Ex-Premie Forum 6 Archive
From: Jul 14, 2001 To: Aug 22, 2001 Page: 3 of: 5


Roger eDrek -:- Cyberstalker and Libel - you are all loosers! -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 21:20:21 (EDT)
__ Silvia -:- My name is not there -:- Tues, Aug 21, 2001 at 05:09:20 (EDT)
__ Peter Howie -:- Re: Cyberstalker and Libel - you are all loosers! -:- Tues, Aug 21, 2001 at 00:57:22 (EDT)
__ __ Zelda -:- Cyberstalker and Libel - you are all loosers! [nt] -:- Tues, Aug 21, 2001 at 03:42:17 (EDT)
__ Sir Dave -:- A clear case of child abuse -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 21:40:10 (EDT)
__ __ Roger eDrek -:- Re: A clear case of child abuse -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 22:29:08 (EDT)
__ __ Sir Dave -:- SO CAN YOU SEE WHY I'M SO FUCKING ANGRY -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 21:50:03 (EDT)
__ __ __ Cynthia -:- Re: SO CAN YOU SEE WHY I'M SO FUCKING ANGRY -:- Tues, Aug 21, 2001 at 10:38:07 (EDT)
__ __ __ Mercedes -:- Re: SO CAN YOU SEE WHY I'M SO FUCKING ANGRY -:- Tues, Aug 21, 2001 at 00:18:47 (EDT)
__ __ __ gerry -:- Dave remember the word, brother -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 22:25:55 (EDT)

Timmi -:- questions -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 20:48:40 (EDT)
__ Timmi -:- More questions -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 21:11:55 (EDT)
__ __ Sir Dave -:- Re: More questions -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 21:30:02 (EDT)
__ Sir Dave -:- It's a sick & nasty cult, Timmi -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 21:05:11 (EDT)

Bryn -:- What a waste of talent -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 19:58:02 (EDT)
__ Pat:C) -:- Thanks, Bryn, beautifully said [nt] -:- Tues, Aug 21, 2001 at 16:30:15 (EDT)
__ Jim -:- What a great point you make, Bryn! -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 20:05:12 (EDT)

salam -:- to cyberstalker -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 19:22:59 (EDT)
__ Salam -:- on second thought -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 19:57:10 (EDT)
__ __ Sir Dave -:- Yours is a masterpiece! -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 21:00:27 (EDT)
__ __ __ sil -:- Never mind. I got it zzzzzz NT -:- Tues, Aug 21, 2001 at 05:25:53 (EDT)
__ __ __ Silvia -:- what pic -:- Tues, Aug 21, 2001 at 05:18:51 (EDT)
__ __ __ salam -:- Re: Yours is a masterpiece! -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 23:37:06 (EDT)

Silvia -:- MAHA needs a huge Class Action Suit -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 17:51:43 (EDT)
__ gerry -:- hey silvia! -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 17:55:31 (EDT)

gerry -:- Oh Poofta! -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 16:47:09 (EDT)
__ Marianne -:- Where's Bjorn's name? -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 21:27:40 (EDT)
__ __ Bjørn E -:- Oh Marianne, can't you forgive that I -:- Tues, Aug 21, 2001 at 07:21:24 (EDT)
__ __ __ JohnT -:- in your dreams -:- Tues, Aug 21, 2001 at 08:08:01 (EDT)
__ __ __ __ Bjørn E -:- Misquote, John T? -:- Tues, Aug 21, 2001 at 08:31:49 (EDT)
__ __ __ __ __ JohnT -:- Yes -:- Tues, Aug 21, 2001 at 11:11:07 (EDT)
__ __ __ __ __ Bjørn E -:- And by the way, John T -:- Tues, Aug 21, 2001 at 08:41:26 (EDT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ JohnT -:- LIAR -:- Tues, Aug 21, 2001 at 11:14:21 (EDT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ Bjørn E -:- Re: LIAR -:- Tues, Aug 21, 2001 at 15:37:31 (EDT)
__ __ salam -:- Re: Where's Bjorn's name? -:- Tues, Aug 21, 2001 at 00:45:50 (EDT)
__ Joe -:- We'll I'm green with envy -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 18:49:36 (EDT)
__ Gerry -:- Thank You, Lord -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 17:06:09 (EDT)
__ Lady Davina -:- Re: Oh Poofta! -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 16:59:16 (EDT)
__ __ Pat:C) -:- Jim should never had worn drag -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 17:37:58 (EDT)
__ __ __ gerry -:- the door is always open -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 17:45:41 (EDT)
__ __ __ __ gerry -:- Let's guess who's next -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 17:47:57 (EDT)
__ __ __ __ __ gerry -:- I gotta question: -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 18:01:17 (EDT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ Selene -:- they are the stalkers -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 18:31:24 (EDT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ gerry -:- Here's the thing, Selene -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 18:36:32 (EDT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Silvia -:- kissing his FEET is even worse -:- Tues, Aug 21, 2001 at 05:28:08 (EDT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Selene -:- and your point is? -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 18:42:22 (EDT)

Sir Dave -:- No rules against outing premies here -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 15:59:21 (EDT)
__ silvia -:- Power to you -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 17:49:11 (EDT)
__ __ gerry -:- Re: Power to you -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 18:05:28 (EDT)
__ __ __ Silvia -:- Re: Power to you -:- Tues, Aug 21, 2001 at 04:48:42 (EDT)
__ __ __ __ DeProGram Anand Ji -:- Re: Power to you -:- Tues, Aug 21, 2001 at 04:56:47 (EDT)
__ __ __ __ __ Silvia -:- here -:- Tues, Aug 21, 2001 at 05:11:28 (EDT)
__ Selene -:- Re: No rules against outing premies here -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 16:04:20 (EDT)
__ __ Sir Dave -:- Yes that's right -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 16:13:33 (EDT)
__ Pat:C) -:- PEWKs are not premies -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 16:04:03 (EDT)
__ __ Sir Dave -:- To think we were once in that cult -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 17:40:18 (EDT)
__ __ __ Pat:C) -:- We're on the list because we don't hide anything -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 17:50:16 (EDT)

Jim -:- Why I'm better than you (from ELK) -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 15:27:46 (EDT)
__ Pat:C) -:- I felt so special as a premie -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 15:43:23 (EDT)
__ __ Peg (devils advocate) -:- Re: I felt so special as a premie -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 17:01:44 (EDT)
__ __ __ Jim -:- Of course not, Peg -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 19:32:33 (EDT)
__ __ __ Pat:C) -:- No, Peg, I just feel normal and ordinary -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 17:45:06 (EDT)

Joe -:- I don't get it -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 15:01:44 (EDT)
__ Jim -:- No they don't -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 15:04:24 (EDT)
__ __ Pat:C) -:- Quite a few quotes on CAC -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 15:15:23 (EDT)
__ __ __ CD -:- Re: CAC -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 18:11:12 (EDT)
__ __ __ __ Joe -:- Picture of Jim -- Yes -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 18:43:51 (EDT)
__ __ __ __ __ CD -:- Re: Picture of Jim -- Yes -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 21:55:00 (EDT)
__ __ __ __ Pat:C) -:- Re: CAC - thanks, CD -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 18:17:00 (EDT)
__ __ __ __ gerry -:- Re: CAC -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 18:15:17 (EDT)
__ __ __ Richard -:- Any publicity is bad publicity -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 15:27:19 (EDT)
__ __ __ __ Joe -:- Exactly -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 15:30:26 (EDT)
__ __ __ __ __ Pat:C) -:- Re: Exactly -it's perfect -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 15:39:11 (EDT)

Is this -:- the place where Glasser works? -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 15:01:26 (EDT)

Jim -:- Commentary on my profile as a 'Cyberstalker' -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 14:34:20 (EDT)
__ silvia -:- JANET WILSON: HILARIOUS! -:- Tues, Aug 21, 2001 at 05:33:05 (EDT)
__ Jim -:- Commentary on my posts they put up -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 14:50:15 (EDT)
__ __ Victoria Clemens -:- Re: Commentary on my posts they put up -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 15:45:04 (EDT)
__ __ __ Jim -:- What kind of idiot are YOU now? -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 19:41:24 (EDT)
__ Pat:C) -:- I will not be rebutting CAC -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 14:43:42 (EDT)
__ __ gerry -:- I am pleased as punch... -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 14:53:59 (EDT)
__ __ __ Roger eDrek -:- uh, Ger, they paid me money and I sold you out -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 21:30:06 (EDT)
__ __ __ __ gerry -:- that explains it drek, buddy -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 21:36:09 (EDT)
__ __ __ __ __ Roger B-I-N-G-O eDrek -:- Re: that explains it drek, buddy -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 22:35:38 (EDT)
__ __ __ Dermot -:- I'm going back to Maharaji -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 15:17:37 (EDT)
__ __ __ Pat:C) -:- If you can't have fame, infamy will do -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 15:11:21 (EDT)
__ __ __ __ gerry -:- That must be it, Pat -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 15:25:28 (EDT)

Chuck S. -:- The Moscow website as publicity.... -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 14:00:16 (EDT)
__ Pat:C) -:- CAC should correct errors first -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 14:06:55 (EDT)
__ __ Joe -:- Pilsner Inn? -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 14:16:40 (EDT)
__ __ __ Pat:C) -:- Re: Pilsner Inn? I also finance the IRA -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 14:22:27 (EDT)
__ __ __ __ Joe -:- So, do you manage the Pilsner Inn? -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 15:24:57 (EDT)
__ __ __ __ __ Pat:C) -:- I emailed you and Jim [nt] -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 15:49:56 (EDT)
__ Joe -:- Hysterical......well done guys NT -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 14:06:48 (EDT)

Sir Dave -:- I don't believe him - do you?? -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 11:29:30 (EDT)
__ salam -:- he's a bloody lawyer -:- Tues, Aug 21, 2001 at 00:50:31 (EDT)
__ Joe -:- Is the site based in Russia? -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 13:49:05 (EDT)
__ Selene -:- what's the url? -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 13:15:45 (EDT)
__ __ Sir Dave -:- Here it is -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 13:28:55 (EDT)
__ __ __ Zelda -:- Worst Stalkers get 'Shame on you??!! Tee hee [nt] -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 18:03:49 (EDT)
__ __ __ Richard -:- Website design by Boris Kontchalovski -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 14:09:57 (EDT)
__ __ __ __ Sir Dave -:- Boris Kontchalovski's address & phone number -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 14:27:33 (EDT)
__ __ __ PeterC -:- Re: Here it is -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 13:56:46 (EDT)
__ __ __ __ Steve -:- VC - Peter C -:- Tues, Aug 21, 2001 at 03:37:49 (EDT)
__ __ __ Selene -:- sickening -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 13:41:23 (EDT)
__ Bjørn E -:- I believe him. But you have -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 12:22:59 (EDT)
__ __ Jerry -:- Re: I believe him. But you have -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 12:43:55 (EDT)
__ __ Sir Dave -:- Here they come -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 12:34:08 (EDT)
__ __ __ Jim -:- First LOL of the day! -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 13:51:26 (EDT)
__ __ __ __ Selene -:- well the writing IS funny -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 13:59:34 (EDT)
__ Sir Dave -:- and furthermore -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 11:39:08 (EDT)
__ salam -:- No -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 11:36:06 (EDT)

Moll of Mole -:- Alias Smith and CW -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 04:24:56 (EDT)

BeenThereDoneThat -:- Told my kids -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 04:18:35 (EDT)
__ Jim -:- Boy, that must have felt right -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 15:06:38 (EDT)
__ Pat:C) -:- Re: Told my kids - well done, Been -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 04:47:39 (EDT)
__ __ Mercedes -:- Re: Told my kids - well done, Been -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 11:13:27 (EDT)
__ __ __ Joe -:- Right on, Mercedes -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 13:29:44 (EDT)

Freedom of Speech -:- have you seen this? -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 02:03:07 (EDT)
__ Joe -:- What am I, chopped liver? -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 13:13:46 (EDT)
__ __ Roger eDrek -:- Re: I still luv ya, Joe! I'll make fun of you... -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 22:06:18 (EDT)
__ __ Jim -:- Because you never say anything! -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 13:47:50 (EDT)
__ __ __ Pat:C) -:- They just added Dettmers and Salam -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 13:50:14 (EDT)
__ __ __ __ salam -:- Re: They just added Dettmers and Salam -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 19:26:07 (EDT)
__ __ Joe -:- So funny, so absurd -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 13:19:44 (EDT)
__ Carl -:- This CACA "net jihad" getting nasty now.? -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 07:36:14 (EDT)
__ __ Sir Dave -:- This is Maharaji's way -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 09:59:20 (EDT)
__ __ silvia -:- Is time to act Nt -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 08:30:41 (EDT)
__ __ __ Jim -:- Silvia, what exactly are you talking about? -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 13:11:36 (EDT)
__ __ __ Deborah -:- Re: Is time to act Nt -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 13:00:20 (EDT)
__ __ __ Sir Dave -:- It shows itself for what it is -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 08:59:43 (EDT)
__ __ __ __ salam -:- Re: It shows itself for what it is -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 11:27:47 (EDT)
__ __ __ __ __ janet -:- chauvinist pig-i see no women on the list -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 13:56:30 (EDT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ salam -:- Re: chauvinist pig-i see no women on the list -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 19:29:17 (EDT)
__ Pat:C) -:- For those mentioned -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 05:32:35 (EDT)
__ __ Salam -:- Re: For those mentioned -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 06:51:46 (EDT)
__ __ __ Joe -:- Re: For those mentioned -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 13:22:52 (EDT)
__ Sir Dave -:- This is Charles Glasser's work -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 03:43:30 (EDT)
__ __ Sir Dave -:- But he's got a friend to help him -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 04:02:07 (EDT)
__ __ __ JHB -:- The site is in Russia -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 05:42:46 (EDT)
__ __ __ __ Pedro -:- MILI is the Man nt -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 12:44:34 (EDT)
__ __ __ __ __ Jim -:- Clearly, Catweasel's involved -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 15:01:54 (EDT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ Steve -:- Re: Clearly, Catweasel's involved -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 15:46:00 (EDT)
__ __ __ __ salam -:- Re: The site is in Russia -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 06:46:24 (EDT)
__ __ __ __ Sir Dave -:- Thanks and I'm off -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 05:53:09 (EDT)
__ __ __ __ Pat:C) -:- You aren't mentioned -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 05:49:09 (EDT)
__ __ __ __ __ gerry -:- Why me Lord? -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 12:47:46 (EDT)
__ __ __ __ __ JHB -:- Re: You aren't mentioned -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 05:53:07 (EDT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ Pat:C) -:- Re: You got it! -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 05:58:49 (EDT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ JHB -:- Re: You got it! -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 06:30:00 (EDT)
__ Jim -:- Interesting for sure -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 03:15:46 (EDT)
__ __ salam -:- Re: Interesting for sure -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 04:46:49 (EDT)
__ __ Pat:C) -:- Holy Jihad! I wish he hadn't used that pic -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 04:43:53 (EDT)
__ __ __ Jim -:- My answer reposted from LG -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 13:16:04 (EDT)
__ __ __ __ Pat:C) -:- Thanks Jim - too funny -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 13:38:23 (EDT)
__ __ __ Sir Dave -:- What dedication -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 05:32:11 (EDT)
__ __ __ __ Pat:C) -:- Re: What dedication - sweetie dahling -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 05:52:17 (EDT)
__ __ __ __ __ gerry -:- What's this 'knife' thingy? -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 11:51:48 (EDT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ Sir Dave -:- How about the Glasser Channel?? -:- Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 12:27:38 (EDT)


Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 21:20:21 (EDT)
From: Roger eDrek
Email: None
To: All
Subject: Cyberstalker and Libel - you are all loosers!
Message:
Wow! That Citizens Against Cyberstalking is absolutely unbelievable. We're talking serious libel against non-public figures here. In our criticism of Maharaji here on the Internet or in the press in the United States we enjoy the protection of First Ammendment rights of Free Speech. And specificially those rights are further extended when the topic or person is a Public figure.

