Ex-Premie Forum 7 Archive
From: Jan 23, 2002 To: Jan 27, 2002 Page: 2 of: 5


Quiet -:- Was the Astrodome realy full in 73? -:- Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 23:18:57 (EST)
__ janet -:- haha-no way -:- Sun, Jan 27, 2002 at 06:24:11 (EST)
__ __ Quiet -:- Re: haha-no way -:- Sun, Jan 27, 2002 at 07:42:09 (EST)
__ Carlos -:- Maybe yes and definately no. -:- Sun, Jan 27, 2002 at 01:15:10 (EST)
__ __ Quiet -:- Re: Maybe yes and definately no. -:- Sun, Jan 27, 2002 at 01:30:41 (EST)
__ Yogi Bear -:- Re: Was the Astrodome realy full in 73? -:- Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 10:16:01 (EST)
__ __ Quiet -:- Re: Was the Astrodome realy full in 73? -:- Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 11:05:38 (EST)
__ Mike Finch -:- Re: Was the Astrodome realy full in 73? -:- Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 09:26:45 (EST)
__ __ Quiet -:- Re: Was the Astrodome realy full in 73? -:- Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 10:08:01 (EST)
__ cq -:- Full??? you gotta be kidding - -:- Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 09:18:40 (EST)
__ __ Quiet -:- Re: Full??? you gotta be kidding - -:- Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 10:34:50 (EST)
__ __ E Bai Gum-Ladd -:- More grist to the mill -:- Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 09:42:44 (EST)
__ __ __ nellie -:- na then -:- Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 19:16:14 (EST)
__ __ __ __ E Bai Gum-Ladd -:- Re: na then -:- Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 19:33:32 (EST)
__ __ __ __ __ nellie -:- Re: na then -:- Sun, Jan 27, 2002 at 09:00:25 (EST)
__ __ __ nellie -:- Hey up lad -:- Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 14:47:52 (EST)
__ __ __ __ E Bai Gum-Ladd -:- Owsa bout that there then -:- Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 19:30:35 (EST)
__ __ __ __ __ nellie -:- Re: Owsa bout that there then -:- Sun, Jan 27, 2002 at 09:03:07 (EST)
__ __ __ __ nellie -:- Re: Hey up lad -:- Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 14:50:17 (EST)
__ __ __ Quiet -:- Re: More grist to the mill -:- Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 10:53:31 (EST)
__ __ __ cq -:- er, a word in your shell-like, guv -:- Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 09:50:55 (EST)
__ __ __ __ Quiet -:- Re: er, a word in your shell-like, guv -:- Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 10:55:29 (EST)
__ __ __ __ cq -:- PS - be a good fellow, now -:- Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 09:58:31 (EST)
__ __ __ __ __ Here it is: -:- Link to search engine ... -:- Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 12:50:04 (EST)
__ __ __ __ __ Quiet -:- Re: PS - be a good fellow, now -:- Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 11:00:36 (EST)
__ __ __ __ __ __ cq -:- You're not E Bai Gum-Ladd then? -:- Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 11:26:11 (EST)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ Quiet -:- Re: You're not E Bai Gum-Ladd then? -:- Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 11:29:33 (EST)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ cq -:- No probs. Don't sweat it (nt) -:- Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 11:40:29 (EST)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Quiet -:- Re: No probs. Don't sweat it (nt) -:- Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 12:01:28 (EST)
__ JHB -:- Full of Aliens and Angels -:- Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 02:07:26 (EST)
__ __ Quiet -:- Re: Full of Aliens and Angels -:- Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 06:50:46 (EST)
__ housemum -:- Re: Was the Astrodome realy full in 73? -:- Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 00:37:28 (EST)
__ __ Quiet -:- Re: Was the Astrodome realy full in 73? -:- Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 06:54:47 (EST)
__ __ As a complete nobody .... -:- i can tell anyone that the Astrodome -:- Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 00:56:42 (EST)
__ __ __ Quiet -:- Re: i can tell anyone that the Astrodome -:- Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 07:00:19 (EST)
__ Dermot -:- Yep....of hot air [nt] -:- Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 23:20:16 (EST)

Quiet! -:- Premnigar -:- Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 16:43:09 (EST)
__ Bai Ji -:- SUCH..quietness...(nt) -:- Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 10:42:56 (EST)
__ __ Quiet -:- Re: SUCH..quietness...(nt) -:- Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 11:08:16 (EST)
__ __ __ Bai Ji -:- Re: SUCH..quietness -:- Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 11:19:21 (EST)
__ __ __ __ Quiet -:- Re: SUCH..quietness -:- Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 11:26:18 (EST)
__ Dermot -:- Big bro/little bro -:- Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 21:04:16 (EST)
__ __ Quiet -:- Re: Big bro/little bro -:- Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 22:13:14 (EST)
__ janet -:- learn to spell -:- Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 18:44:14 (EST)
__ __ Disculta -:- Gotta say it Janet -:- Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 08:40:14 (EST)
__ __ __ Quiet -:- Re: Gotta say it Janet -:- Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 11:11:44 (EST)
__ __ __ __ Disculta -:- Re: Gotta say it Janet -:- Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 11:55:26 (EST)
__ __ Quiet -:- Re: learn to spell -:- Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 22:18:23 (EST)
__ __ __ Zelda -:- Re: learn to spell -:- Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 22:44:58 (EST)
__ __ __ __ Quiet -:- Re: learn to spell -:- Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 23:07:14 (EST)
__ __ __ __ __ my turn -:- I hate spelling -:- Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 06:05:37 (EST)
__ __ __ __ __ __ Quiet -:- Re: I hate spelling -:- Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 06:44:36 (EST)
__ housemum -:- Prem Nagar's website, fyi -:- Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 17:11:01 (EST)
__ __ Vicki -:- Re: Prem Nagar's website, fyi -:- Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 01:20:13 (EST)
__ __ Quiet -:- Re: Prem Nagar's website, fyi -:- Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 22:20:21 (EST)

Great! -:- HE asks for money on the first page -:- Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 16:35:15 (EST)
__ Anandaji -:- Re: HE asks for money on the first page -:- Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 00:52:44 (EST)
__ __ Disculta -:- Re: HE asks for money on the first page -:- Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 08:59:14 (EST)

210 -:- curious -:- Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 15:45:28 (EST)
__ Pullaver -:- Re: curious -:- Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 18:05:38 (EST)
__ __ Pullaver -:- Macalomania -:- Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 21:39:00 (EST)
__ Mike Finch -:- Maharaji and Macs -:- Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 17:43:05 (EST)
__ __ cq -:- Third possibility - he's got shares in Apple? (nt) -:- Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 11:46:43 (EST)
__ __ hamzen -:- God he's such a dickhead -:- Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 07:23:13 (EST)
__ __ Moll of Mole -:- Re: Maharaji and Macs -:- Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 04:31:44 (EST)
__ __ Francesca -:- Thanks for that Mike -:- Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 18:35:42 (EST)
__ __ __ Richard -:- Maccin' off -:- Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 21:29:56 (EST)
__ __ Bai Ji -:- The BIG Mac...(nt) -:- Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 18:20:18 (EST)
__ JHB -:- Re: curious -:- Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 16:35:27 (EST)
__ __ hamzen -:- Well that's it, -:- Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 07:20:01 (EST)
__ __ __ cq -:- the downside of Macs -:- Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 11:51:49 (EST)

Zoloft -:- The shit hits the fan ! -:- Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 13:50:48 (EST)
__ Anandaji -:- Great story, Zoloft! [nt] -:- Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 01:03:28 (EST)
__ housemum -:- out of the mouths of babes -:- Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 14:34:33 (EST)
__ __ Cynthia -:- Well, not exactly mouths... [nt] -:- Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 15:28:26 (EST)
__ PatC -:- Another hilarious story, Zoloft -:- Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 14:24:47 (EST)
__ cq -:- Don't you mean: the fan hit the Shit!(nt) -:- Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 14:07:51 (EST)
__ __ housemum -:- Re: Don't you mean: the fan hit the Shit!(nt) -:- Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 14:21:11 (EST)
__ __ __ cq -:- something's fallen out of *someone's* bottom -:- Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 14:31:14 (EST)
__ __ __ __ housemum -:- yes, me (nt) -:- Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 14:35:37 (EST)
__ __ __ __ __ cq -:- Botom fallen out of your world? ... -:- Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 16:21:03 (EST)
__ __ __ __ __ __ PatC -:- Is that maharajism? -:- Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 19:24:31 (EST)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ cq -:- No it's the Epsom salts (nt) -:- Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 09:22:54 (EST)
__ __ __ __ __ __ Bai Ji -:- Re: Botom fallen out of your world? ... -:- Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 18:30:28 (EST)

connectthedots -:- Advise Please -:- Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 09:29:01 (EST)
__ Anandaji -:- Re: Advise Please -:- Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 15:02:30 (EST)
__ Anandaji -:- Thank you, brother -:- Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 01:50:48 (EST)
__ Dermot -:- Parallel universes:) [nt] -:- Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 18:43:18 (EST)
__ PatC -:- Hi, connect the dots -:- Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 14:11:00 (EST)
__ __ connectthedots -:- Re: Hi, connect the dots -:- Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 14:40:10 (EST)
__ __ __ PatC -:- PS, connect the dots -:- Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 14:46:44 (EST)
__ Deborah -:- Thank you for stopping by -:- Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 14:10:22 (EST)
__ __ connectthedots -:- Re: Thank you for stopping by -:- Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 14:43:11 (EST)
__ housemum -:- Re: Advise Please -:- Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 12:35:54 (EST)
__ __ connectthedots -:- Re: Advise Please -:- Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 14:52:31 (EST)
__ cq -:- Re: Advice -:- Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 12:20:34 (EST)
__ __ connectthedots -:- Have a laugh on us! -:- Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 19:53:28 (EST)
__ __ __ cq -:- Would love to - but ... -:- Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 09:52:48 (EST)
__ __ __ __ connectthedots -:- Perfect Living Pimp -:- Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 10:28:24 (EST)
__ __ __ __ __ cq -:- Re: Perfect Living Pimp -:- Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 11:29:56 (EST)
__ __ __ sure -:- look at this one -:- Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 07:29:25 (EST)
__ __ __ __ connectthedots -:- Re: look at this one -:- Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 10:31:40 (EST)
__ __ connectthedots -:- Re: relationship of group -:- Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 15:12:18 (EST)
__ __ housemum -:- Re: Advice -:- Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 12:37:16 (EST)
__ __ __ Joe -:- Sound Familiar? -:- Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 13:10:44 (EST)
__ __ __ __ connectthedots -:- Re: Sound Familiar? -:- Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 14:22:01 (EST)
__ __ __ __ __ Cynthia -:- Hello ConnecttheDots... -:- Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 15:35:31 (EST)
__ __ __ __ __ __ Livia -:- Re: Hello ConnecttheDots... -:- Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 16:23:28 (EST)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ connectthedots -:- Re: Hello ConnecttheDots... -:- Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 19:20:09 (EST)

