did you forget to mention.....
Message:
Jethro wrote: 'Hmmm maybe that isn't official enough for Ron. He did say something about 'there are procedures for this type of thing' and was convinced that if a complaint had been made the procedures would have been followed.'

I assume that Ron means there is a procedure for such things by the police. And he is convinced that Anth did not report this to the police, otherwise the procedures would have been followed.

Anth in his letter to Glen also refused to give the names to the victims. Previously Anth has stated that Abis father reported about the incident to a mahatma, now he states that he believes a instructor was informed by one of the victims relatives.

So who is lying now and who has a bad memory is up for speculations.

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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 08:13:19 (GMT)
From: AJW
Email: None
To: Ruphus
Subject: For the record Ruphus
Message:
I did report Jagdeo to the police.

I made statements to the local Police and also to a special unit investigating child abuse in boarding schools in the UK.

The other 'relative' I mentioned was indeed Abi's father, who told me he had reported Jagdeo to an instructor.

Anth the Grass

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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 08:30:12 (GMT)
From: Ruphus
Email: None
To: AJW
Subject: For the record Ruphus
Message:
You wrote: 'I did report Jagdeo to the police.
I made statements to the local Police and also to a special unit investigating child abuse in boarding schools in the UK.'

Ruphus relied:
If so how come the police did not do anything?
To make a statement is not the same as to report a criminal act. (in the eyes of the law.)

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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 09:57:42 (GMT)
From: AJW
Email: None
To: Ruphus
Subject: Why don't you...
Message:
...give them a call and ask them what they did Ruphus? You're obviously concerned that this paedophile is still on the loose right?

What other suggestions do you have for stopping him?

Anth the concerned

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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 10:21:21 (GMT)
From: Ruphus
Email: None
To: AJW
Subject: Why I don't
Message:
Nobody agrees more than me that if Jagdeo abuses children he should be stopped.

But what has been done is more in the line of giving Maharaji a bad reputation. IMHO you have done a lousy job for the victims case and for the case of putting Jagdeo behind bars. With your angle the victims are suffering.

I have no power to call anyone, neither the police nor Elan Vital. According to what I have read here, Jagdeo is no longer involved in EV?
According to what I have read a premie sent a complaining letter to EV.

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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 10:41:27 (GMT)
From: Jethro
Email: None
To: Ruphus
Subject: Guilt by ommission
Message:
Ruphus, doesn't it bother you that your master has never even responded to this issue.
All he had to do was to issues a denial if he really didn't know anything about it.

He has been too long silent.

But of course all you care about is his reputation.

This is all a joke to you.

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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 11:06:32 (GMT)
From: Ruphus
Email: None
To: Jethro
Subject: Guilt by ommission
Message:
EV responded, to Anth who did not respond. Then EV rsponded with the FAQ

What would you have done in M shoes. If people do not cooperate and regard him as an enemy, what can you do.

It is, even if some braindead people dont get it, the victims case and their healing that are important. To one victim to bring up this case, according to my information, made her freak out. I think only the victim know why.

If Anth (and Jethro) had pure motives, this case would have been handled totally different.

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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 20:23:38 (GMT)
From: VP
Email: None
To: Ruphus
Subject: Wrong again, Ruphus
Message:
To one victim to bring up this case, according to my information, made her freak out. I think only the victim know why.

What are you inferring here? The victim freaked out because she is in a cult and she is part of a truth which incriminates a primary player in the group.

She is more than likely afraid of some sort of hocus pocus--that Maharaji is going to punish her for telling the truth about Jagdeo-- or something along those lines. Of course, this will NOT happen, because Maharaji is a man--a human and that is all he is.

Having her story told didn't make her freak out. Being afraid of your cult's nonsense made her freak out. Get it straight.

I am for victim's rights and I feel very sorry for the victim who is having a hard time. I feel sorry for her for being abused in the first place. I feel sorry for her for believing in cult nonsense.

If Anth (and Jethro) had pure motives, this case would have been handled totally different.

You are not talking to a bunch of idiots here, you know! Anth did the right thing and his motive and intentions WERE pure. You're don't like that this situation is making EV and Maharaji look VERY bad, which they are.

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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 10:38:47 (GMT)
From: AJW
Email: None
To: Ruphus
Subject: What would you have done Rufus?
Message:
What would you have done Ruphus, if you discovered that some children who had been in your care had been seriously sexually abused by Mahatma Jagdeo, on one of his cult sponsored tours?

I wrote a personal letter to Glen Whittaker. We had private correspondance about the matter- and it became obvious he was making excuses for Jagdeo, and didn't accept the seriousness of the charges. When I realised that nothing would be done through Elan Vital I reported Jagdeo to the police.

I had the full support and co-operation of two of his victims.

Okay, so far I've done a lousy job Ruphus. How do you suggest I should have done it?

And what do you think of the job the cult has done in bringing him to justice?

Anth the nonce basher

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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 11:15:39 (GMT)
From: Ruphus
Email: None
To: AJW
Subject: What I would have done ?
Message:
I would have different motives than you. Due to that, my actions would be different. That is all I can say.

I think a different attitude would have been in place. With better results.

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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 14:11:47 (GMT)
From: Jethro
Email: None
To: Ruphus
Subject: Typical premie non-answer
Message:
Why don't you just admit it neither you or anyone else at EV care about anything except some photograph of prempal. In fact your mob have gone so far as to bring in solicitors.

What a pity no one there has even the courage to instigate an investigation into the whereabouts of Jagdeo.
Is padarthanand still around?

Just carry on and have 'that' experience..that's all that matters, isn't it 'Ruphus'? It doesn't matter that lives have been lost and ruined.

Your master is now on a par with saibaba.

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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 12:34:44 (GMT)
From: Ruphus
Email: None
To: Anth, Joe and Jethro
Subject: End of discussion. (nt)
Message:
nt
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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 13:28:19 (GMT)
From: AJW
Email: None
To: Ruphus
Subject: Quite pathetic Ruphus.
Message:
Ruphus,
You get all offensive, suggesting I have ulterior motives for reporting a paedophile, who seriously assaulted at least one child in my care, to the police.

Then you tell me that I went about reporting it all wrong. I asked you what you think I should have done, or what you would have done, and you come out with this pathetic drivel, about how you would have done something better, but you won't tell us what it is, and you don't want to discuss it any more.

