Forum V: Archive
Compiled: Sun, Sep 10, 2000 at 19:08:00 (GMT)
From: Sep 02, 2000 To: Sep 09, 2000 Page: 5 Of: 5


Jim -:- Whaddup? -:- Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 01:20:00 (GMT)
__ Rob -:- Welcome back -:- Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 03:51:27 (GMT)
__ __ Jim -:- Welcome back -:- Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 04:03:26 (GMT)
__ __ __ Selene -:- my husband plays lap steel -:- Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 04:06:54 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Jim -:- my husband plays lap steel -:- Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 04:14:13 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Selene -:- he plays everything -:- Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 04:21:14 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ gErRy -:- Patty plays a mean skin flute and... -:- Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 04:18:42 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ Selene -:- my wacko sicko friend -:- Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 05:20:24 (GMT)

Gerry -:- Free SB !!! -:- Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 00:04:40 (GMT)
__ hal -:- I'd love an SB -:- Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 19:25:43 (GMT)
__ Salam -:- SB where are you? -:- Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 03:46:45 (GMT)
__ __ sb -:- SB where are you? -:- Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 04:43:02 (GMT)
__ __ __ Salam -:- Got you...nt -:- Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 06:01:48 (GMT)
__ Forum Admin -:- Free SB !!! -:- Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 00:12:50 (GMT)
__ __ gerry -:- OK, I saw that below after I posted... -:- Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 00:14:26 (GMT)

Forum Admin -:- Recent exes / Danish exes -:- Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 22:15:50 (GMT)
__ Salam -:- Recent exes / Danish exes -:- Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 06:24:41 (GMT)

JohnT -:- Autumn (ot) -:- Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 17:32:37 (GMT)
__ Selene -:- thanks for posting that JohnT -:- Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 05:28:54 (GMT)
__ Jenn -:- Autumn (ot) -:- Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 18:58:59 (GMT)
__ __ JohnT -:- Beautiful Autumn (ot) -:- Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 20:03:53 (GMT)
__ __ __ Jenn -:- Beautiful Autumn (ot) -:- Tues, Sep 05, 2000 at 02:01:30 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ JohnT -:- Journey -:- Tues, Sep 05, 2000 at 23:29:17 (GMT)

Lurkex -:- Healing rather than looping. -:- Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 17:24:54 (GMT)
__ from one who cares -:- Healing rather than looping. -:- Tues, Sep 05, 2000 at 08:33:57 (GMT)
__ __ Jim -:- Hey, let's all do some rebirthing! (nt) -:- Tues, Sep 05, 2000 at 15:15:05 (GMT)
__ Jim -:- Sorry, that simply does NOT compute -:- Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 02:41:14 (GMT)
__ __ gerry -:- Explain how the 'shame' thing works again? -:- Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 03:38:33 (GMT)
__ __ __ Jim -:- Explain how the 'shame' thing works again? -:- Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 04:05:07 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Jim -:- THIS is shame -:- Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 04:08:02 (GMT)
__ la-ex -:- WOW!!! -:- Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 18:21:57 (GMT)
__ __ gerry -:- Elaine wanted us all to know... -:- Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 05:14:16 (GMT)

Sleuth -:- found a PAM link -:- Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 08:05:47 (GMT)
__ G -:- found a PAM link -:- Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 13:30:48 (GMT)
__ __ JTF -:- found a PAM link -:- Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 13:45:56 (GMT)
__ __ __ G -:- some more -:- Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 13:59:08 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ G -:- ADVC -:- Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 15:36:11 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Salam -:- I have tried in vaine -:- Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 06:19:15 (GMT)

Oliver -:- Happy Father's to all Aussie Dads (nt) -:- Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 07:33:45 (GMT)
__ Oliver -:- (Ooops) Happy Father's DAY to all Aussie Dads -:- Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 07:37:06 (GMT)

Skippy -:- secret garden -:- Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 01:23:20 (GMT)
__ Hal -:- help is on the way ! -:- Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 06:42:08 (GMT)
__ __ Sir Dave -:- So secret that nobody knows where it is -:- Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 11:23:24 (GMT)

Hal -:- Stoner ? -:- Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 20:02:02 (GMT)
__ Stonor -:- Hal ? -:- Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 01:53:32 (GMT)
__ __ Hal -:- Stonor -:- Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 06:06:48 (GMT)
__ __ __ Stonor -:- Hal -:- Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 15:06:21 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ gerry -:- Stonor could you elaborate a little? -:- Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 17:44:56 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Stonor -:- Stonor could you elaborate a little? -:- Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 18:59:09 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ Hal -:- elaborate at recent exes then ..I'd appreciate... -:- Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 19:21:37 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ Stonor -:- elaborate at recent exes then ..I'd appreciate... -:- Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 20:11:25 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Hal -:- please do nt -:- Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 20:13:28 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ gerry -:- Sorry Stonor this doesn't cut it. -:- Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 19:20:11 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Hal -:- You think therefore it must be right ! Fuck you -:- Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 17:43:00 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Stonor -:- I don't respond to verbal abuse. (nt) -:- Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 19:00:31 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ Hal -:- Above it all I guess ? nt -:- Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 19:11:51 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ Stonor -:- Saddened by it all. nt -:- Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 19:15:08 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ hal -:- Creating our own reality -:- Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 20:12:11 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Stonor -:- will discuss privately -:- Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 20:17:19 (GMT)
__ __ __ Katie -:- Stonor, Hal, SB, G, et al. -:- Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 15:32:33 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Stonor -:- Hi Katie! -:- Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 19:57:17 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Selene -:- always in control; that is how I see you -:- Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 20:13:35 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ SB -:- Nobody is there -:- Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 22:48:25 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Hal -:- Your heart is sweet ! -:- Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 17:58:49 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ G -:- Katie -:- Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 15:48:50 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Katie -:- Katie -:- Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 15:55:51 (GMT)
__ __ __ Why -:- Good post HAL !! (nt) -:- Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 09:25:13 (GMT)
__ Stonor -:- For the record ... -:- Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 01:44:37 (GMT)
__ Stoner's credo -:- Stoner ? -:- Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 22:05:16 (GMT)
__ __ clarification -:- Stoner's credo is NOT stoner -:- Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 22:32:37 (GMT)
__ __ __ G -:- 'go fight M' -:- Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 22:54:56 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Hal -:- 'go fight M' -:- Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 22:59:23 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ G -:- argumentative tactics -:- Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 23:09:42 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ Hal -:- Thanks G -:- Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 23:18:21 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ SB -:- That is IT (ot) -:- Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 01:36:28 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Hal -:- Love to you SB -:- Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 07:48:27 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ SB -:- To you too, tons. (nt) -:- Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 09:41:47 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ G -:- I'm not asking for lots of censorship (nt) -:- Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 23:27:17 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ Hal -:- BTW I do have a soft spot for stonor -:- Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 23:21:31 (GMT)
__ __ SB -:- bs!!!!!! GOOD ONE, not (nt) -:- Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 22:08:53 (GMT)
__ __ __ Hal -:- Sorry I cant stand being preached to..... -:- Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 22:45:11 (GMT)
__ __ G -:- FA - I think this thread should be deleted (nt) -:- Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 22:08:23 (GMT)
__ __ __ Hal -:- FA - I think this thread should be deleted (nt) -:- Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 22:12:53 (GMT)
__ __ __ Why -:- Why? -:- Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 22:09:36 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ G -:- Why -:- Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 22:18:26 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ why -:- I see. Sorry. (nt) -:- Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 22:50:57 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ wrong G -:- no one falsely used anything -:- Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 22:26:09 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ G -:- a sexist remark -:- Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 02:03:11 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ Stonor -:- a sexist remark -:- Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 02:18:56 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ WHY -:- Wrong forum (nt) -:- Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 09:42:35 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ Selene -:- a sexisnope I'm selene so is it still sexist???? -:- Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 02:07:32 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Monmot -:- To Selene -:- Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 16:43:03 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Selene -:- thankyou Monmot -:- Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 17:12:15 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Helen -:- Hey Selene -:- Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 03:47:35 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Selene -:- it posted ***and*** I talked to sister dearest! -:- Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 04:13:15 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Helen -:- it posted ***and*** I talked to sister dearest! -:- Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 14:45:13 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Selene -:- didn't she write that book about writing? -:- Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 17:12:04 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ SB -:- You are not -:- Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 18:31:35 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Michael -:- Hey Selene, do you want to talk? -:- Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 02:10:34 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Selene -:- yes I do -:- Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 02:24:33 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Michael -:- Just know that I am available... -:- Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 02:32:44 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Selene -:- waiting on yet another call.... -:- Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 02:38:52 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Michael -:- Just sent you an email NT -:- Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 03:14:41 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ JohnT -:- mine too -:- Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 02:32:30 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Katie -:- Selene and JohnT -:- Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 15:35:50 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ SB -:- To You -:- Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 09:40:41 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Selene -:- thankyou John -:- Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 08:30:01 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Michael -:- I'm sorry, John -:- Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 03:45:59 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ halo -:- I'm sorry, John -:- Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 08:08:38 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Selene -:- You are appreciated -:- Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 08:17:46 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ JohnT -:- Thanks, Michael -:- Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 07:50:30 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ G -:- 'pick a pseudonym, and stick to it' -:- Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 22:33:56 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ Wrong G -:- 'pick a pseudonym, and stick to it' -:- Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 22:39:51 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ G -:- JohnT -:- Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 01:52:34 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ JohnT -:- Here I am -:- Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 03:10:18 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ gerry -:- Hey JohnT -:- Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 04:15:19 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ G -:- John -:- Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 03:28:24 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ JohnT -:- G -:- Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 17:09:07 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ G -:- John -:- Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 18:16:43 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Selene -:- lighten the fuck up -:- Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 01:59:20 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ G -:- I'm sorry -:- Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 02:16:02 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Selene and PS!! -:- typo I swear regarding sig -:- Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 02:02:29 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ gerry -:- Selene... -:- Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 02:27:24 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Selene -:- thank you gerry -:- Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 08:12:14 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Jerry -:- Now this is somebody who should be called an idiot -:- Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 01:18:55 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Selene -:- I'll be the first to agree I'm an idiot -:- Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 09:10:18 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Jerry -:- Oops! -:- Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 16:39:05 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Selene -:- let them complain who csres? -:- Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 17:27:00 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ G -:- Selene -:- Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 15:10:08 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Selene -:- hey G -:- Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 17:09:59 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ G -:- posting under another person's name -:- Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 22:25:30 (GMT)

psych major -:- elan vital's real title? -:- Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 17:11:06 (GMT)
__ cq -:- elan vital's real title? -:- Tues, Sep 05, 2000 at 18:36:14 (GMT)
__ Salam -:- Good one..nt -:- Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 17:43:53 (GMT)

Salam -:- Chuck, Amtext and motivation -:- Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 15:44:21 (GMT)

JTF -:- Choice A or Choice B(not really OT) -:- Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 11:17:23 (GMT)
__ Salam -:- Choice A or Choice B(not really OT) -:- Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 15:54:34 (GMT)
__ __ G -:- Choice A or Choice B(not really OT) -:- Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 17:03:24 (GMT)

Zelda -:- background color -:- Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 08:37:18 (GMT)
__ Jerry -:- Feng Shui, Zelda? -:- Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 08:55:54 (GMT)
__ __ Zelda -:- Feng Shui, Zelda? -:- Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 11:26:08 (GMT)
__ __ __ G -:- Feng Shui? -:- Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 16:28:15 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Zelda -:- Feng Shui? -:- Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 22:47:03 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Jerry -:- Straw man? -:- Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 17:05:36 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Zelda -:- Straw man? -:- Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 22:55:11 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ G -:- Oh well ... -:- Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 23:02:14 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ G -:- the book -:- Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 19:09:26 (GMT)

buzz -:- glen whittaker -:- Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 05:53:51 (GMT)
__ Stonor -:- another example of self-propagating bullying. (nt) -:- Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 06:12:00 (GMT)
__ __ Hal -:- Glen was a schoolteacher you know ! nt -:- Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 06:37:55 (GMT)
__ __ __ Stonora -:- Glen was a schoolteacher you know ! nt -:- Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 06:42:31 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Humble Hal -:- Hey Stonor it's me Hal - relax, just kidding you -:- Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 06:48:36 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Stonora la 'stupida' -:- Hey Hal - it's beem a long night, ... -:- Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 06:59:42 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ Hal -:- I really didn't mean any offense.. -:- Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 17:37:03 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ Stonor -:- I really didn't mean any offense.. -:- Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 17:52:13 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Hal -:- How about letting go of it ? -:- Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 19:44:14 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ G -:- 'just kidding' -:- Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 16:53:04 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ Stonor -:- Thanks for the link, G. -:- Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 17:42:10 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ Hal -:- So pompous ! nt -:- Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 17:31:54 (GMT)

