Forum V: Archive
Compiled: Sun, Dec 31, 2000 at 15:16:37 (GMT)
From: Dec 18, 2000 To: Dec 27, 2000 Page: 2 Of: 5


Deputy Dog -:- Why don't you people believe Maharaji? -:- Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 00:00:09 (GMT)
__ PHD -:- Why don't you people believe Maharaji? -:- Wed, Dec 27, 2000 at 05:16:54 (GMT)
__ Aussi Ji -:- Why don't you people believe Maharaji? -:- Sun, Dec 24, 2000 at 19:10:46 (GMT)
__ looser -:- don't know about you but... -:- Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 05:04:54 (GMT)
__ Nigel -:- Admit it - you're on the turn, Dep... -:- Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 04:14:07 (GMT)
__ Jerry -:- You're being facetious, right? -:- Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 01:19:55 (GMT)
__ __ Deputy Dog -:- Yes I'm being facetious! -:- Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 04:07:21 (GMT)
__ JHB -:- Why limit yourself to 4 techniques??? -:- Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 00:13:38 (GMT)
__ __ janet -:- Why limit yourself to 4 techniques??? -:- Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 09:50:50 (GMT)
__ __ __ ulf -:- Why limit yourself to 4 techniques??? -:- Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 15:35:54 (GMT)
__ __ __ Helen -:- Why limit yourself to 4 techniques??? -:- Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 11:22:02 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Lesley -:- I think Dog is making a mistake -:- Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 19:54:55 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Deputy Dog -:- I think Dog is making a mistake -:- Sun, Dec 24, 2000 at 03:37:07 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ Lesley -:- Agreed, Dog -:- Sun, Dec 24, 2000 at 20:07:22 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ Sir Dave -:- I think Dog is making a mistake -:- Sun, Dec 24, 2000 at 07:58:47 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ Stonor -:- We know you're not GI-Joe -:- Sun, Dec 24, 2000 at 03:50:08 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Helen -:- I think Dog is making a mistake -:- Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 22:29:09 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ Lesley -:- Helen, your posts about fibromyalgia have got me -:- Sun, Dec 24, 2000 at 20:22:28 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ Helen -:- Helen, your posts about fibromyalgia have got me -:- Mon, Dec 25, 2000 at 04:52:35 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Lesley -:- Thanks, Helen, really helpful. NT -:- Mon, Dec 25, 2000 at 19:17:49 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Helen -:- the mind-body stress of being a premie -:- Tues, Dec 26, 2000 at 15:31:44 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Lesley -:- Yeah, the ironies are one of the more entertaining -:- Tues, Dec 26, 2000 at 20:31:56 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Helen -:- Yeah, the ironies are one of the more entertaining -:- Wed, Dec 27, 2000 at 00:50:05 (GMT)

JHB -:- Hi Everyone - Did this get posted? -:- Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 23:40:59 (GMT)
__ Jethro -:- Hi Everyone - Did this get posted? -:- Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 17:37:29 (GMT)
__ Katie -:- Greetings, John! -:- Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 13:12:09 (GMT)
__ __ Salam -:- Hello Kaite -:- Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 17:17:45 (GMT)
__ __ __ Katie -:- Hi Salam (and hey, Stonor!)(ot) -:- Sun, Dec 24, 2000 at 00:22:23 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Stonor -:- Hi Salam (and hey, Stonor!)(ot) -:- Sun, Dec 24, 2000 at 01:02:25 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Katie -:- Hi Stonor! (ot) -:- Sun, Dec 24, 2000 at 03:52:11 (GMT)
__ Robyn -:- Hi Everyone - Did this get posted? -:- Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 03:39:06 (GMT)
__ __ JHB -:- Thank you -:- Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 19:50:07 (GMT)
__ __ __ Marianne and Rafael -:- No, thank you! -:- Sun, Dec 24, 2000 at 08:05:22 (GMT)

Marianne -:- Libel threat made below -:- Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 22:53:04 (GMT)
__ Salam -:- Libel threat made below -:- Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 13:56:32 (GMT)
__ __ such -:- Salam has a point.Rife corruption. hush money. (nt -:- Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 20:54:32 (GMT)
__ __ Sanjit Ghandi -:- Bullshit. it was simply a discussion Marianne -:- Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 14:36:34 (GMT)
__ __ __ such -:- Sanjit, how are those holes in your head doin'? -:- Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 20:34:08 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Sanjit Ghandi -:- Sanjit, how are those holes in your head doin'? -:- Sun, Dec 24, 2000 at 01:09:31 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ GERRY -:- Sanjit, how are those holes in your head doin'? -:- Sun, Dec 24, 2000 at 04:12:29 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ suchabananda -:- ...Just like m. did, huh? 'NO CHEAT, NO DECEIT!' -:- Sun, Dec 24, 2000 at 03:49:36 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ suchabanana -:- It's longterm pattern of abuses,coverups,deception -:- Sun, Dec 24, 2000 at 02:30:38 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Stonor -:- You Tamil Tiger you! -:- Sun, Dec 24, 2000 at 02:00:40 (GMT)
__ __ __ Marianne -:- Bullshit. it was simply a discussion Marianne -:- Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 17:51:25 (GMT)
__ __ __ Salam -:- Bullshit. it was simply a discussion Marianne -:- Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 17:51:12 (GMT)
__ __ __ Nigel -:- Call that a discussion..? -:- Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 15:22:47 (GMT)
__ suchabanana -:- question of libel r.e. Public Figures-Please READ -:- Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 06:36:28 (GMT)
__ __ No statute of limitations -:- question of libel r.e. Public Figures-Please READ -:- Sun, Dec 24, 2000 at 06:13:59 (GMT)
__ __ __ such -:- you are so very welcome, one who understands (nt -:- Sun, Dec 24, 2000 at 09:53:37 (GMT)
__ __ such -:- Q:Was there any drinking prior to accident? (nt -:- Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 06:49:33 (GMT)
__ Nigel -:- Can you email me? (ot) -:- Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 04:21:46 (GMT)
__ such -:- Right on! Power to the PEOPLE!!! (nt -:- Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 01:28:18 (GMT)
__ Sir Dave -:- I'm really worried -:- Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 00:32:47 (GMT)
__ __ Roger eDrek -:- You'd better be worried -:- Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 01:37:40 (GMT)
__ __ Marianne -:- I love that picture! -:- Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 00:38:37 (GMT)
__ __ __ Cynthia -:- Marianne, I love you, you, you, woman lawyer! -:- Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 01:26:57 (GMT)
__ Roger eDrek -:- Don't mess with 'em. They are the worst... -:- Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 23:19:53 (GMT)
__ Bazza -:- OT -:- Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 23:07:28 (GMT)

Joe -:- What a Surprising Journey It Has Been -:- Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 19:00:30 (GMT)
__ Jim -:- You're so right (with slight correction) -:- Sun, Dec 24, 2000 at 02:07:11 (GMT)
__ __ ham -:- Hippy mega naivete methinx -:- Sun, Dec 24, 2000 at 22:50:26 (GMT)
__ __ Deputy Dog -:- More information does not equal happiness -:- Sun, Dec 24, 2000 at 03:56:11 (GMT)
__ __ __ hamzen -:- But good information management does (nt) -:- Sun, Dec 24, 2000 at 22:54:01 (GMT)
__ Deputy Dog -:- A debt of gratitude. -:- Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 03:41:42 (GMT)
__ __ Sir Dave -:- A debt of gratitude. -:- Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 03:55:24 (GMT)
__ __ __ Deputy Dog -:- Thanks Sir Dave. -:- Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 04:27:21 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Nigel -:- Amen - humility stinks! (nt) -:- Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 05:45:45 (GMT)
__ Bin Liner -:- What a relief , I didn't find a single word ..... -:- Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 00:28:27 (GMT)
__ __ Sir Dave -:- An alien culture fooled us -:- Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 01:05:34 (GMT)
__ Kelly -:- What a Surprising Journey It Has Been -:- Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 23:05:08 (GMT)
__ __ Cynthia -:- What a Surprising Journey It Has Been -:- Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 02:55:36 (GMT)
__ __ __ Roger eDrek -:- I swear! The devil made me do it! -:- Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 06:08:46 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Sir Dave -:- I don't fancy yours much, Roger (nt) -:- Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 10:07:34 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Sir Dave -:- Meaning, I'll have those chicks but -:- Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 10:11:12 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ Roger eDrek -:- I only lust for money and power -:- Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 20:16:31 (GMT)
__ Sir Dave -:- He couldn't compete with my toilet bowl -:- Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 20:08:14 (GMT)
__ __ Roger eDrek -:- Sir Dave, I challenge you to a pissing contest! -:- Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 23:16:42 (GMT)
__ __ __ Sir Dave -:- Sir Dave, I challenge you to a pissing contest! -:- Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 00:42:28 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Roger eDrek -:- Damn right, I'll take some -:- Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 02:06:46 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Roger eDrek -:- Sorry, Joe. I'm bringing the vibe down... -:- Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 02:42:25 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ Sir Dave -:- He walked with gods and didn't know it -:- Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 03:13:25 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ Cynthia -:- He walked with gods and didn't know it -:- Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 04:47:18 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ Cynathia -:- Rog, are you talking to yourself??? -:- Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 03:00:52 (GMT)
__ __ Joe -:- That's Hysterical, Dave...well done. (nt) -:- Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 20:44:28 (GMT)
__ Joy -:- What a Surprising Journey It Has Been -:- Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 20:02:49 (GMT)
__ __ Katie -:- Thanks from me, too, Joe (and what she said!) -:- Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 13:10:45 (GMT)
__ __ __ Joe -:- Thanks, Katie .. I appreciate your friendship, too -:- Mon, Dec 25, 2000 at 21:17:22 (GMT)
__ __ Joe -:- Thanks, Joy -:- Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 20:45:25 (GMT)
__ Way -:- The beat goes on -:- Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 19:22:00 (GMT)
__ __ Tim G -:- The beat goes on -:- Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 19:38:40 (GMT)
__ __ __ Helen -:- The beat goes on -:- Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 03:21:20 (GMT)

SB -:- Can someone tell me right now -:- Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 18:19:55 (GMT)
__ gerry -:- Yes, Ma'am, at your service.. -:- Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 18:29:43 (GMT)
__ It's in -:- Not my last response -:- Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 18:29:30 (GMT)

kap -:- friendship ranch updates -:- Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 14:11:50 (GMT)
__ Sir Dave -:- friendship ranch updates -:- Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 14:41:42 (GMT)
__ __ Cynthia -:- I wasn't there, but I'll come this time (nt) -:- Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 04:53:47 (GMT)

Salam -:- Buzz -:- Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 12:11:20 (GMT)
__ Buzz -:- Buzz -:- Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 05:56:07 (GMT)

Eric -:- Tell me what knowledge is -:- Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 11:58:12 (GMT)
__ Elaine -:- Wouldn't this be Knowledge? -:- Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 22:01:18 (GMT)
__ __ cq -:- what need is there for an instructor - ? -:- Sun, Dec 24, 2000 at 18:32:06 (GMT)
__ __ gErRy -:- HorseCOCK, Elaine -:- Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 23:11:11 (GMT)
__ cq -:- Quote: 'TO PLACE THE TEACHER ABOVE ALL' -:- Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 15:15:52 (GMT)
__ __ Suchabananda -:- KNOWLEDGE TECHNIQUES-FREE-HERE-NOW-NO GURU! -:- Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 19:17:16 (GMT)
__ __ __ Salam -:- KNOWLEDGE TECHNIQUES-FREE-HERE-NOW-NO GURU! -:- Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 18:22:12 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ such -:- KNOWLEDGE TECHNIQUES-FREE-HERE-NOW-NO GURU! -:- Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 21:07:34 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Salam -:- Well I am glad you've come so far -:- Sun, Dec 24, 2000 at 00:14:33 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ Suchaboneanna -:- r.e.moola:you sure you aren't related to Prem? (nt -:- Sun, Dec 24, 2000 at 01:04:17 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ Salam -:- Oh, it is nothing. Only the thought of a -:- Mon, Dec 25, 2000 at 13:31:19 (GMT)
__ __ __ cq -:- OLD knowledge techniques-free-here-now-NO GURU! -:- Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 19:26:18 (GMT)
__ __ Stonor -:- Quote: 'TO PLACE THE TEACHER ABOVE ALL' -:- Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 15:55:30 (GMT)
__ __ __ cq -:- 'TO PLACE THE TEACHER ABOVE ALL' = dictatorship -:- Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 16:59:43 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Stonor -:- 'TO PLACE THE TEACHER ABOVE ALL' = dictatorship -:- Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 17:53:42 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ cq -:- benevolent dictatorship it AIN'T! -:- Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 18:55:23 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ Stonor -:- covert aggressive = 'benevolent' dictatorship -:- Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 22:04:54 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ Jethro -:- CQ Don't you remember -:- Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 19:06:04 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ sucha -:- Stand on your own 2 feet! no need for 'Cain' (nt -:- Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 21:13:30 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ cq -:- Three-legged stool? I know he's milking it but ... -:- Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 19:30:04 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Jethro -:- To CQ -:- Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 23:19:15 (GMT)
__ __ __ Salam -:- Stonor..ot -:- Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 16:11:10 (GMT)
__ janet of venice -:- what knowledge is -:- Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 13:19:09 (GMT)
__ JTF -:- If you want to have some fun,... -:- Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 12:41:10 (GMT)
__ Salam -:- There is no secret. -:- Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 12:05:36 (GMT)
__ __ Tim G -:- There is no secret. -:- Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 14:47:44 (GMT)

Sir Dave -:- The War of the Web -:- Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 11:12:52 (GMT)
__ Cynthia -:- Your Welcome and Thanks (nt) -:- Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 04:51:41 (GMT)
__ sucha -:- Fire up metatags, links,boost this site rating (nt -:- Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 19:07:36 (GMT)
__ bill -:- Thank you for your good work all this time!-nt -:- Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 13:34:02 (GMT)
__ __ Sir Dave -:- Thanks for the thanks (nt) -:- Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 14:53:54 (GMT)

janet of venice -:- SATPAL HELD OFFICE. HE CAN PROSECUTE THESE -:- Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 09:38:13 (GMT)
__ bill-his brother is even -:- more harmful that our lord is.-nt -:- Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 17:26:04 (GMT)
__ Mr. Free -:- SATPAL'S ADDRESS OR WEBSITE -:- Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 19:27:46 (GMT)
__ Jim -:- THAT'S A VERY PRACTICAL IDEA, JANET -:- Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 17:46:14 (GMT)
__ __ Nigel -:- Er, one small problem...? -:- Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 06:14:44 (GMT)
__ Jethro -:- Dopn't hold your breathe -:- Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 09:46:55 (GMT)
__ __ Buzz -:- Dopn't hold your breathe -:- Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 06:34:00 (GMT)
__ __ __ Jethro -:- to Buzz -:- Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 10:16:53 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Buzz -:- to Buzz -:- Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 15:53:12 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Jethro -:- to Buzz -:- Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 17:32:10 (GMT)
__ __ Sir Dave -:- Don't hold your breath -:- Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 10:05:54 (GMT)
__ __ __ Jethro -:- Thanks for correcting my spelling -:- Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 12:16:10 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Sir Dave -:- and talking of heavies -:- Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 16:36:44 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Jethro -:- Did you hear the 'Black Rose' story.. -:- Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 19:13:46 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ Sir Dave -:- Did you hear the 'Black Rose' story.. -:- Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 01:13:12 (GMT)