The people listed as cyberstalkers by CAC are not, in fact, Public figures and therefore they are protected by law in terms of libelous garbage as presented by CAC. These people are free to file suit against the owner of the site as well as pursue action via the Digital Millenium Copyright Act against the ISP hosting such material. I certainly don't think it's going to be very difficult to convince a jury that material presented as fact by CAC is, in fact, untrue and quite reckless and libelous.

And wouldn't it be a total windfall if somehow the operation or even the slightest hint of supervision or even suggestion came from Elan Vital to the owner of CAC.
[ Cyberstalkers ]

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Date: Tues, Aug 21, 2001 at 05:09:20 (EDT)
From: Silvia
Email: None
To: Roger eDrek
Subject: My name is not there
Message:
It must be because I have many original papers that JM posted on line and also 400 recent videos, old Divine times, old cassettes of the 70s where maha asks us, poor nothing to surrender, and a cassette of Paranand asking for money. Maybe that is the reason. I am willing to testify under oath, anytime.

They are getting dangerously ridiculous.

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Date: Tues, Aug 21, 2001 at 00:57:22 (EDT)
From: Peter Howie
Email: None
To: Roger eDrek
Subject: Re: Cyberstalker and Libel - you are all loosers!
Message:
As I read this site I am overcome with a sense of humour. It simply has to be a serous joke. I read MD's stuff and it is delightfully succinct but their analysis, while pssible, is wonderfully twisted.

Aren't they simply reprinting the worst of MJ in a different forum so more people can see and read it? A bit like having serious premies arguing on the ex-premies site? I haven't read all the stuff - but I mean saying stuff like Jim's work is 'at the lower end'. This has to be a joke doesn't it. It paints Jim as a sleazy gumshoe from a Mickey Spillane novel. And suggests that all criminals should should be slammed in joail and have the keys tossed. JM is now in the secret service? Great.

Sounds like CW or someone with a similar level of intelligence and time on their hands - that is their own boss.

The articles they have on apostasy are interesting as well - though they fall into the somewhat specious basket though much of what they say is pretty interesting.

Cheers for now

Peter Howie

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Date: Tues, Aug 21, 2001 at 03:42:17 (EDT)
From: Zelda
Email: None
To: Peter Howie
Subject: Cyberstalker and Libel - you are all loosers! [nt]
Message:
The site sounds like a bad Russian novel with a worse translation. To use words like terrorist so loosely - along with 'shame on you' - it has to be written by someone who has English as a second language.
If it so serious it is funny.
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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 21:40:10 (EDT)
From: Sir Dave
Email: sirdavid12@hotmail.com
To: Roger eDrek
Subject: A clear case of child abuse
Message:
Does ''cac'' mean in America what it means in Britain? i.e. ''shit''.

If the site stays there, with a pic of myself with my daughter, with my address and phone number on, I'd say there is a very clear breach against children's rights. Child abuse by proxy against my daughter.

Now we know that Maharaji and Elan Vital don't care Jack Shit about children and the abuse of same but other people do. I will be investigating this.

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 22:29:08 (EDT)
From: Roger eDrek
Email: None
To: Sir Dave
Subject: Re: A clear case of child abuse
Message:
Indeed, while it may be the only picture of you that they had, it is very much out of bounds in terms of decency. And then there is the entire subterfuge where it doesn't state that the girl is your daughter either. It's really fucking sick stuff.

Or is this really a joke? It's so bad. How could it be anything other than a joke?

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 21:50:03 (EDT)
From: Sir Dave
Email: None
To: Sir Dave
Subject: SO CAN YOU SEE WHY I'M SO FUCKING ANGRY
Message:
This is blatant endangering of my own children. You premies are slime. You stoop to any level. You have shown the world now, both you and Maharaji what low-life you all are.

You are scum. You endanger innocent children. You are pure scum. The whole cult has shown its true colours. Now I see why Jagdeo got away with abusing children for so many years. You, Maharaji and premies have no sense of humanity. You are spineless and evil.

One thing for certain, you've made a big enemy now out of me. I was quite relaxed about Maharaji and premies until this.

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Date: Tues, Aug 21, 2001 at 10:38:07 (EDT)
From: Cynthia
Email: None
To: Sir Dave
Subject: Re: SO CAN YOU SEE WHY I'M SO FUCKING ANGRY
Message:
Dave,

This is absolutely beyond any kind of human decency. To publish your child's photo is unforgivable!

If they had to do this utterly ridiculous thing, they could have cut or blurred the girl's face.

If I were you I'd be fighting mad!

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Date: Tues, Aug 21, 2001 at 00:18:47 (EDT)
From: Mercedes
Email: None
To: Sir Dave
Subject: Re: SO CAN YOU SEE WHY I'M SO FUCKING ANGRY
Message:
Hi Dave, yes this people are evil they must have snagged that picture the moment it went up I remember it was only up for a day or less. They are connaving, and mean to the bone.
I am disgusted and have even more reason not to ever go back to that cult of spinless bastards, that's exactly what they are starting from the top man himself.
Best wishes to you and family,
Mercedes
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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 22:25:55 (EDT)
From: gerry
Email: None
To: Sir Dave
Subject: Dave remember the word, brother
Message:
Is that your daughter? What a cutie pie. I miss having kids when I see a picture like that. She's obviously having a great time with her loving father. Dave, this is nothing. They are loosers and cac to the max. Please don't let this upset you. They are nothing.

The person who put up that webstie can't be representative of most premies. Can't be. The premies I knew and loved were some of the best people in the world.

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 20:48:40 (EDT)
From: Timmi
Email: None
To: All
Subject: questions
Message:
Haven't been here for awhile, but I looked at CAC. Is that even legal? What do they think they are doing? It is so obviously a threat to people who dispute rawat's 'Godness'. I found it quite sickening.

Also, I understand that rawat has a or some mistresses. Is this true? Is this known as fact? Is the information available somewhere on the web or elsewhere?

Still no answer as to why ev is registered as a church. Odd. I know they are reading these posts. Are they that cowardly to not answer a very simple, straightforward question? Apparently.

It all makes me quite ill.

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 21:11:55 (EDT)
From: Timmi
Email: None
To: Timmi
Subject: More questions
Message:
Sorry. Just a couple more questions. What the hell is satsang? And what in the world is a satguru? Am I just that out of it that these mean nothing? The more I read, the more questions I have! The sites need a vocabulary. Maybe there is one and I missed it? Darshan is kissing some body else's stupid feet, I figured that out. Isn't that just a little disgusting? Pranam appears to be lying completely at someone's feet? Face down?

I have the deepest respect for anyone who lived in and accepted all the filth of this cult and had the courage to leave it. That is truly finding that which is within you, finding that most precious self. I applaud all of you who have done it.

That cyberstalker site is disgusting and has me more than a little freaked out.

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 21:30:02 (EDT)
From: Sir Dave
Email: None
To: Timmi
Subject: Re: More questions
Message:
Satsang is a so called spiritual discourse or speech. If someone gives satsang then they give a speech about Maharaji and knowledge etc. It comes from Hindi for truth which is ''sat'' and company which is ''sang'' suppose. Satsang also means the event where the discourses are happening. You can go to satsang and then listen to satsang or even give satsang. Well, people used to but now it's just Maharaji videos and nobody else speaks. Just boring baloney really.

Sat Guru means true guru. Like the only one who is divine and the incarnation of God. God on Earth, the Lord. What sat guru really means in reality is fake conman.

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 21:05:11 (EDT)
From: Sir Dave
Email: None
To: Timmi
Subject: It's a sick & nasty cult, Timmi
Message:
Full of little people who are without humanity. If you look at The Truth About Maharaji site, linked at the top of this forum, you'll see what you're looking for in there.
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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 19:58:02 (EDT)
From: Bryn
Email: None
To: All
Subject: What a waste of talent
Message:
Just read CAC. It is soooo TACKY! Maharaji, I know you are behind this somewhere, you have just succeeded in actually embarrasing me. I take a step away and after a while look back with sincere and hard won self-examination at you and your place in my life--and then this?! This is near porn-site status. CAC is transparent, cynical, insincere abuse of communication. It is completely empty of humanity. And the person/s who wrote it so obviously relished every nuance of their service to you in preparing it. It's pathetic.

One simple point for CAC: The teacher v. pupil confrontation/situation as expressed on Ex-p.org, is ORIGINAL. It is primal, vital, human, a dialogue. A bit like a marital dispute. People on the sidelines are a second order issue. Can't you get that? No matter how much cheering or slagging off of the main contenders you do you remain a side-show. A commentator on something original and alive. There is nothing, short of pulling the plug, that will make the Ex/Maha dispute go away now.

It is tragic to watch talented writers demean the whole process of communicating with the written word, in a desparate attempt to achieve the impossible. CAC writers! The main event is Guru v.ex-devotees, a perfectly legitimate and productive (if rather one-sided ) slanging match. Nothing you say will ever effect the outcome at all. You can get as brash, gross, self-rightious, thourough as you like-whatever. Get it? All you will achieve is to reveal yourself in the way you play your part as a spectator. In this case, you simply succeed in disgracing yourself.
The authors so obviously enjoyed every gratuitous little innuendo. They have clearly been waiting to do this for years and have invested much talent and effort in studied manipulation of language to achieve it. And what is it? An un-original, cynical, pastiche, completely devoid of any life of its own.

In the interests of language in general, and out of respect for your own talent (if nothing else) please take it off the air! It has no life.
.
Bryn

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Date: Tues, Aug 21, 2001 at 16:30:15 (EDT)
From: Pat:C)
Email: None
To: Bryn
Subject: Thanks, Bryn, beautifully said [nt]
Message:
[nt]
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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 20:05:12 (EDT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: Bryn
Subject: What a great point you make, Bryn!
Message:
One simple point for CAC: The teacher v. pupil confrontation/situation as expressed on Ex-p.org, is ORIGINAL. It is primal, vital, human, a dialogue. A bit like a marital dispute. People on the sidelines are a second order issue. Can't you get that? No matter how much cheering or slagging off of the main contenders you do you remain a side-show. A commentator on something original and alive. There is nothing, short of pulling the plug, that will make the Ex/Maha dispute go away now.

That is so true. Well said too.

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 19:22:59 (EDT)
From: salam
Email: None
To: All
Subject: to cyberstalker
Message:
please be adviced, your ass is trash, remove my name from your list or you will hear from certain lawyers asap.

And may allah smite you all, you infidels.

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 19:57:10 (EDT)
From: Salam
Email: None
To: salam
Subject: on second thought
Message:
leave it for a while, there are some certain people that might be very interested in what you are writing.

Oh and thank for the statement:

He has his own highly defamatory web site, hosted for him by a friend of his in Seattle, WA, USA. He did this as he believes that this will help keep him outside the reach of Australian cyberstalking laws.

That only proves that EV is behind your website

Little does he know that Australian authorities recently arrested Australian residents for cyberstalking activities against US citizens in the US.

very interesting, because the Australian Authority is coming here in few hours and they will be crtainly paying you a visit. We will compare notes and they will make the decision on who is cyberstalking who?

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 21:00:27 (EDT)
From: Sir Dave
Email: None
To: Salam
Subject: Yours is a masterpiece!
Message:
I just read a bit of your articles on the cyberstalking site and they're fucking funny man. That Glasser has no sense of humour. Christ, the author of this new site is a complete moron.

There's me talking about having a fixation with Glen Whittaker and becoming a transexual... Christ, these idiots aren't even human. Is that what Maharaji does to you long term!

Anyway, I'm not happy with my pic. It's an old one plus my daughter's in it, which is not good. Do you think if I sent them a pic taken a fortnight ago, they'll swap them over?

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Date: Tues, Aug 21, 2001 at 05:25:53 (EDT)
From: sil
Email: None
To: Sir Dave
Subject: Never mind. I got it zzzzzz NT
Message:
NT
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Date: Tues, Aug 21, 2001 at 05:18:51 (EDT)
From: Silvia
Email: None
To: Sir Dave
Subject: what pic
Message:
are there pics?????
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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 23:37:06 (EDT)
From: salam
Email: None
To: Sir Dave
Subject: Re: Yours is a masterpiece!
Message:
you can try.

In my opinion this website is breaching the Telecommunication Act [at least in Australia]. The webmaster and the hosting company will have to answer some questions. But I do agree that my part is a bit hillarious and sick. I really don't want to bring myself down to their level. EV is rolling in shit and I want to keep a distance between me and them. Hey we are famous now.

So the official australian goverment has been here, and they are not impressed with what I told them.

And EV, you have asked for it. I was holding back on something that will bring you under the microscope of certain Australian Goverment Agency, now you have really pissed me off. So remember this next time someone knocks on your door. And hey there is nothing you can do about it. I have already downloaded the material, all I need now is to present it.

Wanna play dirty, lets do it.

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 17:51:43 (EDT)
From: Silvia
Email: None
To: All
Subject: MAHA needs a huge Class Action Suit
Message:
AND NEEDS TO BE AUDITED BY THE IRS!

DON'T YOU THINK?

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 17:55:31 (EDT)
From: gerry
Email: None
To: Silvia
Subject: hey silvia!
Message:
Barking Chihuaha

Wasn't that the name Sandy called you? Now they say that was MY nickname. Liars or what?

ps I agree with you, the irs should investigate him.

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 16:47:09 (EDT)
From: gerry
Email: None
To: All
Subject: Oh Poofta!
Message:
Actually I'm quite amused. And honored. Just imagine, being on one of goober's 'shame ' lists.

Did he pick you Selene?
Did he pick you JW?
did he pick you Dermot?
Did he pick you Jethro?
Did he pick you Marianne?
Did he pick you Joy?
Did he pick you Silvia?

And the rest of you louts: you're a bunch of slackers. I want you all to get in here now and start slinging the mud, lies, false accusations, cussing, rants, anything but just get going. There's only a few spots left on the front page for you lack-luster mediocre types to FINALLY SHINE!

I knew I was special. I just knew it. And this proves it. Goober picked ME! He probably even knows my name! Ha, now eat them words, Carlos baby! Think he know YOUR name? Fuck NO!!!!!!!

hahahahahhahahah (An insane gutteral laugh dribbles off his lips, his chin hits his chest. A thin red line trickles down his scrawny white forearm, and it drops to his side. Christ, he hadn't even the time to get the damn thing out. He can only hope his poor live-in girlfriend doesn't find him like this when she comes home from working so hard to support HIS fucking habit, to pay HIS fucking internet bills...