Curious George -:- Rich Premies flock to Amaroo -:- Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 02:36:46 (GMT)
__ King Munmut -:- How can you be a 'Rich Premie' -:- Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 02:02:11 (GMT)
__ __ cq -:- Perhaps they just like to hang out with the Lord, -:- Tues, Sep 05, 2000 at 18:14:49 (GMT)
__ Jean-Michel -:- Maybe for one of His Seminars? -:- Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 07:05:51 (GMT)
__ __ Lotus eater -:- Maybe for one of His Seminars? -:- Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 20:17:53 (GMT)
__ __ __ Curious George -:- Did he turn up? -:- Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 14:47:03 (GMT)
__ __ __ Hal -:- Thanks LE - a hot million ! nt -:- Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 23:12:16 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Lotus eater -:- The winds have dropped now -:- Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 20:32:33 (GMT)
__ __ kiwiji -:- hes coming to NEW ZEALAND HE IS COMING TO NEW ZEAL -:- Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 08:10:59 (GMT)
__ __ __ luckdog -:- amaroo -:- Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 20:36:58 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Hal -:- Elvis? -:- Tues, Sep 05, 2000 at 20:11:27 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Curious George -:- amaroo -:- Tues, Sep 05, 2000 at 17:34:33 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Lotus Eater -:- what a curious situation -:- Tues, Sep 05, 2000 at 20:36:46 (GMT)


Date: Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 01:20:00 (GMT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: Everyone
Subject: Whaddup?
Message:
Hi guys.

Just got back from a small tour back east. Toronto, Montreal, Ottawa. Got to see a bunch of people, from before, during and after my cult years. Laurie had never been to eastern Canada at all and I hadn't been back for 14 years. The whole trip was great. Toronto and Montreal are such cool towns, both of them. And Ottawa's so cute in its own sleepy way (as if Victoria isn't sleepier still!). So we did it all, saw everything, talked, played music, partied, laughed. It was all so good.

I saw several former premie friends too. We didn't connect with a few others because we were just so busy but I guess the bottom line is that I can't for the life of me figure out why I'd avoided going home for so long. I won't make that mistake again and will be able to see others next time out. Yup, life's good.

Yesterday, when I went to return our rental, I stopped in at the shopping centre store for the phone company where you can try out their high-speed internet hookup. So I checked out the page. I didn't read any of the known premies' posts. Why bother? I was on holidays. But I did read some of the discussion below regarding 'verbal abuse' and whatnot. I was particularly impressed by Stonor's expanded definition of that term. It's now quite clear to me that my entire mode of communicating is wrong. Mind you, I'm a little wary of saying that as I wonder, could I possibly be subjecting myself to thought abuse with such blanket and unqualified opinions?

Well, it's nice to be nice and I'm trying. Perhaps we should sit on our hands or something. That might help.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 03:51:27 (GMT)
From: Rob
Email: None
To: Jim
Subject: Welcome back
Message:
Lord knows I could do with a vacation too, its been quite a year. I may be in Seattle next year, is that far from you? I'd enjoy doing lunch with you. Yes, I know, I need to phone first:) I will...

Anyway its all been fun and games while you've been away. Bit like a forum version of 'Big Brother' - you know, the TV show where people get voted out, or would 'Survivor' be more accurate?!

Looks like shroomananda took the hint and bowed out for a while, he/she/it had thrown off the last vestige of the 'harmless hippy' disguise and was putting out, raw, unabridged propoganda. Worth a look at the archive, if you've a mind to. One can only wait in anticipation of his/her/its next incarnation.

Bjorn is still hanging around like a fart in a phone booth, thinly disguised as Kjarne (yes Katie, I know, but I got the microphone now and I'm sharing whatever comes through....).

But anyway, you've proven that there is life beyond the forum and I find that so inspiring, I think I'll go buy a guitar and take lessons.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 04:03:26 (GMT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: Rob
Subject: Welcome back
Message:
Thanks Rob,

Yeah, Seattle's just over there. Not far at all.

So call already ..... :)

You want a really cool instrument? This old premie friend of mine from Ottawa, Amory, a great musician then and now, turned me on to lap steel guitar of all things. We jammed one night on some of our tunes and that thing just added this incredible emotionality to it all. I'm gonna get one, yes I am. And they're not that hard to get the basics on either, I think. Open tuning and you get rewards for your mistakes (all those extra slides, up and down, serching for the note you wanted). Just a thought.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 04:06:54 (GMT)
From: Selene
Email: None
To: Jim
Subject: my husband plays lap steel
Message:
circa 1950 National. He treats it like a precious possession, which I am sure it is.
You also missed the obvious. Read the threads Jim.
Sorry I can't meet you in my family visit , unexpected, next week in western Mass. Ships passing in the night no?
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 04:14:13 (GMT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: Selene
Subject: my husband plays lap steel
Message:
What kind of music does he make with it? I'd be interested in taking it a bit outside the usual template.

Sorry about your mum, by the way. What can you say? I lost my father to cancer about twelve years ago. Just going through old photo albums at my mother's in Toronto was really something. Bitter, yes, but really sweet too.

Sigh .....

Good luck and all....

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 04:21:14 (GMT)
From: Selene
Email: None
To: Jim
Subject: he plays everything
Message:
role models for him (not me I'm a hopeless trance music fan):
but his:
Ry Cooder of course. and old is Robert Johnson on slide.
hubbies dad played saxaphone in the Gene Krupa band. old swing aka Benny Goodman etc... did a White House Command Performance for Roosevelt. (sp?)
yeah, family. what to say? Thank you Jim.
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 04:18:42 (GMT)
From: gErRy
Email: None
To: Jim
Subject: Patty plays a mean skin flute and...
Message:
I'm dead if she reads this (snicker.)
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 05:20:24 (GMT)
From: Selene
Email: None
To: gErRy
Subject: my wacko sicko friend
Message:
Keep on changin, you make me look stable!!
ps -- this is tongue in cheek, aFoot in mouth whatever. Just killing time til countdown.
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 00:04:40 (GMT)
From: Gerry
Email: None
To: Everyone
Subject: Free SB !!!
Message:
SB is a perfect example of a person who should be allowed miles of latitude to express any damn thing she wants, any way she sees fit, without censor or censorship.

It really pisses me off to think her posts are being edited or that she is being discouraged to post here.

Come on now folks, she lived in goober's dungeon for decades. What gives?

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 19:25:43 (GMT)
From: hal
Email: None
To: Gerry
Subject: I'd love an SB
Message:
Yes , send me one ,

I'll go for a free anything

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 03:46:45 (GMT)
From: Salam
Email: None
To: Gerry
Subject: SB where are you?
Message:
I hope you are reading this post. Where are you, I have e-mailed you and you do not answer. Are you ok? TALK TO ME TO STUBBORN SPANISH PERSON, I am worried about you.

LOVEYOULOVEYOULOVEYUOLOVEYOU

answer me,

Salam

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 04:43:02 (GMT)
From: sb
Email: None
To: Salam
Subject: SB where are you?
Message:
I LOVE YOU TOOO!!!!!

Busy, busy, very.

I'll email you soon, sorry.

I just came few times, for few minutes.

I'm fine. I feel great. Lard doesn't deserve even one single of my tears.

Just busy, Salam, y tell you more in my email.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 06:01:48 (GMT)
From: Salam
Email: None
To: sb
Subject: Got you...nt
Message:
nt
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 00:12:50 (GMT)
From: Forum Admin
Email: None
To: Gerry
Subject: Free SB !!!
Message:
Gerry, the post below was NOT edited by the FA's. Only one post of hers has ever been edited for reasons clearly stated at the time (in a pretty rowdy thread a couple of weeks back where a few posts were edited. Nothing personal.)

If anyone is discouraging SB from posting, believe me, it isn't the admins.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 00:14:26 (GMT)
From: gerry
Email: None
To: Forum Admin
Subject: OK, I saw that below after I posted...
Message:
Please feel free to delete this thread.
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 22:15:50 (GMT)
From: Forum Admin
Email: forumfour@hotmail.com
To: Everyone
Subject: Recent exes / Danish exes
Message:
A Danish ex-premie has emailed the admins, anxious to know where the recent exes forum is situated. Having never been there, I was unable to help.

He also stated he felt pretty isolated, not knowing any other ex-premies in Denmark.

If anyone could (a) let me know how the guy can make contact with recent exes, or (b) is a Danish ex-premie - or knows of some Danies exes - please drop us a line and I'll pass on any info.

Thanks,
Forum Admin

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 06:24:41 (GMT)
From: Salam
Email: None
To: Forum Admin
Subject: Recent exes / Danish exes
Message:
Try e-mailing to:

recentexes@yahoo.com

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 17:32:37 (GMT)
From: JohnT
Email: None
To: Selene, Gerry and All
Subject: Autumn (ot)
Message:
The round earth in the evening of Autumn
sings of drifting leaves, of growing absense.
Great Night now surely means to overcome
the soft light guttering, sad failing sense.

But see the living wind sculpt supple stems,
see patterns flowing through the fields of grass!
For so it is with us; we're dancing gems,
We form, we whirl, then cease; the wind will pass.

Unfurling lives go spinning through the years
until that wind has blown itself to calm.
The round earth holds us; pale sun dries the tears
on still mourners; for Autumn means no harm.

Fly! crisp leaves of gold returning below.
Dance! soft blades of grass; the wind wants it so.

JohnT

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 05:28:54 (GMT)
From: Selene
Email: None
To: JohnT
Subject: thanks for posting that JohnT
Message:
It comes of course at a very appropriate time for me.
Thanks.
Opposite view, though, here in the damned desert I LOVE September, it promises in 3 or so weeks an end from hell on earth. New Years for me.
Well I'll be back east soon. best time to go really. Tourists flock to see the leaves turning. how strange.
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 18:58:59 (GMT)
From: Jenn
Email: None
To: JohnT
Subject: Autumn (ot)
Message:
John, T.
I wrote this last year when I was feeling sad about the change of season. I normally enjoy fall. Since you shared yours, I'll share mine. Happy Labor Day!
Thanks,
Jennifer


Autumn

Just when you think you will melt under the oppression of summer's dog days, you may find a small orange leaf on the ground. You may not realize the significance of finding this at first, when you feel it's hardened form underneath your toes. It's discovery will surprise, delight and sadden you all at once.

The leaves that just recently gave you shelter from the sweltering sun are now changing colors, falling, rotting. You will miss their whispering voices during the summer rain. No longer will they hang in a soft canopy, dancing gently, feeding your soul. Now they will feed the trees from which they came.

Summer is not long for your world. You mourn her passing like the sweetness of a lover you have taken advantage of, and now long to hold again. Gone are mimosas served at June wedding showers, magnolia blossoms, and bare feet running through sprinklers. The tanned faces of children selling lemonade, cucumber plants and blueberry pies are but a memory. Shake the sand from your shoes and try to forget the lull of the ocean. Kiss your blackeyed susan's goodbye, until next year.

The yellow jackets begin their dance of death. They swarm around you, desperate. Do they know their days are numbered? Autumn is the alarm clock that rings loudly waking you from the dream of summer's bounty. You awaken to remember your mortality as the nature you are connected with dies around you. You watch, helpless and affected.

Autumn pleasures are a more difficult sort than the easy, fickle summer loves. Fall flowers have a sad scent. Yes, you must work for your contentment now, surrounded by death as you are. Autumn pleasure is a true test of human optimism.