Ruphus, I think you're a pathetic fucking creep with your head so far up your arse you can't tell the difference between a child molester and a meditation teacher.

Get a life toe kisser and stop defending the cult paedophile.

Anth Ginn

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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 15:41:45 (GMT)
From: Susan
Email: None
To: AJW
Subject: Rufus is Bjorn Again I think (nt)
Message:
And for the record I think Anth is a hero and has acted with more sanity and genuine caring than almost anyone involved in this whole thing.
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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 18:36:20 (GMT)
From: Jethro
Email: None
To: Susan
Subject: Rufus is a real sicko
Message:
Whoever Rufus is, he certainly gets off on this stuff.
He's a real sicko.
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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 16:06:00 (GMT)
From: Monmot
Email: None
To: Susan
Subject: I Was Just Going To Suggest That Also
Message:
Same raggedy language, same obsessive interest in Jagdeo, same high and mighty attitude suggesting he's on the High Road looking down at Anth wandering on the Low Road. And my favorite premie trait of all: engage in discussion/debate and then when the questions or answers become too pointed, grandly announce 'end of discussion' or disappear. This guy has the hallmarks of a stalker.

He keeps announcing he's leaving for good because we 'hurt' him. Promises, promises.

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Date: Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 23:47:49 (GMT)
From: Joe
Email: None
To: Ruphus
Subject: Did you forget to mention.....
Message:
You would think Elan Vital would not require that the incidents of child sexual molestation be reported to the police before they would do anything about it.

Susan reported her experiences with Jagdeo to two officials in Elan Vital. Abi said her father reported the abuse to Charanand, another offical of Elan Vital. Anth had correspondence with yet another Elan Vital offical about the incidents, and Elan Vital lies on its website and implies that Susan and Abi refused to talk with them, which, according to Susan is a lie because Elan Vital never contacted her.

So, just who is it that is conveniently failing to mention things?

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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 00:23:49 (GMT)
From: Ruphus
Email: None
To: Joe
Subject: Did you forget to mention.....
Message:
According to Elan Vital:
'We were able to contact two individuals* who made these allegations and asked that they help shed light on what happened but as yet have received no cooperation from them. As it stands Elan Vital has still received no direct information from any of the alleged victims and to date no complaint has been filed with Elan Vital or with any authorities.'

*It is not written two victims. ( I suppose they mean Anth and another person). Anth refused to give the names.

So if Elan Vital do not know the victims names or address, how can they contact them?

Someone is conveniently failing to mention things. IMHO

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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 00:40:34 (GMT)
From: Joe
Email: None
To: Ruphus
Subject: You are an idiot......
Message:
You quoted:

According to Elan Vital:
'We were able to contact two individuals* who made these allegations and asked that they help shed light on what happened but as yet have received no cooperation from them.

And then you asked the follwing stupid question:

So if Elan Vital do not know the victims names or address, how can they contact them?

What is wrong with this picture?

Elan Vital said they DID contact them, you idiot.

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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 00:49:43 (GMT)
From: Ruphus
Email: None
To: Joe
Subject: From one idiot to another.....
Message:
Ealn Vital IMHO wrote they contacted two indibiduals who made these allegations. The only individual I know of who made such allogations is Anth. There is obiously another person who did the same.

What is your problem?

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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 21:06:57 (GMT)
From: Joe
Email: None
To: Ruphus
Subject: You are even more of an idiot than I thought....
Message:
Elan Vital said they contacted the two individuals who refused to cooperate. Then you say they didn't have addresses. If they contacted them, you idiot, they obviously had addresses.
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Date: Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 23:59:42 (GMT)
From: Jethro
Email: None
To: Joe
Subject: Did you forget to mention.....
Message:
These EV people are just wannabe politicians, it seems nothing has been learned over the years.

They don't give a shit about anything except to please their lord.

They haven't even bothered to reply to my email. They could have just said that I got it wrong.....but like their leader(who is of course not a leader).

Their silence speaks a thousand words.

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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 00:26:05 (GMT)
From: Ruphus
Email: None
To: Jethro
Subject: Did you forget to mention.....
Message:
I just read your respons from Ron???
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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 00:29:52 (GMT)
From: Jethro
Email: None
To: Ruphus
Subject: What are you talking about?nt
Message:
nt
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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 00:55:12 (GMT)
From: Ruphus
Email: None
To: Jethro
Subject: What I am talking about
Message:
is that Ron according to your post called you.
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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 01:20:58 (GMT)
From: Jethro
Email: None
To: Ruphus
Subject: He did call me! nt
Message:
nt
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Date: Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 23:29:22 (GMT)
From: Jethro
Email: None
To: Ruphus
Subject: So what is it that you care about 'Ruphus'?nt
Message:
nt
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Date: Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 16:05:03 (GMT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: Jethro
Subject: You're lucky, Jethro
Message:
You know, there is a very weird perverse pleasure in these conversations. It's kind of like pretending that you're in an episode of The Prisoner, the classic sixties surrealistic tv show about a spy who wanted out but instead is kept prisoner in a mysterious spy village where no one has a straight ansewr for anything. That shit's fun in a strange kind of way.

It's like going to a horror movie, really. Nothing's as it once seemed. Are you mad? Are they mad? Are you they? 'Angel Heart? You ARE Angel Heart!' (that was a good one, if you've never seen it).

By the way, while I'm on the subject and at the risk of stating the obvious, has it ever occurred to any of you that IF -- hypothetically speaking, just think about this for a moment -- but IF EV's FAQs are true and accurate, we must all be mad?

Neat huh?

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Date: Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 16:31:24 (GMT)
From: Jethro
Email: None
To: Jim
Subject: You're lucky, Jethro
Message:
'-- but IF EV's FAQs are true and accurate, we must all be mad?'

I had the same feeling during the part of the conversation that I haven't discussed...especially when Ron mentioned about the Pope not being responsible for priests that have abused people. I seem to remember that that was mentioned in the FAQs? Is that right?
Do you think they all have to learn the part line?