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 21:27:40 (EDT)
From: Marianne
Email: None
To: gerry
Subject: Where's Bjorn's name?
Message:
If anyone deserves to be included in this category, it's him. In fact, he deserves his own website for the stalking he's done here.

Marianne

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Date: Tues, Aug 21, 2001 at 07:21:24 (EDT)
From: Bjørn E
Email: None
To: Marianne
Subject: Oh Marianne, can't you forgive that I
Message:
revealed your lies and double morality?
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Date: Tues, Aug 21, 2001 at 08:08:01 (EDT)
From: JohnT
Email: None
To: Bjørn E
Subject: in your dreams
Message:
revealed your lies and double morality?


---

do you mean by the transparent misquotes you promulgated?

You fooled no-one - you only showed that you are trash.

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Date: Tues, Aug 21, 2001 at 08:31:49 (EDT)
From: Bjørn E
Email: None
To: JohnT
Subject: Misquote, John T?
Message:
I just clipped a post from F4 or 5, where Marianne stated that it warmed her heart when she read the links to Jagdeos activities. Is that a misquote????

Have never heard about someone so fucked up that this shit warms a heart. Have you?

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Date: Tues, Aug 21, 2001 at 11:11:07 (EDT)
From: JohnT
Email: None
To: Bjørn E
Subject: Yes
Message:
Yes,

I saw what you posted. And I saw Marianne's original post. You clipped it alright, it would seem deliberately to misrepresent her.

The full post made it clear that what warmed Marianne's heart was to see oppressed people fighting back, not the fact of the original oppression.

So why did you clip it? Why not post a link to her actual post?

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Date: Tues, Aug 21, 2001 at 08:41:26 (EDT)
From: Bjørn E
Email: None
To: Bjørn E
Subject: And by the way, John T
Message:
she lied and said she could never write such a thing because of the evidence that people who knew her, knew she wouldn't. And then she lied and called me a liar.

Yet I never lied about things here at ex-premie sites.

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Date: Tues, Aug 21, 2001 at 11:14:21 (EDT)
From: JohnT
Email: None
To: Bjørn E
Subject: LIAR
Message:
You are a liar, because you misrepresented Marianne. You could have made it clear that what warmed her heart was to see oppressed people fighting back.

But you perverted her words for reasons of your own, and tried to represent her as approving of the original oppression. You could easily have posted a link to what she actually wrote. But you did not.

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Date: Tues, Aug 21, 2001 at 15:37:31 (EDT)
From: Bjørn E
Email: None
To: JohnT
Subject: Re: LIAR
Message:
I am not a lawyer neither do I have any education in laws. And I dont know the practice of law in US nor the laws. But at least in my country, the burden of proof when someone libels or accuses someone of lying as you do or Marianne does, is at the person who attacks another person. In this case this means you and Marianne, or even me. Marianne called me a liar, and stated she had never written such a thing (based on evidential proofs that people who knew her, would know this was not true), I stated that she posted this. In fact I stated that this sentence was the one reason for me to talk about the J. business). Ironically it might have saved me from going away from M.

So why did I not post a link?. I had it on my computer, that is why.

So then the burden of proof is yours. Proof that I am a liar.

Until proven, you are the liar.

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Date: Tues, Aug 21, 2001 at 00:45:50 (EDT)
From: salam
Email: salam_au@iprimus.com.au
To: Marianne
Subject: Re: Where's Bjorn's name?
Message:
Hello MrieAnne,

As a lawyer, can you please comment on what is happening, also can you e-mail me, have something to say to you.

Salam

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 18:49:36 (EDT)
From: Joe
Email: None
To: gerry
Subject: We'll I'm green with envy
Message:
Like I told Jim, I never rate in the evil, hateful, ex-premie lists. What is wrong with me? I live right. I deserve notoriety, but it seems to be my karma to be forever a middle-management nobody, both in and out of the cult. I guess I should just get used to it.
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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 17:06:09 (EDT)
From: Gerry
Email: None
To: gerry
Subject: Thank You, Lord
Message:
The born Lord of the Yogis, Mr Filament, by proxy has given me a new lease on life. I have a springy lilt in my step, a song on my lips, a smile on my face today. This may be my finest hour! Thank you Lord!

I'd like to share with you nice folks all the particulars of my new raison de pride (that's a little frenchy talk to show we aren't all communists like dave and jean michael, and oh yeah, to show I got a 'intellect', what ever the hell that is):

Gerry Lyng, Alleged Cyberstalker

A.K.A.'Gerry'

McCleary, WA

Email:
gkl1@techline.com
glyng@techline.com

Gerry, once nicknamed 'Barking Chihuaha,' because of his endless ranting and because of allegations about the size of his brain, does not appear to hold a steady job. While his live-in girlfriend, who supports him financially, is at work, he logs on and spends day after day harassing innocent people.

Creating a profile of Gerry is difficult, since he does not seem able to articulate coherent views or opinions. What he lacks in intellect, however, he makes up in sheer hate, ferocity, and volume. Lyng targets innocent people on a number of forums and harasses them for months or years in a row. He makes a point of informing his victims that he 'sleeps with a shotgun under the bed.' He is suspect to be capable of spontaneous physical violence and should be considered possibly armed and dangerous.

If you need assistance to protect yourself from this individual you may:

File a 'Cyber 911 report' with Cyberangels
Contact your police department to file a complaint
Contact the FBI (in case of death threats)
Tell us what you know about this individual

Here are some examples from a day in Lyng's life on the Internet.

LYNG INSULTS PEOPLE HE DOES NOT EVEN KNOW

'You phony lying manipulative bitch witch. Everything you write is a lie. You are a pathological sicko fucked up cunt. Good fucking riddance you piece of shit I hate you. What a joke. Pure fantasy. You are the drama queen for sure. Why would anyone believe anything you say? Unless they are sick crazy fucks like ****. btw who called you a lying manipulative cunt. Which you are. You fucking lying fake liar fraud manipulator So did you two have sex yet,? Hows the old mare's crack? Bet it stinks. Suck cocks in hell. You really crack me up with this reap what you sow crap. and you don't feel sorry for me, you sociopaths don't have feelings. this aint about joey's mom or barney, or me. it's about you, you lying bitch. you're a real case, talking about respect. you don't know the meaning of the word. Sicko. Get help. Cat, whats a ''scmuck?'' And how do you pronounce it? Ska Muck? So I'm a ska muck. Ouch ouch ouch. '

OFTEN, AT SOME POINT, LYNG WHO APPEARS TO BE ON DRUGS, GETS AMNESIA

'What am I raving about, again? I forget. Help me remember……..'

AND THEN STARTS AGAIN

'I'm having a really tough time not cussing your ass out bigtime, dufus. Maybe I should put you back in the litter box (that means block your IPs again dunce) for pussies like yourself. What a chickenshit! Excuse me? Or maybe you understand this better: Huh? How can I lighten up, wheezy? Please do tell. You guys in England could toss a little petrol on the flames by sending this statement to the appropriate papers so they can take another shot at him. If goober unplugged his butt plug and told you to lick it, would you? Just trying to raise your consciousness here. GET THE FUCK OUTTA HERE OR JUST SHUT THE FUCK UP. GIVE THIS CUNT THE HEAVE HO.IS THAT ABUSIVE ENOUGH??????'

LYNG SHARES HIS RACIST VIEWS

'Israel is the pre-eminent racist, religionist, separatist, apartheid state in the world. By acts of terrorism, massacre, and forcible relocation, it removed hundreds of thousands of Palestinian people from their towns and their land, and denied them any right of return. Whatever villages, towns, homes, farms, and other properties were considered useful were taken over by Jews; everything else was bulldozed and destroyed, all with the US's support and sanction.'

GERRY SAYS HE IS ARMED AND MAKES THREATS

'Talking of knives, here's a nice one that will suit MXXXXXX(note:name of person withheld) up to the hilt. What he really needs and will get, given half the chance.
[N.B. the URL is http://store4.yimg.com/I/knifeart_1628_18975327
It contains a photo of a very large knife.]
Fighting may, in some instances like this one, need to be a little violent itself. As little as possible as far as I prefer, but some violence may be needed. Period.
I'd rather throw molotov cocktails than sit at the negotiating table anyday !!!
We are armed to the teeth. don't fuck with us !!! I'm a physical coward...that's why I keep a loaded shotgun under my bed.'

GERRY IS PARANOID ABOUT PUBLIC FIGURES

'These people are public figures. They put themselves in the limelight. They take money, energy, and trust from people indiscriminately and give NOTHING back. They are blood suckers on the most basic level. Psychic Vampires if you will. All blubbering and fuzzy feelings aside, THEY KILL PEOPLE, in a very real sense. And they know it. And it doesn't matter to them as long as their power trip continues. They lie, steal and kill. Let's cut the crap and quit coddling the bastards.
I now hate conseratives as much as liberals...They're all in it together. You're not interested in the truth. You're interested in making that ugly bastard some 'special' person. And yeah, I have listened to the puke recently. It made ME puke.'

GERRY DISCUSSES HIS SEXUAL PERVERSIONS

?Breasts, I've always wanted to be a hermaphrodite. Then I could really do it when people tell me to go fuck myself.'

GERRY ADMITS TO HAVING PARANOID TENDENCIES

'I admit, I'm a nasty piece of work sometimes. And conspiracy theories (some) do appeal to me. It's how I make some sense out of an insane world. AM I INSANE? MAYBE…'

'Shame on You' List - The worst alleged cyberstalkers

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 16:59:16 (EDT)
From: Lady Davina
Email: sirdavid12@hotmail.com
To: gerry
Subject: Re: Oh Poofta!
Message:
It's no way to treat a lady. I'm all woman, you know. I always felt like I was a woman in a man's body and now, at last, I'm out!

Now I can wear that new pink chiffon dress I bought at Harrods last Easter.

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 17:37:58 (EDT)
From: Pat:C)
Email: None
To: Lady Davina
Subject: Jim should never had worn drag
Message:
when he went to darshan in Amaroo. That's why he's on the list.
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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 17:45:41 (EDT)
From: gerry
Email: None
To: Pat:C)
Subject: the door is always open
Message:
would you guys chill on the drag talk, this is serious stuff here. sorry about the lecture, but we CAN redeem ourselves if you guys would quit horsing around and pay attention:

Our sole motivation is to force these people to cease and desist their antisocial behavior.

If the stalkers listed in the 'Shame on You' section agree to cease their wrongdoings, and demonstrate their commitment to cease victimizing others, we will remove them from our list after they have demonstrated their good faith.

I like my bio in CACa a lot, but you all have to read Mike Dettmers. Of course him being a PAM and all (ex-pam, mike sorry) it's a bit longer than mine so you'll have to read it there.

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 17:47:57 (EDT)
From: gerry
Email: None
To: gerry
Subject: Let's guess who's next
Message:
I bet it will be Nigel. Or maybe JW. Joe, patience there's room for you on the front page still.

Any other guesses? Time for a woman?

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 18:01:17 (EDT)
From: gerry
Email: None
To: gerry
Subject: I gotta question:
Message:
At its most basic, cyberstalking is an electronic version of the real-world crime: unwanted, obsessive pursuit of an individual by another individual. At its worst, it becomes real-world stalking, with potentially dangerous and even deadly consequences.

OK I agree with this. Now who have I stalked?

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 18:31:24 (EDT)
From: Selene
Email: None
To: gerry
Subject: they are the stalkers
Message:
creeps. Sitting around saving our posts to files. Making little profiles like good little robots, like some kind of recreational activity in Mahaaraji's rehab clinic for the mentally challenged.

Can you imagine doing that? Saving a premies posts over 2 or 3 years to get the supposed scoop on where they are at?
Excuse me please I must go barf now.

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 18:36:32 (EDT)
From: gerry
Email: None
To: Selene
Subject: Here's the thing, Selene
Message:
Most of that crap they quoted me as saying would have occurred on Anything Goes they are quoting an old fight involving mary mcgraw remember? It had nothing to with rwarat.

Some of the stuff, like the bit about the knife was just fabrication.

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Date: Tues, Aug 21, 2001 at 05:28:08 (EDT)
From: Silvia
Email: None
To: gerry
Subject: kissing his FEET is even worse
Message:
Can you imaging when the premies are depossed and have to explain why they kiss lard's feet? That is going to be FUNNYYYYYY!!!!
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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 18:42:22 (EDT)
From: Selene
Email: None
To: gerry
Subject: and your point is?
Message:
A post on AG can be copied and or saved, no?
And of **course** I know a lot of the bs on there is fabrication - geez I'm not one of them!!
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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 15:59:21 (EDT)
From: Sir Dave
Email: None
To: All
Subject: No rules against outing premies here
Message:
Premies have demonstrated that they are in a nasty, little insidious cult. Some of them have stalked me and found info about me that could only have been found by private detectives.

Therefore, it's open season here. You can give personal details of any premies you feel like and that includes names, addresses and telephone numbers and online maps to where they fester.

The people who are in Maharaji's cult are not 'premies'. Premies are what we used to be back in the seventies. You know, peace and love, forgiveness, sharing, community, spreading happiness and feeling glad to help each other.

No, we have a different kettle of fish here now with these PWKs. They're nasty little anonymous trolls who live behind rocks and pewk bile at people. They aren't the free spirited people we used to be, and still are.

So you're welcome to uncover them from their hiding places and show them up in the clear light of day. As FA, I won't stop you.

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 17:49:11 (EDT)
From: silvia
Email: None
To: Sir Dave
Subject: Power to you
Message:
Is time that we revolt to rawat's dirty practices.

I like that: Premies is what we used to be, not what people who follow maharaji have become. Premies cannot even love themselves and I do not have much compassion for them anymore. A new ex? Of course. I can feel compassion for them. Premies who are fanatical to the point of excussing maharaji for EVERYTHING, including robbing his premies, hiding child molesters,etc., no. I have no compassion for them. They have a choice now that information is available to continue being a follower of such a crocked person or not, and by staying they are part of the dirty game. So. They are scum themeselves, IMHO.

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 18:05:28 (EDT)
From: gerry
Email: None
To: silvia
Subject: Re: Power to you
Message:
Oh silvia, you're just lobbying to be the first female 'stalker' on the list. :)
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Date: Tues, Aug 21, 2001 at 04:48:42 (EDT)
From: Silvia
Email: None
To: gerry
Subject: Re: Power to you
Message:
But I am offended: My name was not included on the 'list of liars'! :))

Hey, he asked me to sorrender to him, the DOG!

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Date: Tues, Aug 21, 2001 at 04:56:47 (EDT)
From: DeProGram Anand Ji
Email: sharkdc@aol.com
To: Silvia
Subject: Re: Power to you
Message:
Where is this list everyone is talking about?
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Date: Tues, Aug 21, 2001 at 05:11:28 (EDT)
From: Silvia
Email: None
To: DeProGram Anand Ji
Subject: here
Message:
Read Roger Dreak's post: Cyberstalker and Libel - you are all loosers!

It has the link to the list.