You are assisted in this test by a tug of nostalgia. It may be the smell of sharpened number two pencils, a leather football, or a nip in the air that does it. It may be a night long enough to allow Jack Frost to paint the entire world outside your window. What a wonder to see your breath! Is she a silly shy entity who has hidden herself throughout the summer? Perhaps it was just too hot for her then.

Autumn pleasures are slow to come. Cozy sweaters and mugs of soup, fires in the hearth at night, fresh baked bread and thermoses of hot chocolate...these are not as immediate as the twinkling of fireflies, or the song of sacadas (so loud they can drive a man to the edge of sanity and beyond), or the sensuousness of a lover's thigh, naked under the stars. Fight for your right to celebrate life no matter what! Use any means at your disposal. Jump into raked leaves, travel to the mountains, carve a pumpkin!

When you look behind you, seeking summer once more, you will find your fall shadow. Notice that she reflects your corrected image, tall and self assured. So, you think, 'Out of this death, I make life.' And you find ways to fill the void Autumn has left in your soul. The void she leaves this time each year.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 20:03:53 (GMT)
From: JohnT
Email: None
To: Jenn
Subject: Beautiful Autumn (ot)
Message:
Thank you for posting that; poetic truth and beauty are so close - that's a great power.

I read almost everything while I'm here but I'm not sure if I've seen your name before. Maybe once or twice? Hope you post more on-topic off-topics (if you know what I mean :-)

I'm out of here for a while (I keep saying that!). But really, I've got some work to do.

We wrote about the same truth! And used the same title? What fun!

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Tues, Sep 05, 2000 at 02:01:30 (GMT)
From: Jenn
Email: None
To: JohnT
Subject: Beautiful Autumn (ot)
Message:
Thanks, John
There is another Jennifer who posts here, so I use Jenn just so it won't be too confusing. I have a journey on site. There is more to life than Maharaji and sometimes talking about him is a big bore. It's good to go OT occasionally. Enjoy Autumn.
Sincerely,
Jennifer
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Tues, Sep 05, 2000 at 23:29:17 (GMT)
From: JohnT
Email: None
To: Jenn
Subject: Journey
Message:
Hi Jennifer,

I just read your Journey. I don't recall how I first found this site - probably the wife asking me to find the EV website and me spotting the ex-premie.org in the listing that came up.

Then I read all the Journeys. Every one. I wept and raged. I was appalled. The reason I hate Rawat as much as I do (which is more than I can express - and believe me, I've given it my best shot!) is in the Journeys - including yours.

He perverts the love and idealism of open-hearted and beautiful people into something sordid and evil.

That filthy fraud Rawat first came into my life when I was 17 or so, and still at school. I never bought into the scene. I was fucked up enough; not nice enough tho' - far too hard-boiled. In those days I drank heavily, despised poetry, and hated anything remotely 'spiritual'. Yet I hated that false messiah even more! I was safe from the fat 14 year old, as me and my mates derided the fool.

BUT he sucked the life blood out of the counter-culture that seemed to be flourishing in Bristol, England at that time. No end (it seemed to me) of beautiful young people started following him. They no longer put their love and energy into their community, friends and family. They became superior in attitude; kept secrets from the rest of us; and came to view us as foolish and lost for rejecting m's trojan gift without even trying it. It was horrible to watch the idealism of those days go to fatten the belly of beasts like Rawat and the hard drug dealers that moved in on a generation that thought it could make a difference.

Decades later, when I met my wife, it was like a time warp! She was shy to talk about Rawat - but I knew enough to tease and laugh her through to opening up a tad about things. Just to say the feelings are hers - nothing you can feel that can't be felt - and nothing to do with grace or whatever. I took her involvement very lightly. She had lapped her 'knowledge' from a toilet - but had not immersed herself so far in the shitty reality of Rawat's racket that she had become depraved. A butterfly, sipping from the pretty lotus that hid the rank and festering swamp beneath.

I have taken that lotus and placed it in my heart.

And I have found friends who would drain the swamp. For in that fetid swamp, below the beautiful lotus blossoms, lurks a gross and poisonous toad that feeds on the butterflies.

When the swamp drains, the toad will die, just as he has killed so many others.

And the lotus flower in my heart will blossom in joy that an evil has been removed from the earth.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 17:24:54 (GMT)
From: Lurkex
Email: None
To: Everyone
Subject: Healing rather than looping.
Message:
Oh, I'm really going for it here! Just when I think I'm off it and ready for my long hike, I get another wave of inspiration to write something. So here goes.

I am repeating and building on something I added in the middle of the verbal abuse thread below (which if you didn't read it yet is in the middle of the second thread starting with Glen Whitaker's name).

As Joe, Katie and others said below, it is definitely a very intense subject being discussed on this Forum, and one of the big problems we had in the cult was that we were encouraged to repress our emotions. This is crazy-making and sick-making and breeding grounds for violence. It's really important that we get the opportunity to express ourselves now.

It feels really good that all this is being discussed and some distinctions are being drawn, like between expressing our anger at what happened to us, and dumping it on each other; or getting overly activated by each other's personalities. Let's celebrate diversity and a non-violent expression of every intense feeling and thought we need to have heard. Non-violent means I don't project it on you, name-call, subtly denigrate you, bully you, put you down based on caste, creed, color, gender, profession. It can seem challenging and I think it's doable and well-worth learning. It makes the difference between healing and just looping in circles of abuse.

This is the big doorway! It can feel very healing to just dump out what was given to you. This isn't a conscious process. In fact, I think the big problem for me and probably for many of us is that we aren't fully conscious of the fact that we were abused, verbally, emotionally and in other ways. I had absolutely no idea that I had been verbally abused in childhood until I did therapy and started remembering it. I had a completely different picture of my childhood. It seemed quite normal to communicate in these ways. It was a big awakening to me to go back to the original memories and realize how much they had hurt me, and how much fear, anger and grief was held in some part of myself, which was now spilling out into my life. I would never have made the connection between some of the ways I was behaving in relationships with the abuse I received as a child (and which was hugely reiterated in the cult) without quite a bit of focussed work and help. I also realized that each of my parents, who as I posted below, abused me in slightly different ways, were merely repeating what they had received, which seemed NORMAL to them. (BTW I'm in fairly loving communication with them and am not 'blaming' them for my life, before you post and tell me I shouldn't. It was really important for me to reclaim my own feelings and the right to have them, but I never felt there was much point in blaming them, years later. I just try to love them and work my own end of it.).

The thing about abuse seeming NORMAL is the main point I want to make. I think we are all pretty much entrained to expect it, and that we went numb a very long time ago to our real authentic feelings about lack of kindness. I found that I had replaced them with a defensive structure that acts like it's all cool, and: THIS IS THE MOST SIGNIFICANT PART TO ME: deals with the pressure of these unfelt feelings by passing them on to others through similar behaviors to the ones that my nervous system received. It can feel very cathartic to be violent, whether through verbal put-down or actually beating someone up. The good feelings that 'letting it out' produce can create a brain chemistry that makes you feel incredibly 'right.' This is the righteousness of the disgruntled postal worker: 'they all deserve it!' or the spousal and/or child abuser, who even after he has gone through his cycle of remorse, will say in a support group 'they were asking for it.'

So my point, and I do have one, is that we were definitely abused, systematically, over a long period of time (however long we stayed). It is really different for different exes, as many people have pointed out here. If you were in the ashram and gave up everything, it is more intense (I was). Much of that abuse was in the form of subtle verbal abuse where the covert or overt message was something like this:

'You are stupid. You are unworthy even to kiss my/His feet. You still don't get it, do you? You are in your mind. You are wrong and I (or the party line) is right. Your feelings don't matter and you are being a wimp if you are complaining. It's for your own good. He is just kidding when he does that cruel stuff, it's a LILA, you know.'

We received this. We even received it while breathing deeply, which can make it go deeper into your cells. Do we want to continue this cycle of violence with our own selves and the other precious human beings around us?

There is an incredible story in Victor Frankl's book 'Man's Search for Meaning' (which I highly recommend). Victor was in a concentration camp and describes how people under unbelievable duress reacted in different ways, and how some people were still able to be loving to others while being tortured and that this gave him faith in human dignity even while the powers controlling the situation were trying to bring everyone down to the lowest level. When they were liberated, Victor was walking with an inmate through some fields, which had little green sprouts growing. The other guy started stomping on the baby shoots. Victor was shocked and asked him why, and the guy said, 'After what was done to me, why should I care about any other living thing.'

I think that this is a great description of the doorway that is available, where instead of repeating or inflicting more pain, I actually decide that the buck stops here and that I won't. The next step is to find a way to heal what happened to me. Again, it won't work to suppress it. There are very valid, intense feelings that may need to come out and be acknowledged for a very long time. Here's the rub: there actually are APPROPRIATE ways to release and integrate feelings, and INAPPROPRIATE ones. They may not seem very different, but the difference is as big as the difference between a loop that continues the problem and a new wave that creates an evolution into something new.

I think it's appropriate to say how I feel, and not appropriate to attack you or put you down, however 'good' it may feel in the moment. I'm not talking about some wimpy kind of niceness. One of the attacks that is sometimes made on the kind of idea I am putting forth is that it is about sugar-coating, it's too 'nice,' it's 'new age' (Forum 5's version of 'monmot'), it's an attempt to control others etc. etc. Nope.

I'll try to give an example by releasing some of my own feelings:

When I think of the time I spent attacking myself with feelings of unworthiness while I was in that cult I feel so fucking pissed off I want to yell FUCK< SHIT BALLS THIS SUCKS. I am SO FUCKING ANGRY ABOUT THIS. I'm not willing to repeat it in my life or support it being repeated in anyone else's life. NO FUCKING WAY!

Love to everyone

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Tues, Sep 05, 2000 at 08:33:57 (GMT)
From: from one who cares
Email: None
To: Lurkex
Subject: Healing rather than looping.
Message:
I understand and agree with your post. Some people just don't get it!!! I won't be back again in the near future. It is sickening to see the continued abuse and ridicule of one victim by another which really reveals how far they are from healing by means of their current path to it.
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Tues, Sep 05, 2000 at 15:15:05 (GMT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: from one who cares
Subject: Hey, let's all do some rebirthing! (nt)
Message:
hhhh
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 02:41:14 (GMT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: Lurkex
Subject: Sorry, that simply does NOT compute
Message:
Lurkex,

It seems as if you've found a way to see 'abuse' everywhere. Has it ever occured to you that that kind of thinking in itself is more abusive than any of the past negativity you appear to be so interested in? That's how it sounds to me. It sounds like you're trying to elevate sensitivity to some unworkable level, as if you're offended by the fact that you've got a thicker skin than you did as a baby. Like I say, that's unworkable. Hell, it's not even desirable. It's just a confused fake ideal, fomented, apparently, from a toxic exposure of late twentieth century psycho-babble.

The abuse Maharaji imposed on us was real because it was so beyond the pale. He really did treat us like shit, there's no question about that. All the more reason, then, that I'm troubled by your casting your net as wide as you do. Frankly, I think you belittle the very meaning of the term 'abuse' with taht philosophy. Just like one doesn't join cults everyday and it's misguided thinking, in my opinion, to equate all social conventions, etc. with that word, as metaphorically appealing as it might seems sometimes.

I think it's completely appropriate to rage at premies who lie and dissemble. There is indeed a significant place for shame in this game. At times it's the very emotion one needs to invoke in a cult member. I mean, good luck trying. For the most part, they're so committed to their cult and its leader that even that has no effect. Mind you, if and when it does, that's anothing but a good thing. It's a full, frontal blow on the very trap that's got these guys, the real barrier to their living full lives. Just as it was with us.

So hit that wall and hit it hard. That's what I think anyway.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 03:38:33 (GMT)
From: gerry
Email: None
To: Jim
Subject: Explain how the 'shame' thing works again?
Message:
Hi Jim. Welcome back. We've all become pussycats in your absence. Except Elaine. She's still struttin' here stuff, strong and, ah, 'erect.'