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Date: Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 00:51:16 (GMT)
From: Premie on-looker
Email: None
To: Everyone
Subject: A few comments
Message:
I wandered in here a few weeks ago.
It has been fascinating to read the discussions taking place.
It is time for me to have a say.
Then I will leave you alone.
As a practicing premie I do not regard myself as a premie clone.
Nor do I regard myself as a cultist.
These are words that try to grasp the elusive.
This is the way I see it.
People are individuals. We all veer towards those things that we feel an empathy or affinity to.
And away from those things we feel an antipathy for.
I try to surround myself with friends,work,books,music,possessions,family,life-style and everything else that are as near to what I feel close to.
And I try to steer clear from whatever I feel indifferent or antogonistic towards.
This changes over time.
I choose though to not hold onto bitter feelings if those things I valued highly in my past I now value poorly.
One relationship doesn't work out.
Who's to blame?
Everyone? Or perhaps it's not a matter of blame.
Being a premie for me is a very private affair.
It is not a group thing.
My relationship with Maharaji likewise is a totally private affair.
Do individuals have to justify their personal lives?
You people have your tales to tell.
Fair enough.
Everyone does.
But surely you see that no one tale ,nor any collection of simular tales can reveal the 'truth'.
The 'truth' is not common agreement.
If it were then there would be common agreement.
There isn't.
Nor it seems to me will there ever be.
What fascinates me the most is how people differ in their attitudes to those who they feel an antipathy towards.
The people here seem in the main to have a very hostile attitude towards those who differ from what seems to me as a group 'attitude'.
Yet, one of the main criticisms aimed at premies and I guess Maharaji is that of 'clonish or cultish' thinking.
This seems highly contradictory and hypocritical.
It is illogical.
You can't have it both ways.
How can individuals here reveal characteristics that appear powerfully like those they claim premies have?
Or do you really not see that?
Are those here going to ignore or bitterly discount what I have to say?
That is what I have seen in your treatment of others who veer away from the consensus.
Anyway,I have no desire to continue with my involvement here.
It just so happens I've had more time on my hands over the last few weeks.

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Date: Sat, Jul 15, 2000 at 18:10:51 (GMT)
From: Salam
Email: None
To: Premie on-looker
Subject: A few comments
Message:
I have posted this here but it seemed to have disappeared, so here it is again.

You sound pretty genuine, but alas not genuine enough. I can see you standing with your back to the exit, oh yeah you come in, but when its time for the penny to drop you bolt out of the door. Maybe that door will be shut one day, then you will have to face up to it. Just imagine in your head for a secound that there was no maharaji ,what will you do? It is a scarry thought is it not? well my dear that is called brainwashing, normally practiced in cults, i.e. maharaji inc..

I think one of the main messages that this forum is trying to convey to you and to your supporters (that are hiding behined the wall)is that there is no need to have a master to experience knowledge, it is in you and it is you. No more than your life experience, if you can be aware of that, then that is all there is.

Also we all (at least I think so) have/had private experiences of meditation, so I do not know what is your point. Perhaps one can provide a better supporting environement so maybe one can have a richer experience, which what ashram was all about, but in the end it all boils down to one thing, I am the one that is going to have the experience not you.

I do not know if you have heard the term peer group, it is a bunch of people that come together, have similer interest and give support to each other, mind you no one is asking me for anyhting , neither I need to give anything, I have a choice. This is what the forum do to me, when gm start creeping back in my head, thanks to technology, I can find a place to help me, and notice the 'help' me, not ramming it down my throught .

I am free, free to think, free to stay, free to go, I am free

I am free, can you say that and feel it?

I do not think so.

Salam

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Date: Fri, Jul 14, 2000 at 04:51:08 (GMT)
From: An avid fan
Email: None
To: Premie on-looker
Subject: Right on, Premiji!
Message:
I totally agree with you. Don't listen to these non-practicing ex-premies. They have nothing else to occupy their minds and their hearts are full of dirt.
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Date: Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 16:01:08 (GMT)
From: Way
Email: None
To: Premie on-looker
Subject: To Premie on-looker
Message:
Dear Premie on-looker,

I cannot determine from your post if you have left us permanently already, or if you plan to read the responses generated by your post and then depart. In case you are still around for one last look, I will add a little response of my own to your post.

It seems to me that you do not really wish to analyze your involvement with Maharaji and Knowledge. And you do not specifically address any of the issues that concern ex-premies. Your 'say,' as you put it, boils down to two simple points: (1) that you are a practicing premie who is only involved privately with Maharaji and Knowledge and not in any sort of cult, and (2) ex-premies are ironically cult-like in their thinking and their hostility to outsiders.

After making your two points, you wonder aloud whether what you have said will be ignored and bitterly discounted.

Ok, I will react. I will not attempt to instruct you about our issues, since you express no interest. And I will not challenge any of your comments or ask you to clarify your 'private affair with Maharaji.'

I will simply attend to your two points and let you know that we have been visited by premies many times before who have made the identical points. Although I do not bitterly discount what you have to say, I do disagree with it. I think that there are many elements of typical cult thinking for any person who follows Mr. Rawat as a Master, and I do not think that ex-premies have adopted a new cult mind set after rejecting Mr. Rawat. It is true that ex-premies all share a common view of Elan Vital and Prem Pal Singh Rawat, and there is a sort of group dynamic here. But what's wrong with that? There is nothing at all wrong per se with community, with group support. The negative association with 'cult' is not that there is consensus, but that the leader is a charlatan who makes false claims and the followers adopt these falsehoods in their thinking. We have no leader here claiming to be able to bridge the gap between ourselves and the mystery of life. And that, dear Premie on-looker, is the point.

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Date: Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 10:47:30 (GMT)
From: AJW
Email: None
To: Premie on-looker
Subject: A few comments
Message:
Jai Sat Cap Inand Premie-Ji,

So you don't think you're in a cult eh?

Do you know anyone who is in a cult who admits it?

Do you think that Moonies, Hare krishnas, and Children of God are in cults?

If the answer is 'No', then what is a cult?

If the answer is 'Yes', how come Premies are different?

I await your enlightened reply with great interest- but I won't hold my breath, as premies rapidly disintegrate mentally when they compare themselves to Moonies, Hare Krishnas etc.