Kelly -:- A book recommendation and a suggestion -:- Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 09:35:31 (GMT)
__ Helen -:- A book recommendation and a suggestion -:- Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 03:32:38 (GMT)
__ Salam -:- A book recommendation and a suggestion -:- Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 11:09:08 (GMT)
__ __ Kelly -:- A book recommendation and a suggestion -:- Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 13:49:20 (GMT)

Mr. Free -:- The enemy behind the enemy -:- Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 06:57:42 (GMT)
__ bill -:- 'the devil knows not for whom he works' right? -:- Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 13:43:21 (GMT)
__ lol -:- The enemy behind the enemy and more Bull Shitttttt -:- Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 07:35:36 (GMT)
__ __ Mr. Free -:- The enemy behind the enemy and more Bull Shitttttt -:- Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 19:58:15 (GMT)
__ __ __ lol -:- The enem and the nemy and more Bull Shitttttt -:- Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 22:05:44 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Mr. Free -:- You seem to need to be in control -:- Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 01:12:52 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ lol -:- You seem ...... blah blah blah -:- Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 03:10:47 (GMT)
__ __ brian too -:- Give him a break -:- Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 09:19:18 (GMT)
__ __ __ lol -:- Give him a break, (not) -:- Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 10:23:05 (GMT)
__ __ janet of venice -:- i'm with your mr free--same realizations nt -:- Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 08:16:16 (GMT)
__ __ __ lol -:- i'm with your mr free--same realizations nt -:- Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 11:02:13 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Mr. Free -:- i'm with your mr free--same realizations nt -:- Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 19:56:21 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ lol -:- i'm with your mr free--same realizations nt -:- Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 22:23:43 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Bin Liner -:- What caches of weapons , explain please (nt) -:- Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 22:03:14 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ Mr. Free -:- What caches of weapons , explain please (nt) -:- Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 23:33:19 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ Bin Liner -:- I'll wait. (nt) -:- Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 00:53:14 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ brian too -:- nt means no text nt -:- Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 20:53:17 (GMT)


Date: Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 00:00:09 (GMT)
From: Deputy Dog
Email: None
To: Everyone
Subject: Why don't you people believe Maharaji?
Message:
Why don’t you people believe Maharaji and give him a break for God’s sake? What Maharaji clearly states in the FAQs on the Elan Vital Web site is that:

1. He does not present himself as a leader
2. He is not a messianic type figure
3. He is just an ordinary human being no different from anybody else.

And evidently the foot kissing, and the Krishna dancing, and the whole Satguru - superior - power - in - person - Lord - of - the - Universe schtick we were all asked to swallow, was the work of evil mahatmas. It was I assume, just some sort of eccentric and flamboyant tomfoolery foisted on unsuspecting Westerners in order to con them out of their cash. Although it seems the mahatma’s didn’t get much. And why would an ordinary human being no different from anybody else deserve a $5 million yacht?

Apparently 1973 to 1999 was all just some sort of bizarre, spiritual charade, a bunch of strange concepts, corny spiritual materialism for form-junkies; a fascinating and rather odd soap opera designed to entertain and make money. Maharaji has all but admitted this in those FAQs hasn’t he? Of course tomorrow he could claim that those same evil mahatmas wrote the FAQs without his approval.

And what are we left with? In my experience the four techniques of meditation are real and they work. They tune me in to a place where I feel safe and good and real. I’m going to hold onto them. I am also going to use these four ancient meditation techniques to extricate myself from this bizarre and sleazy story.

Buddha said to, “Be a lamp unto yourself,” and I for one am going to take his advice. And as they say in 12 Step Programs, “Take what you like and leave the rest.”

May you all be happy and successful,

Deputy Dog

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Date: Wed, Dec 27, 2000 at 05:16:54 (GMT)
From: PHD
Email: None
To: Deputy Dog
Subject: Why don't you people believe Maharaji?
Message:
skuzs me askin, but are you from the land down under?
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Date: Sun, Dec 24, 2000 at 19:10:46 (GMT)
From: Aussi Ji
Email: None
To: Deputy Dog
Subject: Why don't you people believe Maharaji?
Message:
G'Day DD,You are a man or woman after my own heart
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Date: Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 05:04:54 (GMT)
From: looser
Email: None
To: Deputy Dog
Subject: don't know about you but...
Message:
I don't read anything here for a couple of weeks, 'What can these loosers say. anyway?' and. and. and its just plain CRAZY or (nevermind)
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Date: Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 04:14:07 (GMT)
From: Nigel
Email: fitzroy@liverpool.ac.uk
To: Deputy Dog
Subject: Admit it - you're on the turn, Dep...
Message:
For one thing, you're thinking like an ex-premie at last. Now all you now need to do is dissociate those four age-old yoga techniques (which might or might not have made you a better man anyway) from his Royal Lordiness and you're there.

Good luck...

(Will you really want to be associated with a sleazy, hit-and-run driver and sexual predator once his unpleasant spare time activities reach the wider public?)

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Date: Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 01:19:55 (GMT)
From: Jerry
Email: None
To: Deputy Dog
Subject: You're being facetious, right?
Message:
So, Dog, does this mean you're giving up the guru worship trip? Good for you if that's so. As for the meditation techniques, hey, if you dig them, why not use them? No harm there as far as I can tell. They're not for everybody, though. I, myself, remain unimpressed.
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Date: Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 04:07:21 (GMT)
From: Deputy Dog
Email: None
To: Jerry
Subject: Yes I'm being facetious!
Message:
Jerry,

I've never been into the guru worship trip. But after what's been posted here in the last few months, whatever respect I did have for Maharaji has taken a real beating.

I think Way put it best when he said that on a premie scale of 1 to 10, I'd be a about a 3. He was right! I've always been into Knowledge more than Maharaji. Thank God for that!

Deputy Dog

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Date: Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 00:13:38 (GMT)
From: JHB
Email: None
To: Deputy Dog
Subject: Why limit yourself to 4 techniques???
Message:
Is it because M (or M's Mahatmas) taught them?

John.

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Date: Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 09:50:50 (GMT)
From: janet
Email: None
To: dog
Subject: Why limit yourself to 4 techniques???
Message:
look dog--the techniques are like sex or food or spending money. sometimes they feel good, but they arent the appropriate response to every situation in life. there are times when they are outright obstructive to meeting the problem and solving it. that's right up there with running for the kitchen and cramming food in your face for every stress you encounter, or compulsively resorting to sex to take away every unpleasant set of circumstances you've created in your life, or running up your credit cards when you feel unhappy. the behavior doesnt address the actual dynamics and change them. its just a compulsive way to hide and self medicate.plus it creates a new crisis on top of the previous one.
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Date: Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 15:35:54 (GMT)
From: ulf
Email: None
To: janet
Subject: Why limit yourself to 4 techniques???
Message:
hi janet.

Thank you for your clever words
For me this is a new way seeing this meditation ``thing``
It is surely not the only answer to everything we are feeling
bad about....Yes Yes Yes ....
this forum is great

ulf

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Date: Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 11:22:02 (GMT)
From: Helen
Email: None
To: janet
Subject: Why limit yourself to 4 techniques???
Message:
Dear Janet
I really agree with you here. I used to crawl under the blanket and meditate when I had a conflict with a person. Trying to dissolve away conflict that exists with another person by meditating it away doesn't work, I am here to tell ya. I think that meditation may be fine as a health regimen just like exercise, but I don't think it's the be all and end all. Especially since we are hard wired to be social beings, not hermits.
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Date: Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 19:54:55 (GMT)
From: Lesley
Email: None
To: Helen
Subject: I think Dog is making a mistake
Message:
by trying to meditate his way out of addressing how he feels about Maharaji.

Dog, if you are reading this, please limit your meditation, too much time under the blanky can be very bad for your mental health. It can literally affect the operation of the senses.

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Date: Sun, Dec 24, 2000 at 03:37:07 (GMT)
From: Deputy Dog
Email: None
To: Lesley
Subject: I think Dog is making a mistake
Message:
Lesley,

Just an hour or so a day and I feel safer, better, and smarter. Lesley, how many wars to end all war have we fought?

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Date: Sun, Dec 24, 2000 at 20:07:22 (GMT)
From: Lesley
Email: None
To: Deputy Dog
Subject: Agreed, Dog
Message:
Yes, religious wars have to be finished with. Ever since we started believing in God The Big Daddy we have been fighting the stupidest wars, literally and also verbally.

That wasn't my point in writing about the overuse of meditation, though. I just didn't want to see you make the same mistake I did, without at least saying something.

I went 25 years where I meditated, generally an hour a day, but towards the end, I was meditating for hours every day and it had a foul effect.

Ever hear about Near Death Experiences? they are generally characterised by golden light, feeling really good, a sense of being loved and cared for.

These experiences naturally occur when a human being is massively traumatised. I ask myself how smart can it be to emulate being traumatised in order to feel good?

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Date: Sun, Dec 24, 2000 at 07:58:47 (GMT)
From: Sir Dave
Email: None
To: Deputy Dog
Subject: I think Dog is making a mistake
Message:
If I were you D D, I wouldn't let anyone dictate what I should or shouldn't do. Nobody has that right.

.. Dave

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Date: Sun, Dec 24, 2000 at 03:50:08 (GMT)
From: Stonor
Email: None
To: Deputy Dog
Subject: We know you're not GI-Joe
Message:
Is that what you've got going for you? You're not part of the military? Which wars did you fight in Deputy Dog? Is that why you feel safer and smarter?
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Date: Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 22:29:09 (GMT)
From: Helen
Email: None
To: Lesley
Subject: I think Dog is making a mistake
Message:
I agree. To meditate away such a huge thing is to lie to one's self. I know because I am the Queen of Da Nile (denial) ha ha
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Date: Sun, Dec 24, 2000 at 20:22:28 (GMT)
From: Lesley
Email: None
To: Helen
Subject: Helen, your posts about fibromyalgia have got me
Message:
thinking. A little over a decade ago, I developed anaphylaxis. This is a condition in which you develop a severe and frequently fatal allergic reaction to certain substances. Just the other day I got stung by a bee and had no allergic reaction, (it is many years since I got stung last, and I did have a course of desensitising injections).

I remember thinking in those last awful months before I found this site and started to sort myself out that I had become allergic to myself!

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Date: Mon, Dec 25, 2000 at 04:52:35 (GMT)
From: Helen
Email: None
To: Lesley
Subject: Helen, your posts about fibromyalgia have got me
Message:
No doubt that you were 'allergic to yourself,' that is, your autoimmune system was attacking itself because you were out of balance.

The ultimate example of this to me, was when someone wrote here about a satsang of Joan Aptor's at a festival where she said her mind sometimes wished it were all over and that maharaji's plane would crash and he could die. And probably in the next breath she was saying she loved him (that is my guess anyway). Such an extreme inner conflict. No one can live like that and maintain physical and mental health.

May we all achieve greater personal integrity and balance in our lives--which means NOT putting up with the unacceptable in the guise of 'love'!

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Date: Mon, Dec 25, 2000 at 19:17:49 (GMT)
From: Lesley
Email: None
To: Helen
Subject: Thanks, Helen, really helpful. NT
Message:
xox
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Date: Tues, Dec 26, 2000 at 15:31:44 (GMT)
From: Helen
Email: None
To: Lesley
Subject: the mind-body stress of being a premie
Message:
The mind-body connection fascinates me as I struggle with these health issues. I'm going to take part in a fibromyalgia/chronic fatigue study which will be dealing in large part with the psychological and emotional traits that compound these syndromes.

I've noticed alot of folks on the forum have multiple chemical senstitivities, chronic fatigue, or arthritis/fibromyalgia. I think that living under the enormous stress of being premies, we were in constant emotional, psychological and physical stress. I never realized just HOW stressful until finding this website. It's ironic that something that is allegedly supposed to connect us with perfect peace could have stressed us out so much, eh?

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Date: Tues, Dec 26, 2000 at 20:31:56 (GMT)
From: Lesley
Email: None
To: Helen
Subject: Yeah, the ironies are one of the more entertaining
Message:
aspects of becoming an ex! It's lucky it is such a rich source of humour because it comes with a sense of horror as I settle down and become more peaceful in myself and realise over and over again how badly Maharaji misled me.

Since dumping the guru, I made the judgement that I was a viable human being, and along with learning how to live with myself instead of being in mortal combat with myself, have been actually exercising my will power to fulfill my dream, simple as it is, and the success that I have had has felt great and brought pleasure to others, rather than pain.

How much pain has Maharaji brought about in people's lives?

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Date: Wed, Dec 27, 2000 at 00:50:05 (GMT)
From: Helen
Email: None
To: Lesley
Subject: Yeah, the ironies are one of the more entertaining
Message:
To recognize oneself as a 'viable human being' --yeah, so true. M and other dogmatic religious leaders really play up our so-called inherent unworthiness, don't they? It's why I am so into humanity mow, and so not into trying to be some perfect 'spiritual' person. Not being in 'mortal combat with myself'--another great phrase. Living day to day shouldn't be so hard, should it? We've had to redraw the reality map and really, a person can draw it any way they want to! It's great having choices.

M can just go to hell, he's no help at all.

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Date: Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 23:40:59 (GMT)
From: JHB
Email: None
To: Everyone
Subject: Hi Everyone - Did this get posted?
Message:
Well, I've finally got home net access here in the Latvian countryside (look it up on an atlas those of you who don't know where Latvia is). It only took 7 months:-)

Anyway, life is good without the fat Indian bloke, but did this gem from Elan Vital in the UK get posted? It's dated 9th October 2000, and it's inviting applications for various vacant positions in Elan Vital UK.

--------------------------------------------------

Introductory and Follow up Manager:-

To ensure that ALL people in the UK have the opportunity to be introduced to M & K.
(didn't this forum start those abbreviations???)