Livia -:- Rainbow Memory Lane -:- Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 07:53:45 (EST)
__ Vicki -:- What was this place? -:- Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 14:29:40 (EST)
__ housemum -:- Re: Rainbow Memory Lane -:- Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 12:49:06 (EST)
__ __ Livia -:- Re: Rainbow Memory Lane -:- Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 16:24:51 (EST)
__ __ __ Livia -:- Re: Rainbow Memory Lane -:- Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 06:15:39 (EST)
__ __ __ Marianne -:- The Houston Coke plant -:- Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 16:34:31 (EST)
__ __ __ __ Richard -:- Re: The Houston Coke plant -:- Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 21:48:07 (EST)
__ __ __ __ __ janet -:- rainbow inn -:- Sun, Jan 27, 2002 at 08:27:54 (EST)
__ __ __ __ Ben Lurking -:- Re: The Houston Coke plant -:- Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 19:21:20 (EST)

fly on the wall -:- here's my question for M...what's yours? -:- Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 06:54:10 (EST)
__ the other fly on the wall -:- This is not me -:- Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 14:21:06 (EST)
__ __ Sir Dave -:- Don't worry Rob -:- Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 15:05:31 (EST)
__ Guru Masarati -:- Does driving real fast for 1 hour count? -:- Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 10:22:42 (EST)
__ __ Sir Dave -:- Now that IS a good name! -:- Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 15:09:02 (EST)
__ Haharaji -:- Here's my answer -:- Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 08:48:15 (EST)
__ __ Haharaji -:- And another thing -:- Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 13:18:39 (EST)
__ __ __ Haharaji -:- You damn imposter -:- Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 15:03:55 (EST)
__ Maharaji -:- You must understand that -:- Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 07:29:59 (EST)
__ The Maharaji of Malibu -:- cannot answer your question -:- Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 07:18:20 (EST)

janet -:- expect a visitor or 2 -:- Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 05:53:09 (EST)

Jean-Michel -:- EPO's outdated pages and broken links -:- Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 03:34:45 (EST)
__ JHB -:- Re: EPO's outdated pages and broken links -:- Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 04:56:24 (EST)
__ __ Francesca -:- I got there just fine in the USA (nt) [nt] -:- Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 18:36:58 (EST)
__ __ Jean-Michel -:- I'll emigrate to Latvia asap -:- Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 05:11:52 (EST)

Francesca :~) -:- GMJ -- We are DEVO -:- Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 01:36:22 (EST)


Date: Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 23:18:57 (EST)
From: Quiet
Email: qgung@yahoo.com
To: All
Subject: Was the Astrodome realy full in 73?
Message:
I have been told for many years that it was full. is that correct or not?
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Date: Sun, Jan 27, 2002 at 06:24:11 (EST)
From: janet
Email: None
To: Quiet
Subject: haha-no way
Message:
we didnt even cover the whole floor. there was no one in the riser seats above the floor.
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Date: Sun, Jan 27, 2002 at 07:42:09 (EST)
From: Quiet
Email: None
To: janet
Subject: Re: haha-no way
Message:
awwwwwwwww again my childish illusions are destroyed.And ill bet the aliens wernt there either. Wow Ira Woods sure told us some Biggie about that.Q
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Date: Sun, Jan 27, 2002 at 01:15:10 (EST)
From: Carlos
Email: None
To: Quiet
Subject: Maybe yes and definately no.
Message:
There was always alot of people off elsewhere, except when M was speaking. So when he wasn't there it was never more than about 1'2 full, the times I was there and saw. When he was there it was fuller, and there were a lot of seats down on the floor, which normally would have been a playing field. So if you compared the seats filled on the field, it might have been more people present than it normally seated. But if you don't indulge in some kind of interpretation, no, it wasn't full with the additional seats we had set up. Maybe 7/8ths, maybe less.

My estimate,based on hotel rooms rented (close to 40,000) is that 70 to 80 thousaand attended. I don't remember who my sopurce was, but it was someone I regarded as credible and, due to the dificulties I'd had with DUO International HQ when I was getting DLM Puerto Rico going I didn't just take stuff blindly.

Hope this helps.

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Date: Sun, Jan 27, 2002 at 01:30:41 (EST)
From: Quiet
Email: None
To: Carlos
Subject: Re: Maybe yes and definately no.
Message:
Thank You Carlos.
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Date: Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 10:16:01 (EST)
From: Yogi Bear
Email: None
To: Quiet
Subject: Re: Was the Astrodome realy full in 73?
Message:
This is taken from Sacred Journeys The Conversion of Young Americans to Divine Light Mission by James V. Dowton, Jr. Columbia University Press, New York, 1979, pages 188-189.

“By 1973 the Mission had been pretty well decimated by the press, as one scandal after another reached public attention. First, there was the claim by the Indian government that Guru Maharaj Ji and his family had smuggled jewels and large sums of money into the country, a charge which was eventually dropped with apologies from the government. Later, a member of the press who had thrown a pie into Guru Maharaj Ji’s face as a prank was beaten into unconsciousness by one of the movement’s most noted Mahatmas and at least two other premies. Then, of course, there were numerous newspaper accounts of the guru’s life-style, which pictured him as more interested in accumulating wealth and power than in changing the world.

That premies had lost their capacity for criticism was fairly clear to me, for not once in all my many reverences to these scandals or charges did they criticize Guru Maharaj Ji. Many rationalized the scandals and his life style as a part of his plan. Others argued that even bad publicity about the Mission was good, because it at least made people aware of the guru and the movement. Some blamed those around the guru. At that time, premies were thinking that Guru Maharaj Ji was so spiritually perfect and powerful he could do no wrong and that no obstacle was big enough to stop him from reaching his goal of ushering in the new age of peace.

These beliefs spawned serious hopes that during the Millennium festival in 1973 a new age would dawn in Houston. Manifestations of this hope were to be found in the many speculations and prophesies about what would happen under the Astrodome. Premies expected thousands to descent on the festival itself, and many millions watching the proceedings on television to see for the first time how spiritually pure their guru was and how compelling his message.

Fed by rumors before the festival that something earth-shattering might happen there, premies lost no time imagining that the teenage guru was going to let out all the stops and turn the earth on its axis. Then there were the sometimes frivolous but often serious predictions that beings from outer space would descend on the Astrodome. As one premie close to the Denver organization told me later, even premies who were normally quite realistic in their views were taken in by these collective fantasies.

As the festival approached, all attention within the premie community turned toward Houston. Expectations were running high that something very cosmic was about to happen there. Curious to experience it firsthand, I flew to Houston and made my way to the festival. Fighting through pickets form the local fundamentalist Christian community who were freely expressing their hatred toward the “false Messiah,” I made my way into the Astrodome. Contrary to the predictions I had heard, it was nowhere near filled to capacity.

As I discovered later, the turnout had been very disappointing to many premies. Also disappointing to many was he response of the press corps, which had been amassed there as part of the Mission’s effort to publicize the movement. They had hoped the festival would trigger a change in the attitudes of newspaper and television newsmen and newswomen, but just the opposite occurred. Representatives from the media became quite hostile toward the guru in his first press conference, charging that his answers to their questions were flippant and arrogant.

With the crowd smaller than expected and an alienated press corps, premies waited for something miraculous to happen. Yet, by the end of the festival, even that expectation was unfulfilled. No beings from outer space had come and no dramatic display of cosmic energy had lit up the Astrodome. Although premies tried hard to find good things to say about the festival, it seemed to me that ruined dreams were hidden under their exuberance.

Before the festival, the Mission’s goals and activities had been quite extravagant, reflecting the community’s confidence that the movement would succeed. Afterwards, the organization was left with a $600,000 debt, and worse, the loss of its millennial dream of world peace. Immediately, the production and distribution of its publications were curtailed to meet financial obligations. Programs were cut back as the premie community began to realize that the mass of humanity was not going to flock to Guru Maharaj Ji to receive the Knowledge, as they had so fervently believed. Their enthusiasm for propagating the Knowledge collapsed under the weight of reality.”

Yea, I know, read it and weep. It was a bummer of a weekend for all of us who had expected so much more. And to this day, nothing has changed. Maharaj ji is still trying to pass the blame on to others (premies) for the collapse of his empire. I believe it is just that we have all become wiser with time.

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Date: Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 11:05:38 (EST)
From: Quiet
Email: qgung@yahoo.com
To: Yogi Bear
Subject: Re: Was the Astrodome realy full in 73?
Message:
Thanks Yogi. Simular things are still happening today.Q
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Date: Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 09:26:45 (EST)
From: Mike Finch
Email: None
To: Quiet
Subject: Re: Was the Astrodome realy full in 73?
Message:
No it wasn't full. But we were all told, and believed (at least I did) that Maharaji was going to lift us all off this planet in the Astrodome into the new millenium in some unspecified way.

I took my full suitcase from my hotel room into the Astrodome, just in case it was true - after all, if we were going to take off and go somewhere, I wanted my toothbrush and a set of clean clothes with me, didn't I ?