Anth the Ex-toe kisser

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Date: Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 09:52:30 (GMT)
From: Mili
Email: mili@cheerful.com
To: Premie on-looker
Subject: A few comments
Message:
Don't worry about the ex-premies. They are just a reaction (and marginal, at that). Maharaji is where the action is.
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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 01:59:18 (GMT)
From: jajajaja SB jajajaja
Email: None
To: Mili
Subject: That was a spanish laugh: hahahaha: english (nt)
Message:
LOL
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Date: Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 23:13:00 (GMT)
From: Ben Lurking
Email: None
To: Mili
Subject: A few comments
Message:
Mili,
If M is where the action is what are you doing here? - we are non M.
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Date: Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 15:51:56 (GMT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: Mili
Subject: That's a good one, Mili. You're hilarious
Message:
Maharaji's 'where the action is'. That's pretty darned funny.

What else is funny is that you're a cowardly worm. Why don't you put together another fake petition like the one you sent Usenet trying to muzzle the newsgroup we used to use? You know, make a total idiot of yourself like you did then? Wasn't that enough 'action', Jackson?

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Date: Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 12:54:52 (GMT)
From: VP
Email: None
To: Mili
Subject: A few comments
Message:
Mili,
What do you think about the actions of Jagdeo? What do you think about EV and Ron Greaves' evasion of this issue? Is this all 'ok' as long as Maharaji keeps providing the 'action' for you?
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Date: Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 05:38:26 (GMT)
From: TD
Email: None
To: Premie on-looker
Subject: A few comments
Message:
A couple of questions I have:

I choose though to not hold onto bitter feelings if those things I valued highly in my past I now value poorly.

Are you speaking of things relating to Maharaji and premiedom and things that he changed that, at the time, you were unhappy about - such as the ashrams closing? Did you ever resolve those bitter feelings, speak to anyone about them, or did time just heal them?

Being a premie for me is a very private affair.
It is not a group thing.
My relationship with Maharaji likewise is a totally private affair.

So you get to see him on your own do you? You chat to him directly about things no-one else but the two of you can share? If you do go to public events, are you the only one in the audience? There's no group of people there with you?

Yet, one of the main criticisms aimed at premies and I guess Maharaji is that of 'clonish or cultish' thinking.

Is Maharaji deemed a 'master' of which there are no other equivalents on the earth at this point in time? Does he, and only he hold the key to the ultimate secret? Can he offer you a form of salvation from yourself, in terms of increased consciousness via these techniques? Does he tell you that the mind is a bad influence, and that questioning thoughts are doubts? Does he tell you that the Master is the best and most reliable friend you will ever have?

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Date: Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 04:36:06 (GMT)
From: P-man
Email: None
To: Premie on-looker
Subject: A few comments
Message:
You're in a cult, sucker. Here's how you can tell...

1. The leader claims he can show you Nirvana.

2. You have to believe this before he actually shows it to you.

3. When the leader claims he's given you the tools to experience Nirvana, he explains any problems you're having as your own doubts or inabilities.

4. Questions are discouraged.

5. The leader's authority is absolute. No one can challenge the leader or point out inadequecies.

6. You start to sound dumb and stilted and wooden.

7. You pretend you're happier than you are.

8. You think you're superior, even if you don't admit it to anyone.

9. You think the leader of your cult has special 'powers' even if you don't admit it to anyone.

10. You post dumb comments to this Forum.

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Date: Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 04:57:02 (GMT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: P-man
Subject: P-man's concise travel cult test kit
Message:
not bad. Not bad at all.
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Date: Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 03:57:53 (GMT)
From: Joe
Email: None
To: Premie on-looker
Subject: A few comments
Message:
I have a suggestion: you might consider paragraphs. They are nothing to be afraid of, even if you don't have an affinity for them. They are helpful devices in organizing your thoughts. I'm also concerned that your affinity for emotionless, declarative sentences represents a lack of stimulation in your life. Are you happy? Do you have joy? Is there anything you like about your life? You would never get that from your post. How sad. Do you have no 'affinity' for sharing yourself as a human being?

I get from your post this fear of contradiction, disagreement, differing views. You can't just 'surround' yourself with everything you are in agreement with and attracted to. That isn't living. It also sounds like a drag. I mean you carry that idea to the point of making your supposed 'statement' and then splitting. You don't even want to engage in human communication and dialogue. How sad.

Just one thing to add. Of course you don't consider yourself a premie clone or that you are in a cult. No one ever does as that's how a cult works. If you knew you were in a cult, you wouldn't be in it anymore. Also, saying that everyone is to blame is the same thing as saying no one is to blame, and that's intellectually dishonest, as well as morally bankrupt.

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Date: Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 05:10:10 (GMT)
From: Daneane
Email: None
To: Joe
Subject: 'Fear of contradiction'
Message:
Good point Joe. Reminds me of something posted by that guy who shows up every once in awhile, says something brilliant then disappears back into the mist.

Here's a post from Brian I thought was pretty keen. I saved it on my desktop:

'Other people aren't you, and you can't join them.
Think for yourself.
Learn from your own mistakes.
Don't look to anyone for agreement, approval or
apologies.
Spend time with those you enjoy, and avoid the ones you
don't.
The world will forget you after you've gone.
The only thing you take with you when you leave is the
person you've become while you were here.'

For all I know it came off a box of Wheaties, but methinks it does not suck.

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Date: Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 02:12:58 (GMT)
From: Jerry
Email: None
To: Premie on-looker
Subject: A few comments
Message:
My relationship with Maharaji likewise is a totally private affair. Do individuals have to justify their personal lives?

What kind of relationsip do you have with Maharaji? How did you get into that relationship? Think back. Remember when that carrot on a stick, Knowledge, was held out in front of you, and you were made to drool for it. But you couldn't have it until you begged for it and were willing to dedicate your life for it, could you? Now that you have Knowledge, do you think you should have been put through all that? I mean, what's the big deal? It's four meditation techniques, right? There's nothing special about them. But where you started out wanting just some meditation techniques that, silly you, and me, and anybody who received K the 'right' way, thought had some extra special divine powers, you wound up wanting to serve Maharaji and doing nothing else in your life, however which way was suitable for you, in whatever way you fit. Like you say, it's personal. But we all have one common denominator.