Preparing for Knowledge Manager:-

To develop the aspirant team as a resource ensuring anyone in the preparation process is fully informed and supported.

Post Knowledge Care Manager:-

To ensure those who have attended a KS have the resources of practice sessions, access to instructors, access to appropriate follow-up materials and the opportunity to participate.

Participation Manager:-

To synchronise, facilitate and bring the area of Participation in the UK to higher standards.

Materials Manager:-

To ensure the availability of appropriate materials to support the Knowledge process.

IT Manager:-

To initiate any IT projects that become necessary and have an overall picture of all IT projects relating to EV, and knowledge of their current status.
-----------------------------------------------------

It seems to me that at that time just about every position in EV UK was vacant. Has everyone jumped ship?

Anyway, Merry Christmas everyone, and thanks again to every who set this website up and who have kept it going!

John Brauns

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Date: Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 17:37:29 (GMT)
From: Jethro
Email: None
To: JHB
Subject: Hi Everyone - Did this get posted?
Message:
Hi John

Seasons greetings

Jethro

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Date: Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 13:12:09 (GMT)
From: Katie
Email: None
To: JHB
Subject: Greetings, John!
Message:
Glad you're back on line - and good to hear from you.

Take care,
Katie

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Date: Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 17:17:45 (GMT)
From: Salam
Email: None
To: Katie
Subject: Hello Kaite
Message:
Nice to see you back too. Missed you :)

Salam

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Date: Sun, Dec 24, 2000 at 00:22:23 (GMT)
From: Katie
Email: None
To: Salam
Subject: Hi Salam (and hey, Stonor!)(ot)
Message:
You are only seeing me here because I had half of yesterday and half of today off from work. December has been wild because of the amount of work we have to get done at my job by January 1! I didn't hardly send out Christmas cards this year and I am usually so efficient about that...oh well.

I'm putting a 'hey' to Stonor in here too - efficient use of one 'ot' message :)!

I hope to be around here in the New Year, but who knows!

Love,
Katie

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Date: Sun, Dec 24, 2000 at 01:02:25 (GMT)
From: Stonor
Email: None
To: Katie
Subject: Hi Salam (and hey, Stonor!)(ot)
Message:
I can imagine! ;-)

Happy Holidays, and Happy New Year to you and Brian!

Much love,

Anna

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Date: Sun, Dec 24, 2000 at 03:52:11 (GMT)
From: Katie
Email: None
To: Stonor
Subject: Hi Stonor! (ot)
Message:
Hey, Anna -
Best wishes for a happy new year to you too!
Lots of love,
Katie
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Date: Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 03:39:06 (GMT)
From: Robyn
Email: None
To: JHB
Subject: Hi Everyone - Did this get posted?
Message:
Dear John,
Merry Christmas and welcome back. Hope things are as you'd invisioned them.
Love,
Robyn
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Date: Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 19:50:07 (GMT)
From: JHB
Email: None
To: Robyn
Subject: Thank you
Message:
Thanks Robyn, Katie and Jethro for your welcome.

Things are good here. When I came in April, my plan was to spend the summer in my house and on my land, and look for work in the autumn (fall). After a short while, I fell in love with living here, and the idea of living in the city (which I would have to do to earn any sort of decent salary) became very unattractive. So I now look after my horses, ducks and hens, saw and chop firewood, and generally chill out! The question is can I afford to do this for the rest of my life:-)

Anyway, all the best to all you wonderful exes!

John.

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Date: Sun, Dec 24, 2000 at 08:05:22 (GMT)
From: Marianne and Rafael
Email: MarianneDB@aol.com
To: JHB
Subject: No, thank you!
Message:
Hello there John! I send you many hugs and kisses. Rafael sends you many thanks for taking care of him.

My time in Europe was made wonderful and even more bizarre by our evening at the Latvian Club. You recall the criminal attorney from Wales who showed up and knew a friend of mine who did death penalty work in the US? Well, I saw that person over the summer and he said, 'Oh, the guy you met at 3 am must have been so and so. And he was right! What a bizarre thing to have been with the exes and to have run into a lawyer in another country with a connection to my death penalty work!!! That just says how special you all are. Many thanks for taking care of me and my husband.

I hope your life in Latvia flourishes. Your specialness should make it so.

Much love.
Marianne

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Date: Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 22:53:04 (GMT)
From: Marianne
Email: None
To: Everyone
Subject: Libel threat made below
Message:
In a thread below, someone courageous soul has made a number of posts using the name Indira Ghandi. In one post, enitled 'Vehicular Manslaughter', this poster tells me that I have come perilously close to libeling M, and encourages me to go ahead.

First of all, I post here under my real name. You can be pretty brave when posting under an alias, can't you?

Secondly, it's only libel if it's false. What's false about what I said?

Thirdly, LET'S GO!!! I'd be more than happy to depose M, Randy Prouty, and everyone else who was present when this incident occurred as a part of my defense of the civil action.

I'm not scared of you, or that sorry excuse for a human being you call your master.

This stuff is really getting to you guys down in Malibu and at the upper echelons of EV, isn't it?

Marianne Bachers
You know where to find me

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Date: Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 13:56:32 (GMT)
From: Salam
Email: None
To: Marianne
Subject: Libel threat made below
Message:
Hello Marianne,

I re-read the thread that you mentioned and this thread. I do not have anything to add about the 'libel' case. But I do want to say that MD has a lot of explaining to do. I hate talking about something without knowing what the details and the circumstances are. I question MDs motives in that post.

As for the rest of Indiras' posts, I really do not think that he is threatining you. I think what he is trying to say is that India, like many third world (I hate this expresion) countries such as Pakistan, Iran, Iraq, Turkey and others work in a different way than that of the west. For example, a man killing his daughter in a muslim country for adultry is not looked at as a criminal but as someone that has put his honor in order, though he may get sentenced. In this particular case of M, we need to remember something called corruption, backsheesh, underhanded, favors..etc. In a place as varied as India, the majority of the population is living under the poverty level, the social status of the two participants plays another part. Money solved the problem, the family of the victim probably thought that the won the lotto by the death of there son, father or whoever it is. Belive me, I have seen it happen. The higher your social standared the more chances are that you will get away with it.

I am not saying, let us sweep this matter under the table. But I do believe that you will find that it is an impossible task to achive. Remember also that the Indian courts, lawyers or whatever, will concider any inquiry as inyerference by a foreignor trying to tell them what to do.

How to approach this is anyones' guess, but finding someone in India that wants to get involved may help.

A civil lawsuite sounds good, but again I wish you good luck.

Please don't take this as a dammper, you know how much I want to see Rawat pay back for what he wants. But India is ruled by gurus not the law.

wish you a good holiday and good luck

Salam

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Date: Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 20:54:32 (GMT)
From: such
Email: None
To: Salam
Subject: Salam has a point.Rife corruption. hush money. (nt
Message:
nt
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Date: Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 14:36:34 (GMT)
From: Sanjit Ghandi
Email: Mum , the Tamils are back!
To: Salam
Subject: Bullshit. it was simply a discussion Marianne
Message:
You are on the money here Salam.Marianne you seem so paranoid as to not recognise reason.You are talking about an impossible task. The case would have been well and truly closed. You have only one antagonistic witness who is 'speaking up' twenty years later.
I gave you more credit. As a legal practioner you should acknowledge your chance of successfully raising this matter in a foriegn court of jurisdiction as ZILCH.
Even under the terms of Suchabana's convoluted logic , you are sailing close to the wind. I'm certainly doing nothing about it . It was merely an observation. I just think your passion for a cause damages your legal judgement.As for EV taking an interest in your activity I think you certainly flatter yourself.
I'd say you are viewed in the same light as a Bot fly on a horse's arse. Nothing that can't be cured with a good purgitave infused with the right pathogen control!Talk about legends in your own lunchtimes!Sheesh..at least Heller has the guts to admit it has no legs.
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Date: Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 20:34:08 (GMT)
From: such
Email: None
To: Sanjit Ghandi
Subject: Sanjit, how are those holes in your head doin'?
Message:
Hey Sanjit,

Hey, how are those holes in your head doing these days? 'convoluted logic', huh? My post below clearly outlines and articulates the rights of ex-premies [or anyone] to discuss, speculate, and express opinions based upon the matters recently brought up by Mr. Michael Dettmers.

Stay Sikh, Sanjit! Back into the box, or the flames of wherever you came from...

Peace,

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Date: Sun, Dec 24, 2000 at 01:09:31 (GMT)
From: Sanjit Ghandi
Email: So , she's Italian,So What Mom??
To: such
Subject: Sanjit, how are those holes in your head doin'?
Message:
No problem. Since those wonderful little Tamil separatists opened up my head for me , I can see the situation far more clearly but; oh well , there is nothing I can do now.God though , I have a Tiger of a headache!
I am not talking about 'discussion'.I like discussion. Here in my discussions with you and other X's I am refering to taking something on board and accepting it as truth,publishing it and then allowing it to be further embellished. For instance in the way Marianne has.(A lawyer may discuss interrogitorries within the confines of their law firms. It is never a public discussion.) Mind you , she is totally free to talk about whatever she wants . I enjoy talking with her. But make no mistake if Heller , Bacher and Co allow this little conversation to blossom , nothing will happen at law.

Why do you think neither she nor Jim will discuss a Class action here. Is it because they seriously want to keep that one up there sleeves? ( Wouldn't they make some lolly there huh?) So why is she so willing to discuss this issue here? Because she knows it hasn't got a snow flakes chance in hell of getting up.
As for EV spending a fortune finding out who posts here Marianne, you are doing the talking . Put up or shut up.More hearsay , more unprovable facts. I'm sure some poor soul from PR has the unenviable task of wading through the show here. So what? would you expect any less?
I don't think it happens the way Marianne projects it. Her one big break was working on the Jonestown thing. Now she keeps trying to introduce it like some immediate spectre,like her Ace in the pack, her four leaf clover; when in fact the activity she is comparing it to,has now been conducted for over thirty years , with little or no incident.To try and create controversy,isolated non connected ,incidents from those thirty years are publised here as if it were yesterday.
This is no Waco ,no Jonestown . There is no isolated well guarded jungle compound. No rural fortress bristling with weaponry.People are not living in social isolation.

Do you understand me now regarding my 'discussion' on libel?And if you still think I'm just a lone crazed Gunmen on the Grassy Knoll , check with Bazza. He was interested in my office address.
Just let's make one thing clear. I'm talking.As an individual.No EV,no agenda.
And isn't it always good to get a second legal opinion?
PS: Above a quote refers to 6 million premies world wide over the last 30 years. I'm one of them.What makes you think I'm still practising Marianne?

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Date: Sun, Dec 24, 2000 at 04:12:29 (GMT)
From: GERRY
Email: None
To: Sanjit Ghandi
Subject: Sanjit, how are those holes in your head doin'?
Message:
so where do you get the 6 million figure?

I challenge that number.

Prove your figures are correct. Why should I accept them? Offer some proof.

Yes, Marianne was indeed involved in the Jonestown case. Don't try to minimalise this, it was indeed a very big deal. But it's not the most important thing she's ever done. You see, for her death row clients, she the last line of defence between life and death. And some of these people may be innocent. Do you understand?

And also, you're blowing smoke BECAUSE YOU KNOW NOTHING OF THE BEHIND-THE-SCENES happenings.

We've got some serious and professional people here dedicated to righting these wrongs. Too bad for you and your master, turd-face. (snicker)

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Date: Sun, Dec 24, 2000 at 03:49:36 (GMT)
From: suchabananda
Email: None
To: Sanjit Ghandi
Subject: ...Just like m. did, huh? 'NO CHEAT, NO DECEIT!'
Message:
You wrote:

'Here in my discussions with you and other X's I am refering to taking something on board and accepting it as truth,publishing it and then allowing it to be further embellished.' --

Yeah, exactly, that's just what m. and EV did -- with the cult p.r. and the whole guru-shmuru trip. -- for selfish ego-power while gorging on 'maya' shamelessly at the premie trough!

Hey, I'm still under direct 'agya' to give holy discourse of the truth. 'No cheat, no deceit', remember? I actually took that phrase seriously.

If nothing else, I've learned that one -- in my own life.

I expect a so-called master to do at least that, too, and better.

So, who is truly master and who is fraud? I won't be the judge on that one.

Sanjit, tip: don't put any more Tigers in your tanks.

Peace,

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Date: Sun, Dec 24, 2000 at 02:30:38 (GMT)
From: suchabanana
Email: None
To: Sanjit Ghandi
Subject: It's longterm pattern of abuses,coverups,deception
Message:
Sanjit:

You wrote:
'in fact the activity she is comparing it to,has now been conducted for over thirty years , with little or no incident.To try and create controversy,isolated non connected ,incidents from those thirty years are publised here as if it were yesterday.'

little or no incident, huh? Guess you haven't been around - that's right, you've been dead [sorry, almost forgot]. Incident-ally, I was there with Fakiranand in Detroit. Also, where did the thousands of dollars of my donations REally go? I was not expecting it to go toward buying a yacht, or Rolexes, etc.

You are so sly, Sanjit: ok, Marianne ain't no dummy, where it counts! But never to underestimate someone, ok? Sshhh.

So, you're not practising anymore (knowledge or law)? Guess what, I meditate on several ancient universal and readily available techs (have been for 30 years). In truthfulness, I like sincerely communing with the life energy within me. Have been doing that -- and seeing inner light, hearing inner music etc. ever since I was a kid. I just close my eyes -- it's there. I hear the inner sounds all the time.

'6 million'? oh yeah, you mean the hollowcost!

Oops, time for din, we are having spicy lentils, rice, and dhosas.

You like paisley? Remember, dead men don't wear plaid.

Merry Mithrasmas!

Peace,

da lil' swami

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Date: Sun, Dec 24, 2000 at 02:00:40 (GMT)
From: Stonor
Email: None
To: Sanjit Ghandi
Subject: You Tamil Tiger you!
Message:
How dare you introduce politics other than 'American' at FV?! Don't you realize that anything other than 'American' politics is subversive?! Oh, you 'Tamil Tigers' love to live dangerously!

On a more serious note, you (who are not a REAL Tamil Tiger), love to twist the agenda and avoid the point in order to maintain your maya of denial.

You don't get it, do you - even though you imply that you're a Tamil tiger (with highly negative implications for the 'hindi' m, IMO); your prison is the mind control m has over you.

Have you read Erikson's 'Ghandi's Truth'?