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 16:04:20 (EDT)
From: Selene
Email: None
To: Sir Dave
Subject: Re: No rules against outing premies here
Message:
Does the same rule apply with HotBoards on this forum?
You once mentioned that HotBoards (and therefore *I assume*) their ISP had said that the liability of a post rested on the individual who posted it, and you as FA and HotBoards were not responsible.
Did I get that right?
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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 16:13:33 (EDT)
From: Sir Dave
Email: None
To: Selene
Subject: Yes that's right
Message:
Especially when you've got a little disclaimer on the forum.
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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 16:04:03 (EDT)
From: Pat:C)
Email: None
To: Sir Dave
Subject: PEWKs are not premies
Message:
Well said. Okay! It's about time. These cyber-character-assassins are not premies/lovers of truth. They are full of hate and deceit.
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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 17:40:18 (EDT)
From: Sir Dave
Email: None
To: Pat:C)
Subject: To think we were once in that cult
Message:
What a creep Maharaji is. The lord of love! To think we innocently gave our lives to him. This shit toe-rag, wanker, coward, can't even face his critics. Now this kind of thing really shows up what a nasty little creep he is.

I have no doubt that this has been his big plan all along. His ''final solution''. At least his father used to face his critics. Nobody can say we don't face ours, either. Do you realise, we, the people on that site are there because we have not been afraid to voice our dissent with some honour and courage. Not hiding away but standing by our words. How many premies are doing that?

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 17:50:16 (EDT)
From: Pat:C)
Email: None
To: Sir Dave
Subject: We're on the list because we don't hide anything
Message:
Everyone on the list is totally open about themselves. I'm still upset that Joe was not included as a GAY San Franciscan card-carrying liberal. To me the way to fight lies and hypocrisy has always been to hide nothing. What drove me out of the cult was the secrets, lies and revisionism. I really have nothing to hide. I've been called names for as long as I can rememeber - poofter, communist etc. Boris has done good work against his master by showing just how low they will stoop and how creepy and sick the cult is.
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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 15:27:46 (EDT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: All
Subject: Why I'm better than you (from ELK)
Message:
Joao Silva:

A recent time when I felt especially glad to be alive

From Coimbra, Portugal

Recently I 'forwarded' Elan's introductory newsletter to a friend of mine. She enjoyed reading it. And then we talked about happiness.

I said that I couldn't complain. She said the same. And then I thought to myself: 'Well, we're both happy to be alive. ...and this a great but, there is a small, yet big difference. I felt so happy to be alive because someone has given me something priceless - out of his kindness.'

And he still does. So, I had to feel specially glad to be alive...

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 15:43:23 (EDT)
From: Pat:C)
Email: None
To: Jim
Subject: I felt so special as a premie
Message:
I just said that to Chuck and Andy yesterday. I really miss feeling so special, so superior to people without K.

This is exactly what Boris etal are doing. They are protecting their own delusions about M and K in order to cling to their specialness.

God, it's so boring being an ordinary human being who does not have the living god as an executive friend. It's so demeaning to just be one of 6 billion other ordinary human beings. ;)

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 17:01:44 (EDT)
From: Peg (devils advocate)
Email: None
To: Pat:C)
Subject: Re: I felt so special as a premie
Message:
But don't you now feel special to be an ex-premie? A realized soul who's finally realised M is not special.
I have been aware of the pull to be special and how being a premie fitted into that. however I don't think being a premie caused me to want that and I must admit I could easily feel superior about my new position.
By the way I do think those Russans have sunk a bit low.
Pegg
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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 19:32:33 (EDT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: Peg (devils advocate)
Subject: Of course not, Peg
Message:
Peg,

What's special about admitting you got sucked into a cult? Nothing.

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 17:45:06 (EDT)
From: Pat:C)
Email: None
To: Peg (devils advocate)
Subject: No, Peg, I just feel normal and ordinary
Message:
like a member of the human race. I hated feeling seperate from folks and having this secret called K which I was not supposed to talk about. Yuk! Secrets, lies and spin control is what M and K have come to.
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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 15:01:44 (EDT)
From: Joe
Email: None
To: All
Subject: I don't get it
Message:
Nothing in the Maharaji cult world, and its response to the ex-premies surprises me anymore. It just all seems so surreal and whacked.

First, Elan Vital says it's filing a lawsuit in India against Jagdeo for child sexual molestation while he was one of Maharaji's most trusted and exhaulted ministers in Elan Vital, and then spends a second press release impuning the motives of the women who claim to have been molested by Jagdeo when they were little girls. It just sounds nuts. Since they aren't doing anything of substance, why would they want to bring more publicity to allegations that are very damaging to Maharaji and the cult. Who is advising this organization on PR? They ought to be fired.

Then,we have this new website, attacking expremies who are critical of Maharaji, but in trying to denigrate somebody like Dettmers, they repeat the negative comments about Maharaji, including his dope-smoking, given them more publicity.

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 15:04:24 (EDT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: Joe
Subject: No they don't
Message:
Then,we have this new website, attacking expremies who are critical of Maharaji, but in trying to denigrate somebody like Dettmers, they repeat the negative comments about Maharaji, including his dope-smoking, given them more publicity.

No, they've just got Dettmers talking about some 'xxxxxx'. Who's this Maharaji guy?

Seems like the site was designed for its search engine impact.

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 15:15:23 (EDT)
From: Pat:C)
Email: None
To: Jim
Subject: Quite a few quotes on CAC
Message:
are actually very sane anti-cult writings (like Dettmers' stuff) and all my hundreds of premie friends will see it when I mail the url to them. I couldn't get them to read EPo but CAC did the job for me.
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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 18:11:12 (EDT)
From: CD
Email: None
To: Pat:C)
Subject: Re: CAC
Message:
Most of the site is junk.
But, is that a real picture of Jim?

CD

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 18:43:51 (EDT)
From: Joe
Email: None
To: CD
Subject: Picture of Jim -- Yes
Message:
Yes, that's Jim all right. And I can testify that that's the way Jim dresses all the time, even when he plays in his band and goes to the beach. He is a VERY conservative dresser. It's just part of his image, I think, and comes from the way he was raised. He really got into those polyester suits we wore in the cult, and Jim would only wear black polyester, and a white shirt with ruffles, just like in the picture.
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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 21:55:00 (EDT)
From: CD
Email: None
To: Joe
Subject: Re: Picture of Jim -- Yes
Message:
OK Joe, so you are teasing me.
Now is that really Jim?
His hair is pretty fancy.
I'm jealous cause mine is mostly gone.
The guy does have THE gaze. Serious stuff!

CD

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 18:17:00 (EDT)
From: Pat:C)
Email: None
To: CD
Subject: Re: CAC - thanks, CD
Message:
You're a gentleman as I always said. Don't know about Jim's pic but I wish they had used a nice one of me in drag instead of that holier than thou one where I look like a church lady.
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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 18:15:17 (EDT)
From: gerry
Email: None
To: CD
Subject: Re: CAC
Message:
Most of the site is junk.
But, is that a real picture of Jim?

CD


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Chris, you still mad at me? Here's a cybersmooch and peace sign for your having said what you did.

And yes that's Jim, but he looks better in a hat with a guitar in his hands.

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 15:27:19 (EDT)
From: Richard
Email: None
To: Pat:C)
Subject: Any publicity is bad publicity
Message:
And bad publicity is doubly bad. Thanks to whoever is responsible for this new site. It does more than we could have to draw attention to M's personality cult.

M has been terrified of publicity (or factual information for that matter) since the early day fiascos on Merv Griffin and the media pan of Millenium. Sites like it-aint-so.org, GlassNose and the Ex Defamation League site created by 'Boris', all encorage premies to question M and his motives. Once the thinking begins, it's all downhill from there.

Several PWK's have let me know that the archives of EPO have flipped them off their decades long fencesitting marathon. It is increasingly obvious that the die-hard devotees are getting desparate to defend their fragile religion. And most importantly, M is letting them take the fall for him by putting up defamatory websites for which they are liable.
[ Best of Forum ]

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 15:30:26 (EDT)
From: Joe
Email: None
To: Richard
Subject: Exactly
Message:
In the very least, every time a PWK, or Elan Vital, tries to respond to ex-premies, which now seems just to attack them as people, it just raises the publicity that there are lots of ex-premies who have lots of negative things to say about Maharaji. It just adds publicity that there IS a problem with Maharaji. It doesn't make PR sense to do that, but I guess premies, and Maharaji are really scared about this.

Just goes to show you how much power knowledge (information) actually has.

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 15:39:11 (EDT)
From: Pat:C)
Email: None
To: Joe
Subject: Re: Exactly -it's perfect
Message:
EV is painting itself right into the Scientologists' trap and will increasingly be seen for what it really is - a cult and a money-making scam.

Every time one of the hundreds of premies who know me read the lies and inaccuracies, they will know that the cult is playing a malicious and deceitful game.

Now I'm glad I kept all my posts and don't have to hunt through the archives.

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 15:01:26 (EDT)
From: Is this
Email: None
To: All
Subject: the place where Glasser works?
Message:

[ Posh place in NY ]
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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 14:34:20 (EDT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: All
Subject: Commentary on my profile as a 'Cyberstalker'
Message:
We maintain a database of more than 5,000 pages posted by Jim Heller over the last five years. While Jim Heller can be considered a dangerous cyberstalker, sadly, he has not been convicted of any crime. Jim Heller lives in Victoria, BC, Canada. He is a lawyer and he defends drug dealers, arsonists and sex offenders. Jim Heller has worked for the Windsor Law Group in Victoria, BC, 200-931 Fort Street, Victoria B.C. V8V 3K3 Tel.: 250.385.6004.

If you need assistance to protect yourself from this individual you may:
File a 'Cyber 911 report' with Cyberangels

Contact your police department to file a complaint

Contact the FBI (in case of death threats)

Tell us what you know about this individual

Recently Heller was involved in a court case where he pleaded that Roderick Patten, who had confessed to raping and killing 11-year old Jessica States in Port Alberni, Canada, should not be found guilty of first degree murder, but rather only of the relatively minor offense of manslaughter. Heller argued that, at the time of the crime, Patten was under the influence of alcohol. This episode speaks eloquently of the 'nobility' of Heller's work. In the name of all victims of rape, shame on you, Heller, for helping rapists and murderers escape what they truly deserve.

There's a famous defamation case all Canadians know wherein the current leader of the federal opposition party, Stockwell Day, was sued for libel by a political opponent who was also a criminal lawyer and who Day had criticized in a letter to a local paper's editor for implicity condoning the actions of his pedophiliac client. One thing I know about libel law is that if the defamation goes to a person's character with respect to their livelihood in particular, malice is assumed. Day settled the suit for a very large amount of money. Now, who is it that's hosting this web site?

He currently works for McCullough Parsons 1011 Fort St # 403 Victoria, BC (250) 480-1529, http://www.mcculloughparsons.com, a law firm serving the lower-end of the market.

See comment above. I take it that the firm's name will now show up in various earch engines as typified as such? Wait until my colleagues at the office see this!

He is a member of the Law Society of British Columbia and of the State Bar of California.

We do not know if these entities are aware of his activities, but if they were, it might help to stop him from hurting additional innocent people.

Jim Heller, who has acknowledged embezzling funds from a not-for-profit association, (See his posts below.) tends to invade Internet forums. He wields his clout as a lawyer, using foul and abusive language towards people who have not even communicated with him, and imposes a reign of terror on other persons posting. It appears that Mr.Jim Heller is consumed by rage, and that he instills fear and threatens anyone who does not follow his commands. His postings read like expressions of hate, and incites hate in others.
God, and I thought I was just being funny! No wonder no one came to my birthday party. Oh well, more cake for me and Laurie.

Jim Heller is alleged to have been instrumental, together with Barry Berenstein from Fraser University in Vancouver, in providing in North America a beachhead for the ultra-secretive French Commission for the Battle Against Cults. The Commission reports to the French Prime Minister and has access to his $53M secret fund. Jim Heller is also alleged, together with Berenstein, to have brought to North America Jean-Yves Defay, a special emissary from this Commission, as part of a trip aimed at securing underground support in North America for the French Commission.

The commission is headed by Alain Vivien, a well-known French counterespionage operative. The commission has been consulting for Mainland China, on how to best repress Buddhism in Tibet and Falun Gong on the mainland. Other activities of the commission involve harassing movements it considers to be incompatible with French Socialist ideologies. The commission was a leading force behind the newly voted About-Picard Law, which restricts freedom of thought and conscience and religion in France. This law has been vigorously denounced by the U.S. State Department, the U.S. Congress and the Helsinki Federation for Human Rights as being incompatible with the 1948 Universal Declaration of Human Rights. Just like his alleged accomplice, J.M. Kahn, who is on the payroll for the French Secret Police, Jim Heller is regarded as having fooled the French into believing that he is an honorable lawyer and hence a worthy correspondent; the commission is not aware of his alleged delinquency and cyberactivities.

All the above is a complete, utter fantasy. Every last word. It's like 'Zelig' only I'm not directing it.

Jim Heller has fabricated and posted on the net, at least two defaming letters that he claims were written to him -but were not-by lawyers from parties that he defames on the net. We have copies of these letters fabricated by Jim Heller on April 12 and 13, 1997.

I wish I knew what they were talking about. Too bad these anonymous cowards can't coem to the table a little more openly. Mind you, I think one of these so-called false letters is included below. Let's see.

Jim Heller likes to reveal private information offered by other people, and once he named a post, 'Don't Trust Me with Your Secrets'. He shows a high disregard for the laws of copyright. He regularly copies entries from the other sites, which he re-posts in their entirety for the purposes of ridicule.

Fair comment? (No, not what these guys are saying, silly, but the doctrine of, as in just what they're doing here. Reposting words of others for commentary purposes. Really, the stupidity of these cult members is astounding. First sign -- gross hypocrisy.

Jim Heller has conducted an unrelenting hate campaign against one Janice Wilson, a person from New York who does not know him and has never communicated with him. Ms. Wilson contributes poems and messages to an inspirational web site and he has taken an obsessive and aggressive dislike towards her. His messages to her have been not merely personal, but vituperative and threatening.

I posted once that she frustrated me so much I felt like 'squeezing her face'. I immediately reframed that comment as hyperbole, which it was, just so that, should the moment ever arise, as it has here, there'd be no grounds for ever saying otherwise. Reasonable people can understand that.

Among other acts denoting pathological hatred, Jim Heller has posted a private letter ridiculing a gravely ill woman, on the net. (This woman, while she was recovering from a life-threatening brain aneurysm, still took the time and trouble to try to console a trusted friend.)

Here he's talking about my publishing the letter from Marolyn Rawat (a/k/a Durga Ji, Goddess of Love), wife of my former cult leader and accomplice in perpetuating a long history of deceit (or was Marolyn somehow not 'x-rated'?). No apologies.

He has also made several insulting communications to a female lawyer, from an association that he was angry with, sent faxes to her, and made threatening phone calls. This female lawyer responded to this harassment with dignity and decency, which only inflamed him more.