-- Mike

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Date: Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 10:08:01 (EST)
From: Quiet
Email: qgung@yahoo.com
To: Mike Finch
Subject: Re: Was the Astrodome realy full in 73?
Message:
Thanks Again Mike. looks like i and so many were lied too.Q
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Date: Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 09:18:40 (EST)
From: cq
Email: None
To: Quiet
Subject: Full??? you gotta be kidding -
Message:
See the top two tiers in the pic? They were completely empty - all the way round the stadium. Even the lower ones were pretty sparsely filled. Most of us were seated on the pitch itself.

'Seating capacity of the Astrodome for baseball is 52,000, for football about 62,000, and for some events, 66,000'.
(from The Texas State Historical Association website)

And here's an extract from an article about the 'Millennium' event, but it's well worth reading the whole thing (linked above):

'Up in the Astrodome press section in the third tier, the fourth estate is turning into a fifth column. The ascerbic comments from 50-odd writers from the Washington Post to the underground press is nearly as harrowing for the premies as assaults from Jesus and Krishna freaks. They are treating the event more as a divine comedy of errors than the greatest event in the history of mankind. And all the premies can do to counter this overt cynicism is to promise a better performance. 'There's so much energy here - that's what counts, and wait till tonight - the stadium will be full,' pleads one premie press liaison. 'Yeah, full of empty seats,' retorts a jaded journalist. 'You really can't judge this until Guru Maharaj Ji himself appears,' she persists'.

Author - Ken Kelley,
first published in February 1974 edition of Ramparts magazine.
[ Full article here. ]
[ Graphic Link ]

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Date: Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 10:34:50 (EST)
From: Quiet
Email: qgung@yahoo.com
To: cq
Subject: Re: Full??? you gotta be kidding -
Message:
Cq thanks for your trouble in putting this together for me. I appreciate it greatly. Ill direct as many people to this. Again thank you. Q
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Date: Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 09:42:44 (EST)
From: E Bai Gum-Ladd
Email: None
To: cq
Subject: More grist to the mill
Message:
I've added that to the others (see above link).
[ And It Is Divine ]
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Date: Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 19:16:14 (EST)
From: nellie
Email: None
To: E Bai Gum-Ladd
Subject: na then
Message:
Eeee, tha nooas nawt abawt nawt, an tha con ged up thee oown end, ah nooa thi fahther an thee ma, an arti benna wesh yon pon an ged it ont slopstoown, are dusti want a leatherin? thal be skriking if ah ged mi hands on thee.
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Date: Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 19:33:32 (EST)
From: E Bai Gum-Ladd
Email: None
To: nellie
Subject: Re: na then
Message:
Eeee, by 'eck lass, is that a promise?
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Date: Sun, Jan 27, 2002 at 09:00:25 (EST)
From: nellie
Email: None
To: E Bai Gum-Ladd
Subject: Re: na then
Message:
aye thall rue thday tha mithered an moyderd wi me ya young whippersnapper.
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Date: Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 14:47:52 (EST)
From: nellie
Email: None
To: E Bai Gum-Ladd
Subject: Hey up lad
Message:
Na then what's ta doin oer here eh? Ahv towd thi to ged up thi oown end lad.
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Date: Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 19:30:35 (EST)
From: E Bai Gum-Ladd
Email: None
To: nellie
Subject: Owsa bout that there then
Message:
Eeeeeeee, am turnin' int' Jimmy Saville. Folks 'ere keep sayin' thez not me an am gettin' confused. Think arl stick t' me orn end laak y'sell.
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Date: Sun, Jan 27, 2002 at 09:03:07 (EST)
From: nellie
Email: None
To: E Bai Gum-Ladd
Subject: Re: Owsa bout that there then
Message:
I sin thi oeer ont lifes gret an tha wer geein thi lip na the arti benna tel mi if thas a prem or an ex. If tha tels me abaat thee ill tell thi abaat me.
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Date: Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 14:50:17 (EST)
From: nellie
Email: None
To: nellie
Subject: Re: Hey up lad
Message:
[nt]
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Date: Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 10:53:31 (EST)
From: Quiet
Email: qgung@yahoo.com
To: E Bai Gum-Ladd
Subject: Re: More grist to the mill
Message:
*ROFLMAO* man that was funny. Thanks a lot E Bai Gum-Ladd.
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Date: Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 09:50:55 (EST)
From: cq
Email: None
To: E Bai Gum-Ladd
Subject: er, a word in your shell-like, guv
Message:
that was a publicity pic from a baseball fan's site, not M's bash in the 70s.

just thought you should know.

bests,
Chris

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Date: Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 10:55:29 (EST)
From: Quiet
Email: qgung@yahoo.com
To: cq
Subject: Re: er, a word in your shell-like, guv
Message:
thats ok Im still larfing.Q
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Date: Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 09:58:31 (EST)
From: cq
Email: None
To: cq
Subject: PS - be a good fellow, now
Message:
if that's you, Dave, I wonder if you could help?

There's a new poster called 'Quiet' who's asking a lot of questions that I'm sure I've seen answered on the Forums before.

Is there any chance of re-posting the link to your Forum archive search engine and give this guy a head start?

(I seem to have lost my bookmark).

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Date: Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 12:50:04 (EST)
From: Here it is:
Email: None
To: cq
Subject: Link to search engine ...
Message:
but I'm not Dave. :)
[ Search Engine ]
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Date: Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 11:00:36 (EST)
From: Quiet
Email: qgung@yahoo.com
To: cq
Subject: Re: PS - be a good fellow, now
Message:
No its not Dave. Im an expremie and i just discovered this site. Ive found it fasinating, and it has answered many questions that plaged me for many years. Thank you very much for your help. Remember guv, there are many of us out there who dont know about this site and Im sure your going to get a hell of a lot more exes like myself who want their questions answred, and im sure the questions will be simular to mine. Q
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Date: Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 11:26:11 (EST)
From: cq
Email: None
To: Quiet
Subject: You're not E Bai Gum-Ladd then?
Message:
Maybe you haven't quite got the hang of the forum yet, 'Quiet', but I was responding to the person who had just added the Astrodome pic to his website.

The 'recipient' box in the top right hand corner will tell you who each post is addressed to.

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Date: Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 11:29:33 (EST)
From: Quiet
Email: qgung@yahoo.com
To: cq
Subject: Re: You're not E Bai Gum-Ladd then?
Message:
Ohhhh thanks for that info . was wondering why things didn`t make that much sense. Oh well im use to it..hey i was a premie for 20 years.
Q
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Date: Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 11:40:29 (EST)
From: cq
Email: None
To: Quiet
Subject: No probs. Don't sweat it (nt)
Message:
another clue: (nt) stands for 'no text'

bye for now

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Date: Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 12:01:28 (EST)
From: Quiet
Email: qgung@yahoo.com
To: cq
Subject: Re: No probs. Don't sweat it (nt)
Message:
Thanks mate!mmmmmm nt=no text, not no thinking. got it.
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Date: Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 02:07:26 (EST)
From: JHB
Email: None
To: Quiet
Subject: Full of Aliens and Angels
Message:
I heard that the many apparently empty seats were actually occupied by invisible aliens or angels.

But seriously, watch the video, Lord of the Universe, available from Amazon, which clearly shows huge empty areas.

John.

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Date: Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 06:50:46 (EST)
From: Quiet
Email: qgung@yahoo.com
To: JHB
Subject: Re: Full of Aliens and Angels
Message:
oh thanks JHB. I dont know about the invisible aliens but the Angles are a great bunch of guys. I ride wiyh them.
But seriously thanks for the info.I like many other expremies are now finding out how many lies were told to us over the years. Q
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Date: Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 00:37:28 (EST)
From: housemum
Email: None
To: Quiet
Subject: Re: Was the Astrodome realy full in 73?
Message:
I'm sure someone has the actual numbers, but I recall that even in my state of zealous devotion to the guru greater than god I was disappointed and somewhat embarrassed by the small number of people who turned out for the liftoff of the astrodome. He told us that he was Jesus returned, and why those Bible-lovin' Texans didn't flock to see the messiah was beyond me. It wasn't because we didn't propagate our little asses off. LOL (unintentional bad pun about randy premies)
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Date: Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 06:54:47 (EST)
From: Quiet
Email: qgung@yahoo.com
To: housemum
Subject: Re: Was the Astrodome realy full in 73?
Message:
Thanks Housemum. you forgiven for your inintentional bad pun. er by the way i aint Jeesus (intentional bad pun) Q
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Date: Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 00:56:42 (EST)
From: As a complete nobody ....
Email: None
To: housemum
Subject: i can tell anyone that the Astrodome
Message:
was disappointingly not nearly full as anticipated that it would be. And I've just been reading here for a couple of years. This topic has come up so many times from so many different posters with always the same disbelievingly disappointed reports, that I can't believe that this hasn't been responded to more quickly ... except that it's Friday night.
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Date: Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 07:00:19 (EST)
From: Quiet
Email: qgung@yahoo.com
To: As a complete nobody ....
Subject: Re: i can tell anyone that the Astrodome
Message:
Thanks ' As a complete nobody' but ive only come across this site and I have many Questions. Its pretty hard when people you have known and trusted for 2 decades turn out to be liers.....but I wish to know the truth.....bad choise of words, Or should i say Facts of the matters.
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Date: Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 23:20:16 (EST)
From: Dermot
Email: None
To: Quiet
Subject: Yep....of hot air [nt]
Message:
[nt]
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Date: Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 16:43:09 (EST)
From: Quiet!
Email: qgung@yahoo.com
To: All
Subject: Premnigar
Message:
I have read that Premnigar is owned by Mr Rawalts elder brother. Many years ago it was told to us (then) premise that the indian courts ruled that Mr Rawalt was awarded the property. This also seems to be a lie. Can any one throw light on to this subject?
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Date: Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 10:42:56 (EST)
From: Bai Ji
Email: None
To: Quiet!
Subject: SUCH..quietness...(nt)
Message:
[nt]
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Date: Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 11:08:16 (EST)
From: Quiet
Email: qgung@yahoo.com
To: Bai Ji
Subject: Re: SUCH..quietness...(nt)
Message:
WOW Was That the 1 handed clap? Funny i thaught that was a Zhen folosophy? nice hearing from you Bai Ji.*roflmao* Q
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Date: Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 11:19:21 (EST)
From: Bai Ji
Email: None
To: Quiet
Subject: Re: SUCH..quietness
Message:
Your writing style is reminiscent of a dear, though recently departed poster, nom de plumed, Such.