Don't expect anyone to argue with you. We've all reverted to 'wimps' 'pee-ons' and 'whiners' status from our ashram days.

Jai.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 04:05:07 (GMT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: gerry
Subject: Explain how the 'shame' thing works again?
Message:
Hi, Ger.

If I'm responsible for bringing Shroom back from the dead, I'm sorry. Really, did I do that? This is like C.H.U.D.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 04:08:02 (GMT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: Jim
Subject: THIS is shame
Message:
Ger,

I got your post mixed up a bit with Rob's. You're both talking about different cult members. Sorry.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 18:21:57 (GMT)
From: la-ex
Email: None
To: Lurkex
Subject: WOW!!!
Message:
Dear Lurk-ex:
Can you drop a quick note to me at: let'stalk21@hotmail.com some time soon...with an e-mail or hotmail address?
Would like to talk off-line sometime soon...

Thanks,
LA-EX

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 05:14:16 (GMT)
From: gerry
Email: None
To: all
Subject: Elaine wanted us all to know...
Message:
From 'Life's AToe'

Well, stopped in for ten minutes, don't know why all the hub-bub over my post.

There WERE wimpy/whining premies in the ashram that complained about not getting money for their underwear ----come on - y'all must have known some.

Then there were ones that wanted a car for, say... a funeral or shopping - looked the DUO director in the eyes and he immediately reached for the keys.

I was that premie.

'Stand erect and go'- I think it went.

Ooo, I was bad.
Sit across from me at a closing table and I bet I get everything I want and with no animosity.
Why is that interpreted as a bad thing?

I'm tired of being walked all over. Got the tee-shirt even.

See ya soon,
Elaine

Hope not

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 08:05:47 (GMT)
From: Sleuth
Email: None
To: Everyone
Subject: found a PAM link
Message:
http://www.secinfo.com/dV3p8.6w6.htmnot sure it means anything but ?
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 13:30:48 (GMT)
From: G
Email: None
To: Sleuth
Subject: found a PAM link
Message:
1900 Decker School Lane Malibu, CA 90265

This address shows up in the Florida listing for United Pathways (see below). United Pathways was mentioned in a post as a financial vehicle used to get 'fund raising' money to Maharaji. I tried a phone number search for this address and found nothing.

'LA Investment Associates, Inc. (Formerly L.A. Associates, Inc.) (a development stage company) ('the Company') was incorporated in Nevada on June 19, 1990 to serve as a vehicle to effect a merger, exchange of capital stock, asset acquisition or other business combination with a domestic or foreign private business. At December 31, 1998, the Company had not yet commenced any formal business operations, and all activity to date relates to the Company's formation and proposed fund raising.'

------------------------------------------

Florida Non Profit

UNITED PATHWAYS, INC.

PRINCIPAL ADDRESS
C/O RANDALL PROUTY
2247 PALM BEACH LAKES BLVD., STE 220
WEST PALM BEACH FL 33409
Changed 05/01/1996

MAILING ADDRESS
C/O RANDALL PROUTY
2247 PALM BEACH LAKES BLVD., STE 220
WEST PALM BEACH FL 33409
Changed 05/01/1996

Document Number: N46592
FEI Number: 650302723
Date Filed: 12/24/1991
State: FL
Status: INACTIVE
Effective Date: NONE
Last Event: ADMIN DISSOLUTION FOR ANNUAL REPORT
Event Date Filed: 09/24/1999
Event Effective Date: NONE

Registered Agent Name & Address
PROUTY, RANDALL
2247 PALM BEACH LAKES BLVD., STE. 220
WEST PALM BEACH FL 33409
Name Changed: 05/01/1996
Address Changed: 05/01/1996

Officer/Director Detail
Name & Address, Title

PROUTY, RANDALL H.
2247 PALM BEACH LAKES BLVD., #220
WEST PALM BEACH FL 33409, PDS

MURPHY, CHRISTINA 1900 DECKER SCHOOL LANE
MALIBU CA 90265, D

EMERSON, JIM 411 VALLEY LAKE DRIVE ATLANTA GA 30087, D

Annual Reports
Report Year, Filed Date, Intangible Tax
1996, 05/01/1996
1997, 04/01/1997
1998, 05/19/1998, N

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 13:45:56 (GMT)
From: JTF
Email: None
To: G
Subject: found a PAM link
Message:
I think the Decker School is where the rawat cult in Malibu held their mind control meetings(aka video presentations).
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 13:59:08 (GMT)
From: G
Email: None
To: JTF
Subject: some more
Message:
From the Nevada corporate info site:

Name: LA INVESTMENT ASSOCIATES, INC.
Type: Corporation
File Number: C5625-1990
State: NEVADA
Incorporated On: June 19, 1990
Status: Current list of officers on file
Corp Type: Regular

Resident Agent: BUSINESS CONCEPTS, INC. (Accepted)
Address: 2949 EAST DESERT INN ROAD SUITE 1 LAS VEGAS NV 89121

President, Secretary, and Treasurer: RANDALL H PROUTY
Address: 1900 DECKER SCHOOL LANE MALIBU CA 90265

From the Florida corporate info site:

Florida Profit
--------------

BRISTOL CAPITAL, INC.

PRINCIPAL ADDRESS
%STEVE DANNER
1101 BRICKELL AVE -STE M101 MIAMI FL 33131
Changed 04/28/2000

MAILING ADDRESS
%STEVE DANNER
1101 BRICKELL AVE -STE M101 MIAMI FL 33131
Changed 04/28/2000

Document Number: P99000018764
FEI Number: APPLIED
Date Filed: 02/25/1999
State: FL
Status: ACTIVE
Effective Date: NONE

Registered Agent
Name & Address
DANNER, STEVE
%KANE HOFFMAN & DANNER
1101 BRICKELL AVE -STE M101 MIAMI FL 33131
Name Changed: 04/28/2000
Address Changed: 04/28/2000

Officer/Director Detail
Name & Address
Title
DANNER, STEVE
1101 BRICKELL AVE -STE M101
MIAMI FL 33131
DPS

Annual Reports
Report Year, Filed Date, Intangible Tax
2000, 04/28/2000

Florida Profit
--------------

BRISTOL REALTY CORPORATION

PRINCIPAL ADDRESS
2247 PALM BEACH LAKES BLVD 220 WEST PALM BEACH FL 33409 US
Changed 04/01/1996

MAILING ADDRESS
2247 PALM BEACH LAKES BLVD., STE 220 W PALM BCH FL 33409
Changed 01/17/1996

Document Number: J82494
FEI Number: 592835538
Date Filed: 07/13/1987
State: FL
Status: INACTIVE
Effective Date: NONE
Last Event: ADMIN DISSOLUTION FOR ANNUAL REPORT
Event Date Filed: 09/24/1999
Event Effective Date: NONE

Registered Agent
Name & Address
PROUTY, RANDALL H.
2247 PALM BEACH LAKES BLVD SUITE #220 WEST PALM BEACH FL 33409
Address Changed: 03/24/1997

Officer/Director Detail
Name & Address
Title
PROUTY, RANDALL H.
2247 PALM BEACH LAKES BLVD #220 WEST PALM BEACH FL
PSD

Annual Reports
Report Year, Filed Date, Intangible Tax
1996, 04/01/1996
1997, 03/24/1997
1998, 09/17/1998

Florida Profit
--------------

BRISTOL CONSULTING SERVICES, INC.

PRINCIPAL ADDRESS
C/O STEVE DANNER
1101 BRICKELL AVE STE M-101 MIAMI FL 33131 US
Changed 04/28/2000

MAILING ADDRESS
C/O STEVE DANNER
1101 BRICKELL AVE STE M-101 MIAMI FL 33131 US
Changed 04/28/2000

Document Number: P99000068708
FEI Number: APPLIED
Date Filed: 08/03/1999
State: FL
Status: ACTIVE
Effective Date: NONE

Registered Agent
Name & Address
DANNER, STEVE
KANE HOFFMAN & DANNER
1101 BRICKELL AVE STE M-101 MIAMI FL 33131
Name Changed: 04/28/2000
Address Changed: 04/28/2000

Officer/Director Detail
Name & Address
Title
PROUTY, RANDALL H
1101 BRICKELL AVE STE M-101 MIAMI FL 33131
D

Annual Reports
Report Year, Filed Date, Intangible Tax
2000, 04/28/2000, Y

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 15:36:11 (GMT)
From: G
Email: None
To: G
Subject: ADVC
Message:
Advanced Communication Technologies, Inc. (OTC:BB ADVC - a 'penny stock') was co-founded by Prouty. I believe ACT is majority owned by the May family trust company Global Communications. Roger May is the CEO. It may not be related, other than the Prouty connection. Some info:
Home page
DDInvestor profile
Bullmarketpicks
rise and fall of their stock

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 06:19:15 (GMT)
From: Salam
Email: None
To: G
Subject: I have tried in vaine
Message:
to find a link on the web to Amtext. If anyone else can, it should be you. Do you know if Amtext have a URL. Do you know if it is in thier own name or something different. Can you help.
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 07:33:45 (GMT)
From: Oliver
Email: None
To: All Aussie Dads
Subject: Happy Father's to all Aussie Dads (nt)
Message:
nt
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 07:37:06 (GMT)
From: Oliver
Email: None
To: All Aussie Dads
Subject: (Ooops) Happy Father's DAY to all Aussie Dads
Message:
...sory, the kids spiked the punch.
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 01:23:20 (GMT)
From: Skippy
Email: johnchalmers@mullum.com.au
To: Whomever
Subject: secret garden
Message:
I cant get into the secret garden even though I was emailed a password. I also cant get into recenexes. I also dont know what nt means. Any thoughts?

Skippy

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 06:42:08 (GMT)
From: Hal
Email: None
To: Skippy
Subject: help is on the way !
Message:
As regards recent exes. You should get an email . I had trouble getting in there at first too but that was due to my inexperience with computers. I can't actually remember how I did it so can't explain to you.

nt means no text to follow.

What's this secret garden place about ?

Hal

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 11:23:24 (GMT)
From: Sir Dave
Email: None
To: Hal
Subject: So secret that nobody knows where it is
Message:
It's so secret that only a select few ever hear about it. Then you have to perform the sacred joining ritual which requires a banana and several cucumbers, with axle-grease and a blindfold and handcuffs, of course.

And The Secret Garden is fast becoming a cult place where nobody understands quite what will happen next. What is its purpose and why do people there keep disappearing into thin air!

I don't know why you, Skippy, cannot get into the garden with the password. SOmetimes the site is down. Try again. All lower case letters, of course.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 20:02:02 (GMT)
From: Hal
Email: None
To: Everyone
Subject: Stoner ?
Message:
Are you deliberately or unconsciously creating divisions and distractions ? Or have you forgotten that we are ex premies ,talking about our experiences during and after our invovement with a cult ?
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 01:53:32 (GMT)
From: Stonor
Email: None
To: Hal
Subject: Hal ?
Message:
You know the answer to these questions, and IMO are using them to suggest that there is no relation between my concerns, which are are shared by others who are exes, to the goals/purpose of this site.
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 06:06:48 (GMT)
From: Hal
Email: None
To: Stonor
Subject: Stonor
Message:
Hi Stonor,

I perhaps shouldn't have phrased it as a question but rather as a statement of my opinion. I don't actually think that you cause division and distraction by intent. It is an unconscious result of your sincere attempts to be RIGHT all the time .

People are not perfect and do say things they feel in the moment and perhaps regret later.

I think that the atmosphere on the forum has been congenial recently. In actual fact a lot of the bad vibes on here have involved your issues with people. I can think of a few examples. You and Joe ; You and SB , You and Jim; You and John T , You and gerry, You and jerry;You and Elaine; now you and me . Sorry if I've missed anyone. For a peace lover and someone who doesn't like conflicts you do seem to have created a few situations. Maybe it's worth looking at the issue of why do I get people's backs up to the point where they are tempted to get insulting towards me?