This is a complete lie in that I never threatended Linda Gross with anything other than the eventual shame she'd feel when her cult leader finally, hopefully, is somehow forced to account for his life as a charlatan. Linda and I got along quite well during the short time we talked and corresponded with each other. She read a couple of books I suggested, enjoyed talking 'shop' with me a bit and even suggested we could meet when she came up to B.C. a while ago. Furthermore, she agreed to try to arrange some communication between me and Maharaji. When she decided it was no longer prudent or easy for her to communicate with me, given the nature of my questions -- always my questions -- she asked me to not contact her any longer. And that's what I did. Full stop.

Additionally, Jim Heller is responsible for publishing the private phone number of a public figure, and, by publishing this number, to have instigated telephone harassment of this person.

Maharaji's 'private phone number',

(310) 457 5561

, is the only way I can reach my former Lord. He IS a public figure, thnak you for acknowledging that, and I again think there's nothing wrong with knowing how to reach him. Do you?


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Date: Tues, Aug 21, 2001 at 05:33:05 (EDT)
From: silvia
Email: None
To: Jim
Subject: JANET WILSON: HILARIOUS!
Message:
Jim Heller has conducted an unrelenting hate campaign against one Janice Wilson, a person from New York who does not know him and has never communicated with him. Ms. Wilson contributes poems and messages to an inspirational web site and he has taken an obsessive and aggressive dislike towards her. His messages to her have been not merely personal, but vituperative and threatening.

I'm peeing my pants! hahahahahahaha

Janet wilson and her poems. hahahahahhahahah

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 14:50:15 (EDT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: Jim
Subject: Commentary on my posts they put up
Message:
EXCERPTS FROM Jim Heller'S POSTINGS

What follows is a compilation of postings from Mr. Jim Heller. The postings have been edited for the sake of brevity. The names of Mr. Jim Heller's victims have been deleted to protect their privacy, and replaced by ellipses (……)

Jim Heller ACKNOWLEDGES HAVING EMBEZZLED $18,000
WHEN HE WAS TREASURER OF A NOT-FOR PROFIT ORGANIZATION.
'I was losing steam. The trip was getting really boring and I stopped hiding the fact that I felt that way. I was also the …..….treasurer and, together with my assistant, Deb, who I was starting to 'hang out' with, I embezzeled $18,000 before Jack caught me. When he did, he called XXXX, one of ……xxxxxx's bloodless bigshot lackeys (and old friend of J.W.'s) and he directed Jack to literally hold me hostage in the ……… basement until Deborah came over with the money.

They couldn't find Deb for two days, the longest two days of my life. Quite frankly, Veep, I thought they were going to kill me. An hour later they came down with my breakfast. Yes, they roughed me up a bit. Anyway, they found Deb at the bus station, got the money and let us both go. So, there you have it. Assholes, huh?

Stole from ……….. and lived to tell about it.'

This was an obvious joke. All the same, even then, one or two posters wondered if I was serious and I immediately explained I wasn't.

Jim Heller ASKS PEOPLE TO COMMIT ILLEGAL ACTS.
Fri, May 08, 1998 at 14:33:06 (est)
From: Still crazy To: Jim
Subject: …xxxxxx letter (part 2)
Why don't you hide a microphone in ……'s bedroom, tape him and M…. having sex, make it into a RealAudio, and post it to the site?

Humour? As in 'OBVIOUS humour'?

Jim Heller FABRICATES TWO LETTERS, AND PRETENDS THEY WERE WRITTEN TO HIM BY THE LAWYER OF A PERSON WHOM HE WAS DEFAMING (ONLY ONE LETTER POSTED HERE; NAME OF VICTIM DELETED).
From: Linda G…… (xxxlawyer) Forum: ,…….
Mr. Hitler (sorry Jim Heller) doesn't need apologists like you defending his actions. He spends all his time criticising ……… in a most unpleasant manner. I know …..…, and he is naturally very upset by the tone and content of Mr Jim Heller's words. ……… has a mission. Anyone who is not for him must be against him. In time, we shall inherit the earth. Then Mr Jim Heller should hide from the wrath of ………….

Yet there will be no hiding place for people like you, Jim Heller. …….. is the greatest …….. ever to walk this earth. You should be very careful whom you cross. All actions have consequences, Mr Hitler.

>I haven't been avoiding you - just been too busy. This is only (BTW, as
>I'm sure you know) my second post on Harlan's page, and that because Mili
>emailed me to let me know about the changes. And of course, I couldn't
>take a look and then just fade away, me with my big big mouth.
>
You don't have a big mouth, OP. You have a very nice mouth. Now, I, blasphemous and steeped in negativity, I have a big mouth. Or would you like to argue about that, too? Sheesh!

This one leaves me scratching my head. It's apparently a post to OP, a premie who used to post on the forum. I'm not sure what it is really. Can anyone else make sense of it?

Jim Heller ADMITS USING INTERSTATE PHONE LINES FOR HARASSING PEOPLE.
Subject: Hey, I just called him!
Posted: Tues, Sep 28, 1999 at 20:13:52 (EDT)
Posted by: Jim Recipient: All
Email Address: Not Provided
Browser Type: Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 4.01; Windows 95; Snap.home.1)

I just called that number I have for XXXX, 310-45xxxxxx. Now, before any of you lurking PAMs out there get any fancy ideas about invasion of privacy, think a bit. And what? I can't call him once every twenty-five years or so? Give me a break, eh? Give me a break. So I called him.

A woman's voice answers:
You have reached the R…xxxxxx residence. For Mr. R… press two, for Mrs. R…xxxxxx press one, for Barney the plant [joke!]xxxxxx. I pressed two.

Ring, ring, ring, ring (What am I going to say if he answers? Oh well, I guess I'll just play it by earxxxxxx.)

Anyway, he doesn't answer. Instead I get that woman's voice again. (I could swear she's the same BBC voice that narrated …… -- 'xxxxxx.but the true light never diesxxxxxx.'). Would I like to leave a message for Mr. R……? You betcha!

I talked for about a minute. Typical Jim shit. 'Hi, it's Jim Heller…… you might know me from the …… web site. I'm pretty frustrated, ……. I've sent you registered mail, emailed you lots, tried to get messages through some of your closer minions. But you never replied. Not once.

And to think of all the time I gave you, the trust you extracted, the money you drew from my humble existence.

So now things are changing a bit, aren't they? Isn't it clear, …...… that you can't hide ……xxxxxx forever? Like take this …xxxxxx thing. I know you're aware of it. It appears that you were advised at least twice in the seventies that ………xxxxxx Yet you never took him out of commission. Do you really think it sits well with anyone that you don't even comment on this? Come on, ……

Anyway, here's my number. I think you have a strong, strong obligation to get back to us somehow. There are a lot of serious, unanswered questions hanging in the air………

Something like that.

That's me admitting harrassing someone? It kind of looks like just the opposite, doesn't it? Don't I raise the harrassment issue myself only to argue against it? Anyway, like I argued at the time, this is hardly harrassment. HARDLY!

EXAMPLES OF A DAILY DOSE OF HATEFUL POSTINGS BY Jim Heller.
''Hate' is such a funny word these days. Some policy wonks decided that after centuries of meaning simply a strong dislike or aversion to something or someone, 'hate' should now be reserved for crimes of racial bias or other such prejudice. Well fuck that. 'Hate' works perfectly fine the old way and that's how I'm using it. Your comment on me shows, once again, that you're a very naive thinker. Just because the devil hates and I hate doesn't make me the devil. Hey, I used to have a moustache too. So what?

I feel a very 'strong dislike', a visceral aversion for the people who post here. Why? Because I despise their words. I despise their thought patterns. I despise what they've turned into, what …. turned them into: backbone-less and forked. Kind of like snakes, I guess. They're liars and they know it. Why do I hate them? Because they engender disgust and revulsion in me. I don't force it, it's a natural reaction to their lies and bullshit.

I hate people like that. I hate what they do and how they do it. Most of all, I hate what they represent. Face it, Bozo, no one but you and your other ……..members would 'see' anything of the sort. The rest of the world just views …xxxxxx as a bunch of pissed-off former suckers. (Tell me, Braindead, if you understand what I'm saying. I warn you! It's like the O.J. criminal trial, but with no resolution.…….Again, Booboo, no one ever admits …xxxxxx

What would it take for you to be honest for a change? Certainly not the something as simple as the death of another. You're blinded by your …. involvement, asshole. You anonymous, creepy little crawler. Now shut up and pass the ammunition. Sickening xxxxxx. Grief??? You're a total, absolute, motherfucking idiot…….……And beside that, dummy, you never did address my point. You're the same coward you've always been. Ready to stick your tongue up the Hamster's love canal just so you can walk around making way too much noise smacking your lips. Here's the scenario fuckface -- you, the big-ass ……

Listen whoever-the-fuck-you-are, changing your identity and refusing to admit it has to be the absolute worst thing you can do on this forum. It's the height of rudeness and -- may I add -- a sign of shame and cowardice. Of course you're probably too stupid to understand what I'm saying. But others will.

In case you haven't notice it, this medium is far too tolerant of stupidity. You know, it just doesn't allow for fast, consistent dumb argument correction such as your thought process requires. Who's got the time to try to show you how absolutely idiotic you are when your own thickheadedness is the problem to begin with? You're one hopeless motherfucker. You seem to be one of those people absolutely unable to look an inch or two below the surface. Big fucking deal.

Our venomous campaign against ………xxxxxx might not consitute a death blow to his …xxxxxx but you have to admit it's sure causing him some problems. Where this all leads, no one can say. But two things are clear: this site is very damaging for him and he knows it. It's true, I'm not to be trusted. You are really a number fella. First, forget about me and all my vices for a minute. Can you? Huh? Just a minute. We can talk about them again (yawn!) whenever. But I just want to point out that you.

I have lied to everyone here and have admitted it…God, are you confused! Of course, that's no crime. I'm confused about pretty well everything in life, too. I think before we go any further, you should forget about me for a sec and deal with the fact that you simply tried to pull the wool over everyones' eyes here. That bears examination, don't you think? Aren't you Vacol, the fearless? You know, an 'unexamined life' and all that? You are so full of it I can barely contain myself. What kind of idiocy is this? Before you launched your deceitful and ludicrous broadside, I never even bothered to read your posts let alone answer them. To me, Keith, you were, are and always will be a bit of a waste of time. I just don't like you. So your 'fatal attraction' garbage is in your head, bud. Get real. What the fuck???? What in the world are you talking about? You just started a little baby tantrum here because you weren't getting enough attention or something. Well you ARE a liar, aren't you? Come on, deal with it. You lied to everyone about your role as a representative of 'many'. Your refusal to deal with it speaks volumes.

Just fuck off, will ya'? That's the answer, bird brainxxxxxx Look, you little bug, you're just lying with this kind of nonsense. When did I threaten to sue you? When did I threaten to get you kicked off the forum?
What you want, asshole, isn't just a place where you can spout your banal pronouncements and whatever else churns in that tepid brain of yours. You want to be able to do that unchallenged here. It's you who has a problem with 'free speech', I guess.

You know, one wonders how people form strong opinions. I never really had that big a deal with new agers having been one myself to varying degrees over the years. Now, though, I'm beginning to really believe that there's an amazingly deleterious effect brought on by long-term New Age thinking. You know, kind of like Pete Townsend's hearing loss or Dean Martin's liver.

One thing that's got to be destructive is maintaining a belief system that 'frees' one from ever having to take responsibility for anything? I expect that will be his last. Why not have some fun and get the bum's rush, eh?

Well, yes, I get angry. Oh yes I do. Mind you, it'd be easier to comment on this post in context. Without even the full text I'm left wondering about much of it. Point being, with no other stick to combat trolls and the like, we've got our mouths. This is how I use mine at times. Give me the context before you judge me excessively uncouth. Give me the full text as well. Otherwise, fuck off.

Jim Heller OBSESSIVELY HARASSES SOME UNKNOWN JANICE WILSON, WHOSE POEMS HE FOUND ON AN INSPIRATIONAL WEB SITE.
Some poor joker named Janice Wilson posted this on ……xxxxxx Pretty revealing, huh? This fake dichotomy, all these 'parts', the good and the bad, got to be a bit tiresome after a while.
…….Of course it's hard work, Janice. It's hard to fuck with your mind, sweetheart. And it's hard to process all that ongoing confusion which, you know as well as anyone, is really SUCH A DRAG, by painting that fake …xxxxxx smile on your face …xxxxxx Here's some of today's detritus on ……

(post by Janice Wilson Baldwinsville NY, USA )
Magnum opus
The hardest, most rewarding work of all
To keep choosing this heart
To keep learning and growing and savouring this gift of life
Short on the one hand, but each moment exquisitely long,
when filled with the celebration of love and gratitude that pours from my heart
What a masterpiece it becomes with your loving help
Thank you that I can continue to embrace, accept, understand, receive
these gifts

I've noticed a lot of xxxxx members murmuring this same zombie chant, 'I must choose the heart xxxxxx I must choose the heart xxxxxx I choose the heart, Master xxxxxx, I choose the heart in Gratitude, Master xxxxxx I love Popeye, xxxxxx. I love Popeye xxxxxx (apologies to Alice the Goon).
I go back to Janice and really, there's just that extra unctiousness. We're talking about elicting a strong, immediate gag reflex. It's got to be simple and it's got to be completely contrary to human nature.

What are they really thinking? That they can starve the mind out or something? That they can put on these funny Kabir masks in front of the tv screen and recite wan, excruciatingly weird self-critical 'poetry' that sounds more like forced 'self-examination' Maoist confessions from the Cultural Revolution than anything else I've come across the same ugly know-nothings we entertain here …xxxxxx ...xxxxxx too much. Absolutely incredible. I think what it's really indicative of is the disgust people can feel in the face of outrageous, sugary-sweet, candied personalities.

Janice is only one of the ELK contributors I've ridiculed but, because she's so prolific and laughable, I've parodied and made fun of her lots. So what? This is hardly stalking. These guys need to get a dictionary. And a better lawyer. Janice has posted unquestioning faith im y former cult leader on a feedback-free forum. Her posts are indeed subject to fair comment.

Jim Heller ACKNOWLEDGES THAT WILSON COULD HAVE A RESTRAINING ORDER ISSUED AGAINST HIM.
Say Ms. Wilson thought like you and went to her local constabulary who then contacted my local constabulary to get a 'peace bond' or restraining order against me. She'd be welcome to one via the courts so long as she could establish that she had a reasonable fear of physical injury. Fine.

So Ms. Wilson would have, as evidence, a post by me saying that I'd like to 'squeeze her face -- hard' in relation to a completely brainless expression…xxxxxx. I say that any judge in the world would look at the context (i.e. the fact that I don't know her, have never hurt or threatened her 'before', have indicated no plan or effort to meet her, let alone hurt her, most importantly, was using an expression more reminiscent of the 3 Stooges than anything else, have spent the better part of four years arguing vehemently that you cult members need to give yourselves a serious shake [no threat there, Mel, relax], etc.) Said judge would, in my humble opinion, toss her application out of court faster than you could say …

Again, didn't I say EXACTLY THE OPPOSITE? Sure I did.

BUT THEN HE GOES ON HARASSING HER.
I really do want to crash this woman's party, wipe that goddamned Alice the Goon smile off her face. This is a disgrace to humanity. So why should I care? Shit, maybe I shouldn't. So goddamn this fucking Internet that's brought these Movementarians into my life again. Asshole.