If I have realised Zenhood by my previous post then YaY!~
Cos 'The Realising of Knowledge' sure was fucking Obscure.

Welcome muffled one.
X Bai

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Date: Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 11:26:18 (EST)
From: Quiet
Email: qgung@yahoo.com
To: Bai Ji
Subject: Re: SUCH..quietness
Message:
Sorry Bai im new here. Loving the answers that im getting. And realy appreciating the help and houmour in the answers to my questions.
Knowlege Obskure? Naaaaa . I think that what ever made us breath did it for a reason.......may be to enjoy life? Or is that toooo rediculous to contemplate? I dont think so. Q
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Date: Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 21:04:16 (EST)
From: Dermot
Email: None
To: Quiet!
Subject: Big bro/little bro
Message:
No, when little bro Maharaji decided to marry a westerner and not an Indian Hindu bride, his mother and elder brother suddenly realised (after telling us schmucks to the contrary for years) that little bro wasn't really the living incarnation of the Lord, the true Satguru, the Perfect Master, the direct successor to his father, the previous God-in-a-bod. I don't know how this realisation came to them but I figure there's some perfectly rational Divine explanation.

Instead, they discovered that Big bro was really God-in-a-bod and as such was entitled to the family silver.

This Divine matter had to be settled in the Indian courts and big bro won. Little bro did ok for himself though, with the help of a Government enterprise initiative he set up a big business of his own.

Now big bro and little bro ignore each other but both claim special allegiance to Daddy, the late God-in-a-bod.

Either one's telling the truth or both are lying. What do you reckon?
I know one thing though, big bro has the better army. Very well turned out they are too:)

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Date: Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 22:13:14 (EST)
From: Quiet
Email: qgung@yahoo.com
To: Dermot
Subject: Re: Big bro/little bro
Message:
Thanks Dermot. Gee you meen to say We were lied to but Mr Rawat the jounior?
Quiet
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Date: Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 18:44:14 (EST)
From: janet
Email: None
To: Quiet!
Subject: learn to spell
Message:
it greatly increases your readers' respect for your intelligence.
to wit:

I have read that Prem nagar is owned by Mr Rawat's elder brother. Many years ago it was told to us (then) premies that the indian courts ruled that Mr Rawat(the younger) was awarded the property. This also seems to be a lie. Can any one throw light on to this subject?

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Date: Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 08:40:14 (EST)
From: Disculta
Email: None
To: janet
Subject: Gotta say it Janet
Message:
Learn to capitalize. ;–)

Hope you're well.

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Date: Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 11:11:44 (EST)
From: Quiet
Email: qgung@yahoo.com
To: Disculta
Subject: Re: Gotta say it Janet
Message:
Dear Discuta,,,,,, I cant capatilize. Im a University Student.Q
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Date: Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 11:55:26 (EST)
From: Disculta
Email: None
To: Quiet
Subject: Re: Gotta say it Janet
Message:
Dear Quiet,

Would you go back and check who my capitalization post was addressed to?

I was just playing around with Janet in a 'pot calling the kettle black' kind of teasing. I wasn't saying it to you.

Welcome to the forum. I have enjoyed your posts.

Enjoy your posts too, Janet.

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Date: Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 22:18:23 (EST)
From: Quiet
Email: qgung@yahoo.com
To: janet
Subject: Re: learn to spell
Message:
Gee Janet....you meen if i can speal reel good like you, peope will think im intrlegent? Good thing Bill gates invented spell cheque or else i would not hold a bachelor and Masters degree.
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Date: Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 22:44:58 (EST)
From: Zelda
Email: None
To: Quiet
Subject: Re: learn to spell
Message:
quiet , I almost posted to Janet to say dont school marm the guy/girl before they get a foot in the door.
but Ididnt cause she may be having an off day.

typos and phonetic spellings abound here so dona worrit bout e.

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Date: Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 23:07:14 (EST)
From: Quiet
Email: qgung@yahoo.com
To: Zelda
Subject: Re: learn to spell
Message:
thank you Zelda. hehehehehe.4netic spelling is easy with a lefthanded key board.
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Date: Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 06:05:37 (EST)
From: my turn
Email: None
To: Quiet
Subject: I hate spelling
Message:
what's this all about?
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Date: Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 06:44:36 (EST)
From: Quiet
Email: qgung@yahoo.com
To: my turn
Subject: Re: I hate spelling
Message:
Janet doesnt like the way i spell.
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Date: Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 17:11:01 (EST)
From: housemum
Email: None
To: Quiet!
Subject: Prem Nagar's website, fyi
Message:
Here's the url for PN's website. I don't know if can get the truth there, but you can book a room, if you so desire.
[ Prem Nagar ]
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Date: Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 01:20:13 (EST)
From: Vicki
Email: None
To: housemum
Subject: Re: Prem Nagar's website, fyi
Message:
And just where did these illustrious holy people get the funds for this Shangrila (sp)?
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Date: Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 22:20:21 (EST)
From: Quiet
Email: qgung@yahoo.com
To: housemum
Subject: Re: Prem Nagar's website, fyi
Message:
Thank you Housemum.
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Date: Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 16:35:15 (EST)
From: Great!
Email: None
To: All
Subject: HE asks for money on the first page
Message:
juajuajuahahahaha

Look at Visions first page. He is desperate about the 'possibilities'. How many are suing?

http://www.visionsinternational.org/

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Date: Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 00:52:44 (EST)
From: Anandaji
Email: None
To: Great!
Subject: Re: HE asks for money on the first page
Message:
My goodness. And to think that '...your contributions make it all possible.'

Hey HampsterJi: Would you mind elaborating on the word "it"?

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Date: Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 08:59:14 (EST)
From: Disculta
Email: None
To: Anandaji
Subject: Re: HE asks for money on the first page
Message:
What I think is interesting about this is that it almost seems as though someone has been reading the recent brilliant rants about MJ's ingratitude on this site.
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Date: Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 15:45:28 (EST)
From: 210
Email: yeah_right_210@yahoo.com
To: All
Subject: curious
Message:
I am a bit curious. Is there some pwk/rawat obsession with Macintosh computers I am unaware of? Mine is not a Mac, but I hear constantly how superior a Macintosh is. Getting just a bit tired of it, I must say!
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Date: Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 18:05:38 (EST)
From: Pullaver
Email: None
To: 210
Subject: Re: curious
Message:
Well, the truth is that the 'Windows' type icon-driven interface popular now on all pc's was pioneered by MacIntosh. Into the early '90s the Mac interface and operating system was generally understood to be superior, definitely more user-friendly than most pc's. The playing field has levelled considerably, but Mac's are still dominant in the publishing, graphic design, music and photo editing shops. I still encounter the mac is holier than pc conceit today which seems to be a bit of a carry-over from the early days, but understandable. So MacAraji would not be alone in this thinking.
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Date: Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 21:39:00 (EST)
From: Pullaver
Email: None
To: Pullaver
Subject: Macalomania
Message:
But the real reason is probably that he owns stock in MacIntosh or in firms developing software for the company. And CEO and Kalifornia neighbour Steve Jobs was once a hippie wandering around India searching for THE TRUTH.
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Date: Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 17:43:05 (EST)
From: Mike Finch
Email: None
To: 210
Subject: Maharaji and Macs
Message:
Is there some pwk/rawat obsession with Macintosh computers...

There certainly is.

I am a software developer for the Windows environment, and I did quite a bit of service in the 90's on various Elan Vital Web sites and other applications (in fact the SmartCard registration application is my creation - at least it was until a year or so ago !!)

We were continually being told to move to a Mac environment - and I am not talking about desktop machines, but server farms to host enterprise applications !! With the new Mac OSX, server farms of Macs are a possibility (although very few and far between), but before that they were just not feasible.

And for many countries outside of the US, Macs are just not obtainable, or at least incredibly expensive.

I was told continually that this came from Maharaji, and was final and non-negotiable. I had detailed technical discussions with the premie honchos on the Information Technology team (or whatever it was called) pointing out the supremacy of Windows for this kind of environment (easily obtainable, much bigger developer base etc) or Unix - but no, it had to be Macs. Again, remember I am not talking about what machine you as an individual prefer on your desk - but the machines to be used as servers for large-scale apps.

Anyway, I finally wrote a paper on this topic, arguing clearly that if Elan Vital was going to have a feasible enterprise international network using the InterNet, it had to be based on Windows or Unix.

I know Maharaji read this, because I was told privately that at some techy meeting in Amaroo, Maharaji was talking about my paper, and trashing it and saying how everything in his world had to be Macs !!

I never had the chance to talk to him about this personally - I was out of the inner circle by the early 90's - but certainly one of two things is true:

1) EITHER Maharaji is so obsessed with Macs, that he will not allow anything else to be used where he has any influence;

2) OR the premies around Maharaji know that he personally likes Macs, and in order to be good devotees interpret this to mean nothing but Macs anywhere.

-- Mike

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Date: Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 11:46:43 (EST)
From: cq
Email: None
To: Mike Finch
Subject: Third possibility - he's got shares in Apple? (nt)
Message:
Third possibility - he's got shares in Apple? (nt)
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Date: Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 07:23:13 (EST)
From: hamzen
Email: None
To: Mike Finch
Subject: God he's such a dickhead
Message:
I love macs, but enforcing them as the choice for server side stuff is just plain silly, but I guess when your ego is as big as he's is he doesn't care, because it's never him that has to deal with the grief.
He really is just a spoilt little rich kid.
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Date: Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 04:31:44 (EST)
From: Moll of Mole
Email: mollofmole@loveable.com
To: Mike Finch
Subject: Re: Maharaji and Macs
Message:
My boyfriend was in one of those training's and he said that his guruness said that 'Bill Gates was a brainfart'.