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Date: Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 17:51:25 (GMT)
From: Marianne
Email: None
To: Sanjit Ghandi
Subject: Bullshit. it was simply a discussion Marianne
Message:
Well anonymous poster, you've returned. I never said that M could be prosecuted. I said it sounded like vehicular manslaughter. You're awfully bent out of shape about this, aren't you? The nastiness of your posts suggests this whole topic has gotten under your skin, just as I said.

Me, paranoid about EV and M? Oh, I think not. They are the ones who are paranoid, spending how many hours and how much money to determine the identity of anonymous ex premie posters? Spending how much money to shut down 3 different web sites in 3 different countries because M did not like what was being said there?

Don't tell me about paranoia. Tell your master.

Oh and tell him I've got another really great post about how similar he and Jim Jones are coming up in a couple of days.

Marianne

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Date: Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 17:51:12 (GMT)
From: Salam
Email: None
To: Sanjit Ghandi
Subject: Bullshit. it was simply a discussion Marianne
Message:
Not sure if it was you that mentioned his son. If it is, what has that got to do with all this? Also, do you care to explain the libel part of it? I do not seem to follow your point of view.
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Date: Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 15:22:47 (GMT)
From: Nigel
Email: fitzroy@liverpool.ac.uk
To: Sanjit Ghandi
Subject: Call that a discussion..?
Message:
You, anonymous person, accuse Marianne of a possible libel offence. If you have 'topic of discussion' to raise, perhaps you could identify the libel.

(Or fuck off you coward.)

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Date: Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 06:36:28 (GMT)
From: suchabanana
Email: None
To: Marianne and everyone
Subject: question of libel r.e. Public Figures-Please READ
Message:
PUBLIC FIGURE:

First of all, a public figure is a person who essentially 'seeks the limelight', or who injects oneself into the public forum or arena. Therefore, certain rights of privacy which might otherwise pertain to many people do NOT pertain to one who has taken a prominent public stance and profile, and who has thereby forfeited some rights to one's privacy. Over the years, m. has clearly thrust himself in the public arena with hundreds of public appearances, publicity campaigns, videos, cassettes, and other promotional materials, media campaigns, public speeches, etc. Ergo m. is a 'public figure.' This is an indisputable fact, and the basis for defining m. as a public figure is well established by numerous precedents of law.

LIBEL OF A PUBLIC FIGURE [OR OFFICIAL]

In the United States, there have been a number of U.S. Supreme Ct. cases establishing precedents regarding what constitutes libel against public figures. For example, in the New York Times versus Sullivan (1964), 'the Supreme Court ruled that public officials [or public figures] can NOT recover damages for a report related to official duties unless they prove actual malice. To establish actual malice, the official was required to prove that at the time of publication, those responsible for the story KNEW IT WAS FALSE or PUBLISHED IT WITH RECKLESS DISREGARD OF WHETHER IT WAS TRUE OR FALSE.' [from the Associated Press Libel Manual - caps are mine] The burden of proof is therefore on the plaintiff to show that the publication knowingly and deliberately printed a malicious lie.

Based upon reasonable supposition from Michael Dettmers' posts on this forum, if one were taking his accounts to be true, then a critical discussion of and reasonable conjecture arising from such accounts would not be libel. Michael has taken that responsibility upon himself. Therefore he must surely know whether what he is reporting is true or is premeditated malicious falsehood.

It is therefore reasonable for others, for example, to publicly speculate or debate whether the fatal car-bicycle collision in India was 1) not m.'s fault, or 2) was avoidable, or 3) may be attributed to reckless driving or speeding - which might indeed be grounds for adjudging the matter vehicular manslaughter. In the absence of any other accounts to the contrary, the statements we have received would indicate that there was probably some sort of wrongdoing involved.

If m. can prove beyond a reasonable doubt that the accident was not his fault, that he was not the driver of the vehicle which killed the bicylist, that he did not, in fact, leave the scene of the fatal accident, and that someone else who was a subordinate to one of his appointed instructors did not falsely admit responsibility in his place, then the ex-premie forum would most probably owe him a published apology and a retraction {which is the customary practice in the press}. In the absence of any such irrefutable evidence to date, the public arena is open to much speculation on this subject (and others).

In the United States and other democratic republics, there are also guaranteed freedoms of speech, press, and religion. So long as the allegations or condemnations made were done so based upon reasonable suppositions and not merely contrived recklessly out of deliberate malice, then libel would be most difficult to prove, if at all. Furthermore, in any libel litigation, the respondents have the right to sub poena all parties, evidence and other materials relevant to the case which might establish the veracity or basis upon which the reports and editorializing were made, in the first place. Would m. and his subordinates wish to be subponeaed to appear in court and be cross-examined under oath, and related files of EVI or m. seized as material evidence? That seems doubtful.

Now, if the forum had published that someone was a pedophile who preyed upon premie children, without any substantiation whatsoever, expressly to malign that person, then that person would mostly likely have justiable legal recourse for libel.

In establishing libel, however, the charges or statements made must not only be proven to have been deliberately malicious, and injurious -- they must be proved FALSE and without any merit or reasonable basis, if the respondent(s) can demonstrate some reasonable basis for having made the statements, accusations, or editorial opinions.

Were a person to sue for libel, and the printed statements were in fact proven true, then the respondents would likewise also be entitled to all costs and fees incurred in their defense [in some countries damages, too].

In instances where a clear case for libel can not be established, then the respondents are absolved of any blame. Similarly, if the respondents can prove that the published statements were based upon false information which they believed at the time to be true, then generally in matters involving public figures the respondents would be required to print a retraction and apology, and a statement of the actual facts or circumstances. This has been a customary procedure in the media.

Was the fatal accident vehicular manslaughter or unavoidable?
That is a matter for public debate, in the absence of absolute proof. Was m. the driver of the car? If Michael's statements are true, then we may conclude that m. was, in fact, the driver. Why would Michael fabricate such a story, which would open himself up for libel?

Did m. leave the scene of the accident? If Michael's statements are true, then we may also conclude that m.'s actions constituted hit and run [or fleeing the scene of a fatal motor vehicle accident], quite possibly in order to evade individual responsibility. In many jurisdictions, this flight would be a crime. The fleeing also opens the door to a reasonable questions of possible/probable intent. If m. was the driver of the vehicle involved, why would he flee the accident scene - if there was no culpability whatsoever on his part? Why not ask him. He knows the truth about what happened -- whatever that may be.

Did m. direct or simply let his instructor's [Sampuranand] subordinate [a houseboy] take the rap and falsely represent himself as the driver of the car which killed the bicyclist? What was m.'s role in this regard? That is a legitimate matter of interest. Surely he was at least aware of what was being done - because he was allegedly an active party in the switching of the drivers and car occupants in the motorcade. The occupants of the cars in the motorcade were also subordinates of m. who reported to him in his official capacity as the master and leader of the cult, or otherwise. Whether his official capacity as the guru or master is, in fact, also duly registered or not is not a matter for consideration, due to the fact that he has represented himself as the master and the person to which these individuals would report, which can be corroborated by countless other credible witnesses. In the case of Michael Dettmers, we have his statements that he was the adviser to m. and that his duties involved services specifically for m. and his operations.

We also have reason to surmise from his statements that Michael was, in fact, a party to certain secret information (why the x-rating?). Now, it may be that in the public interest, certain inflammatory things might be said or written by parties if a disclosure of that information reveals that any laws have been broken. We have reason to believe that there may have been wrongdoing involved in these aforementioned circumstances. Therefore Michael has an 'Absolute Privilege' to disclose that information.

Please understand that I am only rendering opinions here as an individual, not as any legal counsel, but simply as a private person who has access to knowledgeable and established guidelines pertaining to such matters.

Finally, please note: I would caution all of us, however, not to make any irresponsible or baseless charges, violent threats, or embark on any other disreputable actions which might impugn the integrity, honorable intentions or truthfulness of the ex-premie forum and website, and thereby undermine the overall mission of promoting truth, exposing alleged falsehood and abuses, and allowing reasonable and open debate on matters relating to m. and his various organizations, firms, and entities involved.

'The publication of defammatory matter that consists of comment and opinion, as distinguished from fact, with reference to matters of public interest or importance, is covered by the defense of fair comment. Of course, whatever facts are stated must be true.' [from AP libel manual, in reference to the summary of Hoeppner v. Dunkirk]

Thank you.

Peace,

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Date: Sun, Dec 24, 2000 at 06:13:59 (GMT)
From: No statute of limitations
Email: None
To: suchabanana
Subject: question of libel r.e. Public Figures-Please READ
Message:
It is so beautiful sometimes to watch the Sun rise and obliterate the darkness that was, but an absence of the Suns light.

Your post, your words, brings forth this vision.

THANK YOU...............................

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Date: Sun, Dec 24, 2000 at 09:53:37 (GMT)
From: such
Email: None
To: No statute of limitations
Subject: you are so very welcome, one who understands (nt
Message:
nt
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Date: Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 06:49:33 (GMT)
From: such
Email: None
To: suchabanana
Subject: Q:Was there any drinking prior to accident? (nt
Message:
nt
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Date: Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 04:21:46 (GMT)
From: Nigel
Email: fitzroy@liverpool.ac.uk
To: Marianne
Subject: Can you email me? (ot)
Message:
Marianne, I don't have your email address with me so can you drop me a line? Thanks.
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Date: Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 01:28:18 (GMT)
From: such
Email: None
To: Marianne
Subject: Right on! Power to the PEOPLE!!! (nt
Message:
nt
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Date: Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 00:32:47 (GMT)
From: Sir Dave
Email: None
To: Marianne
Subject: I'm really worried
Message:
I think I'm closer to libel than you, Marianne. But worse than that, I've stolen Roger eDrek's big boobs picture which really worries me since it's a blatant breach of his copyright.

Of course, since this happened in India, there's no saying what, if anything, could be done about it even if the relevant authorities are informed. I don't personally think it would be serious for Mr Rawat over there.

As Jim has said, it's really being judged by the court of public opinion. In the end, that's a far more serious judgement for Maharaji who depends upon his public image in order to function as a 'master'.

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Date: Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 01:37:40 (GMT)
From: Roger eDrek
Email: drek@oz.net
To: Sir Dave
Subject: You'd better be worried
Message:
I sold that particular art work to Corbis Inc., which is owned by Bill Gates. It's one of his favorites. He will be very upset and he's gonna kick your ass.
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Date: Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 00:38:37 (GMT)
From: Marianne
Email: None
To: Sir Dave
Subject: I love that picture!
Message:
That's my favorite picture of M, Sir Dave! Could you post it here for recent arrivals to view? I think it pisses Rotwat off incredibly.

Marianne

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Date: Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 01:26:57 (GMT)
From: Cynthia
Email: None
To: Marianne
Subject: Marianne, I love you, you, you, woman lawyer!
Message:
Hi Marianne and everybody,

I love that picture too. When I first saw it I was shocked, it sort of bounces out at you, ya know? Now, the more I look at it the more I laugh!

Because, it's true!!!! LOLOLOLOL

And, I'd like t add, there are lawyers I like and lawyers I don't like, and I've been around many, many lawyers. We've got the good ones!!!

LOve, Cynthia

P.S. Rawat Sucks! Yes, you, Prempal....haha

Marianne, did you get my recent email?

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Date: Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 23:19:53 (GMT)
From: Roger eDrek
Email: drek@oz.net
To: Marianne
Subject: Don't mess with 'em. They are the worst...
Message:
slime on the planet. They're lawyers!
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Date: Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 23:07:28 (GMT)
From: Bazza
Email: None
To: Marianne
Subject: OT
Message:
Hi Marianne
Did you get my last email re 'that' thread?
b.
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Date: Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 19:00:30 (GMT)
From: Joe
Email: None
To: Everyone
Subject: What a Surprising Journey It Has Been
Message:
Okay, so, it's almost Christmas, 2000, and a lot has happened.

I remember checking in on the earliar incarnations of this website, back when it all started in the Spring of 1997. There were just a few people who got together and decided to get this thing started back then. I thought I have put the Maharaji cult behind me a long time ago. But boy, when I started talking about it again, did I find out differently.

I remember Scott Perry who was a driving organizer. And David Sterling from the UK who had the tape of the Mishler interview (one of the most important historical documents in my opinion) transcribed and put on line. And Jim Heller who has hung around all this time as well was there at the beginning too providing his support and inspiration. There have been the tireless efforts of Katie, Brian, Jean-Michel and Sir Dave, (not to mention Roger Drek), who worked hard to keep this all going and to compile and organize valuable information so it is accessible to anyone who wants to know the truth about Maharaji and his cult. And Nigel who organized the censoring expose of enjoyinglife.org. Kudos to all of you, you have helped get this website to the 'critical mass' that it is, with a momentum that isn't likely to dissipate.

I remember Deana was one of the first premies to convert to ex-premie land online. I remember the day Selene showed up on the Forum and said, 'okay, I've had enough, I'm not a premie anymore.' I remember when Selene did that, and I thought, wow, this is really happening...just talking about this is helpful for people who are having doubts.

And then there have been literally dozens if not hundreds of premies who have publicly 'come out' on the forum, dumping Maharaji once and for all, often going through the shakey process of looking at something objectively that they had moved heaven and earth to avoid doing for many years.

And don't forget the aspirants, like Daneane and Memphis Belle, who questioned what was going on, read the website and the forum, and bailed on the cult. That was so great to see. And then there are those hundreds and thousands of 'lurkers' who read but don't post, but nevertheless are getting needed information.

The cult tried to shut us down with their lawyers and they failed. Maharaji and his cult, after disparaging the Internet, got scared and tried to counter what the ex-premies are doing by putting up their own sites. The lying and deceitful Elan Vital FAQs, and fawning and censoring cult-members at Enjoyinglife, and Maharaji's toilet-bowl experience, which he seems to have now abandoned, were all notable and additional 'drips' for many people.

There were various rumors and revelations about what a bastard Maharaji really is, and always has been, what a psychological mess he is, and about some of the scandals in the cult, including child sexual abuse. Some of those things had first-hand testimony from courageous people like Susan and Abi, with tireless advocates like Anth, helping them get their story out. More drips for many people.

There was the Maharaji Responsbility Campaign group that wrote the open letter to Maharaji and took an advert out in a Boston paper to advertise it, most likely resulting in Elan Vital's disgraceful and revisionist attempt to lie about Maharaji's past, which is part of their own undoing, unbeknownst to them.