Personally speaking you've irritated me with your ggody goody two shoes lecturing of people in a self righteous way. This forum has input from folks who are upset and angry and do maybe fly off now and then.

I appreciate the idea of not wanting an abusive forum,
I doubt whether there is a single person who wants disharmony here. It is admirable to make suggestions that harmony would be preferable but not demand it from everyone else. Just because one person swears in conversation ,is not pc or whatever , there is no need to be intellectually superior. No need to tell them off. People are diverse creatures.

Life can't be controlled , people can't be controlled. The forum IS what the contributors make it and IMO it has been fine recently with very few insults. I prefer the word insults to abuse . I don't agree with whatever experts say that verbal abuse is up there with other abuse. Insults hurt the ego and depend very much on how prickly we are as a person.

Hal

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 15:06:21 (GMT)
From: Stonor
Email: None
To: Hal
Subject: Hal
Message:
Another case where my intuitions about someone have been confirmed.
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 17:44:56 (GMT)
From: gerry
Email: None
To: Stonor
Subject: Stonor could you elaborate a little?
Message:
You DO seem to a center around which much controversy and dissention swirl.

Two questions if you please:

Can you elaborate on your intuitions about Hal? It's unfair to make such a nebulous statement and leave it hanging like that.

And could you explain how Rawat hurt your personally? Thanks.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 18:59:09 (GMT)
From: Stonor
Email: None
To: gerry
Subject: Stonor could you elaborate a little?
Message:
I don't enjoy sharing personal perceptions of people in public, so forgive me for not elaborating on your first question.

Wrt to your second question, I have explained that to the best of my ability and/or patience at LaF, and I would have thought you already knew this. Interesting that only you and DavidJ seem dissatisfied with my explanations.

Hope this helps, and hope you had a beautiful day on the mountain.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 19:21:37 (GMT)
From: Hal
Email: None
To: Stonor
Subject: elaborate at recent exes then ..I'd appreciate...
Message:
your intuitions about me. I might learn and grow from them.

hal

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 20:11:25 (GMT)
From: Stonor
Email: None
To: Hal
Subject: elaborate at recent exes then ..I'd appreciate...
Message:
How about I email you - I believe I saw a post there with your address. Would that be OK?

Stonor

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 20:13:28 (GMT)
From: Hal
Email: None
To: Stonor
Subject: please do nt
Message:
nt
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 19:20:11 (GMT)
From: gerry
Email: None
To: Stonor
Subject: Sorry Stonor this doesn't cut it.
Message:
You've already 'shared your perception' of Hal, albeit subtley and in a passive-aggresive manner, IMO, so you can't get off that easily. I really believe you have brought this upon yourself and you are guilty of the very things you rail against. Sorry but that is the stock definition of hypocrisy (sp)

As to DavidJ he actually sounds like a thoughtful, moderate person. I like him He sounds honest to me, and incidently, I believe he's probably on his way out of the cult.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 17:43:00 (GMT)
From: Hal
Email: None
To: Stonor
Subject: You think therefore it must be right ! Fuck you
Message:
Prissy schoolmarm.
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 19:00:31 (GMT)
From: Stonor
Email: None
To: Hal
Subject: I don't respond to verbal abuse. (nt)
Message:
nt
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 19:11:51 (GMT)
From: Hal
Email: None
To: Stonor
Subject: Above it all I guess ? nt
Message:
puke
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 19:15:08 (GMT)
From: Stonor
Email: None
To: Hal
Subject: Saddened by it all. nt
Message:
nt
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 20:12:11 (GMT)
From: hal
Email: None
To: Stonor
Subject: Creating our own reality
Message:
Why do you think you attract this kind of response in quite a few people ?

hal

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 20:17:19 (GMT)
From: Stonor
Email: None
To: hal
Subject: will discuss privately
Message:
I think the answer to your question is in what I quoted from Bully Onine at RE.
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 15:32:33 (GMT)
From: Katie
Email: None
To: Hal
Subject: Stonor, Hal, SB, G, et al.
Message:
It has upset me to read this thread because I like ALL of you. I have exchanged personal e-mails or phone calls with everyone here except Hal, and Hal and I have had other personal communication. Let me make it clear that I am not on anyone's 'side' here, either - I distrust the whole idea of 'sides' on this forum.

Hal, although Stonor may have more to say about this and I might be wrong, I do not think she dislikes conflict. She seems to enjoy a good argument. The point I believe she is trying to make is that a debate or argument shouldn't become tainted by personal insults, etc. You are right that none of us is perfect - I have posted many things in the heat of the moment that I wish I could take back later, and I've had to apologize for them, too. So has Stonor - and I don't think she is claiming to be perfect.

Stonor, I appreciate much of where you are coming from, but I do disagree with you on certain issues. For example, Hal calling me sweetheart - I think it is up to ME to determine whether that is offensive or not. I am the only one who knows what kind of relationship Hal and I have, really, and I am the only one who can judge whether something someone says is offensive to me. If someone does say something offensive to me by accident, I almost always set them straight right away. 'Sweetheart' is not one of those things.

Also, I swear a lot, although certainly not as often on the forum as in real life :).

SB, I hope things are OK between you and me. I have been working on that issue we spoke about via e-mail - I doubt that it will be resolved to your satisfaction, but I have tried my best! I should tell you that I don't have ANY reason to believe that Stonor is a premie plant. If you dislike her, that's fine - I just don't think calling her a premie is appropriate. Also, I don't want to feel like I have to choose between being friends with you and being friends with Stonor, and hope that is OK with you.

G, frankly, you often come across like Mr Spock on this forum (this is not an insult - I was madly in love with Mr. Spock for years - snicker.) I don't have a problem with this, but I know it's not ALL you are, having talked to you on the phone. Would like to see a little more of the complete G, if possible (I know sometimes it's not - but we do get stuck in our personas, or at least *I* do.)

Well, I am triangulating (or pentagonizing) extremely here, which is a really bad tendency of mine, but I really did want to say something because I am so fond of all of you. (Also I hope this is coherent, because as I mentioned to Joe below, I have the flu or something.)

Love -
Katie

P.S. Maharaji sucks! Worse than that, he's a bore!

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 19:57:17 (GMT)
From: Stonor
Email: None
To: Katie
Subject: Hi Katie!
Message:
Hi Katie,

You wrote:

although Stonor may have more to say about this and I might be wrong, I do not think she dislikes conflict. She seems to enjoy a
good argument.

I guess you have little idea of what the conflict here has been putting me through. I have tried to help others to become more conscious of the 'bullying' syndrome, as most are not aware of it, as I wasn't until I read more about it through necessity. I enjoy sharing and discussing ideas, yes, but not 'arguing' in the way the word is popularly used or 'acted out'

Just thought I should clarify that.

Love to you,

Stonor

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 20:13:35 (GMT)
From: Selene
Email: None
To: Stonor
Subject: always in control; that is how I see you
Message:
You talk about emotions but you always have the last line Stoner. The perfect quip, the way to get under ones skin so well. Like your use of the word snipe.
Now where did that come from? I am guessing you will say it was coincidence.
I have avoided and avoided and avoided you. Even since we both fought ages ago, I swore I would never post to you.
I have seen you confront and fight with many here over nothing much at all, a word you took wrong, a way or style or writng that didn't fit into YOUR belief system.
You can justify til you are blue in the face, and say as you just did how confronting has taken it's toll, but that is how I see it. SB is a warm wonderful person. And I broke my promise to myself and got involved in this because I really care about her.
My gut tells me you trashed her and disguised it with wit and intellect.
I'm done. I have bigger things to worry about right now and I hope hope hope hope that this here little snipe doesn't get sucked into any more of your posts. I want you to know I will try very hard to avoid you. So go for it as you do so often. go ahead. give it your best shot I have cut my losses.
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 22:48:25 (GMT)
From: SB
Email: None
To: Selene
Subject: Nobody is there
Message:
so far to understand what you are saying. I'm glad you said it. I bet now you feel better.

Caramba!

;)

Maharaji's cult sucks

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 17:58:49 (GMT)
From: Hal
Email: None
To: Katie
Subject: Your heart is sweet !
Message:
Thanks katie,

I don't think that there is a need for great concern here. As Jim would say , it's probably something astrological like for instance Mercury going retrograde in the 7th house !

These blazes tend to die out of their own accord providing more fuel isn't added. Hopefully afterwards everyone has learnt something. I know that whenever I have some kind of conflict or disagreement I always do learn.

These issues shouldn't be allowed to develop too far into personal animosity, after all most of us don't know each other in the flesh. The disagreements are purely to do with beliefs and different intellectual viewpoints. Even if I think I don't like someone because of their way of communicating on the forum should not be such a big deal.

To me this friction is not a big deal anymore , it was when I first started posting . Sometimes I enjoy a bit of spice with my food. Some like it hot. Things can get a bit bland and nicey nicey sometimes for my taste , at others I like it that way too. Diversity not uniformity is what makes this forum the one I visit the most.

Jim was telling me when he did my astrology chart that I had lots of fire in it , which accounts for my anarchistic tendencies.

Harmony and peace to you and all,
Hal

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 15:48:50 (GMT)
From: G
Email: None
To: Katie
Subject: Katie
Message:

G, frankly, you often come across like Mr Spock on this forum (this is not an insult - I was madly in love with Mr. Spock for years - snicker.) I don't have a problem with this, but I know it's not ALL you are, having talked to you on the phone. Would like to see a little more of the complete G, if possible (I know sometimes it's not - but we do get stuck in our personas, or at least *I* do.) ... I have the flu or something.

I find your statement to be quite illogical.

Just kidding. You're right, I do sometimes mistakenly believe that I am of Vulcan origin, even though I'm not really in control of my emotions. I've been sick for weeks, maybe that's one reason I've been cantankerous.

Live long and prosper,
G of planet earth

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 15:55:51 (GMT)
From: Katie
Email: None
To: G
Subject: Katie
Message:
Well, you know I love Vulcans (or at least the half-breed ones) - and we could probably use a few more on this forum :). You do seem to attract the 'Bones McCoy' types, though.

I am sorry to hear that you've been ill - especially since I'm going through it myself right now (and also tend to get irritable and cantantakerous while posting when sick). But 'ill for weeks' doesn't sound good - hope you are taking care of yourself and not pushing yourself too hard.

BTW, Spock couldn't control his emotions all the time either - that's one of the reasons so many women were madly in love with him. I think he was the number one hearthrob on that show as judged from fan mail - even though Captain Kirk was supposed to be (YUCK).

Live long and prosper!
Love,
Katie

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 09:25:13 (GMT)
From: Why
Email: None
To: Hal
Subject: Good post HAL !! (nt)
Message:
great!!
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 01:44:37 (GMT)
From: Stonor
Email: None
To: Hal
Subject: For the record ...
Message:
You might remember that 'sexism' at this site is another 'popular' issue I raised way back at the beginning of my involvement with this site. It is one of the reasons why I chose this 'gender- neutral' name of my father's side of the family. I have considered this with regards to when you first used its 'feminized' form.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 22:05:16 (GMT)
From: Stoner's credo
Email: None
To: Hal
Subject: Stoner ?
Message:
I am willing to make the mistakes if
someone else is willing to learn from them.
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 22:32:37 (GMT)
From: clarification
Email: None
To: all
Subject: Stoner's credo is NOT stoner
Message:
Happy now?
Good, go fight M.
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 22:54:56 (GMT)
From: G
Email: None
To: 'clarification'
Subject: 'go fight M'
Message:
To whoever you are,

Yes, 'go fight M'. So what's this whole thread about? Stonor didn't create the problems here, they were already here. The issue of verbal abuse is relevant and Stonor just pointed it out. M verbally abused us, ex-premies and premies don't need yet more abuse. Notice how the thread below started and developed, Stonor was not the driving force behind the thread.