His guruness apparently loves Macs and all those in the inner circle use them. PC's are considered not developed enough.

MoM

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Date: Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 18:35:42 (EST)
From: Francesca
Email: None
To: Mike Finch
Subject: Thanks for that Mike
Message:
Shows the old ignorance again. What one prefers for a desktop machine is not necessarily a workhorse in an enterprise/server environment.

Maharaji's a twit. I agree with your two conclusions. It's good not to always blame Rawat for the boneheaded decisions. Some are made by PAMs based on Maharaji's boneheaded obsessions. There is a difference. Either way he's a bonehead.

--f

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Date: Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 21:29:56 (EST)
From: Richard
Email: None
To: Francesca
Subject: Maccin' off
Message:
I was invited to an instructor conference as a guest mid-80's because of the design work I did pro bono for the Miami and national organization. I had just bought a state-of-the-art Mac Plus and Laser printer. M's secretary at the time requested my Mac 'for M to use'. Naturally I was flattered and pleased to have the Guru himself use my computer.

When I picked it up, the caps lock was down and I happened to see of the stuff that the secretary (not M as promised) had printed out. As a graphic designer, I was shocked to see it was all bold caps. When I mentioned this, she chirped 'Oh, Mwagee loves to use bold caps.' A bizarre drip at the time and added to my growing list of doubts. Man, I thought he was perfect and he doesn't know the first thing about typography.

Richard who wears bold caps in the winter

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Date: Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 18:20:18 (EST)
From: Bai Ji
Email: None
To: Mike Finch
Subject: The BIG Mac...(nt)
Message:
[nt]
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Date: Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 16:35:27 (EST)
From: JHB
Email: None
To: 210
Subject: Re: curious
Message:
It has been reported here several times that Rawat has a brand loyalty to Macs. Someone said that was their last drip, after all Macs and PCs are just computers.

Basically, I think Rawat's a little stupid.

John the little stupid

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Date: Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 07:20:01 (EST)
From: hamzen
Email: None
To: JHB
Subject: Well that's it,
Message:
John boy don't forget it's been well researched that productivity on a mac goes up by approx 30%, most designers I know still prefer macs, and they're still much more reliable re audio, and are still much more intuitively natural to use for those with no techy awareness. The op system is also much clearer and simpler to clean up and sort, and much easier setting up a mac network, and that's apart from the secret ms stuff buried in the op system.
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Date: Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 11:51:49 (EST)
From: cq
Email: None
To: hamzen
Subject: the downside of Macs
Message:
I bought a Starmax (Mac clone) for over a grand about four years ago, running system 7.6.

Today, the machine is worth about Ł200, if lucky, the RAM for it is HUGELY expensive, and no-one writes for system 7.6 anymore. Upgrade to system 8? I would, but I'd have to upgrade all my applications too, and the likes of QuarkXpress upgrades don't come cheap.

It's called built-in obsolescence. And it pisses me off.

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Date: Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 13:50:48 (EST)
From: Zoloft
Email: None
To: All
Subject: The shit hits the fan !
Message:
Another program. I was sitting somewhere in the last rows, as usual, again waiting for the inspiration to join the darshan line. It had been a really tough 6 months of 4 hours-a-day meditation technique sessions and nada. Staring into darkness, a constant hissing sound, stuck breath and lots of saliva. Ever sat on the sideseat of a city bus with your 4-month old daughter and you're drooling more than she is ? The old ladies in the facing seat thinking 'Cute baby but look at the retard !'
So I inwardly asked Maharaj Ji if he could look at me just this once. The last 3 times I had traveled to see him since Orlando, he had looked at his watch just as I passed in front of him. Every single time. Had I pissed him off ??
I joined the line that stretched into the lobby. We were approaching the tunnel and the lady in front of me started getting really agitated. She really couldn't hold it in anymore and had to visit the can. She asked me to hold her baby and she'd be right back. BAD IDEA !!!! but you know how you get in darshan lines. 3 things should have occured to me. 1, the flowers-in-the-hair lady was dressed in an indian print dress and wore big boots, in other words, a hippie . Hippies believe in cotton and fresh air. So nyet to leak-proof Pampers. 2. Hippies have no money when they come to see Maharaj Ji, so their diet goes to hell and they and their babies get really liquidy. And 3, for once I was wearing a tie.
The baby's face cramped up for a moment, released and a bucket of diarhea came running down my shirt and pants. The smell!!! The quantity !!! Mom took the thing back and I ran to the can. Ever been in a bathroom jam-packed with impecable suits recoiling in horror as they're trying to get that last strand of hair just right for their Master and you're wearing jeans, a borrowed white shirt and covered in shit ?
I wiped off whatever I could and sat for 20 minutes under the hand dryer. Half my body was now dried brown reeking ooze. I rejoined the line and some time later, approached Maharaj Ji hoping he'd look my way but he never did. But I'm sure he smelled me and that was enough.
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Date: Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 01:03:28 (EST)
From: Anandaji
Email: None
To: Zoloft
Subject: Great story, Zoloft! [nt]
Message:
[nt]
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Date: Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 14:34:33 (EST)
From: housemum
Email: None
To: Zoloft
Subject: out of the mouths of babes
Message:
Great story Zoloft (love your name, btw). It reminded me that for the first 5/6 years of his life I carried and then dragged my poor son through every darshan line and made him kiss the lotus feet. No wonder the poor kid's in therapy. You know that expression 'out of the mouths of babes?' well, maybe in the darshan line the truth emerged from the other end.
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Date: Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 15:28:26 (EST)
From: Cynthia
Email: None
To: housemum
Subject: Well, not exactly mouths... [nt]
Message:
[nt]
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Date: Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 14:24:47 (EST)
From: PatC
Email: None
To: Zoloft
Subject: Another hilarious story, Zoloft
Message:
Keep them coming. :C)
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Date: Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 14:07:51 (EST)
From: cq
Email: None
To: Zoloft
Subject: Don't you mean: the fan hit the Shit!(nt)
Message:
Don't you mean: the fan hit the Shit!(nt)
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Date: Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 14:21:11 (EST)
From: housemum
Email: None
To: cq
Subject: Re: Don't you mean: the fan hit the Shit!(nt)
Message:
Mr.Chris, I responded to you karma post I notice that it has disappeared from the bottom of the screen. A koan of some sort.
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Date: Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 14:31:14 (EST)
From: cq
Email: None
To: housemum
Subject: something's fallen out of *someone's* bottom
Message:
ooops, must be the AHS again.

Seriously though, I'm in the middle of replying to that karma post, but without the archives, am stuck trying to find out if it was indeed you who described yourself as 'scholar of ancient religions' (or was it 'religious scholar') in a post that appeared about 5-8 days ago.

Or maybe it wasn't you?

Bear with me.

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Date: Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 14:35:37 (EST)
From: housemum
Email: None
To: cq
Subject: yes, me (nt)
Message:
[nt]
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Date: Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 16:21:03 (EST)
From: cq
Email: None
To: housemum
Subject: Botom fallen out of your world? ...
Message:
I sold my expectations to reality and got ripped off.

Viz:

ON TESCO'S TIRIMISU DESERT -
Do not turn upside down.
(Printed on the bottom of the box.)

ON MARKS & SPENCER BREAD PUDDING -
Product will be hot after heating

ON PACKAGING FOR A ROWENTA IRON -
Do not iron clothes on body

ON BOOTS CHILDRENS COUGH MEDICINE -
Do not drive car or operate machinery

ON NYTOL (A SLEEP AID) -
Warning: may cause drowsiness

ON A KOREAN KITCHEN KNIFE -
Warning keep out of children

ON A STRING OF CHINESE MADE CHRISTMAS LIGHTS -
For indoor or outdoor use only.

ON A JAPANESE FOOD PROCESSOR -
Not to be used for the other use

ON SAINSBURY'S PEANUTS -
Warning: contains nuts

ON AN AMERICAN AIRLINES PACKET OF NUTS -
Instructions:
open packet, eat nuts.

ON A SWEDISH CHAINSAW -
Do not attempt to stop chain with your hands

ON A PACKET OF SUNMAID RAISINS -
Why not try tossing over your favorite breakfast cereal?

Enough for tonight.

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Date: Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 19:24:31 (EST)
From: PatC
Email: None
To: cq
Subject: Is that maharajism?
Message:
''Why not try tossing over your favorite breakfast cereal?''

Aaaargh - enough puns!!

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Date: Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 09:22:54 (EST)
From: cq
Email: None
To: PatC
Subject: No it's the Epsom salts (nt)
Message:
No it's the Epsom salts
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Date: Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 18:30:28 (EST)
From: Bai Ji
Email: None
To: cq
Subject: Re: Botom fallen out of your world? ...
Message:
FLOTD (First Laugh Of The Day)Tossing not to be performed in polite company......
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Date: Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 09:29:01 (EST)
From: connectthedots
Email: charvozz@cs.com
To: All
Subject: Advise Please
Message:
Hello, I am an RSSB ex-satsangi, I believe our organizations are considered 'cousins'. I have much respect for what you have pioneered here.

Finally, after years of struggle to establish credible damaging information about RSSB, we have a major break and a very high ranking individual who left the orgainzaion has just gone public with information on our site.

Realistically, one needs to consider possible backlash...any advise legal or otherwise at this juncture? If you want to read the posts go to exsatsangisupportgroup.com in Yahoo clubs and read 'waking now' posts titled 'The Real RSSB' and 'A look into Beas Dera Culture'. There was also a subsequent poster called 'walking now' please don't confuse.

connect the dots

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Date: Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 15:02:30 (EST)
From: Anandaji
Email: None
To: connectthedots
Subject: Re: Advise Please
Message:
Perhaps you would be willing to invite Waking Now to visit this site as well. I am sure he would be a welcome guest/interview.
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Date: Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 01:50:48 (EST)
From: Anandaji
Email: None
To: connectthedots
Subject: Thank you, brother
Message:
Thank you for visiting this sister site and for bringing to our attention the revelations of Walking Now. I have spent the last half hour reading them. They are fascinating.