And then, along came Michael Dettmers who confirmed with first-hand knowledge and observation what a lot of us knew to be true, and then he told us that it was even worse than we thought. Maybe more people will come forward to do the same thing. It's all so helpful to those of us trying to sort out our cult involvement and for those who are still involved but questioning, to reinforce the truth, that Maharaji, although he can undoubtedly be very charming, never gave a toss about anybody but himself, that he is and was a highly defective human being, probably with serious mental problems, who uses and disposes of people the way most of us use toilet paper. It really is a fact that the truth, while sometimes confronting and sad, really does set you free, especially when you are in, or trying to recover from, a cult.

I don't know where this will all end. My guess is that, unfortunately, there will probably always be a group of followers that will keep that scoundral Maharaji going, so blinded by their faith in him, that no amount of information with change them.

But there are many others who still have a brain working that will probably be more fortunate. As I have said many times, all this isn't really about Maharaji, it's about the people whom he has trapped in his cult, or who may get trapped in his cult. Maharaji is well beyond salvaging as a human being, in my opinion. But the premies are by and large good people, who deserve to know what they are really involved in, even if it's difficult and confronting to them. And people who have fallen away from Maharaji need the opportunity to sort through what the cult experience was all about. And they can always come here, for support.

Happy Holidays Everyone....

Oh, yeah, and thanks for the many friends I have made through this website, and the opportunity to connect with people I knew when I was a premie.

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Date: Sun, Dec 24, 2000 at 02:07:11 (GMT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: Joe
Subject: You're so right (with slight correction)
Message:
Yeah Joe, right all the way.

..... except for one small thing. I think the Mishler interview first came from Rick. Er, actually, I think it was Rick's brother, in fact, who had it. Sent it to me, sent it to David Sterling, a copy to Scott.

But where the hell is Scott Perry anyway? Nice guy, Scott. Indeed, it pained him more than many of us -- me, at least -- to indulge in the negativity inherent in challenging and discussing one's former cult leader. But I'm sure he'd be proud to see what actually came of all this, so far at least.

And where to next anyway? Are we all gonna end up singing 'Let it Be' on kap's ex-premie retirement ranch?

Last night I played the 'Lord of the Universe' video for my friend, Barry Clarke, who was over at Laurie's trying to help me finish off a few tracks on the long-awaited X-Flies CD. I had kind of hoped that the video might answer Barry's question a bit. Au contraire, watching the video this time even got me wondering....what the fuck????. I have to admit that I saw Maharaji's perfomance in that press conference in a starker light than ever before. Honestly. I laughed before; well this time I felt truly embarrassed. 'How in the world??' is right. Maharaji is just such the petulant, empty-headed little twerp in that brief encounter with the press, it's amazing. How could we not have seen through this travesty?

Well, we didn't.

Sigh, sigh, sigh .....

But we really do have some sort of consolation prize in our shared memories. We all lived and acted in our real-life, spiritual 'Spinal Tap' and now we get to enjoy this bizarre on-going cast party.

So now I think I'll have a drink and go call Deputy Dog and wish him a Merry Xmas .....

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Date: Sun, Dec 24, 2000 at 22:50:26 (GMT)
From: ham
Email: None
To: Jim
Subject: Hippy mega naivete methinx
Message:
Good to see ya here squire, although I do worry that your addiction will grab hol;d again.
A mate of mine came to see a video of gm early 90's to try to understand how someone so cool could have been in something so tawdry/dodgy. He came out even more bemused,
'the guy's so obviously a dodgy second hand car salesman type'.

But that's the sixties for ya, but then don't forget the mystical side of the gd's, acid, primal scream therapy (what do ya reckon on primal scream the band?), Terence Mckenna.
No accident really.

We were all like country bumpkins coming into town for the first time,
not
a
clue.

I'm not here much at the moment but scott was around a lot during the boring election fiasco stuff.

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Date: Sun, Dec 24, 2000 at 03:56:11 (GMT)
From: Deputy Dog
Email: None
To: Everyone
Subject: More information does not equal happiness
Message:
Hi everyone,

Just had a friendly and always stimulating chat with Jim.

If you want to find out if living in the spam age, sorry I mean the information age makes people happy and smarter, please read the Time Magazine article Stressed out Kids article in the URL below. Don't know how to a send link.

More data more facts does not translate into a happy life satisfying life, and this is not just my opinion, this is supported by scientific proof. Cramming more facts into people does not make them happy.

http://www.time.com/time/personal/article/0,9171,92147,00.html

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Date: Sun, Dec 24, 2000 at 22:54:01 (GMT)
From: hamzen
Email: None
To: Deputy Dog
Subject: But good information management does (nt)
Message:
a
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Date: Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 03:41:42 (GMT)
From: Deputy Dog
Email: None
To: Everyone
Subject: A debt of gratitude.
Message:
Right on! I think that premies and ex-es alike owe a debt of gratitude to the people who have created and maintained this site; particularly in the last year or so. Premies can continue following Maharaji if they want, it’s their choice, but at least now it's an informed choice.

I still consider myself a premie, i.e., a lover of Truth, and I will continue practising Knowledge because I know it has made me a better man.

Deputy Dog

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Date: Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 03:55:24 (GMT)
From: Sir Dave
Email: sirdavid12@hotmail.com
To: Deputy Dog
Subject: A debt of gratitude.
Message:
You are one of the gods he walked with, Deputy Dog.

Maharaji has been so blind. He never saw the treasure of the people who were right under his nose. What a wasted opportunity.

Perhaps one day, he'll appreciate just how fantastic were those people who devoted themselves to him.

Perhaps one day, he'll understand the love that was in their hearts.

And then he'll understand how he missed out on the real treasure in this life. The love that exists between people. Incomparable and true...

.. Dave

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Date: Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 04:27:21 (GMT)
From: Deputy Dog
Email: None
To: Sir Dave
Subject: Thanks Sir Dave.
Message:
Sir Dave your response brought a tear to my eye, so I'll let someone else speak for me.

'Our deepest fear is not that we are inadequate. Our deepest fear is that we are powerful beyond measure. It is our light, not our darkness that most frightens us. We ask ourselves, “Who am I to be brilliant, gorgeous, talented, and fabulous?” Actually, who are you not to be?

Your playing small does not serve the world. There is nothing enlightened about shrinking so that other people won’t feel insecure around you. And as we let our own light shine, we unconsciously give other people permission to do so.'

Nelson Mandela

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Date: Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 05:45:45 (GMT)
From: Nigel
Email: fitzroy@liverpool.ac.uk
To: Deputy Dog
Subject: Amen - humility stinks! (nt)
Message:
nt
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Date: Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 00:28:27 (GMT)
From: Bin Liner
Email: None
To: Joe
Subject: What a relief , I didn't find a single word .....
Message:

....in that to object to.

Thanks for all the time & energy that you & others have put into the thankless task of unmasking a lowlife posing as GOD.

I still can't really get my head around the extent of the deception ,or the sheer brass neck of it all , or my own complacent naivety in following him.

Especially the latter ,that's a real kick in the ego.

Without this website though , there would probably have been a part of me that was forever Rawat.

Thanks for clearing that out , however painful the process.

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Date: Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 01:05:34 (GMT)
From: Sir Dave
Email: None
To: Bin Liner
Subject: An alien culture fooled us
Message:
I mean, how much did we know about Maharaji and his true history or even the history of Hinduism when we received knowledge?

Why did we think that just because these Indian guys wore robes, that they were somehow holy?

It was culture shock. They exported some of their own culture over here and we were beffudled and bemused. Had God been born in India? Was Maharaji really the One?

We had no yardstick to go by. Some of us had some good experiences from doing meditation and I personally had some very good experiences from doing propogation.

So we thought that Maharaji must be for real. We never had the true picture of Maharaji until now.

.. Dave

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Date: Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 23:05:08 (GMT)
From: Kelly
Email: None
To: Joe
Subject: What a Surprising Journey It Has Been
Message:
Joe,
What a fantastic post, very illuminating and informative. Speaking as someone who has been helped by the efforts of all of you on this site, to finally see his cult trip for what it is. I offer you my heart felt thanks for your bravery and courage and sheer tenacity. I know, since I have joined this forum, how much effort it must take. I have experienced the steepest learning curve of my life over the last few weeks. It has been an exhilarating and very unpredictable journey, and I can't believe how far I have come and how much has changed in such a short time.
I thank myself for finally listening to my inner voice, the voice of doubt! And I thank you all for keeping the company of truth. The truth has set me free.
Wishing you all a very happy Christmas
love kelly
PS count me in for the ongoing campaign
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Date: Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 02:55:36 (GMT)
From: Cynthia
Email: None
To: Everyone
Subject: What a Surprising Journey It Has Been
Message:
Hi,

Thank you all for your posts. Joe, that's a beauty. You said it all.

I was talking to my Mom on the phone; it was snowing nicely in my quaint Vermont Village, where the decorations are both tacky and tasteful. I wasn't expecting guests, but, there they were again, fourteen years in a row, Christmas Carollers (a Norman Rockwell painting) singing at my door. I said 'Ma, listen, the Carollers are here, as I opened the door and stuck the phone out the door, standing there in my flannel pajammas. Mom loved it so much. Mom's a devote Polish Roman Catholic. And she said about M 'they ought to string him up by the balls!'

I'm not much of a Christmas celebrator, but I do love the New Year celebration the best of all holidays. A time when everybody, in their own way and it doesn't matter how, celebrates the beginning of a year. This year it's the real millennium! Dum, Dum, Dum, Da, Da! (Boomb, boomb, boomb, bompt) etc.

Huh! Blast off, Maharaji. The balance of power has shifted.

As I get older and learn more about everything I want to learn about my life becomes more real and distanced from the cult.

This year, 2000, has been a year of passing through much grief about the cult; the key word is passing through despite the sharp pain of a honed blade of betrayal. Grief, when allowed to flow, does go on it's way. I guess that's why I will probably always live in New England, the passing of seasons so distinctly is necessary in my life, despite the cold.

I've also learned to have fun, which I had forgotten to do. And sing again. I stopped after I stopped practicing KandM. Then I got a great deal on a Univ. of Vermont Music Dept. practice piano which was a steal.

I learned to indulge in the luxury of napping--without guilt! Endulging myself with friendship, both off and online has made me a healthier person.

Then I learned more and more about Maharaji's betrayals in more detail and with evidence. Powerful testimony has emerged here. I feel a shift in power, don't you?

There is so much love on this forum and the efforts put out by everyone who keeps this site together deserve gratitude and kudos. Sound familiar? And of course a ''Pin the tail on Maharaji's Ass'' poster complete with darts and blindfold (just for the irony).:))

A shift in the balance of power feels very positive indeed. I am so honored and proud to be associated with you folks.

Now, as far as the Gooomragi picture with the tits is concerned, if you want to have a pissing contest, Sir Dave and Roger eDrek, lets see some animation. Swinging out of sync with the music?? Or just jiggling as he/she is giving blessings???? Or both?? What a good Christmas gift for him....

Everyone, have a happy, safe season....I got a big box of fudge from a friend and my blood sugar level is soaring....sorry for the babbling....be well,

Love,
Cynthia

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Date: Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 06:08:46 (GMT)
From: Roger eDrek
Email: drek@oz.net
To: Cynthia
Subject: I swear! The devil made me do it!
Message:
A new low at the House of Maharaji Drek

I'm a bad, bad person.

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Date: Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 10:07:34 (GMT)
From: Sir Dave
Email: None
To: Roger eDrek
Subject: I don't fancy yours much, Roger (nt)
Message:
x
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Date: Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 10:11:12 (GMT)
From: Sir Dave
Email: None
To: Sir Dave
Subject: Meaning, I'll have those chicks but
Message:
you can have that she-male god in the middle.

Come on Roger - you know you have wet dreams thinking about that apparition.

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Date: Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 20:16:31 (GMT)
From: Roger eDrek
Email: drek@oz.net
To: Sir Dave
Subject: I only lust for money and power
Message:
once you've got money and power all of the universe is yours
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Date: Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 20:08:14 (GMT)
From: Sir Dave
Email: sirdavid12@hotmail.com
To: Joe
Subject: He couldn't compete with my toilet bowl
Message:
The reason why Maharaji's site went down the pan was the stiff competition from my new and improved toilet facilities.

If you've not already seen it, Click here for the upgraded toilet bowl site.

Maharaji will keep on, I'm sure but he'll never again be able to delude people like he used to. He knows he's in retreat in the West. He'll cut his losses and find new pastures to plunder.

But he will have missed out on a great opportunity - the opportunity to level with all of his old devotees and make amends for past errors. The opportunity to straighten out the mess of the past in an honest and down-to-earth way and give himself and others the benefit that comes from doing such a thing.

Such opportunities don't come again, not in this world...

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Date: Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 23:16:42 (GMT)
From: Roger eDrek
Email: drek@oz.net
To: Sir Dave
Subject: Sir Dave, I challenge you to a pissing contest!
Message:
Here's my toilet bowl, although I rather enjoy those two big floaty things in your bowl.
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Date: Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 00:42:28 (GMT)
From: Sir Dave
Email: None
To: Roger eDrek
Subject: Sir Dave, I challenge you to a pissing contest!
Message:
That's a divine turd in my toilet bowl. It's the solid equivalent of charanamrit. Since I stole your big boobs picture, I think you deserve a bit of it.
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Date: Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 02:06:46 (GMT)
From: Roger eDrek
Email: drek@oz.net
To: Sir Dave
Subject: Damn right, I'll take some
Message:
the divine turd, eh?

How is it?

I mean after you drying it and all.

You know, like, smoking it?

How's the buzz?

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Date: Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 02:42:25 (GMT)
From: Roger eDrek
Email: drek@oz.net
To: Roger eDrek
Subject: Sorry, Joe. I'm bringing the vibe down...
Message:
to toilet jokes. Actually, those are Maharaji's favorite jokes, of course.

Me, I'm kinda feeling sorry for not only those good premies involved in the whole thing, but even Maharaji himself.

I've probably spent too much of my life watching those old 40's and 50's movies where money and power corrupts even the most innocent person. You know, those movies with the Keep It Simple Stupid message and be happy with what you've got.

Anyway, Maharaji sure is looking pitiful and pathetic. Has he always been corrupt or did he ever really care and try? What happened to him?

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Date: Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 03:13:25 (GMT)
From: Sir Dave
Email: sirdavid12@hotmail.com
To: Roger eDrek
Subject: He walked with gods and didn't know it
Message:
It's a big thing, the soul. Maybe this whole thing is just to show Maharaji the nature of life. He walked with gods and yet he didn't realise it. He was shown and given perfect love and yet he still didn't understand.