Then there's this particularly revealing -- and thus all the more disgusting -- post from Ms. Janice Wilson from Baldwinsville, New York. I think I once said that I'd like to squeeze her face. Well, …..… What I'd like to do is deprogram her. Wouldn't you?

She talks about a 'joy that has no bondage, a happiness that is truly free' but sounds like she's trying to maintain exactly the opposite: a transient emotion trapped under glass, a freeze-framed smile. I can't imagine a more quixotic pursuit. How pathetic, really, the idea that one can simply grab at happiness which is somehow waiting to be plucked like fruit on the vine. These xxxxxxxxx's have been strip-mined of their common sense. The ultimate irony is that, for all the talk of 'breath' and the like, they're not breathing. They're frozen.

In context, the 'face squeezing' impulse was clearly explained as being far less than a real threat. FAR less. (Unlike, for example Cat's post about smashing me with a baseball bat or Mili's promise, some years ago, to beat up David Stirling if he ever saw him outside a program somewhere).

FOR SOME UNKNOWN REASON, Jim Heller GETS ENRAGED BY WHAT HE CALLS 'NEW AGE THINKING.'
I think New Age thinking, with its forced irresponsibility and gilded faux innocence, is sick. People who indulge in it are slumming. I'm sure we'll see more examples over time. I think New Age thinking is best characterised by its undermining of reason and accountability. It's not the substantive beliefs so much as the perverse philosophy that obscures simple notions like 'truth' and 'honesty'. You know, in many ways, it's just the sabotage of language and rationality.

Logic is logic. If you don't like it, say so. But don't give me this crap about 'Buddhist logic'. We'll argue and argue and in the end, if you're honest, you'll end up admitting that whatever you're talking about, it's not logic. Be honest. Isn't that one of your goals? Honesty? just tell me this, Mr. Jerry-Springer-Food-Fight-blah-blah-blah-ad-nauseum-already: Are you ever going to get off my back? You sure do stir up the ancillary bullshit a lot. Run, I can't really tell you why you're an asshole. That's something you might want to take up with your mother. But I will tell you that you're coming off as a completely insufferable, pious jerk. I'm not to be trusted. In particular, Mary shouldn't trust me any longer. Why? Because of shit like this: So what the fuck's going on, Mary? You've been jerking us all around and you know it. And Joey, what the fuck is with you, man? How can you trust …… in the circumstances? Do you need to hear more? Mary, you're either as confused as Joey or -- get this -- evil. Shame on you.

……It's quite obvious that while you can run miles and miles connecting the dots you think you see and drawing whatever strange animals inhabit your mental menagerie, you aren't able to deal with the simplest facts that are right in front of you. Too bad. ….Deal with it. Or not. It's kind of clear that you're not able to. Whatever. …xxxxxx I think you're sick as well, by the way. Sick and not to be trusted.

…….If you don't stop this immediately I'm going to do something about it. Here's what I'm thinking just so there's no surprise. I'm going to contact your server and have you cut off. Believe me, Joey, it won't be hard. Sure, you'll be able to post from the odd Internet cafe or whatever but I'll find you on each and every occasion and make sure that that place cuts you off too. Beyond that, I'll report you to the Montreal police and, Joey, I know what I'm talking about. No more warnings. I'm not kidding. ……This post of yours, more than any other, proves how crazy you are. As IF I know what you're talking about! God!

But listen, fruitcake, this one's easy to solve. Ask Joey himself how in the world I could ever know anything at all about his mother. Did he ever tell me? Of course not. I know absolutely zip about his family background and you, I'm afraid, are a paranoid freak.

Admitted!

AFTER A WHILE, Jim Heller GETS BACK TO HIS USUAL SOCIOPATHIC HATE MAIL.
Mel, You're just being typical dumb ol' Mel, huh? Lost in a world of your own. Tell me, Mel?…… Idiot! …xxxxxx and you're a bigger idiot than ever.

You're like a cartoon character, Mel. A complete buffoon. Okay, so what we're fighting about is the notion of 'reasonableness' in this particular circumstance. I say it'd be unreasonable for someone to think I was actually threatening Ms. Wilson, that any reasonable person would have absolutely no doubt that my post was figurative and that you're a flaming idiot.

So that's what I have to say about that. We've argued about reasonableness before, Mel, and you've been found sorely lacking. Fact is, bucko, you've got no credibility here. No one respects you. You're an ..….. icon of cult thinking and that's about it. Is there any way to get their servers to block them? They're ruining my weekend. There ought to be a law or something. These women just keep posting this shit which absolutely offends my sensibilities. Don't I have rights too? How can I enjoy the quiet peacitude of my own synchronism when so-called 'people' are allowed to post so-called 'expressions' like this?

Whatever ...

HE FINALLY PUBLISHES A CONFIDENTIAL LETTER FROM A PERSON RECOVERING FROM BRAIN SURGERY.
……xxxxxx, I have to be frank, one of the main reasons I wanted to post this letter was just to piss him off. I love the idea of ……… knowing that, in the end, he can't trust anybody… Well, sorry, fellas. Call me petty, yes I know, but I derive some real pleasure knowing that, in this small way if no other, our little site has some impact on …xxxxxx He thought he could stonewall the whole world… Well, maybe he can, but shit leaks out. True, in this case it's not that significant but it's something nonetheless. I like it... As for respect for other human beings, Jack, I don't respect …xxxxxx What in the world are you talking about? And I don't respect his wife either… Who gives a shit if …… asked for her letter to be private? Again, 'privacy' takes on an entirely different meaning in this whole ……… business… I'm glad ……xxxxxx will think twice before even writing another letter to someone. Can't you see that?

Fri, May 08, 1998 at 15:58:02 (EST)
From: Jim To: Still Crazy
Subject: Good idea, Still!
I think that's a fantastic idea! ………xxxxxx. I'd love to evict the whole family. Until then, it's at least a small consolation to upset her tea party a bit. ………, her pathetic, almost autistic disregard for the world around her. If you can't read through the lines, you're naive beyond words. Basically, this letter is just her telling her friend to shut the fuck up and quit bothering her………. SHE……….. didn't die and is long out of the woods on this one. So what possible difference does it make now that she was once convalescing? And all that whiny moaning and groaning? ………If it's embarrassing to read it's all her fault. ……… and every last ……. ever taken in by these retarded mental exhaust fumes has the right to see them for what they really are -- the confused, whimperings of a … wife -- and not only if and when she sees fit. In short, they have no right to any privacy… So fine, now we know that she's a brainless twit with absolutely no ability to maintain the slightest friendship bond that even slightly contravenes the boundaries of her own mind-trap and who calls anyone who walks an 'asshole' such is her ability to stand back and see the world. Big fucking deal. Unpleasant? Yes. Just? Absolutely. Face it, she's as big a hypocrite as he is…
that sweet, self-effacing cry-baby, was a total asshole to her friend and that's why she wanted to post the letter. I just like to help people, you know?

No apologies! Got any other letters from Marolyn where she explains that all she can do is think about Maharaji, nothing else matters and people who don't practise are 'assholes'? Let me have them. I'll be happy to post them, oh yes I wll.


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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 15:45:04 (EDT)
From: Victoria Clemens
Email: None
To: Jim
Subject: Re: Commentary on my posts they put up
Message:
... It is really funny observing your reaction to that site, Jim...

Funny to see you 'defending' yourself... (How does it feel to be on the receiving end?)

Funny to see you 'avoiding the allegations' (Did you or did you not defend that scumbag rapist? Shame on you.)

Funny to see you trying to keep your composture... as it nothing happened... (wait until your colleagues find out of your stupid crusade, and how you spend their time$$)

Funny to see you eating your own dog food... (Karma ... I guess...)

Victoria
[ Shame on You! ]

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 19:41:24 (EDT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: Victoria Clemens
Subject: What kind of idiot are YOU now?
Message:
You guys are just so fucking crazy. Really, one of the big attractions, if you can call it that, of posting is waiting to see what the cult members will say next. Should I answer you or would that be me 'defending' myself?

Aw, what the hell, because you're such an idiot, I'll answer you. No other reason, mind you:

I didn't mention defending Mr. Patten because of course I did. That's what I do for a living, I'm a defence lawyer. Damned proud of the job I did for Patten by the way but you'd never understand that. Whatever.

As for my 'composture', you must mean 'composure'. Assuming you do, what? If I lose it, which I do with you fools, you fault me, now you fault me when I don't? That really is hilarious. And no, I don't answer to my colleagues for how I spend my time or money. Maybe you've got the kind of job where you do. I don't.

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 14:43:42 (EDT)
From: Pat:C)
Email: None
To: Jim
Subject: I will not be rebutting CAC
Message:
I prefer the lies and inaccuracies to stand as such. There are plenty but I will keep them guessing about which error is the one that is libellous.
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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 14:53:59 (EDT)
From: gerry
Email: None
To: Pat:C)
Subject: I am pleased as punch...
Message:
but a bit puzzled as to why I am included in such illustrious company when I am, as this person implies, intellectually bankrupt.

But it's nice to know I've gotten under their skin.

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 21:30:06 (EDT)
From: Roger eDrek
Email: None
To: gerry
Subject: uh, Ger, they paid me money and I sold you out
Message:
Gerry,

I took the cash they offered and gave you up, man. Can ya forgive me? I needed a drink and I was down to my last 50 cents.

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 21:36:09 (EDT)
From: gerry
Email: None
To: Roger eDrek
Subject: that explains it drek, buddy
Message:
Gerry,

I took the cash they offered and gave you up, man. Can ya forgive me? I needed a drink and I was down to my last 50 cents.


---

I just got to wonderin' why you ain't on the list yourself, Mr. eDrek. Now it all fits: the plant, the conspiracy, the foamies, joey, mary m, it all fits.

You're really Keith, aren't you Rob??? !!!

gerry the intuitive wizzard

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 22:35:38 (EDT)
From: Roger B-I-N-G-O eDrek
Email: None
To: gerry
Subject: Re: that explains it drek, buddy
Message:
That's it Gerry!

I am all of the above. I am the omega. I am the alpha. I am the one. And my name is Neo.

In His Service (IHS) I've been all along. The Lord will be pleased with me this time, fer sure. No doubt a private darshan ceremony at the Rez. Sockless, I bet. Toe jam foreplay fantasy action. There's nothing higher, nothing more a premie of the Living Lord could ask for.

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 15:17:37 (EDT)
From: Dermot
Email: None
To: gerry
Subject: I'm going back to Maharaji
Message:
Sorry I meant to say I'm going back to *******

I didn't realise you guys were so hateful , criminal and perverted.

.....so next time I post here I'll be anonyMOUSE....talk a load of cult SHIT and do and say ANYTHING as long as it protects *********'s good name.

:)

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 15:11:21 (EDT)
From: Pat:C)
Email: None
To: gerry
Subject: If you can't have fame, infamy will do
Message:
Me too. Like you, I was getting bored with being an ex but have been re-inspired. Maybe you got on the list because you're an anti-establishment libertarian conspiracy theorist like me.
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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 15:25:28 (EDT)
From: gerry
Email: None
To: Pat:C)
Subject: That must be it, Pat
Message:
Me too. Like you, I was getting bored with being an ex but have been re-inspired. Maybe you got on the list because you're an anti-establishment libertarian conspiracy theorist like me.


---

Well, I guess I've been less than flattering in my expressed opinion of our former lord of the universe.

But if they knew the true extent of it...hoowah!!! Perhaps they do. Yes, that's it. They're on to me.

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 14:00:16 (EDT)
From: Chuck S.
Email: bctanda@hotmail.com
To: All
Subject: The Moscow website as publicity....
Message:
I wonder if 'Combat' magazine in France would be interested in doing a follow up article, about harassment and public slander of ex-cult members in an effort to silence them? Slander using an anonymous Moscow website? Sounds like a good european news topic to me. For all we know, Elan Vital is sponsoring this.

Chuck,
...who knows that You too can be a Sat Guru.

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 14:06:55 (EDT)
From: Pat:C)
Email: None
To: Chuck S.
Subject: CAC should correct errors first
Message:
But first we need to ask the designer of CAC to correct the errors. For instance he did not mention that I was jailed as a communist in South Africa for opposing apartheid and that horrible porn site is so tasteless. I mean my porn is classy AND funny. He also forgot to mention that I had my ears pierced and got tattooed in the sixties before it was fashionable for nice men to do so.

But seriously, I hope J-M shows this to Combat. I'm sending the url to all my premie friends.

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 14:16:40 (EDT)
From: Joe
Email: None
To: Pat:C)
Subject: Pilsner Inn?
Message:
Pat, do you really manage the Pilsner Inn? I didn't know that. It's a great place in a good location. I love the name; reminds me of Bavarian Beer Gardens.

It's pretty clear that whoever set up that website is an amazing prude. He or she finds you shocking, Pat. And he or she is pretty homophobic too, which isn't surprising, given what we have heard about Maharaji. But the Pilsner is in a guide to gay bars in San Francisco. I am shocked! And they drink beer there and everything.

Apparently he or she doesn't get out much, perhaps because he or she sits in a dark room, staring at computer screens for endless hours, and worrying about what a bunch of ex-cult members might say about his master, whom he or she barely mentions and, like all the other current Maharaji cult-members, can't seem to say anything in defense of the former Lord of the Universe.

So lacking in confidence about either Maharaji, or the supposed gift he gives, he or she has to resort to attacking the critics. Funny, too, that Maharaji seems incapable of defending himself.

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 14:22:27 (EDT)
From: Pat:C)
Email: None
To: Joe
Subject: Re: Pilsner Inn? I also finance the IRA
Message:
SC/Marolyn Kintire/David Whitla said on LG: ''I had no idea that PatC was such a sick fuck.''

This coming from someone as cynical and worldly-wise as he (he's a writer not good but uses his imagination) makes me think he may also know all about CAC.

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 15:24:57 (EDT)
From: Joe
Email: None
To: Pat:C)
Subject: So, do you manage the Pilsner Inn?
Message:
Where did that come from?
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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 15:49:56 (EDT)
From: Pat:C)
Email: None
To: Joe
Subject: I emailed you and Jim [nt]
Message:
[nt]
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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 14:06:48 (EDT)
From: Joe
Email: None
To: Chuck S.
Subject: Hysterical......well done guys NT
Message:
nt
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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 11:29:30 (EDT)
From: Sir Dave
Email: None
To: All
Subject: I don't believe him - do you??
Message:
Charles Glasser emailed me this:

>From: Charles Glasser
To: sirdavid12@hotmail.com
Subject: Correct yourself
Date: Mon, 20 Aug 2001 07:52:29 -0700 (PDT)

I have been told that you and your associates have
openly accused me of creating some website based in Russia.

Be advised that this is simply not true. Without
comment on the material contained therein, until I saw it posted on the Life's Great board this morning, I had no knowledge regarding that site or any of its content, and have had no hand in its creation.

With this information, be advised and on notice that any attempt to encourage a 'campaign' to distribute personal information about me in order to affect, remove, edit or verify the contents of that website is without a rational basis, is malicious, and will be met with legal remedies in law and or equity.