I'm going to post more about the issue of verbal abuse and argumentative tactics. It's not a taboo subject.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 22:59:23 (GMT)
From: Hal
Email: None
To: G
Subject: 'go fight M'
Message:
G,

Are you claiming that you don't use argumantative tactics ?Perhaps I misunderstand your use of that term. What constitutes argumentative tactics?

Hal

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 23:09:42 (GMT)
From: G
Email: None
To: Hal
Subject: argumentative tactics
Message:
By that I mean statements used in an argument that are not logical. For example:

appeal to authority
appeal to ignorance (the unknown)
begging the question
either-or thinking
rhetorical question
straw man

Ok, I missed the boat about Jerry using the straw man argument with Zelda about Feng-shui. Well, that illustrates it's not always obvious.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 23:18:21 (GMT)
From: Hal
Email: None
To: G
Subject: Thanks G
Message:
I think the danger of too many rules of etiquete on the forum is the loss of real emotion being expressed. As a person attempting to express my feelings and thoughts I sometimes get angry and frustrated. I've enjoyed being able to express myself here without having to censor every word I say. I try not to be overly or too frequently abusive but on occasion.. well. I'm just an imperfect guy .

Hal

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 01:36:28 (GMT)
From: SB
Email: None
To: Hal
Subject: That is IT (ot)
Message:
Hi Hal!!!
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 07:48:27 (GMT)
From: Hal
Email: None
To: SB
Subject: Love to you SB
Message:
I for one am missing your lovely fiery emotionally expressive posts !

Hal

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 09:41:47 (GMT)
From: SB
Email: None
To: Hal
Subject: To you too, tons. (nt)
Message:
tons
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 23:27:17 (GMT)
From: G
Email: None
To: Hal
Subject: I'm not asking for lots of censorship (nt)
Message:
nt
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 23:21:31 (GMT)
From: Hal
Email: None
To: Hal
Subject: BTW I do have a soft spot for stonor
Message:
A swamp at the bottom of my garden !

Just kidding ! OOPS THERE I GO AGAIN !

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 22:08:53 (GMT)
From: SB
Email: None
To: Stoner's credo
Subject: bs!!!!!! GOOD ONE, not (nt)
Message:
nt
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 22:45:11 (GMT)
From: Hal
Email: None
To: SB
Subject: Sorry I cant stand being preached to.....
Message:
By people on high horses in self righteous ego trips !

Hal

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 22:08:23 (GMT)
From: G
Email: None
To: FA
Subject: FA - I think this thread should be deleted (nt)
Message:
nt
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 22:12:53 (GMT)
From: Hal
Email: None
To: G
Subject: FA - I think this thread should be deleted (nt)
Message:
Yes why ? Is there something against the forum guidelines ?
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 22:09:36 (GMT)
From: Why
Email: None
To: G
Subject: Why?
Message:
Why
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 22:18:26 (GMT)
From: G
Email: None
To: Why
Subject: Why
Message:
It was started only to accuse, then someone falsely used 'Stoner's credo' as if that was coming from Stonor. From my understanding, that's against the rules. At the very minimum, this supposed 'credo' should be deleted.
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 22:50:57 (GMT)
From: why
Email: None
To: G
Subject: I see. Sorry. (nt)
Message:
NT
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 22:26:09 (GMT)
From: wrong G
Email: None
To: G
Subject: no one falsely used anything
Message:
You interpreted it that way. It was a JOKE from someone else
get it???? A little PMS today or what?
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 02:03:11 (GMT)
From: G
Email: None
To: whoever you are
Subject: a sexist remark
Message:

?:
You interpreted it that way. It was a JOKE from someone else get it????

Oh yes, 'it was just a joke'.

A little PMS today or what?

That is an extremely insulting and sexist remark. Those kinds of remarks are way out of line.

Are you JohnT?

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 02:18:56 (GMT)
From: Stonor
Email: None
To: G
Subject: a sexist remark
Message:
I agree, and have read (and experienced) that many women reinforce sexism for various reasons, but hesitate to comment further. A woman here has sniped at me for being 'intellectual', for example.
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 09:42:35 (GMT)
From: WHY
Email: None
To: Stonor
Subject: Wrong forum (nt)
Message:
nt
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 02:07:32 (GMT)
From: Selene
Email: None
To: G
Subject: a sexisnope I'm selene so is it still sexist????
Message:
You are kinda funny but I am not in the mood.
Ny motner is dying. I came on here in defense of sb who IMO was bullied off forum.
NOT by a man, mind you.
Call me sexist. go ahead. I've been called everything else.
And while you are at it, ponder why a woman who has posted as herself for 2.5 years is suddenly afraid to.
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 16:43:03 (GMT)
From: Monmot
Email: None
To: Selene
Subject: To Selene
Message:
S:

My thoughts are with you and your mother. I hope you're doing as well as can be expected under such circumstances. Both of my parents have passed over, and I know it must be an intense passage for you right now.

If you feel emotional (and how could you not?), please don't feel bad about that.

Take care
Monmot

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 17:12:15 (GMT)
From: Selene
Email: None
To: Monmot
Subject: thankyou Monmot
Message:
I appreciate it.
I'm usually emotional anyway so now I'm really bizarre.
ugh, I have to call my sister!!
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 03:47:35 (GMT)
From: Helen
Email: None
To: Selene
Subject: Hey Selene
Message:
Sorry to hear about your mom. Has to be the most intense thing you'll ever go through. Take care of yourself, Selene. Thinking of you.

(I hope this posts...I am using the old computer in the basement--the 'new fancy' one is a piece of crap)

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 04:13:15 (GMT)
From: Selene
Email: None
To: Helen
Subject: it posted ***and*** I talked to sister dearest!
Message:
for 3 hours.
what a long strange trip it has been. as long as I am hanging out all over the freakin place, she told me something so heavy about dad.
how he came to visit her and broke down crying, saying
'I mistreated Selene, really badly, real bad and I can't talk to her about it because she is so angry and verbally vicious'

This, when I was 14 or so.
What a life. I'm a mess even more than usual. it was amazing to me that of all the things she hated me for, my cult involvement was lowest on her list.
Irish Catholics understand religious fanaticism. go figure. :}??

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 14:45:13 (GMT)
From: Helen
Email: None
To: Selene
Subject: it posted ***and*** I talked to sister dearest!
Message:
Ain't that weird that they didn't bat an eye at the cult? You are right about Irish Catholics understanding fanaticism. Is it any consolation hearing that your dad regrets how he treated you? My mom admitted once that she was a horrible mother. It did make me feel somewhat better. But I still have alot of resentment towards her. I guess with your mom dying, all kinds of confessions are going to come out of the closet. It's a time when all people's defenses break down. It may even open a window between you and your sister for a brief time.

Annie Lamont said in one of her books that hanging onto resentment is like eating rat poison and waiting for the rat to die. I always think about that but I still have a lot of resentment!

Take care of yourself.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 17:12:04 (GMT)
From: Selene
Email: None
To: Helen
Subject: didn't she write that book about writing?
Message:
I have it somewhere. Bird by Bird.
My dad and I made peace while he was dying. I'm not sure how I feel about that latest news. It is troubling to think of him falling apart. He was probably drunk. I had run away by then.
sigh. You are right everyone is going to be all emotional for a while.
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 18:31:35 (GMT)
From: SB
Email: None
To: Selene
Subject: You are not
Message:
IS NOTHING WRONG WITH EXPRESSING HUMAN EMOTIONS!!!

I send you a big hug. Check your mail.

You are not bizarre. 'THEY'are.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 02:10:34 (GMT)
From: Michael
Email: mgdbach@hotmail.com
To: Selene
Subject: Hey Selene, do you want to talk?
Message:
I'm sorry to hear about your mother. You can e-mail me at mgdbach@hotmail.com if you need to talk.
Michael
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 02:24:33 (GMT)
From: Selene
Email: None
To: Michael
Subject: yes I do
Message:
I'm sitting here. I have a seperate phone from modem connection connectiona and am waiting on phone calls from ER
I'll write later.
This is a bad time for me but it is good for her, she has Alzheimers.
thank you so much. I WILL be in touch when the dust settles or before!!
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 02:32:44 (GMT)
From: Michael
Email: None
To: Selene
Subject: Just know that I am available...
Message:
I do have two services tomorrow morning, but I will be available all day. If you want to call Panamá, send me an email and I´ll send you my numero de teléfono, but it can be a bit expensive.
You and your mom are in my prayers.
Michael
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 02:38:52 (GMT)
From: Selene
Email: None
To: Michael
Subject: waiting on yet another call....
Message:
Michael I don't have your email
Mine is selene@ocean.ccit.arizona.edu

If you can post your email here or email me *your* email I'd greatly appreciate it.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 03:14:41 (GMT)
From: Michael
Email: None
To: Selene
Subject: Just sent you an email NT
Message:
vvvvvvvvv
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 02:32:30 (GMT)
From: JohnT
Email: None
To: Selene
Subject: mine too
Message:
Mine too. I am terribly sorry.

I'm crying. It is dreadful.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 15:35:50 (GMT)
From: Katie
Email: None
To: JohnT
Subject: Selene and JohnT
Message:
Dear Selene and JohnT -
I am so sorry to hear about your moms. I have already written this to Selene, but I think the loss of a parent at any age is very traumatic. My dad died when I was 33, and it still hurts a lot sometimes (and he was not the world's best dad by a long shot).

I am glad you are allowing yourselves to grieve.

Love to both of you -
Katie

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 09:40:41 (GMT)
From: SB
Email: None
To: JohnT
Subject: To You
Message:
I send you love.

SB

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 08:30:01 (GMT)
From: Selene
Email: None
To: JohnT
Subject: thankyou John
Message:
I'm sorry your mom is in this state. I'll email more when I can.

I feel weird saying something so personal here.
But it's not the first time!! shit I made a promise to myself on Monday not to post here at all, and here I am spilling out all over.
I hate waiting for call backs about critical things. This is my way of coping, distracting. Thanks so much.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 03:45:59 (GMT)
From: Michael
Email: mgdbach@hotmail.com
To: JohnT
Subject: I'm sorry, John
Message:
John, I mis-read your post and just realized that you are in the same situation as Selene. As I told here, I am available to talk; my e-mail address is: mgdbach@hotmail.com. I spent some time as a hospital chaplain, and I am available just to listen; don't worry, I'm just offering an ear, I'm not out to convert, I just want to help in a time of trouble. E-mail me if you'd like.
Michael
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 08:08:38 (GMT)
From: halo
Email: None
To: Michael
Subject: I'm sorry, John
Message:
Hi Michael,

I think it's great the support that is being given by you and others to these guys who are in traumatic times. It feels great that the forum can be used in this way.

It made me think of the way the premies are now , without a community ( a generalisation )or support. When we were in difficuly the other premies didn't even know because there was so little communication. I'm talking video era. Nowadays premies pass each other after a video program and smile, maybe a little shallow chat. Hi how are you? Fine . It's all so wonderful and blissful and no one would confess to having a hard time. After all they've got the nollidge which brings that joy .

I haven't lost my parents yet but I can imagine how I would feel.
Don't want to sound trite or jump on a bandwagon , but my thoughts are with you Selene and John T.

Love Hal

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 08:17:46 (GMT)
From: Selene
Email: None
To: halo
Subject: You are appreciated
Message:
Thank you.
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 07:50:30 (GMT)
From: JohnT
Email: None
To: Michael
Subject: Thanks, Michael
Message:
Thanks Mike,

I will email you. It is kind of you to be clear that you are offering an ear and support (not a conversion service!). From what I've read of you, I have no hesitation in believing you. Indeed it would be hard for me to believe otherwise. Even though I do make a point of believing half-a-dozen impossible things before breakfast (brave smile).

I'm hurting. You realise I have a way with words, and might make you cry?

JohnT
(trying not to)

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 22:33:56 (GMT)
From: G
Email: None
To: 'wrong G'
Subject: 'pick a pseudonym, and stick to it'
Message:
To 'wrong G':
If you wish to post anonymously, pick a pseudonym, and stick to it. This will prevent confusion, and help people get to know you.