Who were the gods and who gave him perfect love?

Why, the devotees, of course.

Who is able to forgive him. Why, us, of course.

And who could he ever turn to for help?

In the end, it will be those who he has cast out and abandoned who will save him.

Such is the irony of life. The story is far from over yet...

.. Dave


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Date: Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 04:47:18 (GMT)
From: Cynthia
Email: None
To: Sir Dave
Subject: He walked with gods and didn't know it
Message:
Sir Dave,

That was a beautiful poem. I feel the power in myself that I once attributed to him.

We were the ones who were there for him. We made communities which flourished.

Too bad for Maharaji that we can re-establish our friendships and make new ones despite his despicable betrayals.

I was a devotee with a heart I gave away to him, a devotee. Now I reclaim it. It's not his to have.

He can't have no more, and I'll dish it out to whom I please...!

Thank you, Sir Dave, for all your work here and have a happy holiday season

Love, Cynthia

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Date: Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 03:00:52 (GMT)
From: Cynathia
Email: None
To: Roger eDrek
Subject: Rog, are you talking to yourself???
Message:
Hi Roger,

Hey, if you want to get in the mood, read my post above, and get to work on those jiggling boobs!

Well, you don't have to read the whole post, but just the last paragraph or two.

Have a holiday!

LOve,
Cyn

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Date: Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 20:44:28 (GMT)
From: Joe
Email: None
To: Sir Dave
Subject: That's Hysterical, Dave...well done. (nt)
Message:
nt
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Date: Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 20:02:49 (GMT)
From: Joy
Email: None
To: Joe
Subject: What a Surprising Journey It Has Been
Message:
How true Joe, and this is one of your best posts to date. A beautiful summing up of the first few years at ex-premie.org.

And let us not, of course, forget a very big THANK YOU from all of us to YOU, most of all, as pretty much the most articulate, courageous (for using your real identity), level-headed and enjoyable poster on the Forum all these years. The 'service' (pardon the pun) you have done here for your fellow ex-s, premies and all those in shades of in between has been fantastic!

HAPPY HOLIDAYS to you and everybody else here,
Love,
Joy

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Date: Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 13:10:45 (GMT)
From: Katie
Email: None
To: Joy and Joe
Subject: Thanks from me, too, Joe (and what she said!)
Message:
Hey Joe!
I won't be as eloquent as Joy, but I CAN say that I agree wholeheartedly with her post. Plus you happened to be the first person that contacted me off-forum, and I really appreciate your friendship and support.

Thanks for a great post!

Lots of love,
Katie

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Date: Mon, Dec 25, 2000 at 21:17:22 (GMT)
From: Joe
Email: None
To: Katie
Subject: Thanks, Katie .. I appreciate your friendship, too
Message:
nt
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Date: Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 20:45:25 (GMT)
From: Joe
Email: None
To: Joy
Subject: Thanks, Joy
Message:
The check is in the mail. :)

I'll send you an email about a possibly Northerly visit.

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Date: Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 19:22:00 (GMT)
From: Way
Email: None
To: Joe
Subject: The beat goes on
Message:
Thank whatever powers may be for the Internet! Without it, how would the gathering of information about Mr. Prem Pal Singh Rawat ever have occurred? And reached so many people?

I remember being on my last premie legs and doing a search for 'Maharaji,' finding nothing. This was back in 1996. Then, when I was gasping my last premie breaths, sometime in 1997, I searched again, and up pops you know what!

The journeys were the best for me. It was a revelation that other people out there from those glorious 1970's were still as wrapped up in gurudom as I was. The remaining struggle for me was short and swift.

What I didn't expect is what fun I would have participating in the on-going struggle against the fraud. And I didn't expect Maharaji to turn out to be such a lousy human being. Not being the living Perfect Master is bad enough, but really now! Hooked on Marlboro's and cognac? Toking every night with the Mrs. and the inner circle? Fucking premie blonds at will? Hit and run? Pedophile protector?

Gotta hand it to you, Mr. Rawat, you are one interesting character!

And the story ain't over. The fat lady hasn't sung yet, but I have a feeling she's getting ready to.

Thanks to you all!

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Date: Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 19:38:40 (GMT)
From: Tim G
Email: timgitti@indigo.ie
To: The Harbingers
Subject: The beat goes on
Message:
A Big round of thanks to all you guys mentioned and others too. The Beat goes on and will no doubt clip the wings of the cultmaster, More important by far it will free a few people from the cult experience,

YET we must put the whole thing in perspective. Once free of it the whole panoply of life is before us with many many more important issues to be engaged .What I'm saying is Don't give the leader and his chickadees too much importance. Let's help those we can and let the rest be followed by the ring in their noses.

I really enjoy SOME of the debate here and most of the characters...addictive or what.

Holiday greetings to you all.
Tim

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Date: Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 03:21:20 (GMT)
From: Helen
Email: None
To: Tim G, Joe, Joy and all
Subject: The beat goes on
Message:
What a positive tone this whole thread has. I agree that there is a 'full circle' kind of feeling to it all, especially with Michael's recent postings. There is a feeling of completeness for me. Michael's posts have substantiated the real character of M in a tangible and potent way for me. I am at the point where I don't even try to talk premies out of being premies, I'm not evangelical in my ex-premieness anymore. I just share the information I have and leave it at that. They are free to find it out for themselves and to choose to leave it or stay. Meanwhile life does take on a spaciousness once old dependencies are loosened at last yet also life is a struggle as I have learned to accept more responsibility for being where I am.

I'm more grateful for the struggle than I ever was for the world of childish fantasy.
Merry Christmas and Happy Hanukkah to all
Helen

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Date: Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 18:19:55 (GMT)
From: SB
Email: None
To: Everyone
Subject: Can someone tell me right now
Message:
because in few minutes I will not have access to a PC for a while where down, in which thread Michael talked about Lard killing a man with his car??

Thanks.

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Date: Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 18:29:43 (GMT)
From: gerry
Email: None
To: SB
Subject: Yes, Ma'am, at your service..
Message:
HI SB,

It's right here

The last paragraph tells how rawrat killed a man.

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Date: Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 18:29:30 (GMT)
From: It's in
Email: None
To: SB
Subject: Not my last response
Message:
nt
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Date: Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 14:11:50 (GMT)
From: kap
Email: qwerty@pdai.com
To: Everyone
Subject: friendship ranch updates
Message:
of course it would be nice to build a geodesic dome on the ranch .still open to friends who wish to start an egalitarian intentional community .any builders out there? friend charlie
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Date: Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 14:41:42 (GMT)
From: Sir Dave
Email: None
To: kap
Subject: friendship ranch updates
Message:
I dunno what a geodesic dome is but if we could have a Millennium 2001 festival in it and invite Maharaji and the unholy family, it would be like old times.
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Date: Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 04:53:47 (GMT)
From: Cynthia
Email: None
To: Sir Dave
Subject: I wasn't there, but I'll come this time (nt)
Message:
nt
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Date: Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 12:11:20 (GMT)
From: Salam
Email: None
To: Buzz
Subject: Buzz
Message:
I thought that thread bellow was going to dissappear. RE:bbj. Is there a way you can also verify what MD said about M killing someone in a car accident? If you can, what is being said about it?

Cheers

Salam

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Date: Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 05:56:07 (GMT)
From: Buzz
Email: None
To: Salam
Subject: Buzz
Message:
Hi Salam,
I'm not too sure if they would know anything about it,from what I picked up from that baiji they don't seem to give m much thought at all,it seems to them he is just a fallen soul.
I'll certainly have a dig around though,catch you later:)
Buzz
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Date: Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 11:58:12 (GMT)
From: Eric
Email: elevy711@mail.com
To: Everyone
Subject: Tell me what knowledge is
Message:
I've gone to a view video screenings of the Maharaji's lectures in New York City. I find some of it relaxing and soothing, but for the most part, very ambigious and full of frustrating metaphors (especially about opening petals of flowers). What I find most baffling and unsettling, however, is that this 'knowledge' business is kept so secretive. People at these screenings who have received 'knowledge' will not reveal anything about its message. Why not just say what it is? What's all this about 'being ready' to receive it? Why the suggested wait time of six months of 'having all questions answered'? I've read a good deal of Zen and see similiar messages. I just want to hear what knowledge is. Since you are all ex-devotees, are you willing to just come out with it-----WHAT IS KNOWLEDGE? Where can I get a written summary of what Maharaji says when providing knowledge? Are people, even those who left this organization, still recluctant to reveal it? Why hasn't it been published in book form? Please...reveal the SECRET!!! After reading what's on this site, I have decided not to persue it. I just want to know the BIG SECRET!
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Date: Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 22:01:18 (GMT)
From: Elaine
Email: None
To: Anyone
Subject: Wouldn't this be Knowledge?
Message:
If I were to tell someone that their breath was the source of great peace and possibly even the unspeakable name of God that is said not to take in vain? ...

If I were to tell someone that by listening inside of themselves they could hear the music of the atoms...that would be considered listening to God?...

If I were to tell someone that by turning there tongue inward and concentrating it might be possoble to taste the 'well of Everlastng Life' etc....?

And if I were to tell someone with much concentration an inch or so inside their skull around their '3rd eye' area they might open to the' Seat of the Soul' Jacob talks about or a Divine Light of Wisdom? ....wouldn't that alone be teaching a person a great and important Knowledge?

All this having nothing to do with pranaming to a teacher.

Just telling someone the big 'secret' is within and telling them the routes. ???

Because without someone telling you to concentrate on these areas - we simply don't. If someone had told me the profound significance of these simply routes say in a 70's book like 'Be Here Now' - I may never have gotten involved with a group.

And we all know those of you who do not even believe these routes amount to much - but for those of you who have benefited from these simple techniques of going inward - isn't it enough just to tell people now.

As opposed to say - telling someone interested in finding peace that saying a mantra will help them. ( I have many people tell me they've got to do something to quiet their mind and find a way to peace and they ask me about meditation. - there are still some desperate, searching people out there.)

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Date: Sun, Dec 24, 2000 at 18:32:06 (GMT)
From: cq
Email: None
To: Elaine
Subject: what need is there for an instructor - ?
Message:
when you've passed your driving test?
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Date: Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 23:11:11 (GMT)
From: gErRy
Email: None
To: Elaine
Subject: HorseCOCK, Elaine
Message:
This is such bullshit. You have the sacred nollidj yet you are fighting with your neighbors, fighting with the people who come to work on your house, denigrate the whole class of working people, and who knows what other 'great peace' you got going on in your life.

Seems to me YOU sow the seeds of discontent and reap what you sow.

So tell me just what are the GREAT BENEFITS of 'going within inside?'

You're such a phony and a hypocrite.

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Date: Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 15:15:52 (GMT)
From: cq
Email: None
To: Eric
Subject: Quote: 'TO PLACE THE TEACHER ABOVE ALL'
Message:
The so-called 'Knowledge' is the thin end of a very dodgy wedge, Eric.

Why the six-month wait?

To get you nicely softened up and ready to admit that, once you get shown the techniques of 'knowledge', you'll think you'll have been shown the meaning of life itself, and will be consequently owing a huge debt of so-called 'gratitude' (measured usually in $$$) to the so-called 'Master'.

Think yourself lucky to have gotten out comparatively unscathed.

.
.
.
By the way, pics of the techniques that used to be taught (they've been watered down significantly) can be found by clicking here: http://www.ex-premie.org/papers/KSession.htm#anchor2550841.


Any while you're there, it's worth taking a look at the 'Instructor's Manual' - written by the Maha - in which he really makes it clear as day WHAT receiving Knowledge should be all about. To wit:

(the following is given at the culmination of the 'six phases', and presumably must therefore be pretty damn important)

QUOTE:

The true qualifications for an Aspirant.

Let's consider some of these points:

a. The person must be sincere.
b. The evaluating instructor must be able to sense, without a reasonable doubt, that this person will continue to make effort.
c. Also, without a reasonable doubt, will continue to enjoy the Knowledge process.
d. Will continue to participate to the best of their ability.
e. Will have the necessary reverence and understanding about the teacher.
f. Will practice Knowledge with discipline, care and the necessary conviction.
g. Will have the openness and concern to continue to evolve.
h. Will have the commitment towards themselves, the teacher and the process.
i. To have the openness to evolve with the directions of the teacher.
j. To give the Knowledge process a high priority.
k. To place the triangle above the rest.
l. To be concerned about his or her relation to the teacher.
m. To place the teacher, and his guidance in the Knowledge process, above all.

ENDQUOTE

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Date: Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 19:17:16 (GMT)
From: Suchabananda
Email: None
To: cq
Subject: KNOWLEDGE TECHNIQUES-FREE-HERE-NOW-NO GURU!
Message:
Copy and paste this address in the go-to box (don't know yet how to create links on a Mac):

http://www.ex-premie.org/papers/KSession.htm#anchor2550841.

Peace,

da lil' swami

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Date: Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 18:22:12 (GMT)
From: Salam
Email: None
To: Suchabananda
Subject: KNOWLEDGE TECHNIQUES-FREE-HERE-NOW-NO GURU!
Message:
da lil swami

I still think a knowledge cd is a viable proposition, wad u tink. Now do not u go all funny on me , ya heer me.

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Date: Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 21:07:34 (GMT)
From: such
Email: None
To: Salam
Subject: KNOWLEDGE TECHNIQUES-FREE-HERE-NOW-NO GURU!
Message:
Salam

just thinking: maybe ok, but All proceeds [after costs] go to legit, reputable charities [e.g. for abused kids, cancer research, etc.]. no salaries, no commissions, no expense accounts, no new greedy gurus. An all-volunteer, non-profit foundation -- no titles, no bullshit.

Also, I'll bet we could make a heckuva lot better CD [or DVD] than the current m. knowledge videos!

Peace,

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Date: Sun, Dec 24, 2000 at 00:14:33 (GMT)
From: Salam
Email: None
To: such
Subject: Well I am glad you've come so far
Message:
How about me keeping some of the moola? You know, a buck or two.
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Date: Sun, Dec 24, 2000 at 01:04:17 (GMT)
From: Suchaboneanna
Email: None
To: Salam
Subject: r.e.moola:you sure you aren't related to Prem? (nt
Message:
nt
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Date: Mon, Dec 25, 2000 at 13:31:19 (GMT)
From: Salam
Email: None
To: Suchaboneanna
Subject: Oh, it is nothing. Only the thought of a
Message:
dung beetle came to me.
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Date: Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 19:26:18 (GMT)
From: cq
Email: None
To: Suchabananda
Subject: OLD knowledge techniques-free-here-now-NO GURU!
Message:
I thought I just did.