EVERYBODY went into this thing to receive K. Nobody went into it to love, serve, and obey Maharaji, not in the western world. It's just not part of our culture to want a master. We're reared differently than that. But he made sure that's what we wound up wanting to do, even before we were given the magic potion. We had to become beggars for the, er, 'gift'. Have you forgotten all this? If I were you I'd think back on it. The relationship you have with Maharaji is ALL ON HIS TERMS, NOT YOUR'S. If they were on your's, you would have just taken the Knowledge and run. Me too. But somehow, my head got turned around, and I began to want what Maharji wanted. I began to think that was the best thing I could hope for, whatever Maharaji wanted. He got into my head and got me to start thinking the way he wanted me to. And what did I get in return for it? 4 lousy meditation techniques blown way out of proportion to what they're really good for -- just what any other meditation techniques are good for, no more, no less. In fact, I've practiced other meditation techniques I've found in a book, whose effects I prefer over K.

But back to your relationship with M. Who's calling the shots in it? Is it two ways, like healthy relationships should be? Or does he call all the shots? And is that the way you started out wanting it? Were you even looking for a relationship? Somehow, probably, before you know what hit you, you were the servant kissing the master's feet. Now you're stuck in that gear, and can't even remember when you came to Maharaji, a stupid, imaginative, gullible, youth looking to learn some meditation techniques that some snake oil salesman and his suckers convinced you would reveal to you the reason you exist.

You sorry sap.

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Date: Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 01:55:49 (GMT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: Premie on-looker
Subject: Great! Like I need logic lessons from cultniks!
Message:
The people here seem in the main to have a very hostile attitude towards those who differ from what seems to me as a group 'attitude'.
Yet, one of the main criticisms aimed at premies and I guess Maharaji is that of 'clonish or cultish' thinking.
This seems highly contradictory and hypocritical.
It is illogical.
You can't have it both ways.
How can individuals here reveal characteristics that appear powerfully like those they claim premies have?

You stupid fool. If you drive your car down the street and everyone starts screaming at you 'Go back! Go back!' it could be because they're all in a cult and were brainwashed into following this script. On the other hand, you might be driving the wrong way down a one-way street, a point obvious to everyone but you.

Get it? The fact that there is a consensus says nothing, on its own, about whether or not it's justified. You guys are hopeless.

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Date: Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 01:41:31 (GMT)
From: Helen
Email: None
To: Premie on-looker
Subject: you have no 'relationship' with maharaji
Message:
'Your relationship with Maharaji' *IS* indeed a private affair because you are having a relationship with a little man on a throne in your brain. You have no 'relationship' with him on any objective level. Do you understand that?

He isn't interested in a 'relationship' with you. Otherwise you and he would be writing letters, corresponding, hanging out and 'keeping in touch'. Ask people here, they have tried in their darkest hours to get some inkling from M that he really cared about them--but he turned away from them. He can't be bothered. M doesn't *DO* 'relationships'. If you are satisfied with your 'relationship' with the little man in your head, fine, but just be real about what it is.

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Date: Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 07:23:31 (GMT)
From: PeterPaul
Email: None
To: Helen
Subject: edited
Message:
edited
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Date: Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 15:02:54 (GMT)
From: Jerry
Email: None
To: PeterPaul
Subject: This moron should go
Message:
Let's try and put into effect Nigel's suggestion of voting a premie off the forum. I recommend that PeterPaul be banned from further participation. Anybody want to second the motion? And PP, you ain't got no brains, does you? Heh, heh.
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Date: Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 17:14:39 (GMT)
From: Katie
Email: None
To: Jerry
Subject: This moron should go
Message:
Hi Jerry -
That guy is 'the Rapper' - my least favorite poster of all time. Usually uses a different name each time he posts - amazing that he's stuck with the same name for three posts in a row. Never says anything relevant to anything, IMHO, and constantly insults people or groups of people (not just exes), so I agree about blocking him.

Katie

P.S. I am a big fan of yours too, Jerry :)

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Date: Thurs, Jul 13, 2000 at 00:48:20 (GMT)
From: Jerry
Email: None
To: Katie
Subject: Well, shucks, Katie
Message:
Thanks, Katie:)
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Date: Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 16:09:46 (GMT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: Jerry
Subject: Yes (but then I'm an easy vote to tap)
Message:
For sure this bum should go.

But guess what? I say Mili should too. Fucking jerk won't answer any questions and keeps sniping at us thoughtlessly. How many more years of THAT should we look forward to?

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Date: Thurs, Jul 13, 2000 at 00:44:56 (GMT)
From: Jerry
Email: None
To: Jim
Subject: Yes (but then I'm an easy vote to tap)
Message:
If you're talking about the questions about where he presented false evidence to shut down an ex site, I'd say yeah, I'll second your motion to get rid of him. Unless, of course, he can prove he never tried to do such a thing, which he's never attempted. Yeah, you're right. He's sitting too pretty just ignoring the questions. He should be forced to address them, or be banished. Right now, as it stands, he's grinning too broadly (I imagine) knowing he doesn't have to deal with it.
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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 11:55:03 (GMT)
From: JohnT
Email: None
To: Jim
Subject: Yes... I agree
Message:
This is a fight to destroy a false god and all his evil works. What place have they here, who come not to bury Caesar, but to praise him?
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Date: Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 06:30:36 (GMT)
From: chr
Email: None
To: Helen
Subject: you have no 'relationship' with maharaji
Message:
This is very true Helen. I know of premies who were actually around him for years who still had to have a relationship with the little man in their head. M is very selective about who he talks to-you can even be close to him physically over a long period of time and have no discourse or even acknowledgement that you exist. This has put many premies through a lot and it was usually rationalised as ego destroying or confronting the mind.
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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 00:05:30 (GMT)
From: Helen
Email: None
To: chr
Subject: you have no 'relationship' with maharaji
Message:
thanks chr. Yes, I think M is anti-relationship really. and the whole idea of a 'private relationship, just you and him in your heart' is really a coward's way out don't you think? The coward I am referring to here is M.
But the whole house of cards is built on that and it all comes tumbling down, doesn't it, when the true reality of M's sucktitude* as a human being comes into clear focus.

*Sucktitude is the copyright of Daneane and means general suckiness

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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 02:28:17 (GMT)
From: Daneane
Email: None
To: Helen
Subject: Yes,if it wasn't fer me,there would b no suckitude
Message:
Interesting play on words.

That private relationship thing is really sad. It's like a longing to be connected to something or someone to the detriment of believing in yourself.

I hate seeing premies attribute soooo much to M that just ain't there.

The Beggar.

Sick, sick, sick.

Compassion for those afflicted...but I gotta remember...

it's still sick, sick, sick.

ps. 'Suckitude' is a shared copyright with my best friend. We both suck equally.