Thank you.



Here's was my reply:

Go to hell.



His master is a blatant liar. I'd expect the same from anyone supporting him. The site has all the hallmarks of Glasser, in my view. Why do you think the author of the site put it in Russia? So that he could deny all knowledge of it, of course.
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Date: Tues, Aug 21, 2001 at 00:50:31 (EDT)
From: salam
Email: None
To: Sir Dave
Subject: he's a bloody lawyer
Message:
what do expect.

Ooops, sorry Jim.

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 13:49:05 (EDT)
From: Joe
Email: None
To: Sir Dave
Subject: Is the site based in Russia?
Message:
And how do you or Charles Glasser know that?

I know it looked like Charles' work, but it might not be him. I would suggest that anybody who is mentioned on the website write to the ISP and complain. The ISP will then likely remove the site, since it is clearly a defamatory site with no purpose than to malign people for doing nothing other than expressing opinions that the author of the site doesn't like.

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 13:15:45 (EDT)
From: Selene
Email: None
To: Sir Dave
Subject: what's the url?
Message:
Does CG threaten lawsuit everytime he hears or reads something he doesn't like directed his way??
The grace that he must have in his life! I mean,
just think the rest of us have to rely on ourselves.
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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 13:28:55 (EDT)
From: Sir Dave
Email: None
To: Selene
Subject: Here it is
Message:
Full of lies and made up postings. Whoever has made the site (almost certainly Glasser) they are stalking me because certain details there I have never divulged to anyone on the net.
[ A REAL hate site ]
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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 18:03:49 (EDT)
From: Zelda
Email: None
To: Sir Dave
Subject: Worst Stalkers get 'Shame on you??!! Tee hee [nt]
Message:
[nt]
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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 14:09:57 (EDT)
From: Richard
Email: None
To: Sir Dave
Subject: Website design by Boris Kontchalovski
Message:
Jeez, this ragtag forum has evoked an international McCarthy-esque anti-ex defamation league that reaches all the way to Russia. Web designer Boris appears to be multilingual like CG and has some funny jokes on his site too - plus a borscht recipe! Can this get any more pathetic. The last desparate clawing of rats just before the ship goes down?

I say publicizing stopcyberstalkers.org on LG will show any sane person what these Pro-M zealots are about.
[ Boris Kontchalovski ]

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 14:27:33 (EDT)
From: Sir Dave
Email: None
To: Richard
Subject: Boris Kontchalovski's address & phone number
Message:
Boris Kontchalovski,
12 Trubnaya Uliza
Moscow, 103045
Russia

phone: 795 9151594

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 13:56:46 (EDT)
From: PeterC
Email: None
To: Sir Dave
Subject: Re: Here it is
Message:
... the bitter taste of one own's medicine.... :(
[ Page Link ]
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Date: Tues, Aug 21, 2001 at 03:37:49 (EDT)
From: Steve
Email: None
To: PeterC
Subject: VC - Peter C
Message:
You'll be destroyed by your own toxicity
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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 13:41:23 (EDT)
From: Selene
Email: None
To: Sir Dave
Subject: sickening
Message:
This is truly an attempt at ('alleged') b) intimidation.
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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 12:22:59 (EDT)
From: Bjørn E
Email: None
To: Sir Dave
Subject: I believe him. But you have
Message:
a credibility problem. And if someone makes a chineese website, it will be really hard to know who did it.
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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 12:43:55 (EDT)
From: Jerry
Email: None
To: Bjørn E
Subject: Re: I believe him. But you have
Message:
And if someone makes a chineese website, it will be really hard to know who did it.

Especially if it's written in Chinese.

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 12:34:08 (EDT)
From: Sir Dave
Email: None
To: Bjørn E
Subject: Here they come
Message:
Christ Bjorn, if you believe him, he must be lying. My dear chap, I am a nobody. An ex-convict, pervert and mentally deranged person, if you believe all you read about me.

Mind you, you are a clever chap. You write, ''And if someone makes a chineese website, it will be really hard to know who did it.''

Who'd o' thought that?

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 13:51:26 (EDT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: Sir Dave
Subject: First LOL of the day!
Message:
Thanks Dave.
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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 13:59:34 (EDT)
From: Selene
Email: None
To: Jim
Subject: well the writing IS funny
Message:
In a creepy sort of way. I feel like I'm reading the National Enquirer. Sneaking from family, retreating to spend hours cyberstalking, blah blah. I can see how it would seem funny. but it's still creepy.
hmmmmm... I hope the China site will be able to match the skill with which this was created!
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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 11:39:08 (EDT)
From: Sir Dave
Email: None
To: Sir Dave
Subject: and furthermore
Message:
I have a strange feeling that if that site remains on the web, someone else (not me) will put another site on the web, perhaps in China, revealing lots of personal details of some premies. Like their full names, home addresses and telephone numbers.

Yes, I can see that happening, for sure, if this anti-ex site is left to fester on the web. I'm a prophet, you know.

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 11:36:06 (EDT)
From: salam
Email: None
To: Sir Dave
Subject: No
Message:
So charlie is a cry baby ha?

Now charlie, everyone has your e-mail address, where you work and know that you are bond to perpetuate hate. You also steal copyright material from writers without permission. So what is wrong with a bit of extra detail about you ha? Oh I see, are we worried about the reputation then duh?

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 04:24:56 (EDT)
From: Moll of Mole
Email: None
To: All
Subject: Alias Smith and CW
Message:
Hey CW me and 'B' are betting kinda folk and we are prepared to have a 100
bucks on at even money that you are MS's partner, we'll also take 200 at
5-1 that CW is in fact both you and Marna.
What do you recon Michael?

Moll of Mole

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 04:18:35 (EDT)
From: BeenThereDoneThat
Email: None
To: All
Subject: Told my kids
Message:
My daughter walked in whilst I was watching a M video, trying to make sense out of the contradictions for the fourth time, and asked me to turn up the volume so she could watch. I turned it off and explained what I have learned about the premie children who were so horribly harmed, Maharaji and EV's lack of care, and all the rest. She was visibly shocked. She then quietly said that ever since she was a little girl, it has bothered her that M lives so lavishly when it wasn't really his money. That he spoils his kids then talks about it seems wrong,as well, to do that to them with other people's money. She said she couldn't connect this to all that he's supposed to be doing, even though she's wanted knowledge for a long time. She just thought it was something wrong inside of her to feel this way. Out of the mouths of babes......

I then informed my son. He couldn't believe M would not address the Jagdeo situation, etc. He's wanted knowledge as well. I told him that I couldn't take someone to knowledge knowing all this now,with the excuse of 'oh never mind all that, don't get concerned about it but be devoted
inspite of it.' At least they know both sides.

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 15:06:38 (EDT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: BeenThereDoneThat
Subject: Boy, that must have felt right
Message:
Good work, BTDT. Must feel great, huh?
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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 04:47:39 (EDT)
From: Pat:C)
Email: None
To: BeenThereDoneThat
Subject: Re: Told my kids - well done, Been
Message:
If your kids are anything like mine then they will not easily be fooled as we were. Today's kids are smart and, if their parents really love them, they are also compassionate and thoughtful. Of course Rawat's insouciance will bother them.
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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 11:13:27 (EDT)
From: Mercedes
Email: None
To: Pat:C)
Subject: Re: Told my kids - well done, Been
Message:
Hi Been There,
That took courage, I am glad you were able to be honest with them. M's lifestyle is something that nobody is ready to really address and that bothers many people who then internalize it and think there is something wrong with them.
Congratulations!
Mercedes
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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 13:29:44 (EDT)
From: Joe
Email: None
To: Mercedes
Subject: Right on, Mercedes
Message:
It's this code of silence in the Maharaji cult about all the contradictions, like the obscene wealth he has, that can insidiously result in repression and guilt in people. That's what is so powerful about this website and this forum. The fact that people really are SAYING and not being SILENT about the contradictions is so powerful. Just knowing that you aren't alone and others see the same problems you do, is very empowering.

This open discussion is so powerful and that's why Maharaji, Elan Vital, Charles Glasser, Pia when she was alive, and other die-hard cult members are so freaked out about ex-premies saying these things. They don't really care that we think about Maharaji, nor even if we discussed it quietly among ourselves, it's that we say it where others can see and hear it that's so freaky to them.

I found Richard II's, comment about how the danger of the forum and website was that it would cause premies who weren't very committed to break away from Maharaji, and his fear that that was the ex-premies' aim, a telling slip on his part.

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 02:03:07 (EDT)
From: Freedom of Speech
Email: None
To: All
Subject: have you seen this?
Message:
Have you seen this?
www.stopcyberstalkers.org
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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 13:13:46 (EDT)
From: Joe
Email: None
To: Freedom of Speech
Subject: What am I, chopped liver?
Message:
How come I never make any of this lists? First Pia excluded me on her website, despite naming Heller, JM, Dettmers and Donner, and now, it appears that this new site, apparently by the infamous Charles Glasser Jr, an attorney at Willkie Farr & Gallagher in New York, has put up his own personal hate-site, and I'm not on it.

It's also quite funny that whoever prepared that website, probably Mr. Glasser, is anonymous. What an amazing crock of hypocrisy.

I also thought this was hilarious:

They have posted thousands of defamatory messages about us, have called our employers, taken anonymous ads against us in the press, sent us email viruses, fabricated documents bearing our names, doctored our photographs, and threatened us of violence and even death. All this because we chose to follow these teachings.

Messages about 'us?' Give me a break. The messages have been about MAHARAJI, and not 'us,' whoever that is. Mr. Glasser flatters himself that anybody cares if he is a follower of the former Lord of the Universe or not.

Anonymous Ads in the Press?

THIS coming from somebody, who has an ANONYMOUS website attacking people who post on the internet. The hypocrisy and moral bankruptcy is just amazing.

The only 'Ad' that I'm aware of, was by the Maharaji Responsbility Campaign, a group unaffliated with the operators of Ex-Premie.org. The Ad, in the Boston Phoenix in June, 2000, directed people to a letter on the internet, which is still viewable at www.openlettertomaharaji.org. Anybody who viewed either the AD or the letter, will see that they are directed to no one but Maharaji himself. Mr. Glasser again flatters himself that anybody would make the effort to take out ads addressing HIM. Again, because nobody cares what he thinks, despite his popensity to plaster it wherever he wants to.

Who ever threatened 'us' with violence and death? Did I miss something? Who 'fabricated documents' or photos of 'us?' The only doctored photo I have seen was of Maharaji, who is a public figure, and both his appearance and what he says are legitimate objects of criticsm, humor and satire, which Charles Glasser Jr, Esq. should know, because he has written and campaigned in favor of open communication on the internet in his own career.

This is all so funny, but I am, again, feeling very left out.

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 22:06:18 (EDT)
From: Roger eDrek
Email: None
To: Joe
Subject: Re: I still luv ya, Joe! I'll make fun of you...
Message:
if it makes you feel better.
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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 13:47:50 (EDT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: Joe
Subject: Because you never say anything!
Message:
Joe,

Why SHOULD you be on any lists? Here, try this:

You motherfucking drone clone!

I just made that up, Joe. See? It's not hard when you get into it. Here, you try it ...

You .......................

Well?

Honestly, Joe -- and here I'm serious -- one of the first things I thought when I read this last night is 'I hope Joe isn't hurt'. And now you are. Boy, that really makes me mad!

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 13:50:14 (EDT)
From: Pat:C)
Email: None
To: Jim
Subject: They just added Dettmers and Salam
Message:
Dettmers is an ''apostate'' and Salam favors the Hamas terrorists. Now Joe if only you had worn drag to SF Latvian Night you might have made it onto the list.
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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 19:26:07 (EDT)
From: salam
Email: None
To: Pat:C)
Subject: Re: They just added Dettmers and Salam
Message:
this is becoming rediculos. what fucking American friend they are talking about? Anti-semetic, did not know that. On drugs?

How is giving this advice.

take this you sybershitheads

fuck you

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 13:19:44 (EDT)
From: Joe
Email: None
To: Joe
Subject: So funny, so absurd
Message:
I thought it was funny that the website is an attack on 'alleged' cyberstalkers. Charles Glasser doesn't really know if they are cyberstalkers or not, because they are just 'alleged' cybertalkers. Neverthless, they are such a menace to 'us' these 'alleged' cyberstalkers must be eradicated. It's so ludicrous it's almost unbelievable that anyone with brains would write something so incredibly stupid.
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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 07:36:14 (EDT)
From: Carl
Email: None
To: Freedom of Speech
Subject: This CACA "net jihad" getting nasty now.?
Message:
"Somebody" is devoting a lot of time (& money?) into the CACA site. By Argya? I imagine his lawyers have vetted it for legality.

It seems that the personal addresses and phone numbers are given for the Exes only, not the two other non-exes. The non-ex stalkers (who seem genuinely criminal) appear to be 'ringers', put there to lend the CACA site an air of 'balance' and to further damn the exes with guilt-by-association.

The site calls for some sort of contrition by the alleged cyberstalkers, at which point their names will be removed from the list. '. . . demonstrate their commitment to cease victimizing others . . . demonstrate good faith.'

What are the conditions, one wonders? What constitutes 'demonstration' if there was no 'stalking' to begin with? How did freedom of speech become confused with 'stalking'?

Such boneheads.

Carl

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 09:59:20 (EDT)
From: Sir Dave
Email: sirdavid12@hotmail.com
To: Carl
Subject: This is Maharaji's way
Message:
Actually, he's got quite a bit of my personal info wrong. He and others have put a lot of work in to just get some bullshit on some ex-premies and some of that wrong. Perhaps a private detective has been used too.

The trouble is, some people once posted info about Charles Glasser on the internet also. He didn't like it then and he won't like it when it happens again because next time there will be more people wanting to give him a piece of their mind. And some.

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 08:30:41 (EDT)
From: silvia
Email: None
To: Carl
Subject: Is time to act Nt
Message:
lets get a lawyer. Let plan further.
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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 13:11:36 (EDT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: silvia
Subject: Silvia, what exactly are you talking about?
Message:
I'm sorry if I seem a bit irritated but I am. What exactly do you think we can do? You keep saying this -- let's act, let's do something -- but what? The fact is we're doing a lot. We're spending our time and energy publicising the truth about the cult. What else exactly do you think we can do? Sue them? For what?
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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 13:00:20 (EDT)
From: Deborah
Email: None
To: silvia
Subject: Re: Is time to act Nt
Message:
check email
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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 08:59:43 (EDT)
From: Sir Dave
Email: sirdavid12@hotmail.com
To: silvia
Subject: It shows itself for what it is
Message:
It just shows, Silvia, what a sick bastard Maharaji is, to countenance this kind of low-life scum. Glasser has proved himself to be scum and the premies who approve of this site are scum too.

I met better people in prison. I've met far, far better people in the adult business too.

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 11:27:47 (EDT)
From: salam
Email: None
To: Sir Dave
Subject: Re: It shows itself for what it is
Message:
hey check his counter on his front page. click on any link on his page then go back to the first page and the counter goes up by two. Refresh the page and it goes by 1. What a sucker.