Links are the same - PC or Mac - and the HTML you'll need is given at the Forum Help Page under 'page links'.

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Date: Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 15:55:30 (GMT)
From: Stonor
Email: None
To: cq
Subject: Quote: 'TO PLACE THE TEACHER ABOVE ALL'
Message:
Hi cq,

I hadn't read this before, thanks. Point 'c' is one that explains why so many people say that they (still) 'enjoy' 'knowledge' or life etc.

c. Also, without a reasonable doubt, will continue to enjoy the Knowledge process.

The imperative emphasis on 'enjoy' and the equation of the meditation techniques+ with the word 'knowledge' (which is said to be above all knowledges) have been two of the key things I have found difficult to understand about the m-trip. I remember one of the m-equations that I found strange was, 'My breath is my Bible, my Gita and my Koran.' And then, to his own ends, he pretends to quote them meaningfully. And the recent one, 'Maharaji is Maharaji.' Now there's clarity!

k. To place the triangle above the rest.

What is the 'triangle' referred to here?

To be concerned about his or her relation to the teacher.

What does this mean? What 'relationship' do most of m's 'students' have with him? And what should their concern be?

And of course, another was the subject of your post, 'Quote: 'TO PLACE THE TEACHER ABOVE ALL' - above 'Whatever-It-Is'?!!

Merry Mithrasmas Chris!

Anna

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Date: Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 16:59:43 (GMT)
From: cq
Email: None
To: Stonor
Subject: 'TO PLACE THE TEACHER ABOVE ALL' = dictatorship
Message:
Hi Anna, and an xcellent xmas to you (and I hope you had a superb Saturnalia too).

Relationship between the student and the teacher, you ask? The bottom line with premie-hood is that it's all a game of follow-my-leader. Maha says 'do this', Maha says 'say that'. It's all learned by imitation.

You can't get the 'knowledge' without having to agree to this kind of submission, and when Maha says an aspirant (not even a premie!) should 'place the teacher above all', well, so much for his claim that he isn't a leader! Clarity and consistency were never among of his strong points.

As for the 'triangle' - it's mentioned two or three times in the instructors' manual, but without any explanation. Bermudan, perhaps? ;)


Merry Mithrasmas
(and I didn't have a lisp before).

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Date: Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 17:53:42 (GMT)
From: Stonor
Email: None
To: cq
Subject: 'TO PLACE THE TEACHER ABOVE ALL' = dictatorship
Message:
After I posted my question about the 'trianagle', I had 2 two theories: 'The Holy Family', or Sat Chit Anand, but how do you put the triangle above 'teacher'-m?

Yes, dictatorship, but as one of my vice-principals said once, ' But I run a benevolent dictatorship.'

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Date: Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 18:55:23 (GMT)
From: cq
Email: None
To: Stonor
Subject: benevolent dictatorship it AIN'T!
Message:
at least, not in Mahaland (and if any ex-ashram premies are reading this, they should know what I mean!)

My guess is that the threesome is made up of teacher, knowledge and student. All innocent-sounding enough words, but put a premie-spin on them and you get a thoroughly different recipe.

BTW, the so-called 'Holy Family' was a lot bigger - I can remember at least five of them.

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Date: Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 22:04:54 (GMT)
From: Stonor
Email: None
To: cq
Subject: covert aggressive = 'benevolent' dictatorship
Message:
And thanks for the 'poop-scoop' on the 'triangle', Chris and Jethro!
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Date: Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 19:06:04 (GMT)
From: Jethro
Email: None
To: cq
Subject: CQ Don't you remember
Message:
the 3-legged stool?

The triangle was, the k-techniques, the teacher and the premie.

he used to say that if one of the 3 is missing thrn the stool falls over because it needs the 3 legs to stand up..etc etc..blah..blah blah.

(To CQ:.....I just won my appeal against the college I worked at.)

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Date: Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 21:13:30 (GMT)
From: sucha
Email: None
To: Jethro
Subject: Stand on your own 2 feet! no need for 'Cain' (nt
Message:
nt
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Date: Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 19:30:04 (GMT)
From: cq
Email: quartus@postmaster.co.uk
To: Jethro
Subject: Three-legged stool? I know he's milking it but ...
Message:
... maybe that was after my time (or maybe I just wasn't listening that well!)

Your appeal victory is good news for you, and I'm all ears. (email above if you feel like it).

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Date: Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 23:19:15 (GMT)
From: Jethro
Email: None
To: cq
Subject: To CQ
Message:
I'll email you about the appeal after the remedies hearing(Feb).
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Date: Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 16:11:10 (GMT)
From: Salam
Email: None
To: Stonor
Subject: Stonor..ot
Message:
Can you please e-mail me. Lost your e-mail.
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Date: Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 13:19:09 (GMT)
From: janet of venice
Email: None
To: Eric
Subject: what knowledge is
Message:
eric--there is an insidious reason for the long wait. you are methodically getting quelled and taught to shut down your critical thinking, your reason, your intelligence, your logic, your individuality and your just plain good sense, by a deliberate carrot and stick leading. the videos are hypnotic. you ape what you see and hear. you keep reshaping yourself , trying to conform to what they seem to want you to be. you stop questioning. you stop being respected for being yourself, for what you think and feel and have to say about any subject. you are told to just 'accept'. eat it without asking. if you want it, if you want IN, you have to keep killing off and forsaking parts of yourself in order to get closer. the mystery is the lure, to draw you into the trap.the techniques of meditation that you would have been shown to do in the Knowledge Session are right here on this site. go read them and try them if you want. they don't belong to anyone, any more than pissing or eating do. like sex, they feel good sometimes, and other times, they just arent appropriate to the circumstances you are in, and have to respond to. zen is a whole lot different from this sick trip. zen is spontaneous and normal. nobody in zen is looking to enslave you, aiming to get you to obliterate your orignality so they can draw you into supporting them in profligate waste and indulgence the rest of their life. in zen, no one is striding around the planet throwing their weight around, and carrying on like they were the unquestioned authority of the human race, with the overweening arrogance of beleiving and demanding that everyone on earth treat them as Master.You don't want to get near this mess. If anything, you want to help us destroy it.
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Date: Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 12:41:10 (GMT)
From: JTF
Email: None
To: Eric
Subject: If you want to have some fun,...
Message:
when next in touch with a cult member, ask them-'Why do I keep having an urge to kiss Maharaji's feet'. You will get a knowing smile but the answer should be interesting since this behavior(known as darshan)is no longer practiced in the West.
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Date: Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 12:05:36 (GMT)
From: Salam
Email: None
To: Eric
Subject: There is no secret.
Message:
It is only for brainwashed people. That is the way blubber keeps a hold on the premies. It really is a lot of crap.

Read my journey and follow this link

http://www.ex-premie.org/pages/aspir1.htm

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Date: Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 14:47:44 (GMT)
From: Tim G
Email: timgitti@indigo.ie
To: Janet of Venice
Subject: There is no secret.
Message:
Hi Janet of the exotic name...your post says it all in a nutshell especially the bit of slowly having to dismember yourself so as to fit the correct degree of gullability before being 'shown' how to concentrate on your breathe, your hearing, forcing your eyes up to the 'third' eye and sticking your tongue back to taste the back of your throat...Of course the Big Secret is the position of M in all this... the Giver purveyor and Administrator of your Life...What a Fucking cheek and what dummies we were.

Love and Peace
Tim

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Date: Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 11:12:52 (GMT)
From: Sir Dave
Email: sirdavid12@hotmail.com
To: Everyone
Subject: The War of the Web
Message:
Maharaji declared full scale web war on the ex-premies some time ago and he set out, search engines blazing and lawyers attacking, to demolish the ex-premie web presence. How's he doing?

If you do a search on AltaVista for Maharaji here's what you come up with.

On Yahoo you get all this.

Maharaji hasn't updated his own website for ages and it looks like he's given up on the web war and is just leaving his diminishing army of premies to fight it out with their scintillating sites.

I expected the perfect one to do better. At this rate, it will all be over by Christmas.

.. Dave

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Date: Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 04:51:41 (GMT)
From: Cynthia
Email: None
To: Sir Dave
Subject: Your Welcome and Thanks (nt)
Message:
nt
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Date: Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 19:07:36 (GMT)
From: sucha
Email: None
To: Sir Dave
Subject: Fire up metatags, links,boost this site rating (nt
Message:
nt
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Date: Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 13:34:02 (GMT)
From: bill
Email: None
To: Sir Dave
Subject: Thank you for your good work all this time!-nt
Message:
sfdhs
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Date: Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 14:53:54 (GMT)
From: Sir Dave
Email: None
To: bill
Subject: Thanks for the thanks (nt)
Message:
.. Dave

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Date: Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 09:38:13 (GMT)
From: janet of venice
Email: None
To: Everyone
Subject: SATPAL HELD OFFICE. HE CAN PROSECUTE THESE
Message:
WHO BETTER IN INDIA THAN SATPAL TO BRING HIS CREEPY LITTLE BROTHER TO RUIN IN THE COURTS.?? SAT PAL HAS HELD PUBLIC OFFICE IN INDIA AND HIS MISSION DOES OUTSTANDING CHARITY SERVICE FOR THE VICTIMS OF DISASTERS THERE.
HE IS THE ONE WE SHOULD SEND ALL THIS DAMNING INFORMATION TO. THE KILLING OF THE BICYCLIST, THE HIT AND RUN, THE PROSECUTION OF JAGDEO--SATPAL IS IN INDIA AND WOULD BE N A UNIQUE POSITION TO DESTROY THE FAT FUCK ON HIS OWN NATIVE TURF.WE HAVE THE WITNESSES TO DO IT.HE HAS THE POSITIONING TO BRING IT. HOW DO WE CONTACT HIM AND ASK.
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Date: Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 17:26:04 (GMT)
From: bill-his brother is even
Email: None
To: janet of venice
Subject: more harmful that our lord is.-nt
Message:
sfgh
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Date: Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 19:27:46 (GMT)
From: Mr. Free
Email: None
To: janet of venice
Subject: SATPAL'S ADDRESS OR WEBSITE
Message:
http://www.manavdharam.org/index.html
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Date: Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 17:46:14 (GMT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: janet of venice
Subject: THAT'S A VERY PRACTICAL IDEA, JANET
Message:
GOOD THINKING.
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Date: Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 06:14:44 (GMT)
From: Nigel
Email: fitzroy@liverpool.ac.uk
To: Jim
Subject: Er, one small problem...?
Message:
Namely, that Satpal is also Guru Maharaji, AKA Lord of the Universe, too.

Suppose M's defence lawyers opted to bring Bubblegum's own dirty laundry into the public eye... (and there's bound to be plenty).

Is he going to risk that? Of course not. But cool idea...

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Date: Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 09:46:55 (GMT)
From: Jethro
Email: None
To: janet of venice
Subject: Dopn't hold your breathe
Message:
A few months ago one of satpal's premies was posting here and I asked him if he knew what happened to Vedpraktanand(a mahatma who was here nthe UK during 74/75 and was sent back to India for interfering with women in the knowldge session).

The satpal-premie told me that 'all is forgiven in the ashram' and vedpraktanand is now a teacher of shastras(scripture).

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Date: Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 06:34:00 (GMT)
From: Buzz
Email: None
To: Jethro
Subject: Dopn't hold your breathe
Message:
Hi Jethro,
Can you give me any help regarding finding the postings from the satpal-premie,i would like to ask him/her a few questions?
Cheers
Buzz
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Date: Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 10:16:53 (GMT)
From: Jethro
Email: None
To: Buzz
Subject: to Buzz
Message:
Hello Buzz,

The satpal-oremie appeared here for a short time within the last 9 months. I can't remmber his name.
The name of the mahatma I was referring to was Vedpraktanand, so I suggest you do a search on 'Ved' or similar.

I'm not sureb how much joy you'll get gfrom this person if you do manage to contact them. I have emailed satpal a few times at his website asking about his own history, but have never had an answer. It appears that revisonism runs in the rowatt family.

regards Jethro

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Date: Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 15:53:12 (GMT)
From: Buzz
Email: None
To: Jethro
Subject: to Buzz
Message:
Thanks Jethro,
by the way your second name isn't Tull is it?:)
Regards
Buzz
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Date: Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 17:32:10 (GMT)
From: Jethro
Email: None
To: Buzz
Subject: to Buzz
Message:
'by the way your second name isn't Tull is it?:)'

No, neither do I come from hilly-billy stock with loads of oil!!

:>)

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Date: Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 10:05:54 (GMT)
From: Sir Dave
Email: None
To: Jethro
Subject: Don't hold your breath
Message:
And don't forget that Fakiranand, the hammer wielding killer, is now one of Satpal's Mahatmas.
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Date: Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 12:16:10 (GMT)
From: Jethro
Email: None
To: Sir Dave
Subject: Thanks for correcting my spelling
Message:
I vaguely rememeber being told that during the family breakup, satpal had darmapal(rajaji) beaten up by a few mahatmas.
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Date: Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 16:36:44 (GMT)
From: Sir Dave
Email: None
To: Jethro
Subject: and talking of heavies
Message:
I remember now, that in the early eighties, some 'premie' heavies came round my place to beat me up because I exposed a forged ticket scam to the police. Some guy was selling forged railway tickets to go to Rome for a Haharaji festival and premies were innocently buying them and then getting busted by the police at Victoria Station for having forged tickets.

Anyway, when the premie heavies came round to beat me up, I was across the road in the grocery shop. Another guy in the house told them I wasn't in and so they went away, never to return again. Perhaps they couldn't afford the bus fare back to my house again.

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Date: Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 19:13:46 (GMT)
From: Jethro
Email: None
To: Sir Dave
Subject: Did you hear the 'Black Rose' story..
Message:
when satpal was given a Black Rose, drugged and put on a plane back to India(circa 74/5)?

Can't recall the details, but I do know where the former WPC leader( along time ex) hangs out. Next time I'm in the area I'll check out the story with him and get more details.

BTW, do you know who the heavies were?

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Date: Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 01:13:12 (GMT)
From: Sir Dave
Email: None
To: Jethro
Subject: Did you hear the 'Black Rose' story..
Message:
Believe it or not, one of the 'heavies' told me in satsang that same week that they'd come round to beat me up. I can't remember their names or faces even now.

Not exactly Kray twins material, this one heavy looked a little sheepish when he told me they'd been round to give me a kicking.

If I'd been in, I would have probably given them satsang.