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Date: Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 01:26:13 (GMT)
From: Sir Dave
Email: sirdavid12@hotmail.com
To: Premie on-looker
Subject: It's almost like telepathy, man
Message:
People always form into groups. That's a characteristic of a species which is social. This group isn't really here though. It doesn't really exist. It's only the thoughts in people's heads transcribed onto whirling computer disks.

The internet is the next best thing to long distance telepathy. This forum and the writings on it are people's previously hidden thoughts all suddenly splurged out onto a myriad computers all over the world.

For that reason, you can't really critisise this forum. This forum just is. It is the sum total of some people's thoughts on a particular subject. If you think it's wrong then you're saying those people's thoughts are wrong.

Your thoughts on the subject are different to some of the other contributors here. So you add your thoughts to ours and then your thoughts provoke other thoughts from us. It's a natural, ongoing process.

There really is no consensus between all the people here. I mean, who can think louder than someone else? But this is a fine medium of fast flowing thoughts; of ideas and memories. Nothing is right or wrong here because there's no judge or jury. There's just thoughts expressed.

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Date: Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 00:21:21 (GMT)
From: PeterPaul
Email: None
To: Everyone
Subject: BE QUIET, BE STILL, BE REAL, OH MY
Message:
Y was my
b quiet be still be real omy
post deleted??????????????????
one day we will be forced to be
quiet, still.
this is our, all, everyone's destiny.
now being real
that's one we do when with breath.
can one be real w/o breath.
o baah humburg, you say.
baah..baah..black sheep
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Date: Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 03:49:36 (GMT)
From: G
Email: None
To: PeterPaul
Subject: BE QUIET
Message:

Y was my
b quiet be still be real omy
post deleted??????????????????

I don't understand why you think it's
cool to write Y instead of Why, etc.

one day we will be forced to be
quiet, still.
this is our, all, everyone's destiny.

Why do you assume that when we die we
will be 'quiet' and 'still'? Our bodies
will disintegrate. Other than that,
nobody really knows what death means.

now being real
that's one we do when with breath.

By 'being real' do you mean being alive?
What are you trying to say?

can one be real w/o breath.

Free divers can hold their breath
for six minutes. While they are
doing this, they are real and alive.
If breathing stops for too long we
die. What is your point?

o baah humburg, you say.
baah..baah..black sheep

You mean 'bah humbug', meaning I
suppose that you think that people
who no longer worship Prem Rawat
are Scrooges. Not so.

I like breath meditation, but you
seem to have some weird concepts
about the breath.

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Date: Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 02:37:31 (GMT)
From: Jerry
Email: None
To: PeterPaul
Subject: BE QUIET, BE STILL, BE REAL, OH MY
Message:
Now, here's a perfect example of a jerk who's crashed our party. Now, think about how you'd feel if you were at a social gathering, and PeterPaul showed up. Wouldn't he be a joy to be with? I'll tell you right now. If it was my house that the gathering was, I'd tell PP that he'd have to leave. And if he asked me why, I'd tell him because he's disturbing the other guests.

Everybody thinks you're weird, PP. Whaddya say we call it a night? Eh? You've had enough.

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Date: Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 03:39:27 (GMT)
From: VP
Email: None
To: Jerry
Subject: Jerry, I am laughing so hard--ot
Message:
Jerry,

Would you seriously ask someone to leave your house? Are you etiquitte impaired? Where I come from you never ask a guest to leave.

One time I was throwing this huge party and this guy I know called me an asshole at the top of his lungs IN MY HOUSE. All because we disagreed on a political point. I didn't even ask him to leave. I just went over to the other side of the room and asked the bartender to make me another drink. Shit, what was WRONG with me?

Seriously, I think that is one weird post and I don't understand it. If we ever do have this ex-premie party here, I am NOT going to tolerate any of that kind of mumbo jumbo. No, siree, I'm having bouncers at that shindig, but don't tell Mr. Hacker over on the Spanish forum. He'll break into an investigation of my personal finances...

Have a good one, Jerry

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Date: Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 14:48:42 (GMT)
From: Jerry
Email: None
To: VP
Subject: Jerry, I am laughing so hard--ot
Message:
Hi Veep,

Maybe a more appropriate way to say it is this is our home, and guys like PP, while not formally invited to visit are welcome outsiders to drop by if they feel so inclined. You extend a welcome, but you expect a certain amount of decency from them if they stop in. If they come in like babbling idiots, calling us 'black sheep' like PP just did, the welcome is withdrawn, and rightfully so. We've been dissed. We don't have to stand for that.

Glad you got a laugh out of my post. I think you're my biggest fan :)

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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 22:27:07 (GMT)
From: Robyn
Email: None
To: Jerry
Subject: Jerry, I am laughing so hard--ot
Message:
Dear Jerry,
Not your only fan though. :) I have been weening myself from the forums and now from the internet all together but I have always enjoyed reading you and of course think of you on hot days while I sunbath by a picturesque(sp) creek, standing in line at that fountain. :)
Love ya,
Robyn
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Date: Thurs, Jul 13, 2000 at 01:32:18 (GMT)
From: Jerry
Email: None
To: Robyn
Subject: Jerry, I am laughing so hard--ot
Message:
Hi Robyn,

I noticed that you hadn't been coming around much, lately. I hope all is well with you. Yes, it is tough waiting on line for that fountain. You bumpkins down by the creek don't know how good you have it. Well, take a dip on me, and when it's my turn, I'll take an extra slurp in honor of you.

Take care.

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Date: Thurs, Jul 13, 2000 at 18:14:09 (GMT)
From: Robyn
Email: None
To: Jerry
Subject: Jerry, I am laughing so hard--ot
Message:
Dear Jerry,
Yes, things are hectic, disorganized, up in the air etc but still good. I moved so I am 2hrs from work but live rent free in a huge and empty hotel in the middle of nowhere and loving it. 10 min walk from a creek with 2 waterfalls, 10 miles from a state park with a huge lake, life is good. Am working 5 overnights at work each month and looks like the job is going to improve big time over the next 6months as far as what I do and also increasing hours. That is the synapsis, big time! :)
Hope you are well.
Love,
Robyn
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Date: Thurs, Jul 13, 2000 at 20:06:53 (GMT)
From: cq
Email: None
To: Robyn
Subject: Yo Robyn, ... if nothing else, at least you can
Message:
Yo Robyn, ... if nothing else, at least you can be proud of the fact that, since leaving the Maha ...