After 28 years in this cult, I have only left last December. There is much to read and study here and I have only begun. But I have questions about the origins of the science for cults; in particular, those of Indian origin. An interest we share.

I appears that our two Guru Maharajis come from a culture where such a science is fairly ancient. I look forward to further study of this subject.

Thank you again for helping us/me connect the dots and gain freedom from such a sinister plot to imprison minds and souls.

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Date: Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 18:43:18 (EST)
From: Dermot
Email: None
To: connectthedots
Subject: Parallel universes:) [nt]
Message:
[nt]
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Date: Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 14:11:00 (EST)
From: PatC
Email: pdconlon@hotmail.com
To: connectthedots
Subject: Hi, connect the dots
Message:
I remember you posting here last year. The last time I looked at the exsatsangi forum was a few weeks ago when I followed a conversation between neural surfer (Dr David lane) and lulalake_1999. Waking now's revelations sure have gotten your forum jumping.

Our cult's worst retaliations were against 12 of us who post under our real name - the notorious CAC attacks. It seems that most exsatsangis post under aliases so I doubt that your cult can do too much harm to any of you. But please feel free to dicuss this with those of us who were attacked by email as there are some things best not mentioned on public forums.
[ ExSatsangi Support Group ]

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Date: Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 14:40:10 (EST)
From: connectthedots
Email: charvozz@cs.com
To: PatC
Subject: Re: Hi, connect the dots
Message:
Thank you, I will do so. I had assumed that allegations we made were covered under 'Freedom of Speech'. It sounds like you are saying RSSB has no grounds to retaliate under 'Freedom of Speach' even if the allegations are not supported by court worthy evidence (at least for now). But I will follow up via email for some fine points. Thank you very much. ctd
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Date: Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 14:46:44 (EST)
From: PatC
Email: None
To: connectthedots
Subject: PS, connect the dots
Message:
Of course what ex-followers say is protected free speech but, as you have seen from waking now's revelations about the immorality of the inner circle of RSSB cult, the fanatical cultists will stop at nothing even if it is criminal behavior.

Two weeks ago our cult sabotaged Ex-premie Org website and took it off line. It is now back up. The methods they used were totally illegal but that did not stop them.

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Date: Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 14:10:22 (EST)
From: Deborah
Email: None
To: connectthedots
Subject: Thank you for stopping by
Message:
I took a hyper link in a lower post to the site but don't have time to read it now. But it looks intereting. Will you be around to talk about it later?

Cheers,

deborah

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Date: Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 14:43:11 (EST)
From: connectthedots
Email: charvozz@cs.com
To: Deborah
Subject: Re: Thank you for stopping by
Message:
Hi Deborah,

Yes, I will follow up. I posted some other references in this thread as well. Best, ctd

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Date: Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 12:35:54 (EST)
From: housemum
Email: None
To: connectthedots
Subject: Re: Advise Please
Message:
I had time to take a look at this site and the similarities are stunning. I will defer a reply to Connectthedots to a more experienced F7 poster. Here's the url for those who are interested. http://clubs.yahoo.com/clubs/exsatsangisupportgroup; the original post he is refering to is 9980, I believe.
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Date: Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 14:52:31 (EST)
From: connectthedots
Email: charvozz@cs.com
To: housemum
Subject: Re: Advise Please
Message:
Yes, that's correct. The original post begins with 9980 or any one under 'waking now' not to be confused with 'walking now'. If I am correct, he will weave a captivating story over the next few weeks. First he has established his credibility. He has begun to give examples of the scope and callousness of the desception with well illustrated examples....while simeultaneously sustituting a way to have a healthier outlook on life...that is confronting the 'dying while living' abomination of the deadening philosophy. His writing style is effective.

ctd

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Date: Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 12:20:34 (EST)
From: cq
Email: None
To: connectthedots
Subject: Re: Advice
Message:
Hi there dots, (if I may be so bold)

Just to get things in perspective, (not knowing quite who RSSB are/were), I've linked to a site that appears to give some basic info. Hope it meets with your approval.

And, though I had a wee bit of trouble finding the forum/bulletin board you mentioned, I got there in the end. And here's the link:
exsatsangisupportgroup
[ Radha Soami Satsang Beas background info ]

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Date: Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 19:53:28 (EST)
From: connectthedots
Email: None
To: cq
Subject: Have a laugh on us!
Message:
I would love to offer you a great laugh, curtesy of an outstanding digital artist poster if you click on the exsatsangisupportgroup link on cq's post and plug in post #9779 on that site.

It's how we view our 'Godman'.....maybe it's not as funny to those who havn't dealt with the guy, but we laughed so hard it hurt.
Smiles, ctd or 'dots'

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Date: Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 09:52:48 (EST)
From: cq
Email: None
To: connectthedots
Subject: Would love to - but ...
Message:
Hi again, dots

Unfortunately the link which Jivin Jiva gave is to a 'members only' part of the site, off-limits to the likes of little old me.

BTW, on a more serious note, did you know that M's brother (Satpal, a.k.a. BalBhagwanji) took over the DLM (Divine Light Mission) ashram in Premnagar, Hardwar, India, after a court case?

He apparently is giving the old-style 'knowledge' techniques and amassing a sizeable following for himself. He was also involved in the Government (as minister for transport, I think). His site, if you're curious, can be found at http://www.manavdharam.org/

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Date: Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 10:28:24 (EST)
From: connectthedots
Email: charvozz@cs.com
To: cq
Subject: Perfect Living Pimp
Message:
OOPs...sorry, didn't realize you had to go thru the sign up business.
Our lineage of 'Godmen' have a fetish about recruiting followers to smuggle consumer items such as watches, jewelry, small TV's and 'Wheetabix' cereal of all things....

We decided to offer some disguises for them so they could do thier own smuggling with the aid of an outstanding digital artist. There we some initial suggestions....Mr. 'T', Don King, but the grand prize was
'Perfect Living Pimp'....of course that means his private jet will have to be reupholshered and decorated in theme.....

ctd

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Date: Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 11:29:56 (EST)
From: cq
Email: None
To: connectthedots
Subject: Re: Perfect Living Pimp
Message:

[ Graphic Link ]
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Date: Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 07:29:25 (EST)
From: sure
Email: None
To: connectthedots
Subject: look at this one
Message:
Hi!

Re: The early Gurus vichar2000
(F/New York, NY) 6/11/99 7:56 pm
Like, this may be really stupid, but like, you are just assuming the gurus are not really perfect living masters.

How do you know they are not? How do you know for sure that Soami Ji is not really a Master merged with the highest region, just like they say he is?
If you are not Perfect how can you know somebody else is not perfect?

There you have it. Too naive to think that way?

Many of us ex-premies bought the same argument. Same boat, eh?

This person says something good:

Whether it is Christianity or Sant Mat,
the consequences of having of a priesthood
or guru who deceives his individual followers
and suppresses open enquiry is exactly the same.
A person's life is wasted trying to follow
something artificial, as a result of a betrayal
of trust by the guru or priest.

There is a loss of precious opportunity
to make the "best use" of one's irreplacable
life,
---
No-o-o-o, not by spending it in meditation, but by treasuring its magic,
and cherishing some of the wonderful, honest people who live here.

Take care ())

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Date: Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 10:31:40 (EST)
From: connectthedots
Email: None
To: sure
Subject: Re: look at this one
Message:
Thanks for the post. I often come to your site to read and come away with fresh or re-inforced insights.

ctd

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Date: Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 15:12:18 (EST)
From: connectthedots
Email: charvozz@cs.com
To: cq
Subject: Re: relationship of group
Message:
Hi cq,

Thank you for posting the link. I don't think when most of us were active, we were educated about the other branches. After all, we were so special and exclusive in this opportunity right?? (grin) Part of the marketing gimmic I suppose. But yes, I think you might find alot of interest in it's similarity. We have your site posted in our 'links' section becuase it is so relevant. There are some who have done quite a bit of scholastic work, are even obscessed with the history and their work can also be accessed in the links section. But 'waking now' (being of the Indian tradition, and a very well educated studied person) made some outstanding summaries on the relationship of the groups in one of his first posts.

Best regards, ctd

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Date: Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 12:37:16 (EST)
From: housemum
Email: None
To: cq
Subject: Re: Advice
Message:
Dear Mr.Chris, Great minds DO think alike!
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Date: Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 13:10:44 (EST)
From: Joe
Email: None
To: housemum
Subject: Sound Familiar?
Message:
This from the lead to that site. The similarities really are amazing. Those Radhasoami jokers, including Maharaji, appear to have the same negative effects on people who get involved with them:

This club began as a support group for people who realized that they had been misled by the likes of a Charan, a Sawan, a Jagat, a Kirpal, a Gurinder, a Darshan, a Rajinder, an Ajaib, a Thakar -- or any other of the 'smooth-operator Singh gurus' -- each of whom has pretended to be a living incarnation of 'god in human form'.

The emotional reaction that often follows when it starts to dawn on one that their guru and his inner circle of support staff, who appeared to be models of uprightness, were actually participants in an elaborate deception means that one needs to talk to and hear from others. This club is a place to share experiences with others.

(BTW, if you do not feel you were harmed or 'spiritually damaged' by Sant Mat, that's OK, but please don't waste time posting here. There are other clubs for you.) For those of you who do realize you were scammed, you will find a treasure trove of postings here. For more information on the Radhasoami Cult, click the Founder's link below

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Date: Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 14:22:01 (EST)
From: connectthedots
Email: charvozz@cs.com
To: Joe
Subject: Re: Sound Familiar?
Message:
Thank you all for your kind responses. Yes, the groups are very closely related, you can reference 'Links' in the menu for a more scholastic overview.