I've never heard of that Satpal story.

.. Dave

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Date: Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 09:35:31 (GMT)
From: Kelly
Email: None
To: Everyone
Subject: A book recommendation and a suggestion
Message:
The Spiritual Tourist by Mick Brown.
He is the journalist who subsequently wrote the Daily Telegraph article exposing Sai Baba’s sexual abuse. It is a well-written and fascinating exploration of gurus and cults.etc. It is excellent, a must read.
I’m getting towards the end of the book, and this morning read the chapter entitled “Her Master’s Voice” In it he talks about various scandals and talks about The Maharishi and then there is a one page history of Guru Maharaji. Then he writes…

“While westernisation had overtaken both the Maharishi Mahesh and Guru Maharaji, they at least avoided the worst taint of scandal.”

We ain’t seen nothing yet!

He then goes on to talk about Rajneesh, Chogyam Trumpa et all. Then he quotes the Dalai Lama…” Misbehaviour should be publicised”

Here are a few extracts from that chapter

. He has suggested that a good test of the qualifications of a tantric master who is beyond attachment and the temptations of self-gratification is whether the master can drink alcohol and urine with equal indifference. Asked which Tibetan teachers were of a sufficiently high level to do this, the Dalai Lama replied, ‘As far as I know — zero.’ In The Return of the Mother Andrew Harvey writes:

I believe that we are at the end of the guru system and that its current abuses disqualify it from the business of serious spiritual transformation. The next five years will see a blizzard of financial and sexual scandals which I am certain will make this point painfully clear even to those who now believe implicitly in the guru system and are prepared to fight dirty to preserve it.

In his illuminating book Feet of Clay, the psychologist Anthony Storr speculates on whether the extraordinary views that some gurus have of themselves may be the consequence of schizophrenia, or manic—depression. In clinical terms, Storr writes, the voices, messages, the messianic beliefs of the mystic, the sense that they are somehow special or chosen, the propounding of theories about the universe that have no basis in scientific fact, are all classic symptoms of delusional behaviour. Yet such characteristics, of course, are also the foundation stones for most of the world’s great belief systems.

I think we should contact Mick Brown with all the recent revelations about our corrupt megalomaniac s-ex-master.

Kelly

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Date: Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 03:32:38 (GMT)
From: Helen
Email: None
To: Kelly
Subject: A book recommendation and a suggestion
Message:
Sounds like a great book. It will certainly make the rounds here at the forum.

M managed to escape the taint of scandal before the Internet. But alas (for him) the Internet has changed all that. I think it would be a great idea to contact the author about this site. Perhaps he would like to do a treatment on Maharaji next!

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Date: Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 11:09:08 (GMT)
From: Salam
Email: None
To: Kelly
Subject: A book recommendation and a suggestion
Message:
Can I borrow it after you finished with it? Just asking.
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Date: Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 13:49:20 (GMT)
From: Kelly
Email: None
To: Salam
Subject: A book recommendation and a suggestion
Message:
Sure you can mate, why don't you come over for a beer. Where do you live? for some reason I think you live down under, whereas I live on the top of the world!
Funnily enough, after I read your post 'On top of the world ' i was going to mention a book I read some time ago called The Wisdom of Insecurity by Alan Watts, by coincidence Mick Brown says in his book that Alan Watts paid for Rawat's ticket to the States when he first went there. I never heard that before, did you?
I've got to go now, so little time so much to do! Talk to you soon, you can borrow both books if you like.
love kelly
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Date: Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 06:57:42 (GMT)
From: Mr. Free
Email: None
To: Everyone
Subject: The enemy behind the enemy
Message:
The biggest enemy in knowledge is opening up to the influences spiritually and mentally. Those who have meditated more than others or surrendered their will and minds are more susceptible. Psychism is a byproduct of this knowledge. Unfortunately not all that comes through these planes of mind is good truthful or legitimate. Evidenced by Kav and how M used his psychic powers on him.
I was reading through my journals reading some incredible shit. My war for years and years was psychical. I guess you have to have gone there to understand otherwise it sounds like a useless bunch of crap. It is defininately not God or Christ consciousness.
M the figurehead is obvious. I will try to refrain from namecalling but with all that has been brought to light there is no doubt he is not God or the embodiment thereof anymore than you or I. We have had some things drilled in our brains over and over and over again creating a subconsious crises when we finally realize we were and have been guided by those living impure lives. Many heard voices all the time after initiation. Never happened with me before knowledge. Someone opened a door and we were powerless to close it because our own sense of identity as unique individuals was constantly attacked and we begin to lose that.
Remember 'give me your mind I will give you peace.' Remember
how your monkey mind was so crazy and how it was constantly reinforced that your mind was crazy? That's where the rebuilding begins. We have to teach our minds they are not crazy they have a function to perform and they belong, and they were misled for awhile. Maybe our minds can only accomlish waht minds can accomplish the true process of unfoldment is natural.
Does the seed have to surrender its life to sprout? No it has within it the power to push through the soil until it breaks out into the light of the glorious sunshine. Does the seed have to chant or pranam or read encyplopedis on how to grow? It has all the inborn wisdom,food and power to become. so it is with the true seed of God in the rebirth process. It only needs favorable growing conditions to grow.
And my creed is simply this;
I OWE NOTHING TO MAHARAJI OR THE MAHATMAS OR KNOWLEDGE, WHICH WAS ADVERTISED AS BEING FREELY OFFERED TO THE WORLD. I WENT TO SEE GOD AND SOMETHING THAT WASN'T GOD WAS REVEALED.

I AM FREE FROM ANY OATH TO ANYONE WHO HAS FRAUDULENTLY MISREPRESENTED GOD AND LIVED THE UNGODLY LIFE. I AM FREE.
GOD CREATED ALL THAT WAS MADE AND ONLY THE TRUE GOD GETS THE HONOR. MY HEAVENLY FATHER THEY TRIED TO REPLACE WITH THEMSELVES STILL LIVES. THE LORD MY GOD THAT THEY TRIED TO REPLACE WITH THEMSELVES IS STILL HERE. I WAS AM AND SHALL EVER BE.
Any spirit or anything which comes on the mental plane to lie, threaten or intimidate is cursed in my soul. They are forces of darknes and they have no power, unless I decide to give them that power. And they are cursed in my soul for even tresspassing in my consciousness.
So if you do not agree with this post don't respond. Don't bother to say fuck you or anthing. Just move along to the next post.
There is more to this universe than earth, and I don't need to get caught up in the web of deception and bitterness of having been decieved. I only curse their dark spirits for even trying to destroy my God given soul and birthright

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Date: Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 13:43:21 (GMT)
From: bill
Email: None
To: Mr. Free
Subject: 'the devil knows not for whom he works' right?
Message:
Call it murphys law, or that damned human nature, or devil or
whatever, define it as you see it in any given moment, it is a reality that we have to deal with and it is not self created.

Not self created if we apply that quote from yeshua (jesus) as the accurate picture on that subject.

Innocence and trust we seem to flourish in during childhood (if we are able), but we do have an 'enemy' (if you will) in this life. How you define that enemy is yours to define.

Trying to define the enemy was what you were doing in your post.
A worthwhile thing to do.
We will refine our ideas about that as time goes on.

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Date: Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 07:35:36 (GMT)
From: lol
Email: lol
To: Mr. Free
Subject: The enemy behind the enemy and more Bull Shitttttt
Message:
FUCCC YOU!
.
lol
.
What a wandering diatribe of I need to start a new thread so that my wisdom can shine to the glorious Sunshine blah blah and blah.
.
lol
.
Go into the desert and tell it to the scorpion.
.
lol
.
Very humble
.
lol
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Date: Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 19:58:15 (GMT)
From: Mr. Free
Email: None
To: lol
Subject: The enemy behind the enemy and more Bull Shitttttt
Message:
Fuck is spelled Fuck not fucc
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Date: Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 22:05:44 (GMT)
From: lol
Email: not
To: Mr. Free
Subject: The enem and the nemy and more Bull Shitttttt
Message:
Actual what I spelled was FUCCC not FUCC or as you had the need to put it, 'Fuck is spelled Fuck not fucc', what a pathetic response to my POST that you were not able to respond too in any other way.

This is classically characteristic of you and your present condition and responses.

I understand your need to say FUCK, try to understand that saying FUCCC is a softer and more gentile way of saying something that was being in a way asked for in your former POST but not actually saying it the way you were daring it to be said, but I guess you did not get that ether.

lol

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Date: Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 01:12:52 (GMT)
From: Mr. Free
Email: None
To: lol
Subject: You seem to need to be in control
Message:
That's ok I think your attitude speaks well enough for itself. After about the 6th or 7th message in the same spirit, not much I can say except you don't speak on behalf of the whole forum let alone the majority.
Go ahead and vent if it's therapeutic for you. Laughter will help. All that lol lol lol. Your probably crying inside in reality. Your the one who kissed M's feet and ass. I didn't. If your that damned intelligent what is it in your intellect that caused you to stoop to such a level? I got knowledge for knowledge not Guru worship. I caught on soon enough and blew the large one off though. Without the bitterness.
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Date: Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 03:10:47 (GMT)
From: lol
Email: notforyou
To: Mr. Free
Subject: You seem ...... blah blah blah
Message:
Again you put forth the same old tired barbs and jabs without any sanguine discourse just your inane attempt at being rude.

lol

You said: 'If your that damned intelligent what is it in your intellect that caused you to stoop to such a level?'

This is your SPIN your connotation on IT, not mine.

And at this point it would be like, {what is that saying about not casting pearls before swine} well it would be a waist to express to you someone who in your above ranting expresses his lack of 'being' in his so called getting knowledge, lol, and his on going troubles with his temper and so on.

lol lol lol lol lol

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Date: Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 09:19:18 (GMT)
From: brian too
Email: None
To: lol
Subject: Give him a break
Message:
If you think Mr. free is posting foolishness under the guise of seriousness there are two possible ways to handle it, one is to ignore it as he suggested, the other is to add to it.
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Date: Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 10:23:05 (GMT)
From: lol
Email: lol
To: brian too
Subject: Give him a break, (not)
Message:
I did {add to it}, but obviously you did not see it.

Read his rantings below, maybe then what I have done will become clear.

If I were looking at it {at what I did} at first blush I might concur with you.

But looking at it in the context of what has gone on below with him, I do not.

{snap}


Respectfully Submitted

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Date: Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 08:16:16 (GMT)
From: janet of venice
Email: None
To: lol
Subject: i'm with your mr free--same realizations nt
Message:
dont curse them--that adds to the darkness. smile and boogie on
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Date: Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 11:02:13 (GMT)
From: lol
Email: lol
To: janet of venice
Subject: i'm with your mr free--same realizations nt
Message:
You touch upon a very deep subject, that being of how to converse with someone or group. Is it ever appropriate to curse (lol) at someone, well I think that in some linguistic circles it is not even considered cursing, but that necessary way in which to communicate with that particular person or persons to indeed get through, (to communicate). I do feel that cursing many times is the wrong method of communicating, but not always. I of course, (not obvious to you in this instance), chose to communicate in the way that I did. And if I do say so my self I would not put a politically correct right or wrong connotation on it, it was just as I saw it the best way to communicate to him at this juncture.

I do take to heart any and or all of your quest within your response to have things attain a higher plane of betterment.

If you would read below the many POSTS he has made, I feel you very much may come to see this in a much clearer context.

Respectfully Submitted

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Date: Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 19:56:21 (GMT)
From: Mr. Free
Email: None
To: all and lol
Subject: i'm with your mr free--same realizations nt
Message:
I struggle with the same problems you have had to deal with when you had to admit M was a fraud. I deal with it the best I can and have had the pleasure or displeasure of trying to see through the same shit with Mahatma Ramananda. It's my struggle and I do appreciate the forum and website because there are others who are dealing with the same stuff.
I've tried to be positive about it, tried to be light as far as The Broncos post went. The point was basically take a little time to enjoy life too.
My positive attitude toward Mahatma Ramananda was based on some basic integrity and good I saw in the man. The enemy behind the enemy wasn't the man himself but the psychical disorders as I pointed out that resulted from being opened up to inner planes, being subject to influences I really wouldn't voluntarily subject myself to. The enemy was the philosophy that Guru was God and he could come in any form he wanted a smoker, a toker, or a money broker. I mean if he comes as the evil one I don't want to hear one goddamn word on 'judgement day' about my petty little sins.
So I post as who I am not as lol or some other pseudonym. Laughter is however a really therapeutic thing and that's far better than some of the negative crap that spews here from time to time, including some of my own spew.
As far as cursing goes that is in my heart, that which has been sown as something negative, destructive etc. So when that something comes again it triggers a response from within which goes forth on the mental and spiritual planes and can become someones karma if they aren't of a positive nature to drive away that influence. Sounds like bullshit but it is a metaphysical fact. There is no verbal cursing or ceremonies, its just a simple subconscious cleansing , sending back to those who sow in me there reapage.
By the way whatever happened to all those caches of weapons that DLM was stashing many years ago? You'd kind of think if the lord could turn people to salt, like why waste money on weapons. Think of all the money that could be saved and spent for another Mercedes. What does nt mean here?
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Date: Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 22:23:43 (GMT)
From: lol
Email: not
To: Mr. Free
Subject: i'm with your mr free--same realizations nt
Message:
{nt} means no text.......

Like there is nothing written bellow. (lol)


Also if You feel a need to Send a message to ALL you, you should start a new thread. (lol)

Also Mahatma Ramananda and the Broncos as you talk about above along with your many many other things just may not be germane to M in the way and in the fashion that you put this junk forth.

lol

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Date: Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 22:03:14 (GMT)
From: Bin Liner
Email: None
To: Mr. Free
Subject: What caches of weapons , explain please (nt)
Message:
nt
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Date: Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 23:33:19 (GMT)
From: Mr. Free
Email: None
To: Bin Liner
Subject: What caches of weapons , explain please (nt)
Message:
I guess I'm going to have to dig through some old books to find the guy who mentioned that he had recieved knowlege from Maharaji and I remember him mentioning DLM stashing caches of weapons. I'll find it and print the name of the author. It's going to take some time.
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Date: Sat, Dec 23, 2000 at 00:53:14 (GMT)
From: Bin Liner
Email: None
To: Mr. Free
Subject: I'll wait. (nt)
Message:
nt
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Date: Fri, Dec 22, 2000 at 20:53:17 (GMT)
From: brian too
Email: None
To: Mr. Free
Subject: nt means no text nt
Message:
nt
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