... your spelling's improved no end!!!

;) I'm sure that's the least of it.

Happy days,

Chris

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Date: Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 18:22:59 (GMT)
From: Veep
Email: None
To: Jerry
Subject: Jerry, I am a fan
Message:
Hope you know I was kidding you about being etiquette impaired. PeterPaul's post was the one I thought was weird, NOT yours-just to clarify.
Your fan (I am)
VP
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Date: Thurs, Jul 13, 2000 at 01:35:11 (GMT)
From: Jerry
Email: None
To: Veep
Subject: Jerry, I am a fan
Message:
No problem, Veep:)
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Date: Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 01:01:39 (GMT)
From: Sir Dave
Email: None
To: PeterPaul
Subject: Why not worship the blood?
Message:
It's a nice colour and you can't do much without it. In fact, you'll look even worse without blood than without your breath.

You've watched too many Maharaji videos, pal. They're addling your brain. Give it a break. What is it? Just some breath meditation. We all know about that, except Maharaji who thinks he's the sole expert on what is obvious to everybody else.

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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 22:29:12 (GMT)
From: Robyn
Email: None
To: Sir Dave
Subject: Why not worship the blood?
Message:
Hi again Dave,
Your post gave me the funniest image of people trying to follow their blood instead of their breath, funny and probably more aggitating then calming. :)
Love,
Robyn
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Date: Thurs, Jul 13, 2000 at 02:07:48 (GMT)
From: G
Email: None
To: Robyn
Subject: No go, eh? Maybe in France?
Message:
Well, maybe blood meditation wouldn't catch on in the states.

But maybe it would in France, the French are already so obsessed with the blood, given all their sayings about it. N'est-ce-pas JM?

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Date: Thurs, Jul 13, 2000 at 18:16:27 (GMT)
From: Robyn
Email: None
To: G
Subject: No go, eh? Maybe in France?
Message:
Dear G,
Hi! :) We always come up with these wonderful guru scams but never move on them, think this one has real possibilities and we could always stay with JM! :)
Love,
Robyn
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Date: Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 04:03:36 (GMT)
From: G
Email: None
To: Sir Dave
Subject: blood meditation
Message:
Why not worship the blood?

Yes, why isn't there blood meditation?
Focus on the beating of the heart, the
flow of the blood. You know, I might
have just come up with an original
technique, so keep it quiet ok? Maybe I
can patent it, set myself up in the
Guru business as Guru G with this
secret technique of mine. It's all mine!
I'll call it the 'Divine Rhythm' and
'Divine Flow'.

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Date: Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 12:37:12 (GMT)
From: Sir Dave
Email: None
To: G
Subject: blood meditation
Message:
And you've got the 'Holy Blood' and can also patent the Heart. Look, there's more to this than meets the eye.

Jim obviously worships the brain, you have the heart and premies can worship Maharaji's ass. I mean, it's big enough. And his breath too since there's plenty of hot air coming out.

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Date: Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 00:28:55 (GMT)
From: Daneane
Email: None
To: PeterPaul
Subject: Humburg???
Message:
Is that anywhere near Hamburg?? I here it's beautiful there. So real, truly breath-taking.

Can one be real without breath?

Yes, I believe that is called a corpse. Does give quite a real stench I've been told.

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Date: Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 07:13:25 (GMT)
From: PeterPaul
Email: None
To: Daneane
Subject: Hamberg???
Message:
wow.
reel 2 reel communications: communes
the good ole'days.
where the tao was equal to being here now.
And finally, {I am aware that it is improper english 2 start a
sentence with and}, but...
a post from current K practititioner,
which @ first glance is rather prudent.
In Amsterdam some eat french fries with mayonaisse.
EVERYBODY....is a phrase out of touch with reality.
U is not everybody and you isn't / ain't no good @ being free.
Live and let live, and leave the driving to us.
Why do I say 'Y' instead of 'why'?
cause it's easier to spell and is faster more efficient.
aqarian age is almost here, hang on amigos.
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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 00:07:25 (GMT)
From: Daneane
Email: None
To: PeterPaul
Subject: Live and let live??
Message:
You probably don't vote either.

What I don't get is if you believe in live and let live...why would you post here?? Shouldn't you be out blissfully and freely living in the world?

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Date: Mon, Jul 10, 2000 at 20:35:04 (GMT)
From: Forum Administrator
Email: forumfour@hotmail.com
To: Everyone
Subject: Links from the Forum
Message:
I regret that I have had to quickly take the decision to remove the link to Roger's webpage from the Forum. I do not feel it necessary to get into a dialogue with Roger to discuss whether or not he would care to remove the offending link on his page before taking this action. It is his choice to have whatever content he chooses on his own site but there is nothing written that states that Forum V should have a link to the House of eDrek or for that matter any other website set up privately by any other ex-premie.

At the moment another effort is underway to draw press attention to the ex-premie vs. Elan Vital situation. I am well aware that the journalists involved would drop their interest like a hot stone if they were to find links to material of this nature directly from Ex-Premie.org.

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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 02:38:07 (GMT)
From: Tonette
Email: None
To: everyone
Subject: Roger's site-Please children
Message:
Stop the bickering! I don't object to 'boobieji,' it's funny actually! Maharaji does has lots of fat and with that big tits, literally! Satire as mentioned previously in an earlier post. It is funny. The clown well, just because I don't see the humor, it's there none-the-less. I imagine it as premies fucking themselves in following Maharaji and his dictates. Satire again. Most people will never discover the other links there. Roger said that without those 'pillars' the whole site would crumble. I am no web master but I think it is in everyone's interest to keep his site on line. Let's find some solutions and support each other. After all, isn't that what this site is all about?
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Date: Mon, Jul 10, 2000 at 23:41:52 (GMT)
From: Roger eDrek
Email: drek@oz.net
To: Forum Administrator
Subject: Sounds good to me. Besides...
Message:
Ex-Premie.org has not paid me for the last 4 months of having my link on their anyway. This saves me the trouble of having my lawyers threaten legal action.
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Date: Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 10:45:18 (GMT)
From: Nigel
Email: fitzroy@liverpool.ac.uk
To: Roger eDrek
Subject: Bad time to do this, Rog
Message:
It's none of my business what you want to put on your site, but I was just getting a bit of national press interest in EV's bully-boy tactics towards ex sites - yours being the main focus of interest. I'm pretty sure they're not going to touch the story if they see those links.