As for a scum bag, I can't agree anymore. If you check his html source you will find that the site is targeted at nothing else but the people in the list as their names appear in the meta tags. The content of site is total crap and is placed there to give it a feel of being officious. I like to know who is/are they that are so concerned about being stalked, but I guess we'll never find out.

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 13:56:30 (EDT)
From: janet
Email: None
To: salam
Subject: chauvinist pig-i see no women on the list
Message:
he lives in a man's world, blind to feminist rage all around/about him. ho hum. you can't expect ants to notice people. the scale differential is too vast for them to perceive.
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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 19:29:17 (EDT)
From: salam
Email: None
To: janet
Subject: Re: chauvinist pig-i see no women on the list
Message:
oh hello janet, we thought you were banned or something.

Hey u be carfull know, am anti semetic, carry stinck bombs and take drugs.

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 05:32:35 (EDT)
From: Pat:C)
Email: None
To: Freedom of Speech
Subject: For those mentioned
Message:
Please save the entire site off line (your browser has the ''Make available off-line'' option) before Glasser removes it as he will when he realizes that he has made a mistake - actually many mistakes. I've saved my bio. Please save yours.
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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 06:51:46 (EDT)
From: Salam
Email: None
To: Pat:C)
Subject: Re: For those mentioned
Message:
I've already download all the pages. Makes good foder. Anyway, how do we know that this is another charless Glas-Snot site?
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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 13:22:52 (EDT)
From: Joe
Email: None
To: Salam
Subject: Re: For those mentioned
Message:
The bottom line is that it's propabaly Charles Glasser's site, but since it's anonymous (note the incredible hypocrisy), nobody knows for sure. Charles is, however, in the position of denying publicly that he did it, if he wants to, and we are allowed to speculate all we like. But of course, according to Charles, that makes us some kind of criminals. Expressing opinions that he doesn't like, seem to be big exceptions for Charles Glasser in his pofessed belief in free speech.
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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 03:43:30 (EDT)
From: Sir Dave
Email: None
To: Freedom of Speech
Subject: This is Charles Glasser's work
Message:
Only trouble is, he's got my address wrong. That's not my address. The person who lives at that address will definitely take some action.

Also, I never wrote the following:

"I had what the doctors called a 'mild case of paranoid schizophrenia' … From there it was en easy step into the … drug culture. It was enough to scramble my brain to the point where If you need assistance to protect yourself from this individual you may:

reality and unreality became blurred, and panic began to set in. My mental problem was getting worse. I believed everyone else could hear my thoughts. It was making my life miserable and work impossible. My psychiatrist really couldn't offer anything more than mind-numbing pills."

Another blatant Glasser lie. He's made that up or someone else wrote it.

Other than that, I've got a better and more recent photo he can have. Since he thinks I'm a transexual, I'd better get one taken in a dress.

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 04:02:07 (EDT)
From: Sir Dave
Email: None
To: Sir Dave
Subject: But he's got a friend to help him
Message:
The domain is registered with

Boris Kontchalovski, Boris Kontchalovski
12 Trubnaya Uliza
Moscow, 103045 RU

Email: Kontchalovski@johndoes.org

phone: (Russia?) 795 9151594

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 05:42:46 (EDT)
From: JHB
Email: None
To: Sir Dave
Subject: The site is in Russia
Message:
The ISP is:-

descr: ZENON N.S.P.
descr: 1-ja Jamskogo polia 19, 706
descr: Moscow, Russia
origin: AS6903
notify: noc@zenon.net
mnt-by: AS6903-MNT
changed: scream@zenon.net 19980511
source: RIPE

role: ZENON N.S.P. Network Operations
address: ZENON/Internet Network Operations
address: ZENON N.S.P.
address: 1-ja Jamskogo polia 19
address: Moscow, Russia
address: 125124
phone: +7 095 251 1071
phone: +7 095 232 3736
fax-no: +7 095 251 5702
e-mail: noc@zenon.net
trouble:
---

---

---

---

---

---

---

---

---

---

---

---

---

---

---

---

---

---

---
--
trouble: ZENON N.S.P. NOC is available 24 x 7
trouble:
---

---

---

---

---

---

---

---

---

---

---

---

---

---

---

---

---

---

---
--
trouble: Points of contact for ZENON N.S.P. Network Operations
trouble:
---

---

---

---

---

---

---

---

---

---

---

---

---

---

---

---

---

---

---
--
trouble: Routing and peering issues: noc@zenon.net
trouble: SPAM issues: abuse@zenon.net
trouble: Network security issues: security@zenon.net
trouble: Mail and News issues: postmaster@zenon.net
trouble: Customer support: support@zenon.net
trouble: General information: info@zenon.net

May make legal action difficult, but I'm sure not impossible. Zenon probably have no idea what they're hosting so may back off if they realise this will damage their reputation.

John the wonders why he's not mentioned.

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 12:44:34 (EDT)
From: Pedro
Email: None
To: JHB
Subject: MILI is the Man nt
Message:
nt
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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 15:01:54 (EDT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: Pedro
Subject: Clearly, Catweasel's involved
Message:
No doubt about it. He's been chomping at the bit, recently, on LG telling me about the big surprise I had coming. This must be it.
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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 15:46:00 (EDT)
From: Steve
Email: None
To: Jim
Subject: Re: Clearly, Catweasel's involved
Message:
I reckon we've a few candidates Jim. Wango Tango/Mr Nice Guy/who claims to work at the same place as Glasser ( Yeah sure ). Mili who could have Russian connections being in a former Soviet satellite country and of course Catweasel who may be heading the suspect list at No1. He has indeed made threats to you which would indicate an action of this sort. Yeah , come to think of it Cat's my choice. He's a bit clever on the PC and can disguise his location with apparent ease.

Of course none of these guys can be straight about who they are so we'll probably speculate for ever.

How many premies have ever given a real name and location on any forum...has it reached 5 yet ?

Steve

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 06:46:24 (EDT)
From: salam
Email: None
To: JHB
Subject: Re: The site is in Russia
Message:
The site is being hosted by this fellow. Why? I don't know, but most likely because the law in russia regarding online defamation and copyrights law is not clear, however those people that are involved should make a conserted effort to contact the hosting agent to bring it to their attention.
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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 05:53:09 (EDT)
From: Sir Dave
Email: None
To: JHB
Subject: Thanks and I'm off
Message:
Thanks for that info. Do you remember when someone posted Charles Glasser's telephone number and work address on here? It caused a bit of a fuss didn't it.

Anyway, I'm off out now.

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 05:49:09 (EDT)
From: Pat:C)
Email: None
To: JHB
Subject: You aren't mentioned
Message:
because you aren't a pornographer, drag queen, transexual, defender of child molesters or a communist veterinarian.
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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 12:47:46 (EDT)
From: gerry
Email: None
To: Pat:C)
Subject: Why me Lord?
Message:
because you aren't a pornographer, drag queen, transexual, defender of child molesters or a communist veterinarian.


---

Hi Pat,

I'm not one of those horrible above mentioned things so why oh why am I on the list?

I didn't do nuthin' (sniff, sniff)

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 05:53:07 (EDT)
From: JHB
Email: None
To: Pat:C)
Subject: Re: You aren't mentioned
Message:
Damn, I knew I was doing something wrong! Oh, well, guess I'll just have to go back to getting the archives of the rantings of all these pornographers, drag queens, transexuals, defenders of child moleters or a communist veterinarians back up on some website I try to look after.

I've just had an idea - all you guys have reputations that can be damaged - I haven't! No point in attacking me:-)

John.

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 05:58:49 (EDT)
From: Pat:C)
Email: None
To: JHB
Subject: Re: You got it!
Message:
Where is Bazza when we need him? He used to track down this stuff in no time. I miss playing Watson to his Holmes.
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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 06:30:00 (EDT)
From: JHB
Email: None
To: Pat:C)
Subject: Re: You got it!
Message:
Hey Pat,

We've got the domain owner who works in Moscow and has an american girlfriend called Cat (really!), his address, and the site's ISP, Zenon. While I was FAing, no one to my knowledge ever posted from a Russian ISP, so it's not possible to link the site to anyone that way.

John.

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 03:15:46 (EDT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: Freedom of Speech
Subject: Interesting for sure
Message:
It's late. I was just going to bed but thought I'd take a look at the forum. Then I found this. I'm going to sleep on it and comment further tomorrow. I'm surprised that the list of 'cyberstalkers' (which includes me, of all people! PatC and Gerry I can understand, but ME?) has at least one person who seems uninterested in Maharaji. I note, as well, that there are some bald-face lies about me as well as some clear-cut defamation. The rest is just silly cult spin that makes the author look absurd. But I need to think about this a bit further. As, I'm sure, we all will, especially, of course, my fellow list members.
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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 04:46:49 (EDT)
From: salam
Email: None
To: Jim
Subject: Re: Interesting for sure
Message:
hey this is too fucking funny, I can't belive this guy putting all this effort to put this shit on the internet. What a joker. EV is desperate to discredit exes in anyway they can even if they have to scrape the bottom of the barell. This guy is hiding behind his mask of being a lawyer and by the look of it, he is going to end up in trouble eventually displaying people's faces, addresses...etc. This information is private and he has no right to publish it on the net without asking.
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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 04:43:53 (EDT)
From: Pat:C)
Email: None
To: Jim
Subject: Holy Jihad! I wish he hadn't used that pic
Message:
The cherry on top of the cake of a great week! My god! I'm infamous! It's nearly 2am and I'm too pooped from runnning a restaurant, a sleazy gay bar and a webring of porn and colostomy bag sites and having kinky sex with George Bush and all the soldiers in the IRA to comment tonight. Too funny because I was just starting to get bored with the premie jihad.

I've just posted this on Lifes (sic) Great - the premie forum.

Subject:

Not a cult but satellite folies a deux

Message:

Sorry to butt in here but, as long as people are badmouthing exes on LG and lumping me in with a group, I want to put in my tuppenceworth because I am not part of any groupthink, thanks.

See the mistake that most expremies make - especially the oldtime exes who left before the evolution of M - is to call it a cult. It isn't. A cult is something like Jim Jones where everybody goes off to live in the outback and drink Kool-Aid. A cult is a group thing. Maharajism is no longer a group thing as it was in the 70s. In fact community is almost a dirty word in PWK-land. Thanks to the satellite broadcasts and video sales by Visions International, it is now, in the west, a loose collection of folies a deux.

Perhaps the Indian premies are happy to call it a cult as the Hindi word ''panth'' translates as ''cult.'' Maharajism is regarded among the Indians as just another ''panth'' in the Sant Mat tradition of religious sects. Indians are not uncomfortable using the word cult and enjoy being part of a group - witness Kumbh Mehla which takes place every 12 years and took place recently and attracted 12 million religious fans.

I grew up among the largest group of Indian expats in the world in Durban and lived in the Indian ashram there for two years. Knowledge for them is a nice religion and Rev Rawat is their beloved guru. Well - they also go to see every guru, swami and pundit who comes to town to get their darshan too.

But the fact remains that expremies are totally mistaken in thinking that it is a cult in the west. It is not. It really is only another nice New Age religion - probably the nicest. And, in New Age religions, it is quite acceptable to indulge in polyamory (yes, even with employees) and to ''evolve'' and ''grow and develop one's potential'' even if that means rewriting history.

I need to add in light of this new infamy of mine that nice New Age religions also don't seem to hesitate to stoop to anonymous slander like this socalled cyberstalker site. If this is Charles Glasser then he is the Whittaker Chambers and Roy Cohn of Elan Vital and really will regret this as they did their support of McCarthyism.

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 13:16:04 (EDT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: Pat:C)
Subject: My answer reposted from LG
Message:
Who ever said a cult only exists if the lambs spend all their time in the same pen? That might well have been the case historically but now, with all the extra ways technology allows cult leaders to commandeer the minds of their dupes with the latter never having to leave home, the cult relationship can well exist in the current EV mode. A few intense get-togethers every year or so and the rest at-home maintenance. I remember when this girl I knew in L.A. years ago started watching Gene Scott, the blond-haired, freckle-faced, cigar-smoking, asshole televangelist. There was no question about it, her mind was captive. And she never had to get off the couch.

As for the 'cult' new religion' distinction, well, in many ways I think all religions are cults with the only difference I'd draw beween them being whether or not the group has an effective means of stifling questions and criticism. If they do, cult.

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 13:38:23 (EDT)
From: Pat:C)
Email: None
To: Jim
Subject: Thanks Jim - too funny
Message:
I was posting that over on LG thinking I would play it a bit more subtly rather than keep using the word cult to bash premies and then came to F6 and found the CAC stuff.

Yes, it does seem as if satellite TV and the net have made it possible to run a cybercult.

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 05:32:11 (EDT)
From: Sir Dave
Email: None
To: Pat:C)
Subject: What dedication
Message:
Charles Glasser must have spent hours searching through the archives for those posts and what he couldn't find, he just made up. (Mind you, my search engine must have helped him.)

I think you and I should go into business, Pat. What with me, a filthy, depraved pornographer and a transexual to boot and your porn website and contacts in the US, we could make a bomb.

Hang on, better be careful what I say here. Some pea brains might get the wrong idea. Like, "make a bomb" as in make lots of money, duh...

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 05:52:17 (EDT)
From: Pat:C)
Email: None
To: Sir Dave
Subject: Re: What dedication - sweetie dahling
Message:
I'm sooo thrilled. I can't wait to mail the url to all my friends.
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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 11:51:48 (EDT)
From: gerry
Email: None
To: Pat:C)
Subject: What's this 'knife' thingy?
Message:
Where the heck did Glassner get that one? Knives? How crude.

Funny, two of my 'harangues' are aimed at Mary McGraw, alleged ex-premie and Runamuck, aka Seth of Houston.

Hey, (this is a paranoid conspiracy theory, of course) I wonder of Runamuck has anything to do with this website? I wouldn't put it past him.

Glassner says he'll remove names if we 'behave.' Well, I've been very good lately haven't I? HAVEN'T I?

PWEESE MISTER GLASSNER TAKE MY NAME OFF. PWEESE

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH FUCK YOU AND GOOBER

I WAS TAPERING OFF ON MY ANTI GOOBEER ACTIVITIES. MOSTLY BECAUSE HE'S SUCH A BORING FUCK. NOW I'M MOTIVATED TO POUR IT ON INTENSELY. I'VE DECIDED TO DEDICATE THE NEXT YEAR TO PUBLICIZING THE TRUTH ABOUT THIS INSIDIOUS CULT.

GLASSNER BUDDY, THANKS. YOU'VE GIVEN MY LIFE NEW PURPOSE AND YOU AINT SEEN NUTHIN YET. ALL MY ACTIVITIES WILL BE STRICTLY LEGAL AND WITHIN MY CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHTS.

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Date: Mon, Aug 20, 2001 at 12:27:38 (EDT)
From: Sir Dave
Email: None
To: gerry
Subject: How about the Glasser Channel??
Message:
You know, a nice pic or two, the sayings of Charles Glasser etc etc. Of course, I know you wouldn't put personal details like his phone number and work place there. Would you? And you wouldn't put personal details of other premies that we know. Would you? You know, the ones that someone saved for a rainy day.

No, nobody's going to do that. Perish the thought.

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