I consider using 'Stoner's credo' as a pseudonym to be unfair.
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 22:39:51 (GMT)
From: Wrong G
Email: None
To: G
Subject: 'pick a pseudonym, and stick to it'
Message:
I kinda like this one. :) Hey it's another JOKE!!

Since when has this place been fair? FA's pick and choose who to censor based on nothing logical.
And don't reply to others who are sincere.

Good luck with fairness. Seriously. I wish you luck.
Your war is not with me.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 01:52:34 (GMT)
From: G
Email: None
To: Wrong G
Subject: JohnT
Message:
My guess is that you are JohnT, since you wrote 'Your war is not with me.' and JohnT used the same phrase in a post below.

If you are JohnT, I find it strange that you wrote that, considering that JohnT has insulted me more than once. He wrote a long nasty post to me before that I skimmed. It didn't even deserve a response.

Why are hiding behind multiple pseudonyms?

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 03:10:18 (GMT)
From: JohnT
Email: None
To: G
Subject: Here I am
Message:
G: (JohnT) wrote a 'long nasty post to me before that I skimmed. It didn't even deserve a response.

JohnT: I've provided a link in case people want to assess G's assesment. I can't think of anything else from me that G has not responded to...

You have the wrong idea about me G. We got off to a bad start - I took you for a premie when you re-appeared here. I guess you and Jim go back a long way?

Anyway, whether you choose to believe me or not, I've only ever posted under one other moniker 'A Master Poet' (or I've signed in the body of the post when posting work by some author under that author's name).

My first ever post here was a poem called Unholy Trinity and was made under that name. I rapidly dropped it for something less pretentious and cumbersome. The name 'A Master Poet' was really just to mock Rawat.

All the same, G, your fight is not with me.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 04:15:19 (GMT)
From: gerry
Email: None
To: JohnT
Subject: Hey JohnT
Message:
sorry to hear about your mom. Must be our age. My own's sick and in the hospital. We are lucky to have them as long as we have. I'm thinking of you.

ps you write beautifully...

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 03:28:24 (GMT)
From: G
Email: None
To: JohnT
Subject: John
Message:
John,

Let's drop it.

I'm sorry about your mom.

G

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 17:09:07 (GMT)
From: JohnT
Email: None
To: G
Subject: G
Message:
I'm sorry,
that you found my post nasty, G. That was not my intent. I apologise for the hurt I caused you.

I was concerned to hear you have been unwell. And thank you for your kind sympathy regarding my mom. She is well looked after, and, as she says, still enjoys watching the tides of the sea and has beauty in her life.

That her pleasure is unremembered guts me; but she accepts her condition with good spirit.

Damn! that's set me off again. I'd better write to Michael.

Respect.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 18:16:43 (GMT)
From: G
Email: None
To: JohnT
Subject: John
Message:
I know you didn't intend it that way. I take these discussions too seriously and personally. I'm not seriously ill, just minor stuff dragging on.

Many dying people do come to a feeling of acceptance, it's amazing. My family member who passed away was an inspiration to me. I wish I could have been as accepting, but I'm just not Mr. Spock, don't need to be. Cherish the time you still have with her.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 01:59:20 (GMT)
From: Selene
Email: None
To: G
Subject: lighten the fuck up
Message:
My mom is in ER about to die.

I posted all those 'fake' posts.
so sue me.

G

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 02:16:02 (GMT)
From: G
Email: None
To: Selene
Subject: I'm sorry
Message:
Selene,

I'm sorry to hear that.

G

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 02:02:29 (GMT)
From: Selene and PS!!
Email: None
To: Selene
Subject: typo I swear regarding sig
Message:
I meant to write
so sue me G

but it looks like a signature frin G and based on your other posts
I thought I'd better fu#$#$$# explain

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 02:27:24 (GMT)
From: gerry
Email: glyng@techline
To: Selene
Subject: Selene...
Message:
So sorry to hear about your mother. I'm here as well.
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 08:12:14 (GMT)
From: Selene
Email: None
To: gerry
Subject: thank you gerry
Message:
I'll email when I can. Appreciate you writing.
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 01:18:55 (GMT)
From: Jerry
Email: None
To: Wrong G
Subject: Now this is somebody who should be called an idiot
Message:
Wouldn't you all agree?
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 09:10:18 (GMT)
From: Selene
Email: None
To: Jerry
Subject: I'll be the first to agree I'm an idiot
Message:
and emotional too of all horrible things.. oh my gawwwwwwwwwwwwd!!!!!!!!!!

I'll behave, later, sometime. Big Brother all over again.
Who will vote me out? I can think of 3 off the bat who would love to see me gone for good.
And you know I had this fantasy of writing the FA's and begging them to block me, I was just thinking about it the other day.
Isn't that funny?
Problem is I could get around it. What to do?

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 16:39:05 (GMT)
From: Jerry
Email: None
To: Selene
Subject: Oops!
Message:
I didn't know it was you, Selene. Would I have withheld my judgement if I did? Probably. You're one of the good guys. I can hear all the premies, now. 'You see, they ARE prejudiced!' Damn right. All premies eat doggy poo. Tough if they don't like it.

Sorry about your Mom. My foster mother recently passed away after a long bout with Alzheimer's. I hadn't been in touch for years, so I don't know the pain of dealing with that kind of situation, but my foster brother told me it was actually a relief when she died, it was such a terrible thing to see here waste away like that. So, I'm sorry you have to go through this. Best wishes.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 17:27:00 (GMT)
From: Selene
Email: None
To: Jerry
Subject: let them complain who csres?
Message:
They come to ex-premie.org and than complain about the subject matter. Pretty bizarre behavior on their part.
Thanks for the kind words.

I suppose some X character or someone will come on now and accuse me of seeking attention! :)

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 15:10:08 (GMT)
From: G
Email: None
To: Selene
Subject: Selene
Message:
Selene,

I'm sorry I got into it with you.

I've thought of having the FA block me, but I could also probably get around it. I spend too much time at the forum. Maybe it's a matter of realizing that the amount of time we spend here is a matter of choice, we don't have to obey every brain impulse.

It's ok to be emotional. I understand what you're going through, I lost someone in my family. It's hard.

Love,
G

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 17:09:59 (GMT)
From: Selene
Email: None
To: G
Subject: hey G
Message:
You did ? I mean think of asking to be blocked? I thought I was the only one, how funny :)
Please don't worry about last night. You were right after all - if I want a new name and to be anonymous I should pick one name.
But I just started this so I am having an 'Identity crisis' :)
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 22:25:30 (GMT)
From: G
Email: None
To: All
Subject: posting under another person's name
Message:
It says:

We actively discourage making violent threats of ANY kind, or posting under another person's name or pseudonym. Any posts that violate these simple rules may be deleted or edited by us.
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 17:11:06 (GMT)
From: psych major
Email: None
To: Everyone
Subject: elan vital's real title?
Message:
I know that EV is supposed to refer to the 'Vital Force', but could it really refer to:
E-Eager to
L-Lie
A-And
N-Never
V-Venture
I-Into
T-Truth
A-At any
L-Length

?

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Tues, Sep 05, 2000 at 18:36:14 (GMT)
From: cq
Email: None
To: psych major
Subject: elan vital's real title?
Message:
could be.

or how about:

Easy
Living
And
No
Values
Is
The
Absolute
Limit.

or

Easy
Living
And
No
Vanity
Is
Too
Abhorrent,
Losers.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 17:43:53 (GMT)
From: Salam
Email: None
To: psych major
Subject: Good one..nt
Message:
nt
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 15:44:21 (GMT)
From: Salam
Email: None
To: Everyone
Subject: Chuck, Amtext and motivation
Message:
From:

http://www.entrepreneurmag.com/Magazines/MA_SegArticle/0,1539,276581----1-,00.html

The Voices In Your Head

They’re saying things—some good, some bad. Timothy Gallwey teaches people to listen to the right ones.
By Mark Henricks
Entrepreneur magazine - July 2000

Chuck Nathan calls it a mini-disaster avoided. A warehouse manager at Amtext Inc., the Miami college-textbook wholesaler Nathan founded in 1985, had overlooked a key variable in a decision that was going to cost the 55-person company big money. At the last minute, a member of a departmental team Nathan set up noticed the error...and the day was saved. 'Just that one decision is going to make a significant difference in the company's profitability [over] the next couple of years,' says the 48-year-old entrepreneur.

Chalk another one up to 'the inner game,' a concept developed and popularized by writer and trainer Timothy Gall-wey. Nathan credits the successful save to the department's ability to work effectively and team-building training his managers received a year earlier from Gallwey. The idea behind the inner game is pretty simple: By removing inner obstacles such as self-monitoring, you can dramatically improve your ability to focus, learn and perform. Gallwey has written a series of books and conducted many speeches and seminars on applying the idea to sports, business and other areas.


Need proof that you can make it happen? Read 'Power Up' and get first-hand accounts of motivated entrepreneurs sharing their success secrets.

Since publishing the first in the series, The Inner Game of Tennis (Random House), 25 years ago and embarking on a fruitful career as a business consultant, Gallwey's client list has grown to include companies small and large, including Apple, AT&T, Coca-Cola and IBM.

Applying the inner game can help entrepreneurs improve employee retention, boost productivity and effectiveness, and encourage faster and better learning of important skills, says Gallwey. Nathan agrees with all that, but also includes the benefits of better financial performance and heightened personal enjoyment of work. 'As the CEO of the company, I've got to be focused on the bottom line and productivity,' says Nathan, 'but I also want to enjoy what I'm doing.'

Does Chucki or Amtext have a web site?
Anybody.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 11:17:23 (GMT)
From: JTF
Email: None
To: Everyone
Subject: Choice A or Choice B(not really OT)
Message:
Yesterday, I got a call from a talking computer. It was trying to sell me something. After a brief tease, it said, 'if you want free info press 1, if you don't press 2.'

So, of course I didn't care so I went to press 2. Just before I pressed 2 it hit me that who the fuck are these people to limit me to 2 choices. So I just hung up.

...maybe, I shouldn't have posted this because rawRat might very easily twist this story for his(HIS)use!

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 15:54:34 (GMT)
From: Salam
Email: None
To: JTF
Subject: Choice A or Choice B(not really OT)
Message:
This is what is called a lead generator. Sales company use them because they can work 24 hrs a day non stop. It saves them using telemarketers, plus they do not need coffee breaks. Basically they generate phone numbers automatically then dial\, does not matter which choice you use, you still have to give your details,
then most likely you will be contacted by a real person.
Hard for rawRat to twist it. There is no chice in it. but shit rawRat is a con merchant and he can do what he like, sheesh
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 17:03:24 (GMT)
From: G
Email: None
To: Salam
Subject: Choice A or Choice B(not really OT)
Message:
This reminds me of 'The Forum' (previously 'EST'). I guess it's called something else now. A premie invited me to an introductory talk and I went out of curiousity. The honcho talking said 'You have three choices.' The choices were all ways to fork over money for a seminar. Afterwards I was cornered by three people who tried to pressure me into signing up. I didn't sign up but did waste $10 on a tape which I never listened to.
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 08:37:18 (GMT)
From: Zelda
Email: None
To: Everyone
Subject: background color
Message:
now then

does anybody think the background color here may be affecting the dialogue here??

I had not thought much about it untill I saw one with pink background and even before I read the page I felt better.

Is this off-white? or biege or sulfuric tan? clinical eggwhite?
government manilla?

I think this looks pleasing but I wonder about what it does to our mood and/or receptivity.

just wondering

Z

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 08:55:54 (GMT)
From: Jerry
Email: None
To: Zelda
Subject: Feng Shui, Zelda?
Message:
I like the colors. But I can understand where you're coming from. Sir David has been experimenting with color combos over at Anything Goes for over a year now. Sometimes, I've just taken one look at the colors and made a quick exit as soon as I got there, I found them so appalling. But this color combo I find appealing. I'd hate to see them change.
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 11:26:08 (GMT)
From: Zelda
Email: None
To: Jerry
Subject: Feng Shui, Zelda?
Message:
not feng shui asfar as I know.
I am used to these colors too

I do react sort of in anticipation when the color comes up.