I know it's fun to show the hamster maximum disrespect by whatever means, but I reckon you are going to alienate a lot of would-be supporters. Just my opinion, of course.

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Date: Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 15:44:12 (GMT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: Nigel
Subject: I'm with Nigel on this one, Roger
Message:
I have to admit that the justification for defiling Maharaji's image so grossly threatens to be lost on the casual observer. Hell, even half the exes don't appreciate the cathartic powers of a good anti-idolatry bit of post-cult exorcism. So, yes, I have to agree that, funny as they are (fairly funny), the pics of Maharaji with Ponocchio etc. detract more than they assist.
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Date: Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 18:40:09 (GMT)
From: Roger eDrek
Email: drek@oz.net
To: Jim
Subject: Forget it! It is what it is.
Message:
I didn't change the tacky content for Elan Vital and I'm not going to change it for you guys either.

It stands as is.

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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 01:19:13 (GMT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: Roger eDrek
Subject: Can we talk about this?
Message:
Come on, Roger. EV tried to force you to change your content for its reasons. Nigel and I and whoever else are trying to persuade you to change it for our reasons. It's the reasons that matter. So why won't you look at this? Maybe our reasons aren't persuasive, maybe they are. But just because EV wanted the same thing, assuming that they did, doesn't mean the objective isn't right, albeit for different reasons.
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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 03:17:07 (GMT)
From: Roger eDrek
Email: drek@oz.net
To: Jim
Subject: SHOW ME THE MONEY! (NT)
Message:
ADSF
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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 04:46:41 (GMT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: Roger eDrek
Subject: Shit, Roger, you haven't even seen my presentation
Message:
I learned how to use Powerpoint and everything. But no, there you are, mind made up and all. Oh well. I DO pray for your soul, brother. Not to mention your journalistic integrity. Don't you know Maharaji's had a breast reduction?
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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 16:53:47 (GMT)
From: Roger eDrek
Email: drek@oz.net
To: Jim
Subject: Let me tell you about my operation
Message:
Ok, Maharaji had breast reduction surgery, but I had a penidectomy. Damn thing was too long. Tired of tripping over it.
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Date: Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 00:33:08 (GMT)
From: Tonette
Email: None
To: Everyone
Subject: Porn and unfortunately Roger' Site
Message:
I truely found Roger's site a wonderful place to explore all the misconceptions and lies perpetrated by Maharaji and his group. I am sorry that Roger won't? consider removing the porn links from his site. Would you Roger? Why have it there? Your site was a wealth of information and history. I agree with the FA with his decision and am glad that he is so quick of spirit to make what, I, consider to be the right decision. I'm sorry if it will be a financial loss not being linked to ex-premie. Actually I'm surprised there was any sort of advertising involving a money exchange in the first place. Oh well, time for me to get with the millennium.
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Date: Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 03:13:38 (GMT)
From: Roger eDrek
Email: drek@oz.net
To: Tonette
Subject: Yeah, I'm going to have to get a job now
Message:
Thanks for caring, Tonette.

I'm going to lose millions without the link here on the big page.

I'm going to have get a goddamn job! Christ, after all these years where I paid and paid and never had nothing. I'm finally making some money on this Guru game and they take it away from me.

Damn, I know I'm going to have to surrender this one to Maharaji.

So-hung, so-hung, so-hung...

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Date: Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 01:41:36 (GMT)
From: Sir Dave
Email: None
To: Tonette
Subject: Porn and unfortunately Roger' Site
Message:
Don't believe everything you read here, Tonette.

And Roger, you now owe me $1,398 for the past 14 months of my link to your website from Not Maharaji's Mixed Bag.

I should also remind you Roger, that you still haven't paid the graphic artist for the clown icon on that site, of which I own sole copyright. Neither have you paid the clown for his sitting in the artist's studio. Look Roger, pay for that icon or the clown gets it, OK?

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Date: Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 03:10:02 (GMT)
From: Roger eDrek
Email: drek@oz.net
To: Sir Dave
Subject: Sue me!
Message:
That's right! Line up behind Elan Vital and it's powerful law firm Mudbank, Tweaker, & Hardly a Real McCoy and sue me!

You and your damn clown anyway! I put that clown on the map!

And to Tonette, I can't remove the links to the porno because they are the pillars, the structural foundation of the entire site. It will all come crashing down like a house of cards if I remove those links.

And besides I haven't been laid in over six years and I need something to look at. Ok, I don't really go to the bestiality website. If them animals ain't well done barbied I don't want 'em.

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Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000 at 00:19:32 (GMT)
From: Sir Dave
Email: None
To: Roger eDrek
Subject: You're in big trouble now Roger
Message:
My lawyers have now informed me that the clown is none other than a certain Mr Punch of the famous travelling duo, 'Punch & Judy'. They've been in contact with Mr Punch's lawyers and there's a big writ on its way to you for gross malpractice and defamation of Mr Punch's character.

I should also add that a firm of Italian lawyers are also on your case, working on behalf of their client, a Mr Gusseppi Pinnochio of Naples who is claiming payment for a stage act which he has performed every night on the House of Drek.

I wouldn't want to be in your shoes. Phew!!!

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Date: Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 16:59:16 (GMT)
From: Daneane
Email: None
To: Roger eDrek
Subject: Sue me!
Message:
Ooooooooh. Sorry Rog, I assumed that hot Halloween mama was your wife.
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Date: Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 20:41:03 (GMT)
From: Roger eDrek
Email: drek@oz.net
To: Daneane
Subject: She's not my wife, she is my dominatrix (nt)
Message:
aadsf
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Date: Tues, Jul 11, 2000 at 06:40:55 (GMT)
From: chr
Email: None
To: Roger eDrek
Subject: Sue me!
Message:
geez, have you really not been laid in six years? I abstained for many years while I was in the ashram-had a break in 76 so I could remember what to do. Celibacy sends you a bit crazy after a while. Anyway, I've been married now for 16 years so I don't need to worry about it anymore.I got through the crazy times of an ex married to a premie by the skin of my teeth. Trouble was, I was the premie at the time.

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