RSSB (Radha Soami Satsang Beas) is very secretive and hides is assets better than M so it has been very difficult for ex's to be taken seriously. The Dera headquarters at Beas in the Punjab is like a large walled in city and now centers are being constructed in UK, US, Europe, Hawaii, Canada. It is a huge exploitative machinery and our stories are very much the same as yours.

OUr recent poster is a watershed event, I know who it is. It changes the whole landscape for us. His posts are 10171-10176, 10099, 9980, 10013, 10008, 10052 or anything with 'Waking now' not to be confused with 'Walking Now' with an 'L'.
Our site is set up different in chronological numerical order or you can just plug in the number.

So, any and all advise at this juncture would be appreciated, you have been down the road ahead of us. I also knew many wonderful people who were chewed up and spit out when M built his centers here so I knew what was coming when RSSB announced the same. Best regards, Ctd or 'dots' Email also charvozz@cs.com

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Date: Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 15:35:31 (EST)
From: Cynthia
Email: None
To: connectthedots
Subject: Hello ConnecttheDots...
Message:
After much searching I did find your support site and read the post you referred to.

The similarities are striking.

Best,
Cynthia

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Date: Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 16:23:28 (EST)
From: Livia
Email: None
To: Cynthia
Subject: Re: Hello ConnecttheDots...
Message:
Hi Connectthe dots and welcome!

It's an amazing thing this internet, isn't it?!! How else could doubting followers anonymously (safely) (cult worlds can be scary) express their doubts and start connecting up the dots?

I once knew a Satsangi, in fact I am acquainted with several in my home town, and used to have intense discussions with one of them. He thought he had the truth, I thought we did. And where are we all now? (Connecting up with each other by the look of it.) I am sure people here can help you set up a forum like this one where you can all get together and really get to the bottom of everything like we are, and if there's anything we can do to help, we're here for you.
All the best and good luck, Livia

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Date: Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 19:20:09 (EST)
From: connectthedots
Email: None
To: Livia
Subject: Re: Hello ConnecttheDots...
Message:
Livia,

Yes, life's circumstances can be ironic. The internet is a remarkable tool to help nullify the 'compartmentalization of information' that RSSB and other such groups use for containment. It's amazing what you find out when you have the ability to compare notes.

RSSB has been low profile, not at all flamboyant like M, until the last 10 years and now they have really been ramping up. The 'Times of India', major news publication just ran an article calling the Dera system a poison that is spreading thru India. It identified Deras headed by so called Godmen as INVESTMENT GRADE PROFIT CENTERS with the capability of corrupting Indian politics by providing mindless voting blocks and an ability to raise undocumented cash.

It cited RSSB Beas as an example of major political leader Ghandi paying court to God Incarnate Gurinder Singh.

Thank you for the welcome, connect the dots

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Date: Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 07:53:45 (EST)
From: Livia
Email: None
To: All
Subject: Rainbow Memory Lane
Message:
Back down Memory Lane - was anybody here at the Rainbow Inn in 1973 in the months leading up to Millenium? I was there, and what a strange time THAT was!!! Anyone want to share any memories? I'll pitch in later today when I've more time.

Love to you all, Livia

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Date: Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 14:29:40 (EST)
From: Vicki
Email: None
To: Livia
Subject: What was this place?
Message:
[nt]
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Date: Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 12:49:06 (EST)
From: housemum
Email: None
To: Livia
Subject: Re: Rainbow Memory Lane
Message:
Dear Livia,
I was there then, danced with the group at the RI in preparation for the Astrodome liftoff. But they changed my service prior to liftoff, and instead I was posted to the main office and told to write the thank you notes for wedding gifts that Guy and Janice Rollins had received some months before. I didn't know them, or the givers of gifts, nor did I see the gifts (which were most likely donated to the goo anyway.)

My other pre-Mill service was 'manning' the telex machine. Remember those?

For me, remembering those days is a little like getting my stomach pumped. Not a pleasant experience.

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Date: Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 16:24:51 (EST)
From: Livia
Email: None
To: housemum
Subject: Re: Rainbow Memory Lane
Message:
Oh dear, nobody seems very interested....

With love, Livia

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Date: Sat, Jan 26, 2002 at 06:15:39 (EST)
From: Livia
Email: None
To: Livia
Subject: Re: Rainbow Memory Lane
Message:
Hi everybody! Well, I've got some strange memories indeed. I'm English and when I arrived with some other English premies we thought the American premies very strange....we definitely didn't get each other's humour at all to start off with. I think you all thought we were really gross...

I remember stepping outside the airport buildings and being hit by a 'whoomph!' of close, damp, rancid heat permeated with a sickly stench of rotting meat. I'd never been anywhere like it in my life. We slept on paper-thin mats on hard floors four to a room, which was luxury by the standards i'd just come from, which was 10 to a room in London, but we won't go into that. We even had a shower for the four of us, which you had to use 3 times a night because you kept waking up drenched in sweat. The other thing that woke you up was the cockroaches that loved to run up your leg, especially while you were sleeping or meditating, which was often the same thing.

I remember a room full of Krishna Lila dancers upstairs who spent large amounts of time on the roof with jugs of orange juice for any stray aliens who might decide to land there. Actually they were very sweet women, and if any aliens had happened to land on that roof, they would definitely have been well looked after, nurtured even.

We were fed on vast hunks of watermelon, which (thin)people always seemed to be fasting on for some reason. Actually I didn't think the food was too bad (better than what we were getting back in England). One thing that always used to make me giggle was when we all got to the vast mound of tahini that was always on the plate with never enough bread. Suddenly the talking would stop as everyone struggled simultaneously with enormous mouthfulls of congealed gloop.

The days were endless and often dull, although I was lucky enough to be doing music which involved hours and hours of rehearsing, which was at least intellectually stimulating. And the musicians were crazy and a lot of fun to be with - we did have some good times. Most nights we'd go to a rehearsal with Bhole Ji in this big warehouse and during the break someone would bring this vast tub filled with stale doughnuts from 'Dunkin Donuts' and we'd all fall on them like starving convicts and eat as many as we could possibly cram in our mouths in one go. I suppose food was the only chance of sensual pleasure we ever got during those months.

Bhole Ji was strange - I could never make him out. Some of the musicians adored him and would dive at his feet at any opportunity. Was he quite all there? I have read somewhere recently that he may be slightly mentally disabled - it wouldn't surprise me, looking back, although of course nothing like that occurred to any of us at the time.

One of the German cellists went completely bonkers while we were there and ran out in the street naked - a not unreasonable response to life there I suppose. And I think something weird happened to one of the other German cellists, although this was more extreme and he didn't come back.

And the rumours!!! I was convinced that one of the guys working in the kitchen (he had no hair and vast, protruding ears) was an alien in disguise. I used to keep creeping in the kitchen to peer at him. And who said they actually SAW aliens sitting on the stage around Maharaji at the Astrodome? It was virtually official! I didn't see them of course, but then that would have been because I was in my mind. The Astrodome programme? Weird. Unlike with some of the previous programmes where I had at least felt SOMETHING, I felt absolutely nothing there. It felt soulless - no love, no magic, nothing. Oh well, maybe it was the massive build-up, what could it then be except an anti-climax?

With lots of love, Livia

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Date: Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 16:34:31 (EST)
From: Marianne
Email: None
To: Livia
Subject: The Houston Coke plant
Message:
Livia, believe me, there's loads of folks who post here who stayed at that place. Just give your post a while and people will say something. It was uncomfortable, the 'food' sucked, the showers were freezing, everyone was so tired you could hear the snores under meditation blankets, and I kept worrying that the Astrodome might take off when I was at the Coke plant so I tried to get to the Dome early and leave late.

Marianne

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Date: Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 21:48:07 (EST)
From: Richard
Email: None
To: Marianne
Subject: Re: The Houston Coke plant
Message:
Only the special service premies got anywhere near the Rainbow Inn. Consider yourself lucky, Livia. As Marianne says, the Coke plant was a huge drip (literally with all the leaks in the roof and shower spray everywhere. It was romatically named The Peace Plant. Later, back in Denver, the editor of Divine Times would buy pot with cash proceeds from subsription sales. Offering me a toke he said, 'why do you think they call it the Peace Plant?'

Richard

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Date: Sun, Jan 27, 2002 at 08:27:54 (EST)
From: janet
Email: None
To: Richard
Subject: rainbow inn
Message:
woo hoo- so that's why we got to stay there. 'special service premies??'
i was in the contingent that came down all in a group with the new york city Alive! kitchen 'family [I guess you could call us...]
we got taken to the rainbow inn for the days of the actual festival. I remember garish pink paint and hideous 70's shag carpeting in some clashing, nauseating color. totally empty rooms, no real plan or discipline to any of it the whole time.
I do remember the swimming pool--that was nice. a bunch of us came back from the dome one of the nights--i think the second night- all revved up and silly with a lot of energy, and we plunged into the pool in our yoga whites after the show. i was so blasted I was confused by the underwater pool lights on, and staring at one while completely submerged, thought i was going into 'The' Light, and forgot myself and nearly inhaled the water like a deep draft of Holy Name before it came back to me where i was and what i was doing, on the physical plane!