Thank the lud that I dont get that picture anymore. It gave me an ulcer i am sure.

It might just be my moving the furniture gene.
Z

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 16:28:15 (GMT)
From: G
Email: None
To: Zelda and Jerry
Subject: Feng Shui?
Message:
Feng-shui \F[^e]ng'-shu`i\, n. [Chin. feng wind + shiu water.] A system of spirit influences for good and evil believed by the Chinese to attend the natural features of landscape; also, a kind of geomancy dealing with these influences, used in determining sites for graves, houses, etc.

Color preference and the effect of color on mood has nothing to do with Feng-shui.

From Argumentative Writing: Terms

straw man: Deliberate misrepresentation of an opponent's argument. This error weakens the relevance of an inductive argument.
Color has been shown to affect mood. White would be more psychologically neutral.

Black letters on a white background is optimal for legibility as it provides the highest contrast. This has been verified by studies. Some suggest an off-white background to reduce eye strain.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 22:47:03 (GMT)
From: Zelda
Email: None
To: G
Subject: Feng Shui?
Message:
Hi J

I think jerry was asking me if what I had said had anything to do with Feng Shui- or else he was asking if I thought that a little feng shui would help aroung here.

so I dont get your straw man reference to this conversation..

BUt I love it and I will bookmark it cause it is used alot- not just here)

by the way , from what I gather from the Feng Shui books I have read, color plays a very important part- but not related to moods as much as elements. So the color for the wrong element would be harmful.

It is not just placement of houses graves ect but the placement of objects doorways and yea even pictures on a web page.

Z

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 17:05:36 (GMT)
From: Jerry
Email: None
To: G
Subject: Straw man?
Message:
You know, G, I think you are the one guilty of being a straw man here. I was NOT making a 'deliberate misrepresentation of an opponent's argument.' I wasn't even ARGUING with Zelda, nor was she presenting one. Feng-shui came to mind because I know it's a popular method of interior decoration. I thought it had something to do with mood modification. I guess I was wrong.

Can you forgive me, G? I'm really so, SO sorry I didn't have it in it's proper perspective, that it's about keeping evil spirits at bay. But tell me, what color coordination will keep the evil spirit, G, off my ass? That's the one I'm voting for.

BTW, I have a copy of Johnston's 'Why We Feel', and started reading it in earnest last night. It's a good read. You should get a copy. His theory is strictly on what he calls 'evolutionary functionalism'. He believes that it all has to do with emergent properties and how they help an organism to survive.

But let's not get into it just now. I'm not so sure there are too many people beside you and me who are interested, and maybe we should give it a breather for awhile. I really try to AVOID getting on peoples' nerves, believe it or not. But I shall return when I've finished the book. I'm looking forward to debating this further, especially since it deals specifically with the purpose of the 'emergent phenomena' of feelings, something that Maharaji has his own outdated superstitions about.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 22:55:11 (GMT)
From: Zelda
Email: None
To: Jerry
Subject: Straw man?
Message:
hey jerry- I dont know what his talking about- but I also dont know you twos history. plaese read my answer to him .-

Anyway I dont know alot about Fieng shui but have read a few books. and shhh dont tell anybody I bought a compass.

I am gonna study hard and write a thesis on web page graphics in relation to feng shui next lifetime.

Didnt you love the straw man thing - wht a great reference tool
Z

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 23:02:14 (GMT)
From: G
Email: None
To: Jerry
Subject: Oh well ...
Message:
Ok, I retract my 'straw man' accusation.
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 19:09:26 (GMT)
From: G
Email: None
To: Jerry
Subject: the book
Message:
Scientific findings about how our feelings and sensations don't quantitatively correspond with what's 'out there' are interesting. For example, our perception of light greatly compresses the dynamic range of the 'light out there'. Because of this, we're not 'blinded' in broad daylight and can see fairly well in the dark. I agree that our perceptions are related to survival.

However, I think scientists should be very cautious about drawing philosophical conclusions from data and should not present them as science. That's not the job of a scientist. They have a right to state their philosophy as a philosopher, but should make it clear that that's what they're doing.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 05:53:51 (GMT)
From: buzz
Email: None
To: Everyone
Subject: glen whittaker
Message:
just seeing that guys name makes me cringe,what a miserable bastard he was.he tried to stop me getting k just cause i hadn't listened to satsang in london for 2 weeks.i asked him what differance it makes where you listen to satsang.luckyly or unluckly as the case may be old charanand agreed to give me k,but that whittiker guy always left a bad rtaste in my mouth,he was like the grown up at a kids party that had to spoil the fun like he never had any fun as a kid. ah well things dont seem to have changed there.
buzz
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 06:12:00 (GMT)
From: Stonor
Email: None
To: buzz
Subject: another example of self-propagating bullying. (nt)
Message:
nt
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 06:37:55 (GMT)
From: Hal
Email: None
To: Stonor
Subject: Glen was a schoolteacher you know ! nt
Message:
dfg
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 06:42:31 (GMT)
From: Stonora
Email: None
To: Hal
Subject: Glen was a schoolteacher you know ! nt
Message:
Buddha and Jesus and m were/are teachers/gurus and our parents and elder brothers and sisters and peers, the media, big business, politics culture are too. I'm not a 'school teacher', I'm usually and ESL literacy adult ed teacher. And I'm just another human being, like you. What's your point?
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 06:48:36 (GMT)
From: Humble Hal
Email: None
To: Stonora
Subject: Hey Stonor it's me Hal - relax, just kidding you
Message:
It seems that your sense of humour has stalled . I know you do have one .
Love Hal
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 06:59:42 (GMT)
From: Stonora la 'stupida'
Email: None
To: Humble Hal
Subject: Hey Hal - it's beem a long night, ...
Message:
I know you must be just waking up. I'm going to bed soon, far too late after a rather up and down evening, but mostly up. Some good reading here and there and elsewhere.

Lots of love and hugs (especially 'cause I could use a bit of that stupid 'nice' stuff every now and then).

Stonora

Hope you can help me and G and his dictionary to determine that spelling of 'shille...'

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 17:37:03 (GMT)
From: Hal
Email: None
To: Stonora la 'stupida'
Subject: I really didn't mean any offense..
Message:
Sorry if you took it . G seemed to think that I was comparing you to a bully which I don't. I just intended to inform you that he was a teacher. I can understand why it could be taken the wrong way. I didn't think enough I guess and it was extremely early in the morning, didn't have my wits about me.
Sorry,
hal
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 17:52:13 (GMT)
From: Stonor
Email: None
To: Hal
Subject: I really didn't mean any offense..
Message:
I know you didn't consiously mean any offense, Hal, but what was your point. What is the relevance of Glen Whittaker's profession in this context? I was referring to the chain of abuse suggested by buzz's story.
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 19:44:14 (GMT)
From: Hal
Email: None
To: Stonor
Subject: How about letting go of it ?
Message:
What do you want bood? This forum does have a purpose and a topic and I don't think this stuff is it.
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 16:53:04 (GMT)
From: G
Email: None
To: Stonor and Hal
Subject: 'just kidding'
Message:
Glen was a schoolteacher.
Glen is a bully.
Therefore all teachers are bullies. (illogical)
Stonor is a teacher.
Therefore Stonor is a bully. (false conclusion)

From Getting help:

Verbal Abuse Disguised as a Joke: By telling a partner that the abuse is only a joke, the verbal abuser is saying, I feel so up putting you down that I never want to give it up, so I decree that my comments are humorous. ... I'm in control. I can say what I want.
The 'humorous' insult might be followed with 'You're too sensitive' or 'Where's your sense of humor?' (an accusation disguised as a question).

Hal, I'm just kidding.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 17:42:10 (GMT)
From: Stonor
Email: None
To: G
Subject: Thanks for the link, G.
Message:
And for helping me to better understand both Hal's post and my reaction to it.
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 17:31:54 (GMT)
From: Hal
Email: None
To: G
Subject: So pompous ! nt
Message:
hgn
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 02:36:46 (GMT)
From: Curious George
Email: None
To: Everyone
Subject: Rich Premies flock to Amaroo
Message:
Anyone know what's going on in
Amaroo?

Curious George

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 02:02:11 (GMT)
From: King Munmut
Email: None
To: Everyone
Subject: How can you be a 'Rich Premie'
Message:
If your rich, then you are not giving your all to the
Calcutta Creep. If your not giving your all, than the
creep will not think as much of you.
You will be well down the list from number 1.

Better start feeling 'GUILTY' right now all you
rich premies, or Heaven will not be yours :)

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Tues, Sep 05, 2000 at 18:14:49 (GMT)
From: cq
Email: None
To: King Munmut
Subject: Perhaps they just like to hang out with the Lord,
Message:
and think themselves his social equal.

Me? I wouldn't want to sink that low.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 07:05:51 (GMT)
From: Jean-Michel
Email: None
To: Curious George
Subject: Maybe for one of His Seminars?
Message:
3 or 4,000 $ par week, only wealthy premies can afford it .....

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 20:17:53 (GMT)
From: Lotus eater
Email: None
To: Jean-Michel
Subject: Maybe for one of His Seminars?
Message:
$5000us for 4 days camping with the Lord, 200 delegates. Yes a cool million US. Yesterday there were strong spring winds and it is very dry. Peak Crossing (right nextdoor to Amaroo) was on the news last night, widespread bush fires in the area, people being evacuated....don't know the exact timing of M's visit but he might be there by now!
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 14:47:03 (GMT)
From: Curious George
Email: None
To: Lotus eater
Subject: Did he turn up?
Message:
Dear Lotus Eater,

Did the 200 get their money's worth?

thanks for the information. Any more news?

Curious George

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 23:12:16 (GMT)
From: Hal
Email: None
To: Lotus eater
Subject: Thanks LE - a hot million ! nt
Message:
kgkj
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Sep 03, 2000 at 20:32:33 (GMT)
From: Lotus eater
Email: None
To: Hal
Subject: The winds have dropped now
Message:
and last night on the news the bush fire brigade were saying that they have the fires under control......Ivory's Rock didn't make the news so I'm looking forward to hearing the 'grace stories'! or the 'bummer filled with grace stories' if it turns out M didnt come because he heard about the fires before arriving!
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Sep 02, 2000 at 08:10:59 (GMT)
From: kiwiji
Email: None
To: Jean-Michel
Subject: hes coming to NEW ZEALAND HE IS COMING TO NEW ZEAL
Message:
AND!!!!
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Mon, Sep 04, 2000 at 20:36:58 (GMT)
From: luckdog
Email: None
To: jean-michel
Subject: amaroo
Message:
I know for sure there are a bunch of premies yakkin it up in amaroo for two weeks. don't know what is going down. My guess is darshan and other awful stuff to generate big dollars for elvis, I mean m.
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Tues, Sep 05, 2000 at 20:11:27 (GMT)
From: Hal
Email: None
To: luckdog
Subject: Elvis?
Message:
Oh please don't compare him with the King of rock 'n' roll. I personally prefer SB's term mariarchi similar to Liberachi.

Cheers hal

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Tues, Sep 05, 2000 at 17:34:33 (GMT)
From: Curious George
Email: None
To: luckdog
Subject: amaroo
Message:
Anymore information about this? I think a PAM has got there with some of my money,

Curious George

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Tues, Sep 05, 2000 at 20:36:46 (GMT)
From: Lotus Eater
Email: None
To: Curious George
Subject: what a curious situation
Message:
did the pam steal your money? is the pam going to give it back??

From what I understand, they will only be asked for more money, but personally you know like hahahahahaha it's a 'resources team' seminar, hahahahahaha

Boy, it takes a lot of money to be in the 'in' crowd! hahahaha
and you really aren't supposed to borrow the money to gain entrance, hahahahahahahaha

Seriously, though, look after your friend, he/she must be desperate.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index