I also remember crates and crates of alfalfa sprouts being watered in towers of screening, with a hose, out back, and being told that the biggest live sprout growing operation in the world was being conducted there for the premies to have with their meals each day. something about that struck me as simultaneously awesome and truly nuts.

remember the strange steel tubs in the little side house by the pool? I had no idea what they were at the time. I have only seen them since in sports medicine clinics, for special theraputic baths. back then, I thought they were medaeval torture devices, what with the dials and pressure guages and hoses and all.
i remember feeling superior because WE didn't indulge in those shameful, sinful, lowly worldly practices like bathing suits, no, we were holy renunciates who performed our sacred ablutions in our most holy yoga whites, modest and chaste like exemplary little devotees should.

anybody here remember stacy russell? grand dame of grey hair and bright blue eyes , in her 50's, received knowledge in the caribbean, started the mission in jamaica, i think, and then came up to Denver?
she was there. the first time i saw her was a bright morning by the pool at the rainbow inn, where breakfast was a buffet spread on the tables outside. I was stuck by the sight of her because she was the first western devotee i ever saw wearing a sari, and not the way mata ji wore hers. stacy pleated the final end of cloth neatly and fastened it to fall to the floor, dramatically, from behind her left shoulder, and a dazzling, rich, goldshot, colorful one it was, too. shocked the shit right out of me. she wore it with such dignity and bearing, regally, gracefully, with authority, none of this holy, pseudo goddess, puff stuff I had gotten till then, from seeing the likes of mataji, the bai's, in their plain white, nunlike attire. Stacy had power and intelligence, and carried herself like she was somebody, and she knew it. It cut thru the fluff and stamped itself on my impressionable young brain, that this was the way to be a whole woman, not all subservient and bowing and scraping and self effacing.
i didnt actually meet her and get to know her until a year later in denver, but that first encounter burned its way in forever.

if people who stayed at the rainbow were special service premies, then what i was given to do must have been some kinda special, alright: bal bhagwan ji ordered us to go up on the higher levels of the astrodome [where no one ever actually sat during the whole program] and clean out the concession stalls, of years of their ignorant, tamasic filth [read: rotted meat juices, stale beer, crud, grease etc. that had been there since the dome opened for business], and to make each stall 'pure and clean and fit for maharaji to come there.'
yeah right. like he would.

but i and a friend busied ourselves cloroxing and scrubbing and scraping down the stall we were pointed at, duly and diligently, until it sank in that neither maharaji nor any other attendees were ever gonna be anywhere near there. I think it took us maybe 4 hours to realize it? after that, we just rinsed down what we had done, closed the place up, and went down to the floor [and fell asleep on the carpeted field].
and yeah--the vibe really was totally dead and soulless. maharaji couldnt project his so called 'omnipotence' to fill the place . the strongest and most pervading thing in the place was the whisper of the impersonal air conditioning system.

by contrast, I was back there 8 years later, with the houston ashram, fundraising by serving beer on tap and hotdogs, out of floor stalls during concerts, the summer of 82, and i saw Stevie Wonder rock the house at 1 am. I saw steve Perry and Journey make the walls ring without trying. I saw sammy hagar and eddie van halen do a torrid dueling guitar faceoff that left everybody blown out. I saw lionel ritchie and the commodores, al green, teddy pendergrass before his accident, and kool and the gang do full shows, one after another, all in one day, with stevie wonder at the end of the bill.

and maha was a pipsqueak memory that made me wanna crawl under the stands and cry.

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Date: Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 19:21:20 (EST)
From: Ben Lurking
Email: None
To: Marianne
Subject: Re: The Houston Coke plant
Message:
I was at rainbow for about 3 months until about a week or 2 before then got moved to the coke plant, that place had some BIG cochroaches
I was up for like 2-3 days straight before the program, I remember walking on some scafolding and taking a step where there wasn't a plank - I dropped about 3-4 feet just enough for my stomach to go past my throat - then I sat there an regrouped for a few minutes. By the time that stage was up we believed the place would take off - that was the only way we saw it coming down in time for the football game on sunday
Ben-
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Date: Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 06:54:10 (EST)
From: fly on the wall
Email: None
To: All
Subject: here's my question for M...what's yours?
Message:
If I were allowed to ask one question to M at one of his little programs he's been putting on these days, it might be this:

Maharaji, can you tell me the longest stretch of consecutive days that you have meditated (practiced) for a bare minimum of one hour?

And if not very long or consistent, why is that, if it is truly the most beautiful experience in the whole universe?

And if you don't do it consistently (or at all, according to some) why do you demand that your followers do?

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Date: Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 14:21:06 (EST)
From: the other fly on the wall
Email: None
To: fly on the wall
Subject: This is not me
Message:
But anyone is welcome to use the handle, because it is descriptive. Welcome, other buzzin' fly.

--the other fly aka
the fly on the other wall

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Date: Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 15:05:31 (EST)
From: Sir Dave
Email: None
To: the other fly on the wall
Subject: Don't worry Rob
Message:
We know that you're the original Fly.
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Date: Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 10:22:42 (EST)
From: Guru Masarati
Email: None
To: fly on the wall
Subject: Does driving real fast for 1 hour count?
Message:
And here's my question for you:
How fast can you give me some new really fast cars?
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Date: Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 15:09:02 (EST)
From: Sir Dave
Email: None
To: Guru Masarati
Subject: Now that IS a good name!
Message:
Guru Mazarati - I like it!
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Date: Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 08:48:15 (EST)
From: Haharaji
Email: None
To: fly on the wall
Subject: Here's my answer
Message:
Why the fuck do you want to know? Maybe this is not for you. You should never have received knowledge. See what happened premies, all those crazy Mahatmas gave knowledge to people like this - (premies all laugh).
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Date: Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 13:18:39 (EST)
From: Haharaji
Email: None
To: Haharaji
Subject: And another thing
Message:
I've seen PPPIBPIIHMATPOKSMWNs* who had more understanding that most Pwks who have had Knowledge for 30 years, like you, for asking stupid questions of ME, ME, MEEEEEEE! (Premies gasp and smile. Some wet their pants, others have orgasms)

*People Possibily Potentially Involved In Becoming Perhaps Interested In Hearing More About The Possibility Of Knowledge Maybe Who Knows

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Date: Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 15:03:55 (EST)
From: Haharaji
Email: None
To: Haharaji
Subject: You damn imposter
Message:
I'd never use such a long winded term as PPPIBPIIHMATPOKSMWNs. I can't remember any phrase longer than five words - everybody knows that.
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Date: Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 07:29:59 (EST)
From: Maharaji
Email: None
To: fly on the wall
Subject: You must understand that
Message:
if I was premie, just ordinary premie, I would be happy to work to get enough money to give to my Guru Maharaji, I woudn't even think of going to a festival(but I would send in the registration money)......I would be happy to be a piece of dirt to be trampled on by Him.

Anyway, as I was saying, I would love to be just a premie just an ordiary premie but NO, my Guru Maharaj Ji has me Lord of the whole Universe, so my first service is to HIM.
So of course I don't meditate. I am doing 24 hours service to HIM. My whole life is meditation. What some see as my living a life of excess is really servive to HIM.'

Blessings to all the premies

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Date: Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 07:18:20 (EST)
From: The Maharaji of Malibu
Email: None
To: fly on the wall
Subject: cannot answer your question
Message:
This is his dilemna. I know he doesn't waste his valuable time doing these 4 stupid techniques. The question is why?

Either, he has 'realized this precious k' in which case he is one special dude and doesn't need to practice OR he knows the practice is nonsense which opens up many cans of worm ji's.

Your question is great in its simplicity. The answer by the malibu maha is complicated in that the truth would destroy his business empire.

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Date: Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 05:53:09 (EST)
From: janet
Email: None
To: All
Subject: expect a visitor or 2
Message:
some of you may remember last year when i went over to yahoo to briefly join the radhasoami discussion group to find out where shri hans's personal journey of practices and masters broke away from theirs before he founded DLM in india.

as a result, some of their members came over here to have a look around and posted on the forum here as well.
one of them goes by the netname of 'connectthedots', and i have stayed in occasional touch with her by email since then.
today she told me that over at their camp, they are having a momentous breakthrough equivalent to when Michael Dettmers decided to come here and tell what he had seen during his time.
One of their very highest members has left the top of the organization and is speaking to them over there what he knows. It is causing a quantum jump in their evolution as a group of ex's.

''dots' may be coming by here in the next few days, in order to seek some feedback about fears and concerns she has regarding the legal ramifications of their new situation. I explained to her that Marianne and Jim would be the likely ones among us to be able to answer her in that area, since they both have years of real world practice and experience with what is likely and what is not.
I have also told her that they may wish to take the discussion off forum in private email with her, if they deem it better to do so.
this is just a heads-up for you all, so that you have some reference point to look to, in the event the ex-satsangi's should drop in to talk with us again soon.

they were really impressed with our site, too. they took a number of ideas back with them to use in their own efforts. so feel free to update them and share what we have learned since the last time they came over.

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Date: Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 03:34:45 (EST)
From: Jean-Michel
Email: None
To: All
Subject: EPO's outdated pages and broken links
Message:
I haven't had time these days to check all the new mirror sites and EPO's pages.
It looks like the persons who've uploaded the pages on those new sites have used outdated backups, and some pages are outdated.
I'll check all this asap, but please be patient. Nothing is lost, and we have several backups, don't worry.
BTW: I can't access www.ex-premie.org
Can you ?
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Date: Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 04:56:24 (EST)
From: JHB
Email: None
To: Jean-Michel
Subject: Re: EPO's outdated pages and broken links
Message:
J-M,

I've emailed you about the out of date pages.

Regarding www.ex-premie.org, the name server changes propagated to Latvia yesterday. I guess we must be a more technologically advanced country than France:-)

John.

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Date: Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 18:36:58 (EST)
From: Francesca
Email: None
To: JHB
Subject: I got there just fine in the USA (nt) [nt]
Message:
[nt]
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Date: Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 05:11:52 (EST)
From: Jean-Michel
Email: None
To: JHB
Subject: I'll emigrate to Latvia asap
Message:
and take care of your horses .....
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Date: Fri, Jan 25, 2002 at 01:36:22 (EST)
From: Francesca :~)
Email: None
To: All
Subject: GMJ -- We are DEVO
Message:
To quote Sir Dave's 1-22 post, below:

An example: The Maha said recently that there's people half way through a knowledge session who are far more aware and conscious than premies who've been meditating for thirty years.

Some comment on the effectiveness of Knowledge, eh? Takes you from darkness to ... uh ... uh ... MORE darkness.

The more you practice, the worse it gets. Oh the peace! Oh the love! Oh the insults from the arrogant Master! And how would he know. Good sources say he doesn't meditate anyway. Perhaps the premies should give him a Knowledge review.

Yikes. The bind leading the bind. Yes, there's the rub.

--f

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